Do You Really Care About Little Details?

JohnBM01 · Jul 8, 2004

Here's another topic I'm taking a chance on asking.

Little details in games tend to be the difference between a good game and a great game. People can hate Gran Turismo because there is no body damage... and I don't give a hoot. People can dislike Virtua Fighter 4: Evolution because it doesn't have weapons and powerups like its rival, Soul Calibur 2. So what made me bring up this topic? Just like my "Sound Off! Track Variety" topic, I am pretty concerned in the posts I read. I know that what I would want in GT4 would either be that of people who agree with my views, people who disagree with my views, or those that are neutral to my views. But a lot of times, I've heard of constant little "rants," if you will, about GT4. For example, the wheels are a problem to some. Some notice some graphical glitches. Some want car damage. So it leads me to ask, do you actually care about little details, or do you just want to play GT4 as is, even if it can't compare to anything on the XBOX? This is not a discusssion ABOUT such details, but do you CARE about them. And why/why not? Do you think that such small details will prevent GT4 from being the greatest game ever? Will such little details mentioned on GTPlanet tell the difference between if GT4 far exceeeds PGR2, or comes up short of the checkered flag? I'll express my views in further detail in future posts. Until then, you may reply right now.

Darin · Jul 8, 2004

Those little details complete a game. They don't put them, it'll have as many Glitches like DRIV3R has.

Live For Speed · Jul 8, 2004

I don't really care about small details. Reverse light wouldn't spoil the game, but i don't mind if they will not make it because i reversed like twice in GT3 over the past 3 years. Car damage.... who cares? if you are retarted and smash into every wall in a race then that is your problem, so i don't care about that either, it's not destruction derby. I think i said everything.

TheCracker · Jul 8, 2004

As long as i have the option to run in 'mph' rather than the euro norm of 'kph' - i'll be happy with the way GT4 is shaping up.

Eagle · Jul 8, 2004

I'm of two minds - they don't make that big a difference to the game, anything by definition that is a minor detail won't have a huge influence, so missing some minor details doesn't really bother me. I'm not perfectionist enough to demand PD include every single thing in exacting detail just like reality, I appreciate whatever we get. However, it is the little details that tend to separate games. Sometimes the smallest things, the tiny, seemingly insignificant discoveries you make yourself while playing, are the coolest things to come from a game. They're the things you remember more clearly than any race. The thing is, quite a lot of the time, those little details tend to be things not necessarily included by the development team as a concious decision, they're just something you eventually find and go "heh, that's pretty cool". What's the danger in this? You waste time and space including something not everyone will notice or appreciate, so it's a balance. You want everyone to just enjoy the game, but you want some hardcore people to pick up on minor details. Minor details are always going to be aimed at people dedicated enough to actually pay attention and notice them.

GT4 will have been through one of the longest "Polish" phases of a game ever, I get the feeling it'll be high on nifty things to notice.

Arwin · Jul 8, 2004

Some small things do bug me. Most notably the reverse - I want to be able to shift into reverse properly and use my accellerator pedal to control the speed, not some stupid button. With Coffee Break 5, for the first time this glitch affects your performance in the game, at least when you drive with a wheel, and I think it's stupid anyway.

For GT4 I'm hoping we'll get good tire wear, fuel consumption and proper pit-stopping. That's all I have on my wishlist really.

Robin · Jul 8, 2004

I feel that the little details in a game are important, its what sets it apart from the rest. In the case of Gran Turismo 4 its huge numbers of cars and its outstanding graphics set it apart from any other game in this catagory, Have you seen any other game with such a scene as the Gran Canyon in such amazing detail!!

Yes, Gran Turismo 4 maybe lacking in some areas such as damaga effects but I don't, like many other people feel it matters because it is made up for in other ways. I like the 3D moving spectators!, I like the top down Cobra! and I like the tight streets in Citta di Aria......etc etc etc, who needs damage when you have these!!!

Ive always liked GT for its unique selling point, it is in a field of its own becuse of the massive attention to detail........PD have done enough to cover for the stuff the game lacks but I it still a game that thrives on the fact it has "those little detials".......

Robin

Mike Rotch · Jul 8, 2004

Game play > Graphics.

Sure, having windscreen wipers or reverse lights or steam from the exhaust "would be nice", but as long as the game play is great I couldnt really care.

code_kev · Jul 8, 2004

John all these features you mentioned are just graphics, chances are they had to sarcrifice some deatils to make other bits looks so awesome. The fact that GT4 may not have a little detail doesn't stop it from being the best racing game when it comes out.

Racedriver33 · Jul 8, 2004

The game will be fully complete when PD decide to include Lancia Y10 Fire in the game!

j8mie · Jul 8, 2004

At the end of the day GT4 will just be another driving game. But what sets it apart from the others are it's little details. Skid marks, reversing lights, having a inside camera view, opening doors/bonnets would all be really nice, and some people put this level of detail above other things like the number of cars or tracks.

At the end of the day we are all looking for different things from GT4, and we just want to see things put into the game in a different order. One day PD will release a GT game that has everything in. And no one will complain about a car being left out, or skid marks not being left on the track. But until that day, we'll just have ot make do with what ever PD give us.

But in answer to the original question, yes I do care about the little details, as these are what makes GT different from other racing games.

Cheers

Jamie

amar212 · Jul 8, 2004

Details are important. And what is more important, some of the best details form first games never appered on PS2.

"New record" for the lap record (GT), count for all the lap times in race (no matter of the race length, GT), 2 player race legendary named "Memory Card Battle" (GT), max speed for race (GT2), time-trial option gallore (GT2), ghost options gallore (GT2), lap-jump in time-trial mode (GT2), full replay save (no matter of race length (GT&GT2), individual garage sorting (GT2), full-screen instead of scrolling "car story" (GT2)...

That were the details that made respect for GT. Hope all of them will make a comeback.

Solid Lifters · Jul 8, 2004

Little things can add up. though. Like, how would the game look if PD were able to add flying leaves, paper and plastics bags that can stick to your car, birds and other animal life darting about, exhaust from the tailpipe, etc... If PD were able to do that, GT4 would definitely look a lot better.

Jay · Jul 8, 2004

Solid Lifters
Little things can add up. though. Like, how would the game look if PD were able to add flying leaves, paper and plastics bags that can stick to your car, birds and other animal life darting about, exhaust from the tailpipe, etc... If PD were able to do that, GT4 would definitely look a lot better.

Dont forget the bird **** when you park you car under a tree in photomode.

Solid Lifters · Jul 8, 2004

VIPERGTSR01
Dont forget the bird **** when you park you car under a tree in photomode.

Exactly! We need bird ****, people!

capnlarge · Jul 8, 2004

I'd rather have no damage than damage like in PGR 2 or Need For Speed. The damage in those games does nothing, all it does is make your beautiful car look ugly.

As for whether GT4 will beat PGR 2? Ummm...All the other GT games are better than PGR 2. I don't see why GT4 will be any different.

Also, GT4 will be full of little details, as GT games tend to be.

yeti · Jul 8, 2004

amar212
2 player race legendary named "Memory Card Battle" (GT),
full replay save (no matter of race length (GT&GT2),
individual garage sorting (GT2),

These you can do? Well the first one not 100% you can race against each other with cars from memory card.

But otherwise you can save full replays (They take up a lot of space though)

And you can sort your garage in GT3.

I do agree with

amar212
"New record" for the lap record (GT),
count for all the lap times in race (no matter of the race length, GT),

Though... Especially as it hardly ever saved any times in GT3... Really annoying... and at the end of an Enduro you could only see the last 20 or so lap times?!

There are many many little details that are in GT... some of them have been sadly missed out (Reverse lights, visual difference when upgrading cars etc) but other things that are in such as distance counters on bends and by the looks of things in GT4

a bloke waving a chequered flag are amazing...

C.

amar212 · Jul 8, 2004

Yeti, dude, no offense, but I know what I'm talking about, read better. And all my points are worthy.

TriplePlay · Jul 8, 2004

^^^^^I would like to see a records page like previously mentioned in another thread.

As for the details......I could honestly care less. Sure, they could polish it off, but what if they didn't? It would STILL be my gran turismo, they would still have the new braking system, still have the nurb, fuji, tskuba, and many new tracks yet to be mentioned. Even if the car list was shortened to 300 or so it would still be one of the best racing games ever. Everybody would still enjoy it, and we would be raving about the sheer brilliance of KY. The fact that he is going to extreme measures to polish and finish the game and make it even better than all expected is simply amazing. I'm happy with whatever PD throws at me.

Iceman · Jul 8, 2004

I dont care what little details it has it will still be a great game overall.

yeti · Jul 8, 2004

amar212
Yeti, dude, no offense, but I know what I'm talking about, read better. And all my points are worthy.

Okey then...

Put it this way.

In GT3, I can sort my garage... and I can save replays of Enduro's.

You can sort your garage by name, distance driven, power, weight, drive & sale value.

C.

Duke · Jul 8, 2004

As Mike Rotch said, gameplay > graphics. So I care a lot about details that affect gameplay: more telemetry information (like tire temperatures), more adjustability to dampers (high- and low-speed bound and rebound), smarter AI, even better physics, more surface conditions, more races with specific entry requirements...

I couldn't possibly care less about animated pit crews, spectators, 3D wheels, etc. Pit stops are when you blink and rest your eyes, anyway. And if you're checking out the spectators instead of the braking point for the next turn, you're not driving hard enough.

yeti
In GT3, I can sort my garage... You can sort your garage by name, distance driven, power, weight, drive & sale value.

But you can't keep it that way. It reverts to default every time you leave that session.

Solid Lifters · Jul 8, 2004

neon_duke
As Mike Rotch said, gameplay > graphics. So I care a lot about details that affect gameplay: more telemetry information (like tire temperatures), more adjustability to dampers (high- and low-speed bound and rebound), smarter AI, even better physics, more surface conditions, more races with specific entry requirements...

I couldn't possibly care less about animated pit crews, spectators, 3D wheels, etc. Pit stops are when you blink and rest your eyes, anyway. And if you're checking out the spectators instead of the braking point for the next turn, you're not driving hard enough.

But what about during replays? Or, don't you watch them? I wouldn't mind seeing the little extras I mentioned during the replays only. It gives it a more real feel to what you're watching.

Duke · Jul 8, 2004

I do watch the replays, usually to see how clean my passes were. Once again, I tend to concentrate on the race itself. But I wouldn't mind seeing that stuff in the replays where it wouldn't bog the gameplay. Realtime skidmarks in the replays would be cool, too, but I'm not in favor of wasting a ton of development time on it.

JAGUAR · Jul 8, 2004

The details are what make GT stand out from the rest. If the details are correct you can be sure the developers have spent as much time on the other, more vital areas of the game.

When a game, like the GT series, reaches the fourth installment of the series, it is these details and refinements that improve the game as a whole.

Lethalchem · Jul 8, 2004

I care about details to a point, because it's the little details that really sets a game apart from another. Do I worry about a single detail here or there? Of course not. Ignore enough minor details, however, and you'll have enough to equal a large fault that would be difficult to overlook as far as gameplay enjoyment is concerned.

Now would I refuse to buy GT4 because they fell short on several details? Hell no. Even a lousy version of the GT series is more enjoyable than most perfected versions from other titles. :lol:

sUn · Jul 8, 2004

I think if it came out sooner, I would forget about the small details.

GT-One Lover · Jul 8, 2004

...i want this details:
---->rearwards LIGHT
and
---->fire out of the exhaustes
...PD plzzzzzzzzzzz :bowdown:

k2racer · Jul 8, 2004

GT-One Lover
...i want this details:
---->rearwards LIGHT
and
---->fire out of the exhaustes
...PD plzzzzzzzzzzz

You now what: every time my little daughter wants something she is always saying plzzzzzzzzzzz and she is 5 years old. Then she is not having it!

Sprite · Jul 8, 2004

In the end what PD put together for GT4 im going to be happy with, because ive tasted what the physics engine is like on a small selection of cars and now I just want to drive the rest. As for small details im not too bothered about tyre marks or 3D crowds. As long as the game moves along at a good frame rate and the game is playable.

Damage is not that important either, yes it happens in real life, but you also have to pay for it fixing, and if I had just done a race and I had hit the barriers hard and took off the front end of my car then I finish the race and it magically repairs itself then that would be more unrealistic than having no damage in the first place.

Do You Really Care About Little Details?

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