◆ SNAIL [Spec] Racing - Currently Recruiting for GT7 - JOIN TODAY!!Open
- Thread starter zer05ive
- 150,145 comments
- 8,714,856 views
dsgerbc
Premium
- 2,577
- dsgerbc
I'm gonna run 0/10 in the Civic. That allows at least some trail braking.
Not sure yet what in the Z, but probably something like 3/7. The reason - GVS eats front tires, and I like a consistent car, even if it's only a few laps. Also, rear bias helps to carry a few extra mphs through turn one. Also, with RWD cars you can change your effective BB in corner w/o the buttons. Just give it a bit of gas during braking and you'll effectively get a forward shift in BB. Wouldn't recommend it in a real car, but in GT5 it helps, and it's another reason to tilt BB to the rear in a RWD car.
And 5/5 in the GT. Can't drive MR cars as it is, and don't need'em any more loose.
Shifting BB forward is IMO counterproductive, since the car is rear-heavy (becoming close to 50-50 under braking).
Not sure yet what in the Z, but probably something like 3/7. The reason - GVS eats front tires, and I like a consistent car, even if it's only a few laps. Also, rear bias helps to carry a few extra mphs through turn one. Also, with RWD cars you can change your effective BB in corner w/o the buttons. Just give it a bit of gas during braking and you'll effectively get a forward shift in BB. Wouldn't recommend it in a real car, but in GT5 it helps, and it's another reason to tilt BB to the rear in a RWD car.
And 5/5 in the GT. Can't drive MR cars as it is, and don't need'em any more loose.
Shifting BB forward is IMO counterproductive, since the car is rear-heavy (becoming close to 50-50 under braking).
- 3,613
- New England
- jobyone71
With all the excitement I forgot to notice I will not be able to race this Sunday. Figures since I got to choose the Civic. I hope it sticks around. The reason for not racing is my 12th wedding aniversary
Hope you all have fun and look forward to the BB discussion afterwards
Hope you all have fun and look forward to the BB discussion afterwards
JLBowler
Premium
- 7,986
- California
- JLBowler
I still think brake bias is a "preference" based on your driving style. No one setting will be best for everyone. I joined this league only because of the potential for clean racing. Not because I don't want to have to tune a car. So far I've seen quite a bit of contact simply because the cars are made intentionally hard to drive. If adjusting BB gives people more control of their car, then there just might be less contact. I know the philosophical hyperbole put forth by the banning advocates but in a car with stock suspension and no aides to speak of, allowing someone to "have control of their car" doesn't seem too radical to me. I intend to use it because I'm not perfect
Brake balance is not a "preference". A preference is where you adjust your seat, the tilt on your steering wheel, the positioning of you mirrors, or how cold the A/C is blowing. Changing brake balance changes the way the car performs. I'm tired of hearing this argument becasue it's simply not valid in any way.
If anyone wants more control of their car, all they need to do is drive within their abilities. As those abilities imporve, they can drive a little faster. If there is anyone out there who doesn't think it's an advantage to be able to brake two car lenghts later into a corner, you have no idea what you are talking about.
- 1,939
- Atlanta
- ZohsixGT5
- pipesta
I set my brake balances to 4/3, 4/2, or 3/2 depending on the car to give it a more realistic feel. Is it slower? Probably, but no real life car has stronger brakes in the rear than in the front. Therefore I don't think people should be allowed to manipulate the BB in that manner to take advantage of flawed physics.
- 156
- sethfraz22
Everyone ready for Magic lap?
- 7,689
- Michigan
- Rallywgn81
I'm pretty sure you started it. Anyway, I don't like the idea of being able to adjust brake bias. It should be at least set to 7-3, as that is a more realistic setting. No car has a 50/50 brake bias. Its actually more realistic to at least have a little adjustability in the suspension then the brakes anyway.
JLBowler
Premium
- 7,986
- California
- JLBowler
I'm pretty sure I never said that tuning brake balance was a preference. (you should really quote the whole message so my comment can be taken in it's correct context)
My point, and I'm beginning to feel more stongly about it, is that it's spec racing and everyone should be in the same equipment. The only difference should be driver skill or we really shouldn't be calling it spec racing. It should be called limited tuning allowed racing.
- 1,236
- Humboldt County
- ExoSphere64
I truly enjoy this league and will always do my best to comply with all rules. With that said, in order to really ferret out if brake balance is truly an advantage or if it's effect is negligible, a handful of our best and most consistent drivers should set up a series of time trials with several, set parameters and let our numbers guys process the data and then continue the discussion.
As far as the true definition of SPEC racing, I think the league has done a great job trying to adhere to the truest SPEC racing that can be attained considering the environment. There will always be some advantage/disadvantage no matter how hard one tries. Take for instance is a G27 and a Playseat an advantage over a lumpy couch and a DS3? A 55" flat screen over a 26" CRT? Married with kids or single? Is your cat well behaved or does your dog have a tendency to blow chunks on the carpet? This list could go on forever. Realistically, we ALL have some sort of advantage/disadvantage. We just need to decide (with concrete data) if something is really an advantage or just another topic for intellectual debate.
I DO adjust my BB for control. My lap times stink most of the time and I routinely qualify towards the very back. The time I do spend on brake adjustments is more so when I am in very close proximity to other drivers, I have a better chance of staying out of trouble when I mis-judge what the drivers near me do. I will also post my settings (once I get them done).
Cheers all!!
As far as the true definition of SPEC racing, I think the league has done a great job trying to adhere to the truest SPEC racing that can be attained considering the environment. There will always be some advantage/disadvantage no matter how hard one tries. Take for instance is a G27 and a Playseat an advantage over a lumpy couch and a DS3? A 55" flat screen over a 26" CRT? Married with kids or single? Is your cat well behaved or does your dog have a tendency to blow chunks on the carpet? This list could go on forever. Realistically, we ALL have some sort of advantage/disadvantage. We just need to decide (with concrete data) if something is really an advantage or just another topic for intellectual debate.
I DO adjust my BB for control. My lap times stink most of the time and I routinely qualify towards the very back. The time I do spend on brake adjustments is more so when I am in very close proximity to other drivers, I have a better chance of staying out of trouble when I mis-judge what the drivers near me do. I will also post my settings (once I get them done).
Cheers all!!
- 1,236
- Humboldt County
- ExoSphere64
- 694
- Pennsylvania
- lifesagamble420
this may sound extremely silly, but where is the driver/color car list? I can't seem to find it, thinking about changing my colors.
- 2,012
- Cranbrook, BC
- tezgm99
It's in my sig....and possibly cheeb's as well, can't remember of the top of my head now :/
Edit; yep, Exo says it is so it must be, lol
- 1,236
- Humboldt County
- ExoSphere64
Scroll up, cheeb has the link in his sig:tup:
- 694
- Pennsylvania
- lifesagamble420
- 694
- Pennsylvania
- lifesagamble420
Honestly I think this argument has a point, but at the same time is somewhat silly. Say for instance the FAIRLADY we are using this week. For the life of me, I cannot get the finesse of this car down. Ton be honest I messed with the brake bias a bunch, trying to avoid the oversteer a bit when braking. It was then that I realized, it wasn't the brake bias, nor was it anything to do with the car. It was user error. I didn't realize how much earlier you had to brake with this car/pick your line on the track we're running.
I'm still fairly new, was following the driving line, and it was just not working for me, turn two and me had it out for eachother. I am just now getting the hang of braking into that turn, and the finesse involved in going 40mph around a turn, while properly apexing, and exiting without too much gas.
The only way I can see regulating this, that would be beneficial for everyone, is have a few division one drivers test the cars, find what brake bias works best for them, and come to some sort of agreement as to the optimal universal brake set up for everyone. But that would be likely honor system, as I do not think there is a way to regulate the brake settings. I'm new, so maybe this affects me slightly less than you more experienced fellows who know the lines they run well on, and know what braking works for them best, but through trial and error I've found less than a second difference in gain within adjusting settings. Just my two cents on the topic, we are all here for the same reason, to have a fun simulated racing experience that is fair, and maybe to just walk away from our everyday lives for a moment. At least that is what this is for me.
- 1,573
- Rural Nebraska
- Apmaddock
Having anyone - division 1 leader or brand new division 5 recruit - submit their brake balance settings as what is best for them and trying to use the info to come to a universal optimum setup is as useful as deciding what the optimum size of shoe is for the S.N.A.I.L. community. One size does not fit all.
- 831
- ANFD
To be honest guys,if you really research what you are calling "Spec racing" you will most likely find information describing a race series where everyone uses the same chassis, engine, gearbox, tires and suspension. There is no spec racing series that completely prohibits any adjustments whatsoever, it just doesn't exist ... this is true for GP2, Star Mazda, Indy Lights or any other "Spec Series" I am familiar with. I spent 15 years in professional racing and know a little bit. Most allow sway bar, brake bias, suspension settings as well as aero adjustments all tailored to suit each driver to make the racing better and safer. In the most tightly controlled series, you are still allowed to change different damper oils to tune suspension even if all the hardware is identical.
Last edited:
dsgerbc
Premium
- 2,577
- dsgerbc
On a semi-related note: my autox start time keeps getting pushed further in the day (due to mysterious helicopter delivery occurring on the site), meaning more sleep in the morning and less runs. So I'm probably gonna have enough juice left in me to race on Sunday night.
