200pt A-spec races
- Thread starter route_66
- 1,675 comments
- 293,660 views
- Status
- 155
yeti
from what I've read, the can't change tyre type ie road / sports, racing etc, but you can change from N1's to N3's
at least that's want I understand
- 371
- Wild_Cobra_Z28
Moloch_horridus
Yes, I recieved 200pts for each race I listed above. I have been keeping track of my pts per race and car settings. Thought I specified that, but I guess not.
My latest race, I used the Aston Martin DB7, N3 tires, and 200kg, no oil change and was only able to get 173 pts for the Aston Martin Carnival event. I only did the first race last night before going to sleep. N2 tires yield 197 pts and I may go back and try n2 and N1's but I think it will be impossible with N1..... Base pts for the cars as bought in this series:
118 for DB7
099 for Vantage (used)
096 for Vanquish
081 for DB9
Before that I recieved 143 pts on the Renault Alpine Cup races using the A310 1600VE no first oil, S1, +200KG. The car was too squirly for me till the tires warm up, especially with N3 tires. The S1 front tires stay blue most the races! I think 200 pts would be impossible to get even if N1's calculate out for it.
- 417
yeti
It was discussed here, but then Famine put up a thread about it and between us we found out that it doesn't actually change to sports tyres even though it says it does.
Go in on N1's and change to S tyres when you haven't got N2's or N3's and you'll stay on N1's, despite what it says.
However go in on N1's and change to S tires when you have got N2/N3's then you'll actually change to the softest tyre OF THE SAME TYPE you have (ie N3's) even though it says you're on sports tires.
The tests aren't conclusive, some races it does seem to change tires and some it doesn't - On the New York Enduro I originally posted it did seem to put S2's on (laptimes up, tyre wear down) but in the case of the Nissan I posted above it didn't work, I could only get N3's, so there was no point putting sports tires on.
I know it's a bit inconclusive, but y'know, what you gonna do. It won the race anyway........
- 3,165
- yeti_c
I've got one to add to the mix...
Renault Clio Race.
I was getting 168 points for each race...
I bought a 2nd hand Renault Clio V6 '00 gave it an oil change an exhaust, NOS and all trans and Suspension and Racing Mediums...
I won all but Motegi and I reckon I could've won that had I not been spun out on the first lap by the last placer (Who just happened to get rammed off the course later on (Mwuhahahahahaaa!!))...
Given a better driver and different setup this car could get the 200 I think... Suspect tyre choice may have been too high (I was slaughtering them through the bends!)
C.
Renault Clio Race.
I was getting 168 points for each race...
I bought a 2nd hand Renault Clio V6 '00 gave it an oil change an exhaust, NOS and all trans and Suspension and Racing Mediums...
I won all but Motegi and I reckon I could've won that had I not been spun out on the first lap by the last placer (Who just happened to get rammed off the course later on (Mwuhahahahahaaa!!))...
Given a better driver and different setup this car could get the 200 I think... Suspect tyre choice may have been too high (I was slaughtering them through the bends!)
C.
- 417
Right then, it's taken me almost exactly a month, but today I broke 100000 A-spec points and my reward was nothing. nada. zip. zero.
here's a little shot of my home screen to prove I'm not a liar:
100895 at 97.4%
I'll finish it off over the weekend (4 enduros and 3 races of 1000 miles to go) and post my final highest score on Monday ish.
And now the bragging: Wooo I'm so great, I'm the best, noone will ever beat my score, yay, I'd like to thank everyone on this thread, PD, My Family, God, etc.
ahem.
sorry.
seriously, I reckon there's at most 3000 more points I could get (and I'm going to have a go) but that's it, Maximum A-spec saturation is achieved. If anyone beats this score I'm going to be really cross.
Cheers.
Route_66.
here's a little shot of my home screen to prove I'm not a liar:
100895 at 97.4%
I'll finish it off over the weekend (4 enduros and 3 races of 1000 miles to go) and post my final highest score on Monday ish.
And now the bragging: Wooo I'm so great, I'm the best, noone will ever beat my score, yay, I'd like to thank everyone on this thread, PD, My Family, God, etc.
ahem.
sorry.
seriously, I reckon there's at most 3000 more points I could get (and I'm going to have a go) but that's it, Maximum A-spec saturation is achieved. If anyone beats this score I'm going to be really cross.
Cheers.
Route_66.
- 502
Man that's freakin' incredible. I've been rerunning different races to up mine, but wow. I'm at 80% and was so proud when I broke 33,000 last night.route_66
I'm going to see how high I can get, but do not plan on things such as adding weight, or dropping to street tires. Sure it adds an extreme amount of challenge, but takes out some of the fun IMO.
- 895
- GTP_Renesis
My congrats to route_66.... a great feat. Now if someone could just compile the list of all the 200pt (or near as) cars, we might be able to test our skills in the vain hope of matching that score. Not for a long time though I think. You people have waaay too much spare time. No fair... 
- 113
"Right then, it's taken me almost exactly a month, but today I broke 100000 A-spec points and my reward was nothing. nada. zip. zero. "
Qute an accomplishment! I'll bet you drove the wheels off a lot of **** boxes to get that many a-spec points!
Qute an accomplishment! I'll bet you drove the wheels off a lot of **** boxes to get that many a-spec points!
- 155
damn !!!
that is , words fail me.
I'm only 75K behind you, but the wife going away on Sunday, so hopefully I can start closing that gap.
but once again well done.
it will take me 3 years but I will catch up to you.
laters
that is , words fail me.
I'm only 75K behind you, but the wife going away on Sunday, so hopefully I can start closing that gap.
but once again well done.
it will take me 3 years but I will catch up to you.
laters
- 417
yeti
Errr...No, but I have got the "Best score" thingy for each race, the race diary to say when I bought all my cars and a very good memory so I can probably come up with one.......I'll see what I can do.
Thanks for the kind words everyone. So far noone's called me sad. Appreciate it.
- 3,165
- yeti_c
meeekael
Somehow I think you missed the point!!!
Route_66
Nice one... that could be the definitive guide to getting as many A-spec's as possible... and you can modify it as you go along with newer races and then we will have all the spreadsheets that you'll ever need on this forum!!
Quite the opposite I reckon... I wonder if there's a leaderboard somewhere for A-spec points... you'd be at the top or pretty high up I reckon... Jordan... fancy making one?
C.
- 417
OK, this is every car (that I can remember) I used to get my score, hope its useful to you
BEGINNER HALL:
Sunday Cup : Toyota Yaris - 200
FF Challenge : Mini One - 200
FR Challenge : Ginetta G4 (ballast) 200
MR Challenge : MGF (NA stage 1? I think) -200
4WD Challenge : Toyota Celica (An old one, 85 mybe) - 200
Light Weight K Cup : Honda Life Step Van (NOS) - 200
Spider & Roadster : Corvette Convetible '54 (Custom Gearbox)- 200
Sport Truck Race : Dodge RAM - 200
PROFESSIONAL HALL:
Clubman Cup : Dodge RAM (yeah I know) 200
Tuning Car Grand Prix : Amuse S2000 R1 200
Race of NA Sports : Opel Speedster (cant recall mods) - 200
Race of Turbo Sports : Opel Speedster Turbo (Turbo stage 2) -200
Boxer Spirit : Subaru Legacy B4 Blitzen - 200
World Classic Car Series : VW Karmann Ghia (N2/N3, NA stage 1) 200
World Compact Car Race : Suzuki cappuccino (N3) - 200
Supercar Festival : Callaway C12 (put NA2 change to NA1) 200
Gran Turismo World Championship : Nissan R390 GT1 (used, R1) - 200
EXTREME HALL:
Gran Turismo All Stars : Ford GT LM spec-II - 200
Dream Car Championship : AMG Merc 190 touring car - 200
Polyphony Digital Cup : Dodge RAM (racing Trans) - 200
Like The Wind : TVR Speed 12 (N3) - 200
Formula GT World : Audi R8 (R1) - 200
Real Circuit Tours : Nissan R390 Gt1 (R1) - 200
Premium Sports Lounge : BMW M3 GTR (ballast) - 200
ENDURANCE HALL:
Grand Valley 300km: Audi S4 (ballast, N2) - 200
Laguna Seca 200 mile: Camaro Iroc-Z - 200
Roadster 4 Hours Endurance : MX-5 89 (used, N1, ballast) - 200
Tokyo R246 300km : BMW 320i touring (NA stage 2) - 200
Super Speedway 150 Miles : Mazda 787B (used, R1, ballast) - 200
Nurburgring 24 Hours Endurance : BMW 320i touring (R1, ballast) - 200
Nurburgring 4 Hours Endurance : ASL Garaiya (N3) - 200
Motegi 8 Hours Endurance : Nissan 240RS - 200
Tsukuba 9 Hours Endurance : Nissan 240RS - 200
Fuji 1000km : R390 Gt1 (R1, used) - 200
Sarthe Circuit 24 Hours I : Nissan R390 Gt1 (R1) - 200
Sarthe Circuit 24 Hours II : Nissan R390 Gt1 (used, R1) - 200
Infineon World Sport Car Trophy : Nissan R390 Gt1 (used, R1) - 200
El Captain 200 Miles : BMW M3 200
New York 200 Miles : Honda HSC (N1) 200
JAPANESE HALL:
Japanese Championship : ASL Garaiya - 200
Japanese GT Championship : Suzuki GSX/4 (R1) 200
Japanese 70's Classic : Skyline GT-R KCGP whatever 70 - 200
Japanese 80's Festival : A Celica of some sort (cant remember)
Japanese 90's Challenge : Skyline GTS25 R32 '95? (used, N2)
Japanese Compact Car Cup : Suzuki Cappuchino (N1, ballast) - 200
EUROPEAN HALL:
European Championship :
British GT Cup : Jaguar S-type R - 200
British Light Weight : Triumph Spitfire (Weight stage 1) - 200
German Touring Car Championship : AMG Merc Evo touring (S2) 200
Italian Festival : Fiat Barchetta - 200
French Championship : Alpine A310 (N1, ballast) - 200
European Classic Car Championship : VW Karmann Ghia (N2, NA stage 1) - 200
European Hot Hatch Car Championship : BMW 120i - 200
1000 Miles : VW Karmann Ghia - (N2, NA Stage 1, NOS) - 200
Schwarzwald Liga A : BMW 120i - 200
Schwarzwald Liga B : Audi S4 (N3, ballast) - 200
AMERICAN HALL:
American Championship : Chapparal 2D (R1, ballast) - 200
Stars and Stripes : Lexus SC300 (used) - 200
American Muscle Car Championship : Ford RS200 road - 200
Classic Muscle Car Championship : Corvette Convertible 54 200
SPECIAL CONDITION HALL:
Various cars here, I cant remember which is for which race, but I did use the RAM for Ice Arena.
Lancer rally car 83, Nissan 240RS rally car, Mitsubishi 3000GT SR(used), Dodge RAM, Nissan Bluebird rally car. 200 all races.
Tsukuba wet cant remember but pretty much anything works here anyway
One-Make Races
--------------
For one model races I used N1s and 200 ballast for all of them.
For races that could have a used version in (Audi TT) I used the second hand version.
Problem manufacturers (either very hard to win, or require numerous line-up changes for high points)
Mini Mini One (vs 3 Cooper S) 200
Mercedes Silver Arrow AMG 190e evo road (SLR started behind) 200
Mercedes SL 300SL (S3) (600 started at back) 200
Mazda RX RX-7 85 - 200
Races that need oil wear for 200 -
Alpine race (A310, 7000 miles)
S7 Club - (S7, N2, 5000 miles)
VW Gti Cup - (polo gti, N1, 5000 miles, ballast)
BMW 1-series - (120i, 5000 miles vs 4x120d)
Lotus Classics - (Elan, 7000 miles vs 4xEuropa)
RX-8 - (RX-8 type E, 3000 miles)
Suzuki K-car (Alto Lapin Turbo/NOS/Ballast/N1/9000 miles)
the non-200 races are:-
MG Festival - 179 (MGF, used, N1, Ballast)
Triumph Spitfire Cup - 159 (Spitfire, 10000 miles, N1, ballast)
Crossfire Trophy - 182 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
2HP-2CV - 134 - (10000 miles, ballast, N1)
Megane Cup - 169 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Audi A3 Cup - 182 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Daihatsu Copen Challenge - 166 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Isuzu Sports - 179 (Coupe, used, ballast, N1, NOS)
Subaru 360 race - 142 (10000 miles, ballast, N1, NOS)
Hyundai Sports - 176 (coupe/tiburion, 9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Midget race - 153 (used, N1, ballast, NOS)
BEGINNER HALL:
Sunday Cup : Toyota Yaris - 200
FF Challenge : Mini One - 200
FR Challenge : Ginetta G4 (ballast) 200
MR Challenge : MGF (NA stage 1? I think) -200
4WD Challenge : Toyota Celica (An old one, 85 mybe) - 200
Light Weight K Cup : Honda Life Step Van (NOS) - 200
Spider & Roadster : Corvette Convetible '54 (Custom Gearbox)- 200
Sport Truck Race : Dodge RAM - 200
PROFESSIONAL HALL:
Clubman Cup : Dodge RAM (yeah I know) 200
Tuning Car Grand Prix : Amuse S2000 R1 200
Race of NA Sports : Opel Speedster (cant recall mods) - 200
Race of Turbo Sports : Opel Speedster Turbo (Turbo stage 2) -200
Boxer Spirit : Subaru Legacy B4 Blitzen - 200
World Classic Car Series : VW Karmann Ghia (N2/N3, NA stage 1) 200
World Compact Car Race : Suzuki cappuccino (N3) - 200
Supercar Festival : Callaway C12 (put NA2 change to NA1) 200
Gran Turismo World Championship : Nissan R390 GT1 (used, R1) - 200
EXTREME HALL:
Gran Turismo All Stars : Ford GT LM spec-II - 200
Dream Car Championship : AMG Merc 190 touring car - 200
Polyphony Digital Cup : Dodge RAM (racing Trans) - 200
Like The Wind : TVR Speed 12 (N3) - 200
Formula GT World : Audi R8 (R1) - 200
Real Circuit Tours : Nissan R390 Gt1 (R1) - 200
Premium Sports Lounge : BMW M3 GTR (ballast) - 200
ENDURANCE HALL:
Grand Valley 300km: Audi S4 (ballast, N2) - 200
Laguna Seca 200 mile: Camaro Iroc-Z - 200
Roadster 4 Hours Endurance : MX-5 89 (used, N1, ballast) - 200
Tokyo R246 300km : BMW 320i touring (NA stage 2) - 200
Super Speedway 150 Miles : Mazda 787B (used, R1, ballast) - 200
Nurburgring 24 Hours Endurance : BMW 320i touring (R1, ballast) - 200
Nurburgring 4 Hours Endurance : ASL Garaiya (N3) - 200
Motegi 8 Hours Endurance : Nissan 240RS - 200
Tsukuba 9 Hours Endurance : Nissan 240RS - 200
Fuji 1000km : R390 Gt1 (R1, used) - 200
Sarthe Circuit 24 Hours I : Nissan R390 Gt1 (R1) - 200
Sarthe Circuit 24 Hours II : Nissan R390 Gt1 (used, R1) - 200
Infineon World Sport Car Trophy : Nissan R390 Gt1 (used, R1) - 200
El Captain 200 Miles : BMW M3 200
New York 200 Miles : Honda HSC (N1) 200
JAPANESE HALL:
Japanese Championship : ASL Garaiya - 200
Japanese GT Championship : Suzuki GSX/4 (R1) 200
Japanese 70's Classic : Skyline GT-R KCGP whatever 70 - 200
Japanese 80's Festival : A Celica of some sort (cant remember)
Japanese 90's Challenge : Skyline GTS25 R32 '95? (used, N2)
Japanese Compact Car Cup : Suzuki Cappuchino (N1, ballast) - 200
EUROPEAN HALL:
European Championship :
British GT Cup : Jaguar S-type R - 200
British Light Weight : Triumph Spitfire (Weight stage 1) - 200
German Touring Car Championship : AMG Merc Evo touring (S2) 200
Italian Festival : Fiat Barchetta - 200
French Championship : Alpine A310 (N1, ballast) - 200
European Classic Car Championship : VW Karmann Ghia (N2, NA stage 1) - 200
European Hot Hatch Car Championship : BMW 120i - 200
1000 Miles : VW Karmann Ghia - (N2, NA Stage 1, NOS) - 200
Schwarzwald Liga A : BMW 120i - 200
Schwarzwald Liga B : Audi S4 (N3, ballast) - 200
AMERICAN HALL:
American Championship : Chapparal 2D (R1, ballast) - 200
Stars and Stripes : Lexus SC300 (used) - 200
American Muscle Car Championship : Ford RS200 road - 200
Classic Muscle Car Championship : Corvette Convertible 54 200
SPECIAL CONDITION HALL:
Various cars here, I cant remember which is for which race, but I did use the RAM for Ice Arena.
Lancer rally car 83, Nissan 240RS rally car, Mitsubishi 3000GT SR(used), Dodge RAM, Nissan Bluebird rally car. 200 all races.
Tsukuba wet cant remember but pretty much anything works here anyway
One-Make Races
--------------
For one model races I used N1s and 200 ballast for all of them.
For races that could have a used version in (Audi TT) I used the second hand version.
Problem manufacturers (either very hard to win, or require numerous line-up changes for high points)
Mini Mini One (vs 3 Cooper S) 200
Mercedes Silver Arrow AMG 190e evo road (SLR started behind) 200
Mercedes SL 300SL (S3) (600 started at back) 200
Mazda RX RX-7 85 - 200
Races that need oil wear for 200 -
Alpine race (A310, 7000 miles)
S7 Club - (S7, N2, 5000 miles)
VW Gti Cup - (polo gti, N1, 5000 miles, ballast)
BMW 1-series - (120i, 5000 miles vs 4x120d)
Lotus Classics - (Elan, 7000 miles vs 4xEuropa)
RX-8 - (RX-8 type E, 3000 miles)
Suzuki K-car (Alto Lapin Turbo/NOS/Ballast/N1/9000 miles)
the non-200 races are:-
MG Festival - 179 (MGF, used, N1, Ballast)
Triumph Spitfire Cup - 159 (Spitfire, 10000 miles, N1, ballast)
Crossfire Trophy - 182 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
2HP-2CV - 134 - (10000 miles, ballast, N1)
Megane Cup - 169 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Audi A3 Cup - 182 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Daihatsu Copen Challenge - 166 (9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Isuzu Sports - 179 (Coupe, used, ballast, N1, NOS)
Subaru 360 race - 142 (10000 miles, ballast, N1, NOS)
Hyundai Sports - 176 (coupe/tiburion, 9000 miles, ballast, N1)
Midget race - 153 (used, N1, ballast, NOS)
- 161
- Cards06
Route 66 is the man! Great job. I have a little over 60,000 and have been wondering if the 100k could be reached. You have given me the inspiration to go for it. Again, congrats!
- 410
yeti
Well... I'm not to the point route is for A-spec points to provide a COMPLETE breakdown, but I've been working on just that for weeks (slowly adding for every race). Basically I've been trying to put together an A-Spec FAQ for a while but it's a long process. There is a detailed race breakdown.
If you'd care to take a peek, I appreciate any feedback you'd have to offer.
B-spec Point Theory and Possible Application to A-spec
There is no need to point me in the direction of a B-spec topic; I have what I consider to be the best available information on B-spec. Team B-spec has noticed a relationship between A-spec and B-spec points, but a direct correlation has not been found. I suspect that the same basic mechanism is used to score both types of points, so I am looking for clues by visiting this A-spec thread. I am also offering notes for comparison, hoping that lessons learned from B-spec can help solves some of the mysteries of A-spec. If these notes do not seem to apply, they can be ignored.
There appears to be a hard limit of 10000 B-spec points. This goal has only been reported twice. The B-spec points are used up once collected, so the goal for B-spec is to collect different hidden points. Recent tests seem to confirm that the major influences for changing the point class of a car are, power (PWR), weight, tires, and down-force (also track).
Some cars seem more likely to collect B-spec points, and this is often dependent on the track. Limited testing using A-spec and Championship series to maintain a constant lineup has not shown any difference in track class difficulty. However, when it was discovered that all points could be earned with a predetermined set of cars and tunings by racing Family Cups only, most of the testing on cars and tracks was abandoned. (If you havent been to the Family Cups, then there are probably a lot of Best A-spec = 000 races on your gamesave.)
Testing on Family Cups might also provide clues to A-spec car mysteries. The competition of Family Cup is selected based on the car and tuning entered in the race. By adjusting the difficulty setting, it may be possible to force the game to identify in advance which cars qualify for certain classes. My experience was that the Dodge RAM 1500 Laramie was an annoying opponent and worth avoiding by maintaining a slightly higher difficulty. If there is a relationship between this car and other big point cars, then the Toyota PRIUS G Touring Selection may be a good choice for A-spec points.
It is my understanding that the online play engine is intact for GT4 and can be accessed by LAN play and internet trickery. If the mechanism intended for scoring online races is related to A-spec points, then it may be possible to control the competition and make more precise measurements of the influence of different upgrades and handicaps. To this end, lag would not be an important factor.
30% of B-spec points are specific to 58 tracks. These points appear least related to A-spec points, so I encourage people not to generalize too much. The points are divided between 4 major power classes; cars can be tuned across classes. In order to make predications match observations, I found it necessary to calculate B-spec points using units of 1/29th of a point. If B-spec points are not solid, then A-spec points may also contain fractions.
70% of B-spec points must be earned by selecting or tuning cars between all of the power (PWR) classes. Im hoping to learn more about these points by studying A-spec points. Team B-spec is currently stuck using 4 cars (8 separate tunings) to collect all of these points on a single track and little progress has been made to apply what has been learned to normal play, or other cars and tracks. Limited testing with a Subaru 360 provided some insights into B-spec points by restricting all points to the bottom of the power spectrum.
I have had some success applying an additional handicap to a car by damaging the engine with used oil. A car can be set to practice using B-spec at triple speed overnight and it will not stop to pit and revert to normal time. This may be useful to someone trying to scrape a few more A-spec points out of a race. It is my understanding that cars traded from a copy of a gamesave (or purchased used), will come with dirty oil, which may speed up this process. This procedure may also restore weight removed by weight reduction or modifications to port polish and engine balancing. I have not tested these ideas.
I would be interested to learn if a point relationship has been found between the 4 class influences; power (PWR), weight, tires, and down-force. For example, -10 A-spec = +20HP = -50kg ballast = N1 to N3 tires = +8, +8 down-force. Can ballast weight exactly replace weight reduction? Is a wing with no down-force the same as no wing? Is there a class distinction between Normal, Sport, and/or Racing tires?
Hopefully, some of this information will be useful to Team A-spec, and I have convinced a few members that Team B-spec is working just as hard to solve a difficult puzzle. To be blunt, I am suggesting that neither team will solve their respective mysteries independently. The people who are most likely to solve this puzzle, will have a good understanding of A-spec and B-spec.
There is no need to point me in the direction of a B-spec topic; I have what I consider to be the best available information on B-spec. Team B-spec has noticed a relationship between A-spec and B-spec points, but a direct correlation has not been found. I suspect that the same basic mechanism is used to score both types of points, so I am looking for clues by visiting this A-spec thread. I am also offering notes for comparison, hoping that lessons learned from B-spec can help solves some of the mysteries of A-spec. If these notes do not seem to apply, they can be ignored.
There appears to be a hard limit of 10000 B-spec points. This goal has only been reported twice. The B-spec points are used up once collected, so the goal for B-spec is to collect different hidden points. Recent tests seem to confirm that the major influences for changing the point class of a car are, power (PWR), weight, tires, and down-force (also track).
Some cars seem more likely to collect B-spec points, and this is often dependent on the track. Limited testing using A-spec and Championship series to maintain a constant lineup has not shown any difference in track class difficulty. However, when it was discovered that all points could be earned with a predetermined set of cars and tunings by racing Family Cups only, most of the testing on cars and tracks was abandoned. (If you havent been to the Family Cups, then there are probably a lot of Best A-spec = 000 races on your gamesave.)
Testing on Family Cups might also provide clues to A-spec car mysteries. The competition of Family Cup is selected based on the car and tuning entered in the race. By adjusting the difficulty setting, it may be possible to force the game to identify in advance which cars qualify for certain classes. My experience was that the Dodge RAM 1500 Laramie was an annoying opponent and worth avoiding by maintaining a slightly higher difficulty. If there is a relationship between this car and other big point cars, then the Toyota PRIUS G Touring Selection may be a good choice for A-spec points.
It is my understanding that the online play engine is intact for GT4 and can be accessed by LAN play and internet trickery. If the mechanism intended for scoring online races is related to A-spec points, then it may be possible to control the competition and make more precise measurements of the influence of different upgrades and handicaps. To this end, lag would not be an important factor.
30% of B-spec points are specific to 58 tracks. These points appear least related to A-spec points, so I encourage people not to generalize too much. The points are divided between 4 major power classes; cars can be tuned across classes. In order to make predications match observations, I found it necessary to calculate B-spec points using units of 1/29th of a point. If B-spec points are not solid, then A-spec points may also contain fractions.
70% of B-spec points must be earned by selecting or tuning cars between all of the power (PWR) classes. Im hoping to learn more about these points by studying A-spec points. Team B-spec is currently stuck using 4 cars (8 separate tunings) to collect all of these points on a single track and little progress has been made to apply what has been learned to normal play, or other cars and tracks. Limited testing with a Subaru 360 provided some insights into B-spec points by restricting all points to the bottom of the power spectrum.
I have had some success applying an additional handicap to a car by damaging the engine with used oil. A car can be set to practice using B-spec at triple speed overnight and it will not stop to pit and revert to normal time. This may be useful to someone trying to scrape a few more A-spec points out of a race. It is my understanding that cars traded from a copy of a gamesave (or purchased used), will come with dirty oil, which may speed up this process. This procedure may also restore weight removed by weight reduction or modifications to port polish and engine balancing. I have not tested these ideas.
I would be interested to learn if a point relationship has been found between the 4 class influences; power (PWR), weight, tires, and down-force. For example, -10 A-spec = +20HP = -50kg ballast = N1 to N3 tires = +8, +8 down-force. Can ballast weight exactly replace weight reduction? Is a wing with no down-force the same as no wing? Is there a class distinction between Normal, Sport, and/or Racing tires?
Hopefully, some of this information will be useful to Team A-spec, and I have convinced a few members that Team B-spec is working just as hard to solve a difficult puzzle. To be blunt, I am suggesting that neither team will solve their respective mysteries independently. The people who are most likely to solve this puzzle, will have a good understanding of A-spec and B-spec.
- 629
- South Texas
- RRoD#9799827.3
Orion_SR
Some of what you are looking for can be found here:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=63174
- 410
Orion_SR
Tracks do not affect A-Spec points. That, I can guarantee.
Yes, some cars have a seemingly "natural" capacity to collect more A-Spec points than others. I speculate this is because of a pre-calculated base value for each car that is changed with modifications to the car.
Note: The number of ASpec points that the Family Cups provide has been tested. It's 200 for ALL of them combined. (So just pick your favorite track, get the 200 and it will be reflected as the highest ASpec point score for all the other tracks)
Orion_SR
This is already possible. Online is not necessary to achieve this. Controlling the competition is easy. Resetting the console will provide the same set of lineups. NOTE: lineups are *dependent* upon YOUR car. I'm also beginning to suspect that the lineups (yes ALL of them) are ALWAYS the same for a given car in a given race starting from console reset (meaning the random seed isn't saved, it's reset... bad programming
)If you'd care to help out with experiments your assistance would be greatly appreciated. I have several in mind.
Yes, ASpec point fractions are likely.
Yes, used oil will reduce ASpec points because it reduces HP for a given car. ASpec points are dependent on the cars HP.
It has yet to be determined whether ASpec points can be restored with ballast (for weight reductions) and port polish/engine balance for used oil.
My guess is... No. Adding mods and ballast seems to be a +/- deal and it seems very unlikely that PWR is calculated on the fly. Given these two factors, it's unlikely that you can "restore" A-Spec points taken away from WRs via ballast. Same with PP and EB.
(Note: A simple oil change will take care of used oil but not "permanent engine damage" that is derived from long use).
Orion_SR
Yes, HP, weight tires and downforce are the 4 things you can do to YOUR car to change points. Yes, they all seem to be +/- relationships although further testing is required. The key point changer is the opposing lineup.
Orion_SR
Good question. Unlikely but needs to be tested.
Orion_SR
Yes. A store bought wing defaults with 0/0 downforce. Installing it doesn't affect points. Changing the downforce does.
Orion_SR
Yes.
Thank you for your observations! 👍
Restoring Resetting Permanent Modifications
Perhaps I was misunderstood. This is likely when joining a thread mid-topic. The procedure I considered for restoring weight reduction, port polish, and engine balance is based on reports that all upgrades and parts are removed from cars which are traded from another memory card. This has led me to believe that permanent modifications would also be reset to default. This is probably not relevant to the conversation. I was suggesting a procedure to quickly dirty the oil and intentionally damage an engine so additional points could be received for the race if a less competitive car could qualify. (If I only get 190 A-spec points with 200kg ballast and N1 tires and the worst possible car, what else can I do? Damage the engine.)
Family Cups and Predetermined Base Levels
Finding a Base Level for each car would certainly lead to progress for A-spec and B-spec. Finding a method to quickly determine which cars are considered comparable might help people generalize tests performed on one car to others in the same general class. I feel there is some potential to research in this area so I will try to explain my observations and assumptions more clearly.
If I enter an Impreza WRX Sedan in a Family Cup race, I expect to see other Imprezas, Skylines and uh a 3000GT if I leave the difficulty at level 0 because these cars are relatively equal. As I adjust the difficulty settings, I notice more difference in the cars used by the competition than any modification to how fast they drive. This has led me to suspect that the difficulty setting can be used to force (base level) class changes compared to the car entered in the race. I am gathering information that might be used to test this idea, but I am not likely to begin testing until predictions can be made in advance. This is a rough outline of a test in case someone wanted to make preliminary observations. I believe cars from the same class (in this case Tuner, Race, Normal, and maybe others apply) are spawned so the process may need to be repeated for each class.
Start a Family Cup race with a Subaru 360
Set difficulty -10, record the competition.
Record a sampling of the competition for each level up to +10.
Choose a car from the +5 competition sample.
Repeat the procedure up through the Speed 12 range.
A complete list and testing for all cars may not be necessary if Family Cups can be used as a test. If I enter my tuned car in a Family Cup, it may be possible to predict the class of my car by comparing it to what is known about the competition sample selected for difficulty 0.
Family Cups as a Glitch Detector
I found it interesting that Team A-spec has identified the Dodge Ram as a glitch car. This car tended to be much more powerful than the other cars entered in the same family cup (vs. VW Lupo 1.4, -4, from memory). This led me to suspect that other glitches or anomalies might be discovered by racing Family Cups and recording which cars tended to outclass the rest of the competition (any car that wins Nurburgring by a minute or so, they should be relatively equal). These cars may provide an easier win when entered in a 200 point A-spec race. I have suggested that the Toyota PRIUS G Touring Selection may be one of these cars, but it didnt seem quite as glitchy as the Dodge RAM 1500 Laramie.
Testing and Theories
A word of caution; many of my ideas have turned out to be completely wrong, but they occasionally lead to new developments anyway. I am comfortable with this. I have recently completed a great deal of testing and Im tired. Team B-spec seems to have stalled, and Im not going to carry on with testing alone, but all of my memory cards have saves with carefully sorted points with the potential to make important tests. This makes new testing, and even playing, somewhat awkward.
Perhaps I was misunderstood. This is likely when joining a thread mid-topic. The procedure I considered for restoring weight reduction, port polish, and engine balance is based on reports that all upgrades and parts are removed from cars which are traded from another memory card. This has led me to believe that permanent modifications would also be reset to default. This is probably not relevant to the conversation. I was suggesting a procedure to quickly dirty the oil and intentionally damage an engine so additional points could be received for the race if a less competitive car could qualify. (If I only get 190 A-spec points with 200kg ballast and N1 tires and the worst possible car, what else can I do? Damage the engine.)
Family Cups and Predetermined Base Levels
Finding a Base Level for each car would certainly lead to progress for A-spec and B-spec. Finding a method to quickly determine which cars are considered comparable might help people generalize tests performed on one car to others in the same general class. I feel there is some potential to research in this area so I will try to explain my observations and assumptions more clearly.
If I enter an Impreza WRX Sedan in a Family Cup race, I expect to see other Imprezas, Skylines and uh a 3000GT if I leave the difficulty at level 0 because these cars are relatively equal. As I adjust the difficulty settings, I notice more difference in the cars used by the competition than any modification to how fast they drive. This has led me to suspect that the difficulty setting can be used to force (base level) class changes compared to the car entered in the race. I am gathering information that might be used to test this idea, but I am not likely to begin testing until predictions can be made in advance. This is a rough outline of a test in case someone wanted to make preliminary observations. I believe cars from the same class (in this case Tuner, Race, Normal, and maybe others apply) are spawned so the process may need to be repeated for each class.
Start a Family Cup race with a Subaru 360
Set difficulty -10, record the competition.
Record a sampling of the competition for each level up to +10.
Choose a car from the +5 competition sample.
Repeat the procedure up through the Speed 12 range.
A complete list and testing for all cars may not be necessary if Family Cups can be used as a test. If I enter my tuned car in a Family Cup, it may be possible to predict the class of my car by comparing it to what is known about the competition sample selected for difficulty 0.
Family Cups as a Glitch Detector
I found it interesting that Team A-spec has identified the Dodge Ram as a glitch car. This car tended to be much more powerful than the other cars entered in the same family cup (vs. VW Lupo 1.4, -4, from memory). This led me to suspect that other glitches or anomalies might be discovered by racing Family Cups and recording which cars tended to outclass the rest of the competition (any car that wins Nurburgring by a minute or so, they should be relatively equal). These cars may provide an easier win when entered in a 200 point A-spec race. I have suggested that the Toyota PRIUS G Touring Selection may be one of these cars, but it didnt seem quite as glitchy as the Dodge RAM 1500 Laramie.
Testing and Theories
A word of caution; many of my ideas have turned out to be completely wrong, but they occasionally lead to new developments anyway. I am comfortable with this. I have recently completed a great deal of testing and Im tired. Team B-spec seems to have stalled, and Im not going to carry on with testing alone, but all of my memory cards have saves with carefully sorted points with the potential to make important tests. This makes new testing, and even playing, somewhat awkward.
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- Zenkatt
That musta been some hardcore gaming to pull that off in a month. I got the game at the end of Feb. like most people in the US, and have hit 83k/80% just tonight. Guess i can be considered as taking my time.
I was planning to have the most Aspec of anybody, and did for quite awhile, but i got passed by rather quickly. Guess i should hope to at least match the final score that route66 is going to have in a bit.
I was planning to have the most Aspec of anybody, and did for quite awhile, but i got passed by rather quickly. Guess i should hope to at least match the final score that route66 is going to have in a bit.
Zenkat
Hey ... I've been busy for the last week or so (no GT4)
and missed both your posts until just now.Congratulations to both of you (Zenkat & Route) for the high A-spec scores. Well done. 👍
I passed 50,000 a week or so ago and was pretty pleased with myself, but 80,000+ and now, over 100,000 is amazing.
I do like the A-spec system and enjoyed very much reading and posting the odd thing to this thread - I love puzzles and maximizing A-spec points makes for a great one. Thanks to all the contributors as well for their recommendations for good, competitive A-spec races they are all valuable and I have tried a few of these suggestions and found them to be a source of great GT4 fun.
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