Mad FinnTuners Co.™ - Finished 301010 with GT-Rdammerung - BIG THANKS everyone!

  • Thread starter Greycap
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Greycap
Codename LThe thing is that it all can be controlled with the right foot. You can use about 50% throttle in the first gear, around 75% until 5000 rpm in the second and then floor it all the way to the redline of the sixth. Nobody forces you to use the full power in all situations and even common sense should say that less is more at low speeds when there are nearly a thousand horses on tap. It takes skill to control the power but it's definitely possible and after all, it's an Expert rated car so it takes an Expert driver too.
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Yes. Something I realized after one lap of driving the car was that, as you say, wheelspin can be controlled in first gear with 50% throttle. But you also have to remember than in most racing situations, a bad move against the AI, you won't have time to think "Oh, I need to just imput half the pressure to the X unlike I would normally do." I think that is just too much dramatized, but it pretty much explains the problem. On time trials, where you can keep focused as long as you want to, unlike long races, you really can do whatever you want. But in long races, after a while, you get tired and really can't think about controlling the throttle.
I absolutely think you are right about the Expert part. Anyone who is an expert driver can control the power. I guess I was too much eager to floor down the pedal yo, !!111!OneEleven!!ExclamationMark! I will give it a try today. I will give you the results tomorrow 👍 Funny enough, yesterday I was writing something about lack of patience :lol: Guess I should listen to my own advices.
 
You thought we hadn't noticed it's almost April Fools' Day, didn't you?
These Mad Files cars should truly be mad.
 
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S-Line Audi Fan, Just asking. I was bit irritated that they're integrating the R8 style to every possible car in the lineup.. it sort of makes R8 less special.


oh, and the Mad Files? well, today you shall see at least first one of them.. :mischievous: is it crazy? I guarantee it.
 
Leonidae
S-Line Audi Fan, Just asking. I was bit irritated that they're integrating the R8 style to every possible car in the lineup.. it sort of makes R8 less special.


oh, and the Mad Files? well, today you shall see at least first one of them.. :mischievous: is it crazy? I guarantee it.
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Yes you're right about that.. Any new Audi has the R8 style, which, as you said, makes the R8 less special.. The R8 should be highlighted 👍

Oh, a new car in the "Mad Files"? - Let's see what you did 💡
 
TVR Cerbera Speed 12 '00

1010 bhp, 1034 Nm, 1020 kg


Clickable for full size​



Parts to fit:
Brake Balance Controller
Turbo Kit Stage 4
FC Transmission
FC LSD
FC Suspension
R3 Tyres
Oil Change
Rear Wing
New Wheels (optional)

Suspension
Spring Rate: 9.0 / 9.0
Ride Height: 80 / 95
Bound: 4 / 4
Rebound: 7 / 5
Camber: 2.0 / 1.5
Toe: 0 / -2
Stabilizers: 1 / 1

Brake Controller
Brakes: 9 / 7

Transmission

Note: First, reset the gearbox to the default settings, then set the Auto setting, and only then set the gear ratios.

Gear Ratios
1st: 3.365
2nd: 2.157
3rd: 1.575
4th: 1.230
5th: 1.000
6th: 0.838
Final Gear: 3.200

Autoset 20

LSD
Initial: 10
Acceleration: 25
Deceleration: 5

Downforce
Amount: 30 / 40

Driving Aids
ASM Oversteer: 0
ASM Understeer: 0
TCS: 0

If the thought of someone trying to build a turbocharged Cerbera Speed 12 that is drivable as a track racer doesn't pass as an April Fool's joke, I have no idea what does. Not only that but it seems that PD made even more of a joke out of the car. Practically no brakes to be mentioned, suspension setup ranges that don't make tuning any easier. But let's see.

The suspension is a derivative of an older Cerbera Speed Six in my garage (not the same one we have here) and while there are similarities there are also a lot of differences, the biggest of which is the increase in the spring rates. Well, I'd like softer ones but no joy. At least it's track ready now, the cobblestones may take your teeth out though. The engine received a small upgrade as if we're going over the top we'll do it properly with full four digits. There won't be a shortage of power, that's for sure. Somewhat of a shortage of traction though. But nothing to worry about, the drivetrain transfers the power to the tarmac excellently and the aerodynamics package ensures the car won't turn into an aircraft - although an aircraft powered by a big British V12 doesn't sound like a hopeless idea either.

Many of you are doubting its handling. Believe me, it's good as long as you take the enormous power into account. 60% throttle through the second gear, 90% until around 6000 rpm in the third, then weld the go pedal to the metal. And use the pedal alongside it earlier than you might think. Oddly enough it's our fastest Nürburgring road car, the good sides of the chassis get to shine there and the car should break 6'00 easily in capable hands. I'm at 6'05 at the moment and the time should come down, the latest settings weren't tested there but they took a second off the GVS time.

Reviews:

by DuoMaxwell
by Kingofweasles
by MinoltaMan89
by Nenad
by stidriver
 
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Review of the Audi RS5+

Braking:
I found the only one problem with the Audi's brakes. It will go into snap oversteer under high speed trail braking if you turn-in to fast.
Other than that the car is very good on brake's with control.

Suspension:

The RS5+ is mostly neutral at turn-in and mid turn with a tendency towards understeer. On the exits the car has a slite to small understeer at all speeds, but it's mostly on the slite side. A small backing out of the throttle will bring the car back on-line without upsetting the car. I also found that car does not like hitting the inside curbing/rumble strips. Doing so can upset the car exit of the turn alot.

Trans & diff:
The differentials setting are OK and keep wheel spin down to a minimum. I found the gearing to be a little off. The top end was OK, but the gear spacing was to open causing me to be in between gears alot. I tried closing up the spacing and dropped a little over half a second off my best lap time.

Overall I like the Audi RS5+ set-up and had fun driving it. My best lap time with the set-up was a 1'40.226 at GVS.:)

Greycap
stidriver - Another very interesting review seeing that the findings differ from the previous ones on several areas, especially the braking behaviour. Possible controller differences perhaps? But it also proves that the car is capable of astonishing performance when driven by an experienced driver.
Click to expand...
I was using the setting listed. I beleive is the little bit of
extra speed I was getting at the end of some of the straightaway that's causing the lock-up to show up.
 
Guten tag MFT....

I have just tested your wonderfull Speed 12. This car is an absolut BEAST!! The car seems to have a tad of unstability under braking, but not enough to get the car in any kind of trouble. The car has so much mechanical grip, or maybe aero grip, it is an absoute pleasure to drive. If you keep it one gear higher than it suggests, you can eliminate some of the wheelspin. The car also seems to understeer a bit, but thats expected due to the soft suspension. I managed a 1'46,501 at GVS, but im sure i can do better.

...thanks for the awesome Speed 12!! The car is very fun to drive!
 
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Just a quick question... with the Speed 12, if you wanted it to be ridiculously powerful, why didn't you go for the Supercharger?? Just curious, it puts out 1136BHP.
 
I think Greycap wants people to have traction in some gears, not wheelspin through all six gears Macca!! :P:sly:
 
mafia_boy
I think Greycap wants people to have traction in some gears, not wheelspin through all six gears Macca!! :P:sly:
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Well, he did say it was an April fools special...:D

Nah seriously, that's fair enough. And congrats for being brave enough to try tuning the Cerbera. I'll give it a proper review later in the week, along with one of these lightweight beasties :dopey:
 
Heldenzeit - Soft suspension? :odd: I'd like to have spring rates of maybe 6.0 / 5.0 but the game won't let me to. It's too stiff and skipping now but no can do. About the braking instability, oh yes it can get you into trouble. Advicable to avoid it though... but yes, undoubtedly a beast. Then again see past the power and there's quite a good handler hiding inside as you noticed.

mcsqueegy - part I - Because it also puts out nearly one and a half thousand Newtons of torque. At low revs.

mafia_boy - Indeed... with the supercharger it could probably break traction in the sixth gear from standing still. Not good, I'd say.

mcsqueegy - part II - One of the reasons I picked that model was actually the fact that nobody else seems to have been nuts enough to make a version with increased power, no aids and still some cornering capabilities left. Someone had to do it and I believe I managed well.

Leonidae - Believe me, it won't. I have inside knowledge. :D

S-Line Audi Fan - OK, now it's time for a glassfibre coffin... careful with that accelerator!
 
Greycap
S-Line Audi Fan - OK, now it's time for a glassfibre coffin... careful with that accelerator!
Click to expand...

Well, I'm back from driving this car.. eer.. monster.. Acceleration is enormous, as anyone can imagine.. The brakes are quite good.. 👍 The car is almost perfectly balanced.. You now ask why I say "almost perfectly", right? - I'll tell you: The car likes to understeer.. It's not extreme, it's just a little bit of understeer there, but sometimes there's too much understeer and you've to brake :ouch: The tyre wear is alright.. I tried to drive this monster at Nürburgring and could do one lap.. I tried to do another one, but.. let me just say it didn't work *cough*unstable*cough*.. Now to the wheelspin.. Of course there is.. But: I could handle it.. 50% throttle through first gear, 60-65% through second and then floor it in third after you've managed over about 5800 RPMs ;).. I've driven this car at Nürburgring and most of the time, I just let it in fourth (sometimes third).. The car has got enough torque to accelerate out of any corner fast :)..

Positive aspects:

- Acceleration
- Brakes
- Balance -> Tyre wear

Negative aspects:

- Balance -> understeer (but this shouldn't count as it's really minimal!)
- Wheelspin (It can easily been handled 👍)

9.5/10

OK, actually I haven't planed to review this car, but I just did.. It was your comment that made me do this :dopey:

Really really well done, Greycap :cheers: Not many people succeed tuning this car.. But you absolutely did 👍
 
I believe I know the reason to the understeer and I also know how to cure it. On the other hand I know that it'll turn the car into a total killer, reduce the rear downforce to 35 or 30 if you have the guts to do it. There won't be much trouble in handling it in the actual corners but brakings while turning become nightmarish. And one of the reasons, no doubt, is the simple fact that you think you're doing some 150 km/h while the actual figure is on the third hundred already. The sense of speed is missing completely.

Slightly unstable, yes. And again the stupidly high corner approach speeds aren't exactly helping the situation, I screwed up one good lap at Bergwerk when some minor bump upset the car in the fourth gear under full braking. The result today was 6'06 and the driver really wasn't up to the task thanks to a full working week, the outside kerbs weren't even close when exiting the corners. Some day I might get that 6'00.

Anyway, thanks for the test, let's see if we can get its counterpart out in the near future. 👍
 
Greycap
I believe I know the reason to the understeer and I also know how to cure it. On the other hand I know that it'll turn the car into a total killer, reduce the rear downforce to 35 or 30 if you have the guts to do it. There won't be much trouble in handling it in the actual corners but brakings while turning become nightmarish. And one of the reasons, no doubt, is the simple fact that you think you're doing some 150 km/h while the actual figure is on the third hundred already. The sense of speed is missing completely.
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I can totally understand your point.. Better have some understeer than a car you can't handle (that well).. Oh yes, the sense of speed is totally missing here.. :ill: ..

Greycap
Slightly unstable, yes. And again the stupidly high corner approach speeds aren't exactly helping the situation, I screwed up one good lap at Bergwerk when some minor bump upset the car in the fourth gear under full braking. The result today was 6'06 and the driver really wasn't up to the task thanks to a full working week, the outside kerbs weren't even close when exiting the corners. Some day I might get that 6'00.
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A 6'06? Hm, I'll try to beat that 👍 But I won't do it now, but tomorrow as I've just finished the "Formula GT"-Races.. And got that Sauber Mercedes C9 :sly: :dopey:

Greycap
Anyway, thanks for the test, let's see if we can get its counterpart out in the near future. 👍
Click to expand...

You're always welcome, pal :cheers: .. Oh and I have some ideas what car it could be, but let's just wait until it's uploaded :P
 
All these hi-powered cars are killed by the inaccurate sense of speed. Driving a certain 754 horsepower car recently (who shall remain nameless to avoid plugging.lol) I had a lot of trouble grading it. I could have easily mark it down for excessive understeer but then I had to take a look at the speedo. Damn GT-4 and it's numerous flaws.
 
That's pretty much the thing, with the Speed 12 it's even more pronounced as you're going down the straight in the 5th gear, approaching the redline. In just about every other car that means 260 km/h or so, in this one it's 320 km/h. No wonder it won't make even the easy turn without lifting off! Even the third gear goes to 180 km/h and causes some hairy situations attacking the usual "third gear corners".
 
OK, Greycap, I didn't manage a 6'06, but a 6'07.158 at Nürburgring.. I once missed the apex and had to brake, so that's the reason I couldn't finish the lap under 6'06.. But anyways, I'll try at least to get a 6'05 or 6'04 and I'll tell you then ;)
 
Honda NSX-R LM RoadCar'02

1005 bhp, 671 Nm, 1230 kg


Clickable for full size​

Parts to fit:
Brake Balance Controller
Turbo Kit Stage 4
FC Transmission
FC LSD
FC Suspension
R3 Tyres
Rigidity Increase (rollcage)
Oil Change
New Wheels (BBS)

Suspension
Spring Rate: 14.0 / 9.0
Ride Height: 85 / 90
Bound: 8 / 4
Rebound: 6 / 10
Camber: 2.0 / 1.5
Toe: 0 / 3
Stabilizers: 3 / 1

Brake Controller
Brakes: 3 / 3

Transmission

Note: First, reset the gearbox to the default settings, then set the Auto setting, and only then set the gear ratios.

Gear Ratios
1st: 4.011
2nd: 2.745
3rd: 2.040
4th: 1.586
5th: 1.270
6th: 1.040
Final Gear: 4.000

Autoset 12

LSD
Initial: 40
Acceleration: 30
Deceleration: 60

Downforce
Amount: 25 / 35

Driving Aids
ASM Oversteer: 0
ASM Understeer: 0
TCS: 0



I know that it's late.. But better late than never. And here it is, my 4-digit monster, NSX-R LM RoadCar'02, with 1005bhp. While the torque curve never meets the power curve, this car is anything else than a failure that doesn't meet the expectations. 180mph+? You got it. 10kRPM redline? Well, there ISN'T any redline, just limiter that kicks in at 10500rpm.. Turbo? Yeah, it has that too, and sound of Super GT monster. It even has roofscoop feeding cold air to the engine, just like the racing machine. Stay alert though, this lady warns you about microsecond before biting your head off.
 
Graycap I have bin playing around with the Speed 12 for a review and put some laps in at the Ring with it. I run a 5'56.742 so far and it has more time to be had.
 
:drool: Me want that NSX!


BTW, which model NSX is that? I couldn't find it in your PDF that you have on the first page of the thread.
 
stidriver - That sounds about right for what the car can do, I could probably break the 6'00 myself relatively easily if I could keep pushing and overcome the thought of the frustration of screwing up during the last rollercoaster section, that 6'05 included driving about flat out until Bergwerk and then mostly making sure I'll make it over the finish line.

Jim3142 - It's the NSX LM, the prize car of the Motegi endurance. The file is updated when I find the time to do it, which effectively means very randomly.
 
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My rewiew of the Godzilla.
I can see why it's called Godzilla just looking at the power curves. It's quite a handful to drive but the acceleration (or should I call it a rocket strapped to the car) is just brutal. And the top speed is... enough, over 340 km/h feels like warp speed. The cornering is good but flooring it while turning was fun, sideways we go. I think it's 10/10. Nice work overall, thanks you MFT.
Now, I give you a challenge. Can you make an Aston Martin DB9 to a DBR9 and make it faster than the Corvette C5R and the Team Oreca Viper around perhaps your test track? Thanks in advance for that. :)
 
Finnish Bomber

Those cars you mentioned are a lot lighter and have superior downforce when compared to tuned DB9.. tuned DB9 vs stock racecar on same tyres and similar downforce levels.. hmm.. It really depends of the driver in the end. But I shall see what I can do.
 
Greycap
stidriver - That sounds about right for what the car can do, I could probably break the 6'00 myself relatively easily if I could keep pushing and overcome the thought of the frustration of screwing up during the last rollercoaster section, that 6'05 included driving about flat out until Bergwerk and then mostly making sure I'll make it over the finish line.
Click to expand...
I can see the car getting into the 54's with a go for it lap and maybe more. As a superchanged 12 running R5's tires will get into the 38's.
 
My review of the Speed 12:

The TVR Speed 12. The car previously known as untamable. Could somebody possibly complete a task before perceived as impossible?

First of all, nothing matches this thing for the dramatic factor when accelerating. I've driven 1200bhp Minoltas (hence my username) and R92CPs, and they can't touch this thing for that feeling.

The biggest problem with the standard Speed 12 is the wheelspin. The regular car will spin the rears in fifth, which sounds amazing before you've tried it. It's very annoying. But in the MFT model, you give it about 60 percent throttle in 1st, 80 in 2nd, and when you reach 7000 in third...BANG! Full throttle. The S12 takes off like a jet fighter. Grey, you've done a masterful job of tuning the LSD.

The other reason I love the MFT Speed 12 is because it's so ridiculous. 1010 bhp is not necessary at all. I love that. Sure, it destroys the rears in 3rd if you're not careful, its high-speed stability is questionable, and it will spin on uneven surfaces if you're not putting 100% attention into the drive. I love it because it's a challenge.

I took it to Nurb, and it was fantastic when I could control it. It defaulted to mild to moderate understeer in mid-speed corners. On the 150-ish mph sections, its stability was not the best, as I said before. With countless crashes, my best time was a massively embarrassing 7'12.

On Sarthe II, I managed 258 mph with your gearing with nitrous. My best time was a 3'23, which translates to around three and a half without it. Not as fast as the faultless Grim R34per, but impressive for me. Let's see what you get.

So, for being such a monster originally, and for being a load of jet-powered, challenging fun, I give the MFT TVR Cerbera Speed 12 a 10/10.

That NSX will be easier to drive, but not nearly as much fun. Expect a review in the next week. If it doesn't come, don't be surprised.

I'm interested in a DBR9 too, just a fun car though, not a fastest-laptime car. I don't play GT4 much anymore.
 
Nice new car, Leo 👍 I'll look up the car in my garage and if I haven't got it, I'll do the race ;)

EDIT: Just broke up the Tsukuba 9h Enduro at about 4 hours, I'm going to do the Montegi Enduro now..
 
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MinoltaMan89 - Sarthe II... I've done that already. With a setup that wasn't finished yet and that understeered quite a bit more I drove 3'09 without nitrous, topping out at 390 km/h which equals 242 mph. The gearing is still the same. I don't actually know about the goodness of the LSD, it's as open as I could make it while retaining two-wheel burnouts and that's simply all it took. The entire car is indeed best described as challenging, both for the tuner and for the driver.

About the NSX, I wouldn't necessarily call it easier to drive. With the Speed 12 you know you're going to crash it and drive accordingly, with the NSX you'll just crash spectacularly all of a sudden.

And my own Nordschleife time attack project - now driving at full tilt for the entire lap - proceeds, the best (and only) complete lap of today resulted in 6'06 including spending a lot of time in the Pflanzgarten sand trap. The last try ended in a disaster, I was more than seven seconds ahead when coming out of Pflanzgarten II and lost control rocketing towards Schwalbenschwantz. 5'58 should be in my reach.
 
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