FM Vs GT - Discussion Thread (read the first post before you post)

PzR Slim · Jul 3, 2012

GTP_Plato
At the moment FM4 is pretty useless to some wheel users including myself, in fairness wheel support since day 1 for this game has been terrible.

I thought I would go back and have a go at Forza, I had not played it since the 2nd week of release due to the early issues they had with wheel support (non linear and sim steering assist).

Very disappointed to come back to the game after not playing for a long time to find out Microsofts latest dashboard update has given wheel users bigger problems (FFB issues, notchy steering)

My opinion on this GT vs FM debate is that controller users don't take into account that most wheel users will back GT (and PS3 in general) because the wheel support is superior, Forza 4 has had wheel problems since release and nothing looks as though it will change. Does anyone have a good reason why using a wheel on FM4 is worse than FM3? I would like to know what went wrong.

I have been playing the forza series since the start of FM2, I am a fan of both games before people start saying the F word

They sorted the wheel issues three weeks after release and the new issue only appeared a couple of weeks ago. Awful lot of time in between when it worked perfectly well and gave much better ffb than GT5.

GTP_Plato · Jul 3, 2012

PzR Slim
They sorted the wheel issues three weeks after release and the new issue only appeared a couple of weeks ago. Awful lot of time in between when it worked perfectly well and gave much better ffb than GT5.

Good to hear

Itching to play, if it isn't one thing it's the other :ouch:

So if what you have told me is correct I shouldn't have issues where the steering is super sensitive or the opposite where the steering was either delayed or non existent :sly:

May have to jump in a lobby with you when this latest issue is sorted now that I have you on my Friends list Slim :cheers:

PzR Slim · Jul 3, 2012

GTP_Plato
Good to hear

Itching to play, if it isn't one thing it's the other

So if what you have told me is correct I shouldn't have issues where the steering is super sensitive or the opposite where the steering was either delayed or non existent

May have to jump in a lobby with you when this latest issue is sorted now that I have you on my Friends list Slim

It's weird because the new issue only affected some and was fixed for some. There are a couple of threads on .net discussing it, might be worth checking them out. After the initial release fix I never had any problems with my PWTS or CSR Elite after that so you should be good to go.

GTP_Plato · Jul 3, 2012

PzR Slim
It's weird because the new issue only affected some and was fixed for some. There are a couple of threads on .net discussing it, might be worth checking them out. After the initial release fix I never had any problems with my PWTS or CSR Elite after that so you should be good to go.

Already tried all the suggestions on FM.Net

Ls2BluGoat · Jul 21, 2012

I happen to stumble across this. I just have one question. Why?

What really amazes me is that none of these cars are the Autovista models. The shaders, textures and the amount of detail that was put in definitely surprised me. I'm still puzzled at what made Turn 10 go through all this trouble in modeling the cockpits when only a glitch can be used in order to view them? :confused:

Thoughts/opinions?

II-zOoLoGy-II · Jul 21, 2012

Nice pictures.

It's just a shame that those aren't the rendered models during gameplay.

Ah well. Here's to Forza 5 on the next XBOX!

Ls2BluGoat · Jul 22, 2012

I agree and with the pop up headlights already modeled on most cars, it seems as though nightracing is a given for the next Forza.

Also I'm not much into comparing graphics since I couldn't care less about them, however doing a quick comparison with the shots in this thread from the GT5 forum, they are definitely on par with GT5 premium models. Forza having the slight upperhand in some areas, (and I use this term very loosely).

buickgnx88 · Jul 23, 2012

Yeah in GT5 you have to use a glitch to take pictures of the interiors as well, so having to do the same in FM4 isn't bad. This is why I had the idea (posted at Forzaplanet) of utilizing the Autovista mode for every vehicle in the game, and being able to view them from the garage/dealer rather than having it be a separate mode.

GTF1 · Jul 23, 2012

jabofu
This. Everybody that have both games knows that there are great differences. Initially you cant really compare both games directly. They come from very different cultures and have very different approaches and targets. Sure they have more cars than any other game, more tracks also and high quality graphics.

What we can compare are the main areas. Driving physics and feel, graphics, multiplayer, tuning, b-spec (yes Forza 3 has it too!). Those areas are to discuss, because there we can compare them. Anything else are additions the other game doesnt really offer (livery editor, shops, auction house, clothing for the driver, 3D, and more).

I also want to see FM + GT than FM vs GT. What can the opposite Studio learn from the other? Why are they so different in the developement?

But one thing i have to say about GT: Without gtplanet, the GT-community would be pretty dead.

💡
FM will make a track creator, add F1 cars and better nascar, while GT will add car painting... 💡

Scaff · Jul 23, 2012

Reply from here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=181399&page=19

Sampyla20plus
FM4's Sounds = Over-exaggarated to even sound like the real cars, if I'm honest.

Sorry but given that GT5 has some very serious issues with regard to sound accuracy (despite the updates) the slight over-exaggeration of FM4's sound does not come close to making them sound in any way unlike real cars.

What GT5 does better in regard to sounds is spacial placement, but actual cars sounds certainly do not sound better.

Sampyla20plus
Damage model = Well, if you like more Pre-made impact points than actual real time based, then it's only about a choice, oh and FM4 doesnt have windscreen modelled at all from the cockpit and is invincible and it doesnt have chassis damage.

I would rather take a limited damage model that actually works across all modes than one that operates on a very different level depending on what mode you are playing and what car you are driving.

Even the much vaunted real time damage often leaves cars looking more like they have been melted than actually suffered an impact.

Sampyla20plus
Car Selection = This is true, but ONLY if you bought the DLC, without those, the list is almost identical with FM3 (without the Porsche)

Utter and compete rubbish, even without the DLC FM4 managed to add a good number of new cars, including 2011 and 2012 model years. Now as you raise this point, as you see a lack of new models in a car list an issue I hope you agree that GT5 suffers from this issue to a much larger degree.

Sampyla20plus
Career = FM4 is identical with the FM3's career, almost, they took away the endurance races due to the lack of fuel consumption which is made all wrong in FM series.

Again no its not identical at all, however once again GT5 does have a strong link in career to past series (Clubman and Sunday cup anyone).

Sampyla20plus
Graphics = Only blind person can really say FM4 looks better than GT5, cant fool anyone who actually has both.

Depends what you compare, premium car on a premium track and GT5 just nails it; standard car on a standard track and FM4 nails it.

Sampyla20plus
AI = in FM4 it is certain that AI will ram onto the player car whenever player is braking at the corner, these dont care are you there or not.

Not even close to true:

Sampyla20plus
Better DLC = Depends, FM4 has received any new track at all, and only DLC cars are really interesting but there is some cars I personally dont understand at all, Jackson's Charger for example.

The lack of new tracks in FM4 is indeed a missed opportunity in my mind, however to say that only DLC cars are interesting? You must have a rather odd taste in cars to find none of the original cars of interest.

Sampyla20plus
T10 ahead of PD = IF T10 can ever create tracks, surfaces or cars right then it could happen, but I doubt that will happen before FM X appears.

Apart from the 'ring I don't actually see any issues that GT5 doesn't suffer from, and please don't try that nonsense that the track surface doesn't change in FM4.

J-KiLLA24 · Jul 24, 2012

Ls2BluGoat
What really amazes me is that none of these cars are the Autovista models. The shaders, textures and the amount of detail that was put in definitely surprised me. I'm still puzzled at what made Turn 10 go through all this trouble in modeling the cockpits when only a glitch can be used in order to view them?

Thoughts/opinions?

You could ask the same question to PD

soheibV12 · Jul 24, 2012

plz see my trailer of the aventador there http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mscDvi7nlAg&feature=plcp
im beginner

ENJOY!

soheibV12 · Jul 24, 2012

Ls2BluGoat
I happen to stumble across this. I just have one question. Why?

*****SNIP*****

What really amazes me is that none of these cars are the Autovista models. The shaders, textures and the amount of detail that was put in definitely surprised me. I'm still puzzled at what made Turn 10 go through all this trouble in modeling the cockpits when only a glitch can be used in order to view them?

Thoughts/opinions?

GT5 actually do that

soheibV12 · Jul 24, 2012

thelvynau
Did you ever prove torque steer in gt5?

how? when i post video, scaff is saying << that prove nothing >>
so how?

thelvynau · Jul 24, 2012

soheibV12
how? when i post video, scaff is saying << that prove nothing >>
so how?

Well your video didnt show the torque steering that you claimed was in gt5.

Scaff · Jul 24, 2012

soheibV12
plz see my trailer of the aventador there http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mscDvi7nlAg&feature=plcp
im beginner
ENJOY!

What exactly does that have to do with the topic of this thread? Please don't post off-topic again, we have an entire sub-forum for GT5 video's.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=232

soheibV12
how? when i post video, scaff is saying << that prove nothing >>
so how?

Because it doesn't show what you claim.

Reply from this thread:https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=7388146#post7388146

Sampyla20plus
I've played both games alot and I've encountered problems in both series

Odd because you seem to only mention issues with FM4 and a lot of these seem to exist inly in the special copy of the game you have.

Sampyla20plus
Physics = This parameter is really interesting, FM4 players think their game has nailed the physics part ? Think again, I can list few things why.
Brakes = Game doesnt make ANY difference for Disc or Drum brakes
IF you turn OFF your ABS, the difference is so minimum it is so hard to get brakes to "lock" at all.
Fuel Consumption, in FM4 every car uses exact the same amount of fuel, no matter is the car a Datsun 510 or a Bugatti Veyron, Fuel = Weight = Physics.

Brakes = Neither GT or FM model drums differently to discs and neither model brake fade in any way. If your going to target T10 for this then it seems odd to not say the same for PD. However T10 do provide the ability to adjust the brake pressure and a wider range of brake bias adjustment.

ABS = You must have a very different version of FM4 to me then as its perfectly possible to lock the wheels with ABS switched off. Would you be so kind as to provide details of a car and track combo that show this happening so it can be tested by anyone who wishes to.

Weight =Not something I have bothered to test in either series, but if you wish to take issue with 'X' = Weight = Physics would you mind explaining why you then ignore the fact that the vast majority of modifications carried out in GT5 have no effect on the weight of the car?

Sampyla20plus
Tires, they might have "Pirelli" data but they didnt put much effort on lifespan of the tires, meaning even the Slicks can handle 5-15 laps on Nurburgring without even heating up, not so right.

Seriously tell me you are not saying that while ignoring the issues GT5 now has with tyre life?

Sampyla20plus
Tire deformation = Only way players did even heard about this is simple, T10 kept drumming about it so much people forgot how false the track surfaces really are compared to actual tracks.

Strawman argument at its finest. Tyre deformation exists and the entire tyre model in FM4 puts GT5's effort to shame (ohh by the way when will you be providing the results of the testing you made such a big deal of - still waiting), none of which has anything to do with your claim that FM4 has no surface changes on its tracks.

A claim that also has no basis in fact.

In a nut shell you try and avoid talking about something with a 'fact' that doesn't stand up to even the most basic checks. Not a smart move at all (read the AUP to discover why).

Sampyla20plus
BUT, I do give ++ to FM4 because of the carlist it has, even the cars itself arent made that well, and the track selection is good.

Which cars are not well made, examples please.

Sampyla20plus
But just for physics, GT5 wins easily because it has so many areas covered just right.

Get any RWD car in GT5 and from a starting start do a wide open throttle launch see how much the rear end steps out under the torque load and then come back and let us know.

And from here:https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=7388479#post7388479

Sampyla20plus
Yes I ment that GT5 doesnt have the tire deformation graphically coded, but the reaction is there.

How do you know the reaction is there? What proof can you provide to us that it is, because right now your making a claim that even PD themselves have never made and your going to have to back that up.

Sampyla20plus
You wouldnt even know the FM4 has it IF the T10 wouldn't had ever drummed about it, trust me.

Nonsense. The tyre deformation that has existed across a number of the T10 titles has always been quite evident in terms of feel. Mainly because before FM4 it was plain wrong once you got over the limit. FM4, while still not 100% correct can be seen and felt quite clearly and has a definite effect on how the car reacts.

The above quite clearly shows it and the effect on the car.

Sampyla20plus
By the rights, when we tested these things with our group from AKK Motorsport, we didnt write it on to the internet, because it isnt what AKK is all about, more like "Off-topic" material, but we did the tests, I could arrenge a meeting between you and our team so you could discuss about it more.

Sam, senior member of AKK Motorsport

Finland would be a bit of a trek, but if you willing to pay!!!

So are you saying that nothing was written down with regard to this. What car and track combos did you use? What were you looking for? What results were achieved? How did you ensure the tests were fair, valid and repeatable?

I'm sure you can provide us with details of the above so that they can then be peer reviewed here at GT Planet.

Sampyla20plus · Jul 24, 2012

Scaff
What exactly does that have to do with the topic of this thread? Please don't post off-topic again, we have an entire sub-forum for GT5 video's.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=232

Because it doesn't show what you claim.

Reply from this thread:https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=7388146#post7388146

Odd because you seem to only mention issues with FM4 and a lot of these seem to exist inly in the special copy of the game you have.

Maybe because you have something that is called "Purple glasses" weared ?

Brakes = Neither GT or FM model drums differently to discs and neither model brake fade in any way. If your going to target T10 for this then it seems odd to not say the same for PD. However T10 do provide the ability to adjust the brake pressure and a wider range of brake bias adjustment.

YES, FM4 lets you set brake pressures, but if you really believe an E-Type Jaguar stops from 100km/h to 0 km/h within 23 meters, as completely stock, then yes FM4 has the absolute perfectly made brakes. (Jag was an example)

ABS = You must have a very different version of FM4 to me then as its perfectly possible to lock the wheels with ABS switched off. Would you be so kind as to provide details of a car and track combo that show this happening so it can be tested by anyone who wishes to.

It is possible, but happens way less often than in real life, the lock-in that is.
For example, you can upgrade your 370Z for Datsun 510 all the way at the max, leaving the chassis, brakes, suspension and tires completely stock and the car remains driveable without any problems occured. Realistic ?

Weight =Not something I have bothered to test in either series, but if you wish to take issue with 'X' = Weight = Physics would you mind explaining why you then ignore the fact that the vast majority of modifications carried out in GT5 have no effect on the weight of the car?

I know flaws GT5 has, and I bet everyone been seeing such complainments since the GT5 was launced, so why post something that is discussed to death ? Especially when people are claiming FM4 being above the GT5 what comes to physics on actual GTplanet, then it's not me who has problems, seriously.

Seriously tell me you are not saying that while ignoring the issues GT5 now has with tyre life?

It is still made more better than in FM4, or are you saying that Pirelli tires are nearly invincible ?

Strawman argument at its finest. Tyre deformation exists and the entire tyre model in FM4 puts GT5's effort to shame (ohh by the way when will you be providing the results of the testing you made such a big deal of - still waiting), none of which has anything to do with your claim that FM4 has no surface changes on its tracks.

It doesnt, that is why T10 now drums out loud how Horizon will have atleast 65 different surface types, coincidence ?

A claim that also has no basis in fact.

And yours does somehow better ? Tell me, which "Universal Fact Manual Book" did you read ?

In a nut shell you try and avoid talking about something with a 'fact' that doesn't stand up to even the most basic checks. Not a smart move at all (read the AUP to discover why).

Which cars are not well made, examples please.

Hudson Hornet
Ferrari 250GTO
E-Type Jaguar
Austin Healey 3000

for example.

Get any RWD car in GT5 and from a starting start do a wide open throttle launch see how much the rear end steps out under the torque load and then come back and let us know.

Someone havent ever heard about Logitech G27 wheel ? I could point you out that RWD car handles just like supposed to with a proper wheelset.
My guess is that you spent all $ on a Fanatec wheel to play with FM4, right ?

Scaff · Jul 24, 2012

Sampyla20plus
Maybe because you have something that is called "Purple glasses" weared ?

I think you mean 'rose-tinted' glasses, and you may want to actually read my posting history before making claims of this nature.

I have a long track history of point out flaws across pretty much every title (because they all have them), you have a track history of pointing out flaws in FM4.

Sampyla20plus
YES, FM4 lets you set brake pressures, but if you really believe an E-Type Jaguar stops from 100km/h to 0 km/h within 23 meters, as completely stock, then yes FM4 has the absolute perfectly made brakes. (Jag was an example)

Once I have a chance to test it I will, in both titles and I strongly suspect GT5 will be little different (because historically it hasn't been and I've carried out more hours of brake testing in GT that I can honestly recall.

Sampyla20plus
It is possible, but happens way less often than in real life, the lock-in that is.
For example, you can upgrade your 370Z for Datsun 510 all the way at the max, leaving the chassis, brakes, suspension and tires completely stock and the car remains driveable without any problems occured. Realistic ?

Once again you are using a totally different point to try and prove an unrelated argument.

I totally disagree in this regard, lock-up is far too eager in GT5, not a big surprise as this is the first title that they have had to model it in.

Sampyla20plus
I know flaws GT5 has, and I bet everyone been seeing such complainments since the GT5 was launced, so why post something that is discussed to death ? Especially when people are claiming FM4 being above the GT5 what comes to physics on actual GTplanet, then it's not me who has problems, seriously.

Ahh so you believe that because its a GT site then we shouldn't be critical of it. Nope, it doesn't work like that here.

Sampyla20plus
It is still made more better than in FM4, or are you saying that Pirelli tires are nearly invincible ?

No I'm saying its an inaccuracy with the tyre model in FM4, I've never claimed it to be accurate. What I said is that GT5 has just as much of an inaccuracy in regard to tyre life (FM4 last too long, GT5s don't last long enough).

Sampyla20plus
It doesnt, that is why T10 now drums out loud how Horizon will have atleast 65 different surface types, coincidence ?

Rally di Postino and Sebring both has wildly differing surface over the course of the laps.

Sampyla20plus
And yours does somehow better ? Tell me, which "Universal Fact Manual Book" did you read ?

Yes its called drive Sebring in FM4 and you can see and feel the track surface changes and the effect on the car.

Sampyla20plus
Hudson Hornet
Ferrari 250GTO
E-Type Jaguar
Austin Healey 3000

for example.

And the issues are?

Sampyla20plus
Someone havent ever heard about Logitech G27 wheel ? I could point you out that RWD car handles just like supposed to with a proper wheelset.
My guess is that you spent all $ on a Fanatec wheel to play with FM4, right ?

Nice avoidance of what I actually asked. The test I asked you to carry out can be done quite easily with a controller (and its accuracy will not be affected one bit in doing so).

Please lay of the strawman arguments, address the actual points and carry out the test. I look forward to hearing what you find.

Sampyla20plus · Jul 24, 2012

I'm sorry, but the GT5 isnt actually ment to be played with a controller, torgue steering wont work with the pad, why ? Because PaD wont change anything virtual into a car, thats why. Havent you ever noticed how limited the actual movement of the Controller stick is ? Just asking.

I understand your "God Given Rights" because you're the man behind this thread anyways, so whatever YOU say, is an ultimate fact.

Sebring and Rally di positano has some different surface types, that is true, but what comes to tracks like Atlanta, Road America, Laguna Seca, Hockenheim, Infineon, Nurburgring, De La Sarthe and Suzuka, surface type is exactly the same, so having few occassional parts on few tracks makes it even ? Alright.

Guestion, have you ever driven a car that is made before '70, for example ? in real life I mean. I could took it on tape that how Corvette '60 stops from 100 km/h to 0 km/h because I have one, and compare that to FM4's awesomeness. But, am I willing to sacrifice my own car just to proove someone wrong about his pet-favourite, what would you do ?

TokoTurismo · Jul 24, 2012

@soheibV12

OMG I ADORE THOSE PHOTOS. They look so real, I can look at them all day, same with FM4's interiors, but I love GT5's interiors a lot more. But both games are great imo.

soheibV12 · Jul 24, 2012

TokoTurismo
@soheibV12

OMG I ADORE THOSE PHOTOS. They look so real, I can look at them all day, same with FM4's interiors, but I love GT5's interiors a lot more. But both games are great imo.

Thanks!

SlipZtrEm · Jul 24, 2012

Sampyla20plus
I'm sorry, but the GT5 isnt actually ment to be played with a controller, torgue steering wont work with the pad, why ? Because PaD wont change anything virtual into a car, thats why. Havent you ever noticed how limited the actual movement of the Controller stick is ? Just asking.

Seeing as how the majority of players use a controller, it obviously was indeed meant to be played with one.

Torque steer won't work on a wheel either, because, again, GT doesn't model it. You seem to be quite stubborn on avoiding this fact, so I'll echo Scaff's request too; just pop on over to Route X in a rear drive car, floor the throttle, and watch. Your car will launch arrow-straight every single time, no matter the power.

I understand your "God Given Rights" because you're the man behind this thread anyways, so whatever YOU say, is an ultimate fact.

I highly recommend stopping this train of thought. The staff don't arbitrarily decide what is and isn't right, but when someone has put untold hours into testing and has provided proof of their conclusions, like Scaff has, then yes, it's a repeatable fact.

Sebring and Rally di positano has some different surface types, that is true, but what comes to tracks like Atlanta, Road America, Laguna Seca, Hockenheim, Infineon, Nurburgring, De La Sarthe and Suzuka, surface type is exactly the same, so having few occassional parts on few tracks makes it even ? Alright.

First it was all tracks have the same surface, and now you've changed your tune. Which is it?

Guestion, have you ever driven a car that is made before '70, for example ? in real life I mean. I could took it on tape that how Corvette '60 stops from 100 km/h to 0 km/h because I have one, and compare that to FM4's awesomeness. But, am I willing to sacrifice my own car just to proove someone wrong about his pet-favourite, what would you do ?

Both games have had better-performing brakes than they really should, historically, and I'll readily admit to that. But that's the thing; it's both of them.

I'll let Scaff answer about his personal driving experience, but I can almost guarantee it's a much longer list than nearly anybody else in this thread.

TokoTurismo · Jul 24, 2012

soheibV12
Thanks!

No prob. 👍

Sampyla20plus · Jul 24, 2012

SlipZtrEm
Seeing as how the majority of players use a controller, it obviously was indeed meant to be played with one.

Torque steer won't work on a wheel either, because, again, GT doesn't model it. You seem to be quite stubborn on avoiding this fact, so I'll echo Scaff's request too; just pop on over to Route X in a rear drive car, floor the throttle, and watch. Your car will launch arrow-straight every single time, no matter the power.

I highly recommend stopping this train of thought. The staff don't arbitrarily decide what is and isn't right, but when someone has put untold hours into testing and has provided proof of their conclusions, like Scaff has, then yes, it's a repeatable fact.

First it was all tracks have the same surface, and now you've changed your tune. Which is it?

Both games have had better-performing brakes than they really should, historically, and I'll readily admit to that. But that's the thing; it's both of them.

I'll let Scaff answer about his personal driving experience, but I can almost guarantee it's a much longer list than nearly anybody else in this thread.

Stubborn only because, IF I let my G27 wheel go, the steering wheel just go on berserk, when launching / driving, I can record this action on video, if that would make it more acceptable. But my guess that someone would say only "prooves nothing"

Oh, so I'm not completely wrong because I named "all" tracks at first and then corrected that, but still these 2 tracks just makes it even because there is about 1 km in total covered with something else than tarmac ?

If the Scaff has more than 21 years of driving experience in real life, then I must admit that he might know more about driving than I do, not to mention I'm working at the AKK Motorsport to build custom racing cars & being part of a restoration team.

With all respect, Sam.

SlipZtrEm · Jul 24, 2012

Sampyla20plus
Stubborn only because, IF I let my G27 wheel go, the steering wheel just go on berserk, when launching / driving, I can record this action on video, if that would make it more acceptable. But my guess that someone would say only "prooves nothing"

The wheel going berserk is an inherent problem in how PD handles FFB, which is why, in this particular situation, the controller is even preferable to the wheel to test for torque steer, as you can be absolutely sure there's been no steering input.

And it will, again, prove that there's no torque steer in the game. A Cerbera Speed 12 on stock tires should not launch arrow-straight every time, or a Cobra 427, or any powerful rear-driver, really.

Oh, so I'm not completely wrong because I named "all" tracks at first and then corrected that, but still these 2 tracks just makes it even because there is about 1 km in total covered with something else than tarmac ?

I'm not really sure what you're trying to get at, then. Unless, like other points, this is a criticism of both games, because GT doesn't exactly have a myriad of different surfaces. It having rally tracks bumps its number up a bit, I imagine, but beyond those, I'm not seeing the massive difference.

thelvynau · Jul 24, 2012

I own both games and forza 3 and that is one feature i like abd have thought how much fun it would be to have torque steer in gt5 i enjoy having to control the car at launch.

I have tried it with a wheel and controller and gt5 doesnt simulate it.

Scaff · Jul 25, 2012

Sampyla20plus
Stubborn only because, IF I let my G27 wheel go, the steering wheel just go on berserk, when launching / driving, I can record this action on video, if that would make it more acceptable. But my guess that someone would say only "prooves nothing"

My question would be why would the steering go berserk when launching a RWD as a result of torque being distributed unevenly to the rear (driven) wheels?

GT5 doesn't model torque steer in cars from launch.

Sampyla20plus
Oh, so I'm not completely wrong because I named "all" tracks at first and then corrected that, but still these 2 tracks just makes it even because there is about 1 km in total covered with something else than tarmac ?

If I recall correctly (I can go and check the threads) its a claim you have made in around three different threads, as such it would not appear to be 'at first', but rather a claim made repeatedly.

Those are also the two tracks that spring to mind first and foremost rather than being the only ones. Can I also ask what you are basing this on? Is it force feedback from the wheel alone or an actual analysis of the telemetry?

I only ask as GT5 and FM4 deal with primary ride sensations in totally different (and equally unrealistic) manners.

Sampyla20plus
If the Scaff has more than 21 years of driving experience in real life, then I must admit that he might know more about driving than I do, not to mention I'm working at the AKK Motorsport to build custom racing cars & being part of a restoration team.

With all respect, Sam.

Passed my test when I was 17, I'm 41 now, so that's 24 years behind the wheel. I've worked most of my adult life within the motor industry and a good chunk of it in training roles.

In answer to your earlier question, yes I have driven cars made before 1970, and as the discussion was around drum brakes and lack of ABS well you could also throw in a host of cars from the early to the mid Eighties as well.

One quick question, why did you pick a figure of 21 years?

Now I've answered your questions, so would you please return the favour and answer mine and this time without the personal digs. Oh and it would be great to see some pictures of your 1960 'Vette as well.

FyreandIce · Jul 25, 2012

Sampyla20plus
Stubborn only because, IF I let my G27 wheel go, the steering wheel just go on berserk, when launching / driving, I can record this action on video, if that would make it more acceptable. But my guess that someone would say only "prooves nothing"

The steering wheel shouldn't "go beserk" in a full throttle take off in a Rear Wheel Drive car. In fact, at most it will slightly turn into the slide that will happen but generally not enough to correct the car.

Forza gets both of these points right, does GT?

Sampyla20plus
Oh, so I'm not completely wrong because I named "all" tracks at first and then corrected that, but still these 2 tracks just makes it even because there is about 1 km in total covered with something else than tarmac ?

Le Sarthe goes from smooth race track to less than smooth public roads.

Sebring goes from race track to pavement along the start finish strait.

Rally Di Positano goes from road surface to cobble stone.

I think what you are trying to imply is race tracks all have wildly different surfaces when in actual fact, this isn't true.

Yes, some ovals have diamond cut surfaces but for damn near every track uses bitumen and asphalt while street circuits are different again (street circuits essentially being no existent in FM4).

Here in Australia, the Albert Pack raceway (as seen in Formula 1) has an almost identical surface to the Winton Motor Raceway located in country Victoria.

Two vastly different circuits in different areas having damn near identical surfaces.

Sampyla20plus
If the Scaff has more than 21 years of driving experience in real life, then I must admit that he might know more about driving than I do, not to mention I'm working at the AKK Motorsport to build custom racing cars & being part of a restoration team.

With all respect, Sam.

Sweeping the floors of some apparent motorsport teams shed really isn't working in the motoring industry. :sly:

phillgt2002 · Jul 25, 2012

FyreandIce
The steering wheel shouldn't "go beserk" in a full throttle take off in a Rear Wheel Drive car. In fact, at most it will slightly turn into the slide that will happen but generally not enough to correct the car.

Forza gets both of these points right, does GT?

I've done launches in my E30 and the steering slowly goes towards a certain direction.

FyreandIce · Jul 25, 2012

phillkillv2
I've done launches in my E30 and the steering slowly goes towards a certain direction.

Into the slide, yes?

FM Vs GT - Discussion Thread (read the first post before you post)

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