Proposal for a new FGT

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analog

analog

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A few days ago I thankfully reached B-spec level 40 (so I won't need to bother with it anymore) and received the level 24 ticket.
When I used it I was expecting to get one of the Ferrari F1 cars but instead I got another FGT (great, another Standard car I won't use, already got and cannot trade...).
This however got me thinking about this car and its role in GT5 and future GT-games.

If future GT-games consist of Premium cars only (and let's hope they do) it is to be expected this car eventually will be replaced by a Premium version but does it have to be replaced, by which I mean replaced by a car similar in concept?
With both Ferrari F1 cars included and the 'ultimate' racecar in the form of the Red Bull X1 (sorry, X2010) the FGT's place seems a bit unclear and perhaps even obsolete.
Sure, GT5 has the FGT championship making this car automatically 'relevant' and some do seem to really like this car but I think PD should rethink this formula's formula.

It seems to somewhat fill the gap right now between the F1 cars and the X2010 (although it's perhaps much closer in concept to the F1 cars) but there's a much bigger gap regarding openwheeled racecars between the F1 cars and the little karts.
So I propose they could fill this gap and here's my suggestion how they could do this (to keep it relevant to GT5 I'll try to fit it within GT5's structure as it is right now, so it could theoretically be added as DLC).

When you go into the Gran Turismo dealership you'll find 2 basic monocoques or formula-type chassis with only the 'necessary' bodywork, no front or rear wings, etc.
One is a short wheel base version and the other a longer wheel base version both sharing the same cockpit view (to save time and not overcomplicate things).
Instead of selecting colours you select the engine, the short wheel base version can be purchased with either an N/A 'four' or a turbocharged 'four' whilst the longer wheelbase version can be fitted with either a V6 or V8 engine, or something along those lines.
Once chosen and bought you take it to GT-Auto where you can pick and mix several types of front and rear wings, diffusers, etc. and paint it (or not) using the paintshop (obviously).

This way you can both create a "unique" formula-car more suited to personal preferences whilst at the same time creating multiple kind of openwheeled racecars and therefor multiple series to exploit, and fill the gap between the lovely little karts and the F1 cars.
No trouble with licensing (and the mighty Bernie) and creating a much bigger variety of openwheeled racecars.
If PD are going to add fantasy or imaginary cars, why not let us play a (small) role in imagining them by selecting a few options?
Okay, not likely to happen anytime soon for multiple reasons but feel free to discuss, suggest, criticize or hopefully applaud. ;)
 
Agreed with the new FGT and make-yourself-a-car.
But i don't agree with multiple fantasy open wheel racing series.
FGT alone would be enough. And just add more car instead of 12 or 16. Though i'm glad they're alot.
 
:D I totally agree, I'm surprised PD didn't make a new FGT considering it's one of their own creations anyway.
 
They should do another deal with Red Bull to create a similar RBFGT, that should allow some similar racers. Also make a deal with Ferrari to create something competitive with the X2010:D
 
My idea was to buy something resembling a Formula Ford (perhaps a bit bigger though) which has no wings like pictured below.

spirit3.jpg


You could then perhaps even decide to keep it that way (no downforce) or 'clothe' it using GT-Auto so that it becomes more like a Formula 3 (or Formula 3000 for the long wheel base version) type racecar.

formulino.jpg


With the engine options in place (would be even better to choose between existing engines of cars available in GT5 but then there are no doubt license issues which would arise and other complications) you could create several different racecars with a different amount of PP and which all behave differently using the same basic template (or car to model by PD, excluding all different add-ons ofcourse).


Radracing
This could also work with a PD LMP car. Great Idea!
Click to expand...

Yes it could work with a LMP car too I guess (that would need a separate model obviously), not sure there are many more categories which would lend themselves easily to this approach though.
 
analog
My idea was to buy something resembling a Formula Ford (perhaps a bit bigger though)

You could then perhaps even decide to keep it that way (no downforce) or 'clothe' it using GT-Auto so that it becomes more like a Formula 3 (or Formula 3000 for the long wheel base version) type racecar.

With the engine options in place (would be even better to choose between existing engines of cars available in GT5 but then there are no doubt license issues which would arise and other complications) you could create several different racecars with a different amount of PP and which all behave differently using the same basic template (or car to model by PD, excluding all different add-ons ofcourse).

Yes it could work with a LMP car too I guess (that would need a separate model obviously), not sure there are many more categories which would lend themselves easily to this approach though.
Click to expand...


Would something like a Radical work as an LMP Base car? Perhaps there could be a basic chassis to fit both and you can choose for it to be a Formula or an LM car. The final expensive upgrade (like an RM upgrade) could turn the car into either a new Formula 1 spec car or a new Group C/ LMP1 spec car.
 
Reminds me of Indycar/Champcar/IRL/whateveritisthisweek's competition to manufacturers for the next gen American open-wheel racer. Lola and Dallara had some interesting offerings, so why not include them? Perhaps even Ariel or KTM?
 
NFSCARBON1
Would something like a Radical work as an LMP Base car? Perhaps there could be a basic chassis to fit both and you can choose for it to be a Formula or an LM car. The final expensive upgrade (like an RM upgrade) could turn the car into either a new Formula 1 spec car or a new Group C/ LMP1 spec car.
Click to expand...

Trouble with one chassis to become both an open wheel racecar and an LMP is that the single shared cockpit view I mentioned wouldn't work as not only is the cockpit of an LMP car off centre (LHD or RHD as opposed to sitting in the middle in an open wheel car) but the bodywork covering the wheels isn't the same too, therefore it needs to be a separately modelled car.

Although you could create something like a mini-X1 perhaps, something which has the steering wheel in the middle but resembles a LMP-racer since it's a fantasy car in the first place.
Maybe even make the cockpit view in a way that you don't see the difference, you neither see the exposed wheels nor the extra bodywork, although that might be difficult to pull of convincingly.

McClarenDesign
Reminds me of Indycar/Champcar/IRL/whateveritisthisweek's competition to manufacturers for the next gen American open-wheel racer. Lola and Dallara had some interesting offerings, so why not include them? Perhaps even Ariel or KTM?
Click to expand...

They were very interesting but to include one of those is another issue not directly related to a PD-designed fantasy car like the current FGT is, you would also need the Indy-license to include them (and the manufacturers license too) I guess as opposed to creating several types of racecars partly yourself which need no license at all.
 
PD would then count every possible configuration of engine/monocoque/aerodynamics as a diferent car, thus bumping the car list by fifty and taking twice the time in development. True story, just see what happened with the SuperGT and NASCAR cars.

Although, it's a great idea and would make for a more diverse type of racing. A shame it's to good to be true.
 
Why not have monoques from older cars as well? I mean they already have licensed most of the companies why not do that as well?

Now combine it with licences engines (Cosworth, Renault, Ferrari, Honda (YES THE TURBO!), etc), and you now have almost 40 years worth of F1 history done in a good fashion.

Hell you could combine old engines with new monoques and vice versa. Or just a single chassis that can be customized via GT Auto and sponsored engines. Now if they could only get Porsche-TAG into this game, allow Martini liveries, and allow all the old cigarette company liveries, we'd have the 1970s-1990s all over again in F1.
 
Nice idea. it would be like the old F1 days where you would see teams running v8's, v10's and v12's all on the same grid! Could also incorporate PP in as well, say you have a mahooooosive v12, you wouldn't be able to have much downforce. vis versa, you could have a v8 and you can have a fair amount of downforce. Or my favourite, a twin turbo 1.6 honda v6 that chucks out 950bhp (or 1200 in quali trim) hardly any downforce and nice chunky tires with a paint job that looks very similar to the Mclaren MP4-4 that Senna drove :D

i think it would be interesting to progress up through what ever the GT equivalent of karts, formula renault, f3, gp2 then f1 would be. It would be good to have a few different 'F1' cars available, like the different Group C and DTM cars etc.

To be fair though it would be necessary to add other forms of touring car racing, from the lower ranks, through to BTCC (or equivalent) then up to the DTM. There are so many possibilities for different racing types and categories. now if PD would only replace some of the variations of mx-5, skylines and toyotas and added more races and cars to compete in them with.... i wonder where we would be?
 
CarBastard
PD would then count every possible configuration of engine/monocoque/aerodynamics as a diferent car, thus bumping the car list by fifty and taking twice the time in development. True story, just see what happened with the SuperGT and NASCAR cars.
Click to expand...

To be fair, a lot of the SuperGT cars are slightly different regarding some details and specification, in fact all of the NASCAR cars, despite having similar exteriors apart from the livery, have a unique interior.
The interiors may appear similar at first glance but each one (not talking about the difference in brands, even cars from the same brand differ from each other) has a different layout, some minor whilst on some the differences are quite obvious, which means each one was modelled separately and is therefor a different car.

Even when those combined monocoques and engine options are counted as different cars (which they are actually, that's the whole point I was trying to make) I doubt they would count the wings, diffusers, etc. too as this isn't the case right now (they don't count all bodykits, spoilers, wheel options and all variations you can make of one car to the total car count).
And even if they were to do that, so what? They've always padded the numbers but that's just numbers, a very minor concern or objection which has nothing to do with the basic concept proposed here.
 
You know seeing as there's an entire plethora of banned technology in F1, i'm quite sure you could just have a build your own F1 car with specific technologies.

Brabham Fan Car? Lotus 79 Ground Effects? FW14 active suspension? I'm quite sure if PD cared to do it, they could easily implement multi-faceted technology combinations as well. It would sure make things incredibly interesting. A 450HP Ground Effect with active suspension? I would have hours of fun just trying out different combinations.

As for touring cars, I say bring back the RM modifications from GT and then add a small layer of customization to each car. Different technologies for different things.

LMPs work great since you can have chassis from Lola or any of the privateer teams (Anyone up to customize a Porsche 962?). It is pretty realistic too since LMP participants had chassis from older cars run for older teams.

For stock to racing mod, you can even make it into a specific fit, >500 for GT500, >500 for DTM, ALMS fit, LMP2 fit, etc.

However owing to licensing issues and PD's lack of inspiration we will never see a Saleen S7 ALMS or an SLR McLaren Race car...
 
analog
To be fair, a lot of the SuperGT cars are slightly different regarding some details and specification, in fact all of the NASCAR cars, despite having similar exteriors apart from the livery, have a unique interior.
The interiors may appear similar at first glance but each one (not talking about the difference in brands, even cars from the same brand differ from each other) has a different layout, some minor whilst on some the differences are quite obvious, which means each one was modelled separately and is therefor a different car.

Even when those combined monocoques and engine options are counted as different cars (which they are actually, that's the whole point I was trying to make) I doubt they would count the wings, diffusers, etc. too as this isn't the case right now (they don't count all bodykits, spoilers, wheel options and all variations you can make of one car to the total car count).
And even if they were to do that, so what? They've always padded the numbers but that's just numbers, a very minor concern or objection which has nothing to do with the basic concept proposed here.
Click to expand...

I do know that, given that I've driven most if not all Super GTs in the game. However, I believe this details are an expression of pointless perfectionism and are only meaningful to a couple of people, and thus are a waste of time considering how long does it take to re-model a whole new interior view.

Personally, I like more the Forza approach when it comes to this kind of racing. Forza's NASCAR cars are one of each model (Impala, Challenger, Fusion) but have a blank livery. You could replicate your favourite racer out there in the real world field or you can make your own race car. I really don't care having all iterations of the Lexus SC430 SuperGT. Just take the fastest one out and give it to me as a representation of the Lexus SC430 SuperGT, and use part of the shaved time designing a proper customization system.
 
All that is needed.. IMO, we don't need any more fantasy cars like the FGT or X2010, they just ruin online :\

5286732726_d0edd8c943.jpg

watsonlotus72n.jpg
 
analog
When you go into the Gran Turismo dealership you'll find 2 basic monocoques or formula-type chassis with only the 'necessary' bodywork, no front or rear wings, etc.
One is a short wheel base version and the other a longer wheel base version both sharing the same cockpit view (to save time and not overcomplicate things).
Instead of selecting colours you select the engine, the short wheel base version can be purchased with either an N/A 'four' or a turbocharged 'four' whilst the longer wheelbase version can be fitted with either a V6 or V8 engine, or something along those lines.
Once chosen and bought you take it to GT-Auto where you can pick and mix several types of front and rear wings, diffusers, etc. and paint it (or not) using the paintshop (obviously).

This way you can both create a "unique" formula-car more suited to personal preferences whilst at the same time creating multiple kind of openwheeled racecars and therefor multiple series to exploit, and fill the gap between the lovely little karts and the F1 cars.
Click to expand...

Are you familiar with formula racing? There isn't a mix-and-match to formula racing. The "formula" in "Formula One" and other formulae refers to a specific set of requirements that the cars must comply to. Using F1 as an example, there are very specific dimensions that the car must fit within, restrictions on where certain things can and cannot be, what technologies can and cannot be employed, what materials are forbidden, engine displacement, number of valves, and so much more. If you're mixing and matching, you're not formula racing. You may be open-wheel racing, but not formula racing.
 
IceMan PJN
Are you familiar with formula racing? There isn't a mix-and-match to formula racing. The "formula" in "Formula One" and other formulae refers to a specific set of requirements that the cars must comply to. Using F1 as an example, there are very specific dimensions that the car must fit within, restrictions on where certain things can and cannot be, what technologies can and cannot be employed, what materials are forbidden, engine displacement, number of valves, and so much more. If you're mixing and matching, you're not formula racing. You may be open-wheel racing, but not formula racing.
Click to expand...

Yes, I'm aware of the specific and highly detailed requirements of formula racing, although I didn't meant for anyone to take the whole formula-description too literally since the Formula Gran Turismo, which this concept could replace, doesn't meet any real life criteria too since it's a fantasy car (and is still called a formula).
My whole idea was a simplified version which you could partly 'build' yourself and where you decide which criteria to follow, you decide which engine/wing configuration, etc. (you're basically a designer and the FIA at the same time)
Not in any way as specific as the real life criteria of any formula-series but still enough room to create different formula's within the limited context of this particular videogame (to meet your criteria they would need to create an entirely different game).

Yes, they're at the very least open wheel race cars but if you made your car according to a limited set of requirements (for example N/A 'four', no downforce, fixed PP limit and hard racing tyres, etc.) and asked others to meet the same requirements online then you could call that a "formula" I guess.
The same car with a V8, full downforce package, soft racing tyres wouldn't fit that criteria and would be a different formula.
So the mixing and matching only extends when you create (by selecting options) a single formula, I didn't mean all the options were equal (them being completely different whilst using the same basic template was the whole point) or that all possible combinations were to race together.

Whether it's realistic or not is largely irrelevant as the current FGT isn't very realistic too, at least this way there's going to be much more scope and variety, for all I care they call it the OWGT instead of FGT.
 

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