FITT - Moving on to GT6!

DigitalBaka · Aug 17, 2011

* * * FITT has moved to GT6! * * *
Follow us in our new home!

Welcome to F.I.T.T., the
Federation of International Tuners and Test-Drivers!

Our Mission

Thank you for taking a look at FITT! Here we feel that tuning competitions and test driving provide invaluable feedback to the GTPlanet and Gran Turismo tuning and racing community.

Tuners use these competitions to test and refine their skills against some of the best GT5 tuners from around the globe. There are no borders or barriers in a FITT Tuning Shootout.

Test drivers also compete with each other, sometimes formally and sometimes just for bragging rights, but also provide valuable feedback to the individual tuners and to those following the competition.

Interested fans can use the tunes provided to make their own racing and driving experience more enjoyable and competitive.

Everyone has fun and everyone benefits from a well run Tuning Shootout!

Our Goals

At FITT our goals are:

Provide a standardized format for Tuning Shootouts that enables tuners, test drivers and observers to participate under the umbrella of a consistent, equitable and limited set of guidelines. When you see the FITT banner sanctioning a Tuning Shootout, you can be certain the event will be well organized, time efficient and of course, fun.

Promote awareness of all officially sanctioned FITT events, both past and present, and be a historical reference point for anyone researching previous tuning competitions.

Be a resource center and provide support for past and future Event Sponsors.

Extend an invitation and actively encourage participation in FITT sanctioned events by all members of the GTPlanet and general GT Community, regardless of their level of tuning and driving skill or experience.

The FITT Council and Competition Committee (FITTCCC) will always be open to constructive feedback, and will continue to explore and test new contest formats and guidelines to make Tuning Shootouts more enjoyable and competitive for everyone.

Social Media

Follow us on your favorite social sites! FITT has a home on both Facebook and Twitter. If you have an idea for an event, want to see who wins what or just want to hangout with the members of FITT outside of GTPlanet feel free to join us!

Facebook Page - http://www.facebook.com/GTPFITT
Twitter Feed - http://www.twitter.com/GTPFITT

FITT Council and Competition Committee Members

Online Tuning Room

For FITT members and friends, ACSR421 has been kind enough to open an online tuning room to be available 24/7! It is intended to be a friendly gathering spot to share ideas, test out tunes and get advice. To join, simply send a PSN friend request to ACS_Test-n-Tune and click the lounge coffee cup. ACSR is planning to have some events in the room which will be posted on the message board. You may also join the group here on GTPlanet. Hope to see you there!

Ticket Booth

FITT member CyKosis has taken up a collection for all available prize tickets. The purpose is to create a repository to be used for both prizes and for tuners having trouble finding a particular car for an event. These tickets will be available to all FITT members and event tuners at any time, trade schedule permitting. If you are in need of something please coordinate the trade with Cy.

This is being done as a kind gesture for the community and any who would abuse Cy's kindness will not be allowed to take part.

DigitalBaka · Aug 17, 2011

Standardized rules

1)Each tuner may submit one entry for the challenge unless otherwise provisioned in the event rules.

2)Car limitations and restrictions will be set by the Event Sponsor (hereafter ES).

3)All tunes and test results must be submitted no later than the deadline specified by the ES. Greenwich Mean Time (GMT) is the standard time used for all deadlines. Please be sure to use the time calculator provided if you're unsure of the deadline or look at the chart provided in the FAQ in post #4.

4)The ES will designate which track(s) cars are to be tested on as well as all testing parameters. Cars are to be tested exactly as written by the tuner. ES will determine if test cars are to be placed on "share" by tuners or purchased individually by testers. It is at the discretion of the ES to decide if tuners may participate as drivers. Drivers must submit a time/review for all cars by the testing deadline. The winner will be determined by a formula set by ES.

5)Test drivers are expected to be very conscientious in setting up their test facilities to ensure equal testing parameters for all vehicles. The ES reserves the right to question any and all lap times submitted by test drivers. At the discretion of the ES, a test driver may be asked to repeat testing for the car (s) in question or all cars in the contest, or may choose to exclude any and all times associated with the test driver in question. Also at the discretion of the ES, the test driver may be asked to produce photo or video proof of unusual lap times.

6)Prizes, if any, are to be established before the contest begins by the ES, along with all relevant parameters regarding qualification, payout dates, etc.

13) Driver feedback, both positive and negative, is strongly encouraged but in a constructive manner. Not all tunes work well for every driver. Personal attacks will not be tolerated and may result in penalties or disqualification at the discretion of the organizer and also may be subject to sanction by GTPlanet Moderating Staff.

------------------------

These rules are meant to be a guideline for those wishing to start an event based on a "tried and true" method. They are not set in stone nor are they the only rules that can be used or that will be needed. However, Rule 13 is the exception and MUST be a part of every FITT sponsored event.

DigitalBaka · Aug 17, 2011

DigitalBaka · Aug 17, 2011

Frequently Asked Questions (F.A.Q.)
Maintained by krenkme

Q) How do I figure out the deadline when I'm in a different time zone from the event sponsor?
A) All deadlines are calculated using Greenwich Mean Time (GMT).
For those having difficulty converting GMT to their local time see the following:

Code:

[SIZE="2"]Here is a chart I've used a lot for my flight sim.
You can also use the following [url=http://www.timezoneconverter.com/cgi-bin/tzc.tzc]Time Zone Converter[/url] 

[B][COLOR="Blue"]How to convert Greenwich Mean Time (GMT) to your time zone[/COLOR][/B]

[B][U]Africa[/U][/B][COLOR="Red"] Time Zone Offset (in hours)[/COLOR] 
Accra, Dakar, Monrovia  [COLOR="red"]GMT [/COLOR]
Algiers, Lagos, Windhoek (West Africa Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+1[/COLOR] 
Cairo, Kigali, Johannesburg (Central Africa Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+2[/COLOR] 
Addis Ababa, Kampala, Nairobi (East Africa Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+3[/COLOR] 
  
   
[B][U]North America[/U][/B] [COLOR="red"]Time Zone Offset (in hours) [/COLOR]
St. John's (Newfoundland Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-3.5 [/COLOR]
Halifax (Atlantic Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-4[/COLOR] 
New York, Toronto, Washington (Eastern Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-5[/COLOR] 
Chicago, Mexico City, Winnipeg (Central Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-6[/COLOR] 
Denver, Edmonton, Salt Lake City (Mountain Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-7[/COLOR] 
Los Angeles, San Francisco, Vancouver (Pacific Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-8[/COLOR] 
Anchorage, Juneau (Alaska Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-9[/COLOR] 
Honolulu (Hawaiian Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT-10[/COLOR] 
   
[B][U]South America[/U][/B][COLOR="red"] Time Zone Offset (in hours)[/COLOR] 
Brasilia, Buenos Aires, Montevideo  [COLOR="red"]GMT-3[/COLOR] 
Caracas, La Paz, Santiago  [COLOR="red"]GMT-4[/COLOR] 
Bogota, Lima, Panama City  [COLOR="red"]GMT-5[/COLOR] 
   
[B][U]Asia[/U][/B] [COLOR="red"]Time Zone Offset (in hours)[/COLOR] 
Amman, Ankara, Jerusalem  [COLOR="red"]GMT+2[/COLOR] 
Baghdad, Kuwait City, Riyadh  [COLOR="red"]GMT+3[/COLOR] 
Tehran  [COLOR="red"]GMT+3.5[/COLOR] 
Abu Dhabi, Baku, Muskat  [COLOR="red"]GMT+4[/COLOR] 
Kabul  [COLOR="red"]GMT+4.5[/COLOR] 
Islamabad, Karachi, Tashkent  [COLOR="red"]GMT+5[/COLOR] 
Bangalore, Mumbai, New Delhi  [COLOR="red"]GMT+5.5[/COLOR] 
Almaty, Colombo, Novosibirsk  [COLOR="red"]GMT+6[/COLOR] 
Rangoon  [COLOR="red"]GMT+6.5[/COLOR] 
Bangkok, Hanoi, Kuala Lumpur  [COLOR="red"]GMT+7[/COLOR] 
Beijing, Manila, Taipei  [COLOR="red"]GMT+8[/COLOR] 
Ambon, Seoul, Tokyo  [COLOR="red"]GMT+9[/COLOR] 
Port Moresby, Vladivostok  [COLOR="red"]GMT+10[/COLOR] 
 
   
[B][U]Australia/New Zealand[/U][/B] [COLOR="red"]Time Zone Offset (in hours)[/COLOR] 
Perth (Western Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+8[/COLOR] 
Adelaide, Alice Springs (Central Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+9.5[/COLOR] 
Melbourne, Sydney (Eastern Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+10[/COLOR] 
Auckland, Christchurch, Wellington  [COLOR="red"]GMT+12[/COLOR] 
 
   
[B][U]Europe[/U][/B] [COLOR="red"]Time Zone Offset (in hours)[/COLOR] 
Dublin, Lisbon, London (Western Europe Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT[/COLOR] 
Berlin, Paris, Warsaw (Central Europe Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+1[/COLOR] 
Athens, Helsinki, Minsk (Eastern Europe Time)  [COLOR="red"]GMT+2[/COLOR] 
Moscow, Murmansk, St. Petersburg  [COLOR="red"]GMT+3[/COLOR] 
Baku, Tbilisi, Yerevan  [COLOR="red"]GMT+4[/COLOR] 


[B][COLOR="Purple"]If you're in a Daylight Savings area you will have to
 subtract an hour during the time you observe it.[/COLOR][/B]
If confused if you're in Daylight Savings Time (DST) this might help as well.
Most countries save one hour in the summer and change their clocks
 some time between midnight and 3:00AM.
 
[B][U]Continent Country Beginning and ending days[/U][/B] 
[COLOR="Green"][U]Africa Egypt[/U][/COLOR] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Last Friday in April[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Thursday in September[/COLOR] 
[COLOR="green"][U]Namibia[/U][/COLOR] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in September[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in April[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="green"]Asia[/COLOR][/U] [COLOR="DarkOrchid"](Most states of the former USSR.)[/COLOR] 
Start: [COLOR="Red"]Last Sunday in March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"][/COLOR]   
[U][COLOR="SeaGreen"]Iraq[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Friday in April[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Friday in October[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Israel (?)[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Last Friday before April 2[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]The Sunday between Rosh Hashana and Yom Kippur[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Jordan[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Last Thursday of March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Friday in September[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Lebanon, Kyrgyzstan[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in October[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Mongolia[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]Fourth Friday in March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Friday in September [/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Palestinian regions (Estimate)[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Friday on or after 15 April[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]First Friday on or after 15 October[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Syria[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]March 30[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]September 21[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Australasia Australia - South Australia, Victoria, 
 Australian Capital Territory, New South Wales, 
 Lord Howe Island[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in October[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in April[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Australia - Tasmania[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in October[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in March[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]New Zealand, Chatham[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in September[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in April[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Tonga[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in November[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in January[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]UK[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in October [/COLOR]  
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]North America: United States, Canada 
 (excluding Saskatchewan and parts of Quebec, B.C., and Ontario),
 Bermuda, St. Johns, Bahamas[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Second Sunday in March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in November[/COLOR]  
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Cuba[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]Third Sunday in March[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday of October[/COLOR]. 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Greenland Same as EU[/COLOR][/U]    
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Honduras[/COLOR][/U]
Start: [COLOR="red"]May 7[/COLOR] 
End: [COLOR="red"]August[/COLOR]  
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Mexico (except Sonora)[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in April[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Last Sunday in October[/COLOR]   
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Brazil (Equatorial Brazil does not observe DST)[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Third Sunday in October[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Third Sunday in February[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Chile[/COLOR][/U]
Start:[COLOR="red"]October 11[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"][COLOR="red"]March 29[/COLOR][/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Falklands[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday on or after 8 September[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday on or after 6 April [/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Paraguay[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]Third Sunday in October[/COLOR]
End: [COLOR="red"]Second Sunday in March[/COLOR] 
[U][COLOR="seagreen"]Uruguay[/COLOR][/U] 
Start: [COLOR="red"]First Sunday in October[/COLOR] 
End: [COLOR="red"]Second Sunday in March[/COLOR][/SIZE]

Onboy123 · Aug 17, 2011

Standardised result submission template-

Insert Shootout name- Tester Results Template

Times
ABS - 1, Tire Wear - On/Off, Grip Reduction - Real

x:xx.xxx - Bubba
x:xx.xxx - Lassie
x:xx.xxx - Ima Jutz
x:xx.xxx - you get the picture

Drivers Choice

1st - Added after results are posted!
2nd - Added after results are posted!
3rd - Added after results are posted!

Comments
Bubba
<comments on car here>

Lassie
<comments on car here>

Ima Jutz
<comments on car here>

XDesperado67 · Aug 17, 2011

Onboy123
Any more placeholders required?

Just trying to cover the bases in case people are interested in making this a working concept.
If it gets support I'll redo the OP to list members of the Committee and post relevant information that doesn't fit elsewhere.

JackWilson · Aug 17, 2011

I think maybe we should post these competitions in another sub-forum? You could mention it here for the tuners sake, but we could probably get a lot more test drivers if other people knew about it

C-ZETA · Aug 17, 2011

My shootout I'm planning for September is rather different to the other shootouts in a few aspects so I'm not sure how well it could really work. Who is the third person BTW? I'd known about CSL's plans but no one elses... :confused:

XDesperado67 · Aug 17, 2011

TimberW just PMed me yesterday with a detailed proposal for a Shootout based on his winning ProToss tune.

Jackthalad
I think maybe we should post these competitions in another sub-forum? You could mention it here for the tuners sake, but we could probably get a lot more test drivers if other people knew about it

I've discussed forming a new Sub Forum here with SlipZtrEm and mentioned it elsewhere as well. As far as I know the moderators are discussing the idea and or having us move the events to another forum.
My objection to going to another forum is two fold. First the primary focus of these Shootouts are the tunes with the driving simply providing a means of comparison. Second the suggested Sub Forum on this site deals with online racing and online racing leagues, while to this point these have been offline events. For those who can't go online with GT5 or prefer not to they offer a competitive outlet, that would be lost if they have to do events online or else be excluded.

Onboy123 · Aug 17, 2011

XDesperado67
TimberW just PMed me yesterday with a detailed proposal for a Shootout based on his winning ProToss tune.

Ah, I think I know what the theme of the shootout will be. Hint? Initial D (Or, to old man Wallbanger, a bunch of teens running around a mountain pass in their dad's civic :lol:

)

XDesperado67 · Aug 17, 2011

Onboy123
Ah, I think I know what the theme of the shootout will be. Hint? Initial D (Or, to old man Wallbanger, a bunch of teens running around a mountain pass in their dad's civic )

Not exactly.

this is closer to the Kei vs supercar challenge we discussed...with the added twist of TimberW wanting to use a custom track.

C-ZETA · Aug 17, 2011

I'd keep it in this forum. It's more about tuning than just general GT5.

I'm also planning to use 3 different tracks for testing with at least one custom track, since the idea of my shootout is to build your car for more than one track. I won't be giving away much more than these tidbits though. :sly:

smalldave · Aug 17, 2011

speaking of placeholders, it could be an idea to put the names of all the tuners and all the testers in a post at the start, and you can check each person off the list to make sure the testers have access to all the cars. I have had a few problems making sure I have all the cars available in the RVR shootout, and maybe it could have been simpler to put all the names together

Also, it may be an idea for people to pm the sponsorer their tunes and have them put it in a post at the beginning, so they are all in one place as opposed to scattered across the thread

Just a few ideas

C-ZETA · Aug 17, 2011

smalldave
speaking of placeholders, it could be an idea to put the names of all the tuners and all the testers in a post at the start, and you can check each person off the list to make sure the testers have access to all the cars. I have had a few problems making sure I have all the cars available in the RVR shootout, and maybe it could have been simpler to put all the names together

Also, it may be an idea for people to pm the sponsorer their tunes and have them put it in a post at the beginning, so they are all in one place as opposed to scattered across the thread

Just a few ideas

But there already is one if I think I know what you mean. Onboy's in charge of them. I'm planning on keeping track of my own testers and tuners though...

smalldave · Aug 17, 2011

Oh haha I'll look closer next time

Indy Racerfan · Aug 17, 2011

Another idea is if a sub forum is a no go how about a sticky at the top of this forum

madmyk · Aug 17, 2011

I think you are on the right path trying to get this more organized. 4-6 weeks per competition is a bit much, so there are probably many things that can be done to make it more efficient.

Ultimately, it is the supply of testers that will determine if these contests can keep happening. There needs to be more rules on testing. Maybe friend requests and car sharing should be mandatory to save time building cars. Testers should spend X time with each car, running a minimum of Y and maximum of Z laps.

The tester's time commitment needs to be verified before a contest starts. The number of entrants may need to be restricted to the available time of the testers. If you tell the tester the total time needed for a contest and he or she agrees to it, then all cars must be tested or all of that tester's results will have to be thrown out.

Anyway, these are just suggestions. feel free to add them or not, or change them however you need.

Edit: so I don't double post...

Since the testers are the key, I think the tester prizes/awards/pay needs to be significant. I'm planning on giving each tester a car or ticket as a thank you gift for their time with my car, which is probably more than the organizer is doing. You probably should offer multiple cars/tickets/gear etc. to provide enough incentive.

TimberW · Aug 17, 2011

Yes desperado is on the money on this, that we should only run an event at a time. I don't mind being in the line if someone was ahead of me. I just thought it'll be appropriate now, cause there's sort of a theme happening and story behind the competition.

Onboy, you're pretty close about Initial D bit. =P But the winning tune is not by me, is by one of the players from Legend of the Streets.
(You're really a stalker Oneboy, lol. And I'm a big Initial D Fanboy)

Edit: I think a standard time for tuners to prepare their cars and testers to test the cars is important.

Eg.
TUNERS - 2 Weeks?
TESTERS - 2-3 Weeks? (Depending on number of tunes)

And keeping it to a minimum number of tracks is important too. Unless it's a one make tuning competition like what Adrenaline was running before this, then multiple tracks is more plausible.

XDesperado67 · Aug 17, 2011

madmyk
I think you are on the right path trying to get this more organized. 4-6 weeks per competition is a bit much, so there are probably many things that can be done to make it more efficient.

Ultimately, it is the supply of testers that will determine if these contests can keep happening. There needs to be more rules on testing. Maybe friend requests and car sharing should be mandatory to save time building cars. Testers should spend X time with each car, running a minimum of Y and maximum of Z laps.

The tester's time commitment needs to be verified before a contest starts. The number of entrants may need to be restricted to the available time of the testers. If you tell the tester the total time needed for a contest and he or she agrees to it, then all cars must be tested or all of that tester's results will have to be thrown out.

Anyway, these are just suggestions. feel free to add them or not, or change them however you need.

Edit: so I don't double post...

Since the testers are the key, I think the tester prizes/awards/pay needs to be significant. I'm planning on giving each tester a car or ticket as a thank you gift for their time with my car, which is probably more than the organizer is doing. You probably should offer multiple cars/tickets/gear etc. to provide enough incentive.

Thanks for the input there, and your right about the significant amount of time testers must spend with the current format. There has been discussion in several places about changing testing somewhat to allow tuners to act as test drivers of other tuners cars. These events are evolving as we find things that work and those that don't.

I copied the "standard" rules posted above from the FF Shootout I sponsored but that is just an example and starting point for reference until a more formalized set can be drawn up. The only one of those rules that I personally feel needs to be a hard and fast rule included in all events is rule #13.

As for how long the events last, and again this is just my opinion, 4 weeks is just about right for shootouts. This allows tuners 2 weeks to select and tune their cars and testers 2 weeks to complete all testing. If you don't give tuners enough time they will either pass on the event all together or else submit a sub-par tune that has little validity for use outside the event. Remember that many tuners will spend weeks or even months fine tuning a car to their satisfaction. Also with the current test driver setup it becomes very time intensive. With 20 tuners in a contest and a test driver unlikely to spend less than half an hour with each car that's 10 hours of gaming time dedicated right there making it unlikely that testers will complete their trials in only a single day or even two days.

TimberW · Aug 17, 2011

+1 to rule #13

Don't know if this is suitable in archived events, as this has clearly overtaken the Monthly Tuner Championship.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=166724
But the Tuner Championship is a forerunner for tuning competition.

bigberry · Aug 17, 2011

Just want to say I agree 100% with Harveys post and Madmyks which he quoted .

Good line Harvey 'testing 20 cars for 30minutes each is 10 hours'
I never realized that , I probably put in 20+ hours as a tuner

.

Testers should be incentivised as there will always be a higher ratio of tuners. Its a thankless task for some too.

Like Madmyk I intend to send a car or 2 out to testers. I dont really have anything great to gift but the thought counts haha .

CSLACR · Aug 18, 2011

XDesperado67
Standardized rules

1) Each tuner may submit one car tune for the challenge.
2)There is a XXX PP limit on all cars.
3)Ballast and Power Limiter are allowed for cars to meet the PP limit.
4)(Chosen tire type) or lesser tires only.
5)No Race Modified or Race Cars!(and yes race cars includes Rally types!:)
6)All car tunes must be submitted here no later than MM/DD(A link to your garage is sufficient if you do not wish to post the full tune here. Consideration will be given on the final submission date due to time zones, however it is highly recommended that entrants not wait until the last minute to get their contender in.)
7)Independent test drivers will test cars on (Designated Track).
8)Test drivers have the responsibility to test all cars as the tuner writes them up, including all gear settings and LSD settings. (Suggest that the tuners either place the car on share or send it to the test drivers, especially for cars from the UCD which the test driver may not have readily available.)
9)No one entering the shootout as a tuner may participate as a driver. However feel free to post your best times for comparison.
10)The average of the drivers times will be used to determine the Shootout winner.
11)All drivers must submit valid times for all car tunes entered in the event here no later than the MM/DD.(If the number of cars that need to be tested makes the time between final entry and event final a problem then event may be extended.)
12)Arrangements for payouts to the event winner and all test drivers will start on the MM/DD, or the first day following the final time posting whichever is later.
13) While discussion of the various cars tunes and the methods drivers use in testing as well as their reviews of said car tunes is encouraged, anything viewed as a personal attack on either the car tuner or the driver/reviewer may constitute grounds for disqualification/removal from the contest. Discussion of anything related to the contest is highly encouraged. Personal attacks and bickering/flaming will not be tolerated as this curtails the enjoyment of the community as a whole and could lead to the moderators steping in and closing the contest down. This can be an enjoyable experience for all of us and a possible learning experience. Let's have fun and be respectful of others.

Everything in bold goes against ideas myself and/or C-Zeta had in mind.

I for one liked Praianos idea about everyone tuning also testing, with whose cars/tunes testers are driving (except their own, which is unavoidable) being kept secret until the end of the shootout.
The only real technicality is that tuners would have to restrain themselves from posting their shootout tunes in their garage until the end of the shootout.

I also know many people dislike cars with massive power limiter use, for obvious reasons, even if it doesn't offer a significant advantage. Seeing a neutered (poor car) Gallardo running 400HP is pretty much case-in-point.

Obviously any event that's for race/rally cars can be fun, so the blanket statement that they're not allowed could be misleading, though it's obviously not fair to try to mix race cars with non-race cars, this also applies to some non-race cars, particularly tuner cars.

And of course, a pure driver's choice championship can always be interesting, as we've seen there are and will always be dominant cars, we all know this, sometimes it could be a nice change of pace to have a "driver's choice only" championship.

Just my thoughts...

Milldrum · Aug 18, 2011

Hey guys, and CSLACR.

As the 7th fastest driver in Wallbangers FF Shootout, I will admit it was a task to gather all the machinery to test in that one. Maybe a central point to test the cars from would help.

The tuner would send his/her car to a designated person who would then check it's legitimacy towards the rules. They could then set it to share. 6 cars- 1 point of access. 12 cars- 2 points of access.

The testers could be added once the cars are ready. Only then would the tunes be published. The tuners could then try anything published in thier own time and thier own way.

I like custom tracks and have more than 60. So a 3 track testing system including a custom would be nice for me. The custom track could be available at the central access points for download. But it would be a lot of driving for the tester for 10 laps of each.

TimberW · Aug 18, 2011

Milldrum's central download point is a wonderful suggestion.

And I don't mind starting a new PSN account to manage one of these central points.

CSLACR · Aug 18, 2011

Milldrum
Hey guys, and CSLACR.

As the 7th fastest driver in Wallbangers FF Shootout, I will admit it was a task to gather all the machinery to test in that one. Maybe a central point to test the cars from would help.

The tuner would send his/her car to a designated person who would then check it's legitimacy towards the rules. They could then set it to share. 6 cars- 1 point of access. 12 cars- 2 points of access.

The testers could be added once the cars are ready. Only then would the tunes be published. The tuners could then try anything published in thier own time and thier own way.

I like custom tracks and have more than 60. So a 3 track testing system including a custom would be nice for me. The custom track could be available at the central access points for download. But it would be a lot of driving for the tester for 10 laps of each.

Pretty much what Praianos idea evolved into for me, though I'm not sure about multiple tracks, the trick is laps always improve from first car to last, which is why second sessions are a good thing, but two sessions on 3 tracks is 6 sessions a car, and ends up taking hours and hours.

My plan was/is as follows: 6 cars shared from each host, amount of tunes will determine number of hosts needed, everyone submitting a tune submits it either via car send or PM to me, once the deadline arrives, I'll post each tune up, without inclination as to whose tune is whose, at the same time. For the sake of fairness, I'll test tunes but will not submit a tune myself, as I'll be the only one knowing whose tune each car is.
After testing deadline, all tuners for cars will be revealed.
I already had Tris_73 volunteer to be a host, and I have a TwiztedLove account which can also host, if extra hosting is needed, of course if someone else wants to host tunes that already has many people added, that would be easier, it's up to individuals on that.

That said, I know C-Zeta started planning on his shootout first, so depending on his time frame, I'll wait for his to end before starting mine, as far as I know, I'm second in line with shootout plans, and I can't remember the name, but there's a third now I see also.
But as far as I know, the next shootout can reasonably start as soon as the current one ends, so I'll wait for word from C-Zeta on whether he wants to start his immediately, or wait a few weeks, in which case I can put mine in-between to fill the gap.
FTW - C-Zeta has some very interesting plans, and I look forward to it.

Edit: TimberW would be the name I forgot. :lol:

XDesperado67 · Aug 18, 2011

CSLACR
Everything in bold goes against ideas myself and/or C-Zeta had in mind.

I for one liked Praianos idea about everyone tuning also testing, with whose cars/tunes testers are driving (except their own, which is unavoidable) being kept secret until the end of the shootout.
The only real technicality is that tuners would have to restrain themselves from posting their shootout tunes in their garage until the end of the shootout.

I also know many people dislike cars with massive power limiter use, for obvious reasons, even if it doesn't offer a significant advantage. Seeing a neutered (poor car) Gallardo running 400HP is pretty much case-in-point.

Obviously any event that's for race/rally cars can be fun, so the blanket statement that they're not allowed could be misleading, though it's obviously not fair to try to mix race cars with non-race cars, this also applies to some non-race cars, particularly tuner cars.

And of course, a pure driver's choice championship can always be interesting, as we've seen there are and will always be dominant cars, we all know this, sometimes it could be a nice change of pace to have a "driver's choice only" championship.

Just my thoughts...

Input like this is why I started this thread. As I mentioned before the "Standard" rules I have posted currently are simply a starting point. Also various events might see one or more of the standard rules either replaced or removed completely from that event. Ultimately what I'm looking for is a small set of baseline rules that can be implemented for most competitions, with the event sponsor adding any additional rules for the specific competition.

How testing is done is for at least the present time an open field that we can and should explore various options to find what works and what doesn't.

The "blind taste test" option your proposing is interesting but may prove cumbersome in implementation. Another option is to allow tuners to test all other tunes but their own which would allow for open posting and the tuner sharing their car.
I've got several more ideas to try in the next shootout I sponsor. Things like setting a PP hardcap that limits how much play you get with ballast and power limiter. (Example a 450PP classic sports car/sports sedan shootout with a 465PP hardcap. So no car can be over 465PP with full power and no ballast.) Another idea is to divide tuners into smaller groups that the drivers can test with maybe a short period allowed between the last group and a final round. (Example first 5 tunes submitted form group A, next 5 form group B, etc... Then take the top 1 or 2 cars from each group and have a final round after tuners are given a short period to make adjustments to the tune.)

While it would be completely subjective in many ways I could see a contest where tuners submit a personal favorite car for everyone else to drive and then all cars ranked from 1-20 or however many cars were entered with that ranking being a combination of performance, driving pleasure, style and presentation of the tune.

Again what I'm hoping to accomplish currently is to form some sort of competition committee to help organize events and provide support. If we have a group like this then we can work on scheduling issues so that we avoid problems like competing or conflicting shootouts and or other events.

Onboy123 · Aug 18, 2011

Nevermind

TimberW · Aug 18, 2011

CSLACR
My plan was/is as follows: 6 cars shared from each host, amount of tunes will determine number of hosts needed, everyone submitting a tune submits it either via car send or PM to me, once the deadline arrives, I'll post each tune up, without inclination as to whose tune is whose, at the same time. For the sake of fairness, I'll test tunes but will not submit a tune myself, as I'll be the only one knowing whose tune each car is.
After testing deadline, all tuners for cars will be revealed.
I already had Tris_73 volunteer to be a host, and I have a TwiztedLove account which can also host, if extra hosting is needed, of course if someone else wants to host tunes that already has many people added, that would be easier, it's up to individuals on that.

Mystery car challenge, that's an interesting one... <- does that mean that no one is to reveal what car/tune which they submitted?

I think it's okay for it to be like this:

Host 1:
GTP ID: TimberW
PSN ID: GTP_TUNERHOST_01
Car 1: RLT Garage - Toyota MR2 G-Limited '97
Car 2: OSE_CAP_SHADOW - Nissan Skyline GT-R V spec II (R32) '94
Car 3: J's Tuning Garage - MR-S S Edition 99
Car 4: Tuner Garage/Independant - Car Name
Car 5: etc..
Car 6: etc..

Host 2:
GTP ID: CSLACR
PSN ID: TwiztedLove
Car 1: etc..
Car 2: etc..

Yes, I agree that a host is not allowed to submit a tune.

CSLACR
That said, I know C-Zeta started planning on his shootout first, so depending on his time frame, I'll wait for his to end before starting mine, as far as I know, I'm second in line with shootout plans, and I can't remember the name, but there's a third now I see also.
But as far as I know, the next shootout can reasonably start as soon as the current one ends, so I'll wait for word from C-Zeta on whether he wants to start his immediately, or wait a few weeks, in which case I can put mine in-between to fill the gap.
FTW - C-Zeta has some very interesting plans, and I look forward to it.

Edit: TimberW would be the name I forgot.

Thanks for remembering me! lol. So I'm third in line. that's alright!!!

CSLACR · Aug 18, 2011

The "blind taste test" option your proposing is interesting but may prove cumbersome in implementation. Another option is to allow tuners to test all other tunes but their own which would allow for open posting and the tuner sharing their car.

This in particular, I know obviously everyone will have the opportunity to "cheat" for their own car, but I don't see it as far to have different drivers test different cars, as there's quite a large gap in driving ability here, for example, Driver A may run 1:28 as his fastest lap, Driver B may run 1:33. If we discount their own times, Driver A loses a 1:28 (fast lap) while Driver B loses a 1:33 (slow lap).
So I see more time for people to lose/gain by discounting the tuners own time then the chance for people to embellish their own time.
I think it'll be pretty obvious if anyone gets carried away with their own time, worst case scenario, it fails, and I improvise a solution...

TimberW
Mystery car challenge, that's an interesting one... <- does that mean that no one is to reveal what car/tune which they submitted?

I think it's okay for it to be like this:

Host 1:
GTP ID: TimberW
PSN ID: GTP_TUNERHOST_01
Car 1: RLT Garage - Toyota MR2 G-Limited '97
Car 2: OSE_CAP_SHADOW - Nissan Skyline GT-R V spec II (R32) '94
Car 3: J's Tuning Garage - MR-S S Edition ‘99
Car 4: Tuner Garage/Independant - Car Name
Car 5: etc..
Car 6: etc..

Host 2:
GTP ID: CSLACR
PSN ID: TwiztedLove
Car 1: etc..
Car 2: etc..

Yes, I agree that a host is not allowed to submit a tune.

Thanks for remembering me! lol. So I'm third in line. that's alright!!!

I don't see a problem with hosts entering, for mine I plan to be the only one who knows which all cars belong to which tuners, which is why I plan on not entering a tune. Otherwise, I intend to keep them a secret, just to avoid the potential bicker-fest of "sandbagging" others tunes.

XDesperado67 · Aug 18, 2011

@Onboy123 what???? :confused:

I've updated the current and upcoming events post.(Post #3)

Please let me know when I should change the OP and what information I should place there.

Also someone mentioned getting this stickied which would be great if there is enough support for making this an effective and useful resource.

Also I'd like to ask madmyk to be part of the standing Committee as official time-keeper with his spreadsheets.👍👍

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