THE way GT4 shifts!!!

futuredrifter

futuredrifter

320
OK people i searhed for a thread like this and couldnt find wat i was lookin for exactly.

In GT4 does it bother anybody that almost every car shifts like it has a sequential gear box. For me its kinda annoying.

If this thread has been allready posted please redirect me to it. thnx
 
It's always been that way, in every GT game, ever. How are you going to shift non-sequentially with a controller that doesn't have an H-pattern?
 
It's not annoying... it's just the way it is. No way to make it better. Would you prefer having R3 as an H-pattern shifter? :ill:
 
well im not talking about how its done really mainly i mean the sound.

but if there was a clutch button that would be good

and there is a game with a clutch button. Toca race driver 2
 
futuredrifter
well im not talking about how its done really mainly i mean the sound.

but if there was a clutch button that would be good

and there is a game with a clutch button. Toca race driver 2
Click to expand...

Enthusia also has a clutch button, but that is an aside.

If you are talking about the flat-shifts on upchanges, you can get around this by quite simply lifting off the throttle when you up-shift. A number of people have already posted to say they do this anyway, not for any reason but they feel it make the game more 'realistic' for them.

If you are talking about the throttle blip on downshifts, then its the game heel and toeing for you, as you should when racing (or in my opinion driving smoothly on the road). It has a very good reason, to avoid compression/engine braking, which is not your friend on the track.

Have a read of these, the first is just about compression braking (but helps clear up a few myths on the subject) the second covers its implementation in GT4 and the reason for the Heel and Toe downshifts. Its a fair bit to read, but well worth it.

Compression Braking - What exactly is it for?

Compression Braking - How well implemented is it in GT4

If you have any queries regading these two posts it would be useful if you asked them over in the GT4 & Brakes thread (link in my sig) in the Tuning section of the GT4 forum, as the general GT4 section is not realy the right place to discuss it.

Regards

Scaff
 
coolacrille
omg. could you tell us how that would work? in your opinion.
Click to expand...

Ever played Enthusia Pro Racing or TOCA Race Driver 2????!!!!
IN TOCA 2 you literally have to engage the clutch (L1) to upshift w/o tranny damage and you have to "Heel-Toe" it to downshift w/o tranny damage, or locking the rear end (Downshift drift initiation anyone?).

In Enthusia, you push a button (L1) and it engages the clutch wich makes the car seem to be in neutral untill you release it (POP IT!!) and violently release the car into gear, throwing you sideways into a perfect and realistic drift!!MUAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! Or let the revs drop and release it to lock the rear end and throw you sideways. (again, downshift drift) However in Enthu. you don't need it to shift. Though it can help with downshifts via "Heel-Toe"

With the DFP it is hard to use because it is a button on the wheel and in 900 mode it is very difficult to find.
I WANT A CLUTCH PEDAL LOGITECH!!!!!! AND ONE THAT'S COMPATIBLE WITH PS2 AT THAT!!!!!!!
 
Scaff
Enthusia also has a clutch button, but that is an aside.

If you are talking about the flat-shifts on upchanges, you can get around this by quite simply lifting off the throttle when you up-shift. A number of people have already posted to say they do this anyway, not for any reason but they feel it make the game more 'realistic' for them.

If you are talking about the throttle blip on downshifts, then its the game heel and toeing for you, as you should when racing (or in my opinion driving smoothly on the road). It has a very good reason, to avoid compression/engine braking, which is not your friend on the track.

Have a read of these, the first is just about compression braking (but helps clear up a few myths on the subject) the second covers its implementation in GT4 and the reason for the Heel and Toe downshifts. Its a fair bit to read, but well worth it.

Compression Braking - What exactly is it for?

Compression Braking - How well implemented is it in GT4

If you have any queries regading these two posts it would be useful if you asked them over in the GT4 & Brakes thread (link in my sig) in the Tuning section of the GT4 forum, as the general GT4 section is not realy the right place to discuss it.

Regards

Scaff
Click to expand...


well i dont mind wen it downshiftsi like that its real cool and realistic. But its just the sound of all the upshifts.
 
futuredrifter
well i dont mind wen it downshiftsi like that its real cool and realistic. But its just the sound of all the upshifts.
Click to expand...

OK, as I say they are just flat-shifts, something that can be done with (as you say) most racing sequential boxes. If it offends you that much, just lift slightly before each shift (if you are using manual).

Regards

Scaff
 
One thing I did notice accidentally is that when I hold down the accelerator and brake pedal at the same time, neither are engaged and you just coast. By holding down the brake pedal in-place of the clutch, you can get the same effect.
However, this might just be my pedals and it doesn't work with braking downshifts. :lol:
 
In forza the gears are change in a slower rate, so it kinda emulates the manual shifting process. when you upgrade the tranny and shifter it changes gears faster. just need to compare the true automatics (Merc Benz) vs manual gearbox shifting speeds vs racing cars secuentials.
 
I agree though.. i would love to have a racing game that had a clutch.. esp a rally game... toca ok.. but no makers make a clutch on thier wheel sets

if i had the room i would make a seat set that had a clutch for those games where i would wire a clutch that would activate the L1 or what ever button so it woudl work like a real clutch... plus extend a wire to a shifter on the side so it's in a more realalistic position along with the e-brake... although.. if you do it right u shouldn't need to use your ebrake
 
Scaff
Enthusia also has a clutch button, but that is an aside.

If you are talking about the flat-shifts on upchanges, you can get around this by quite simply lifting off the throttle when you up-shift. A number of people have already posted to say they do this anyway, not for any reason but they feel it make the game more 'realistic' for them.

If you are talking about the throttle blip on downshifts, then its the game heel and toeing for you, as you should when racing (or in my opinion driving smoothly on the road). It has a very good reason, to avoid compression/engine braking, which is not your friend on the track.

Have a read of these, the first is just about compression braking (but helps clear up a few myths on the subject) the second covers its implementation in GT4 and the reason for the Heel and Toe downshifts. Its a fair bit to read, but well worth it.

Compression Braking - What exactly is it for?

Compression Braking - How well implemented is it in GT4

If you have any queries regading these two posts it would be useful if you asked them over in the GT4 & Brakes thread (link in my sig) in the Tuning section of the GT4 forum, as the general GT4 section is not realy the right place to discuss it.

Regards

Scaff
Click to expand...


What, you mean people shift without lifting the foot off the gas? I always take my off the games when I shift, imagining a non-existant clutch.
 
The original Ridge Racer arcade game was available in a deluxe cabinet with progressive clutch pedal. You didn't need to use it and I doubt many players did, but it did provide slightly quicker shifts with less loss of revs (100rpm at most). It was only really noticable if you'd played the game far too much and had each section of the track memorised down to the millisecond, then you'd notice being able to reach a slightly higher top speed before particular braking (sliding!) points.
 
~Sp33~
Wouldnt that cause the car to back off and not shift?
Click to expand...

If you are using Automatic then it may, I was talking about using Manual. My bad, I should have been a bit clearer, but I always assume Manual and its what I always use.

Regards

Scaff
 
Brock5000
The original Ridge Racer arcade game was available in a deluxe cabinet with progressive clutch pedal. You didn't need to use it and I doubt many players did, but it did provide slightly quicker shifts with less loss of revs (100rpm at most). It was only really noticable if you'd played the game far too much and had each section of the track memorised down to the millisecond, then you'd notice being able to reach a slightly higher top speed before particular braking (sliding!) points.
Click to expand...

only other arcade game i've seen that had one was the Sega Ferrari F355 challenge game had a working clutch, wasn't entirely needed... but did make a noticeable difference.
 
I've thought of how best to impliment a clutch in the game, probably the easiest way to introduce a clutch into the game without requiring everyone to buy new pedals or joysticks, or having to use an awkward button configuration, would be to have the clutch activated by holding down either gear shift button.

A quick tap would change gears as normal, but continuing to hold down would incrementally disengage the clutch until it's all the way in and no drive is being transmitted. The length of time it takes to put the clutch in would correspond to the clutch plate and other drivetrain mods you have done to the car.

Releasing it would effectively be dumping the clutch, which would allow us to drop big smokey burnouts without having to apply the brakes and stall the engine up. The severity of the clutch engagement should correspond to how long you've held it in (better yet if the R & L buttons were pressrue sensitve), as well as the power of the car.

To complete the simulation and make the cars behave realistically you'd also want the engine to react accordingly and potentially 'stall' if you ask too much , but that probably wouldn't be much fun.
 
get in a stock car, and it performs like a stock car. if you want lag in the shift, dont buy a racing clutch, lightweight flywheel, and the racing tranny. i keep the stock tranny and i use a heavy duty clutch and semi-racing flywheel in my high-rpm honda's to make them sound better and perform like a street car
 
That is a good point. Drive something old or just something with a slow shifter, like an econobox. A few cars that shift like they have SMGs (not sub-machine guns) shift like that because they hactually have SMGs (again, not sub-machine guns) or automatic trannys. A good, cheap example. Buy a Mazda Protege. Put a full racing tranny in it. It will shift half as fast because the tranny isn't an automatic in the car anymore. A better, but far more expensive, example, is the Mercedes SL 55 AMG (or even the SL500). When that car shifts it sounds like it doesn't even get out of the throttle because it shifts so fast because it has an automatic in it. If you put a full racing tranny in it, it shifts very slowly.
 
Toronado
they have SMGs (not sub-machine guns)
Click to expand...

why not just say SMG (Sequential Manual Gearbox) ... it seems more polite to tell people what it is, rather than what it isn't.
oh and the only cars with an SMG are all wearing a BMW badge, since that is a trademark, not a general acronym.
 
rcravincase
get in a stock car, and it performs like a stock car. if you want lag in the shift, dont buy a racing clutch, lightweight flywheel, and the racing tranny. i keep the stock tranny and i use a heavy duty clutch and semi-racing flywheel in my high-rpm honda's to make them sound better and perform like a street car
Click to expand...


Exactly! For instance I love the sound of the 2005 Mustang bone stock. It sounds great and the shift time feels fairly accurate too.

If you guys want to hear some great sounding cars/shifting though, try Need for Speed Underground 2. If it's not for the game itself, but the car sounds are dead on!
 
Brock5000
Releasing it would effectively be dumping the clutch, which would allow us to drop big smokey burnouts without having to apply the brakes and stall the engine up. The severity of the clutch engagement should correspond to how long you've held it in (better yet if the R & L buttons were pressrue sensitve), as well as the power of the car.
Click to expand...

that would work out well... but only if the L&R buttons were *proper* analogue triggers, not just pressure sensative buttons.
the pressure sensative buttons (x,[],O,^, on the ds2) Worst idea the playstation dev team ever came up with. They're complete rubbish.
 
The only thing I have to say about shifting in GT4, is that when you shift up, the instant acceleration just stops. For instance, if you accelerate until 9000 rpm in a Civic Type-R, when you shift up to second gear, it just gets stucked in that same speed...

This is boring, and irreal.
 

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