GTPNewsWire
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This is the discussion thread for a recent post on GTPlanet:
This article was published by Michael Leary (@Terronium-12) on March 7th, 2018 in the Formula One category.
Sauber F1 Signs Tatiana Calderon as Test Driver for 2018 Season
- Thread starter GTPNewsWire
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- 4,806
- Sweden
I wish Calderon the best of luck but she'll make no advancements in this team.
Sauber couldn't even see fit to give talented Simona de Silvestro a proper chance
when they had the opportunity. I just can't take Sauber seriously if their goal is
indeed to help a female into a racing seat. They don't follow through, feels like it's just for show.
I think Silvestro would have done well in a race driver role for Sauber those years ago
and I was actually excited about the prospect. She'd have certainly performed better
than the abysmal Ericsson.
Sauber couldn't even see fit to give talented Simona de Silvestro a proper chance
when they had the opportunity. I just can't take Sauber seriously if their goal is
indeed to help a female into a racing seat. They don't follow through, feels like it's just for show.
I think Silvestro would have done well in a race driver role for Sauber those years ago
and I was actually excited about the prospect. She'd have certainly performed better
than the abysmal Ericsson.
- 759
- France
I don't follow F1, or even many racing categories that closely, but since I realised that racing drivers are not really the fastest people I stopped taking a lot of it seriously. It makes me upset when hear about talented drivers missing out.
The reason why it took my so long to realise was because when you compare to other sports, for example: any of the best Football clubs, when you see that a player is on the starting 11 for Real Madrid, you know it is because they are one of the best players in the world. When you see a tennis player in the finals of a grand slam, you know it is because they are one of the greatest tennis players at that time. But when you see some of these professional racing drivers, it's often not because they are the most talented drivers in the world, but because they are fortunate enough or marketable. Of course the circumstances of the sport are completely different, but it's still sad
- 3,177
- St helens, merseyside, England.
- crazybuttocks198
- Crazybuttocks19
Women will have to eventually have to become more of a presence, whether or not theres a shot of a race seat.
- 759
- France
I would be happy if the entire grid was filled with women that are the fastest drivers around that track. I hope one day Motorsport is able to get to the point where the people sitting in the cars are there because they are truly faster and better drivers than those who are not in that car, although it is just a fantasy for now...
- 840
- NYC, NY, USA
- potvinsuks
- Potvinsuks
To be fair, I am not sure just how highly Simona was touted when she came on through the ranks. As we know, she's a very talented driver racing in several different disciplines of the sport like Indy Car and Super Car.
However, not taking anything away from Simona, this girl Calderon is a highly touted phenom, and is known to be something quite special. They have been talking about her as the best female prospect ever.
We shall see.
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Sorry for benzema at the starting 11 of real madrid, he s one of the worst player out thereI don't follow F1, or even many racing categories that closely, but since I realised that racing drivers are not really the fastest people I stopped taking a lot of it seriously. It makes me upset when hear about talented drivers missing out.
The reason why it took my so long to realise was because when you compare to other sports, for example: any of the best Football clubs, when you see that a player is on the starting 11 for Real Madrid, you know it is because they are one of the best players in the world. When you see a tennis player in the finals of a grand slam, you know it is because they are one of the greatest tennis players at that time. But when you see some of these professional racing drivers, it's often not because they are the most talented drivers in the world, but because they are fortunate enough or marketable. Of course the circumstances of the sport are completely different, but it's still sad
- 11,636
- Intercourse, PA
- Carbonox
I know money talks, but this is getting ridiculous. For a "highly touted" driver, she has spent the last five years sucking in European feeder series. I don't think a PR stunt could be more blatant if they tried.
I also know that the opportunity to drive an F1 car has already been devalued a lot by the Gaston Mazzacanes and Paul Belmondos of this world, but we really don't need more of them.
I also know that the opportunity to drive an F1 car has already been devalued a lot by the Gaston Mazzacanes and Paul Belmondos of this world, but we really don't need more of them.
- 5,619
- Hampshire
- Spurgy777
You sure you're talking about the right person? Looking at her racing record (linked below) she hasn't done anything that I would describe as "quite special".
In 235 races she has had 2 wins both in pretty junior series (compared to F1 anyway) and 13 podiums, and out of 129 European F3 and GP3 races she only had 12 top 10 finishes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatiana_Calderón
SestoScudo
(Banned)
- 3,000
- Australia
- Decepticon 47
Im going to go and marry her.
- 1,455
- Oak Bay, NB, Canada
- Bic44
Racing is one of those few sports where it should be closer to a 50-50 split between men and women. There’ll probably be more men simply because, as far as I can tell, men are more interested in cars than women usually. But nice to see this girl possibly getting a shot. Hope she makes it to a real F1 race at some point!
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
Why? Sounds about as whimsical as utopia. In reality, which is where we all reside at this present time, women and men aren't 50/50, and that really doesn't have to do with some extreme sexism put on by the sport so much as it has to do with as you put it and can be left to say...interest factors.
- 1,112
- United Kingdom
I don't follow F1, or even many racing categories that closely, but since I realised that racing drivers are not really the fastest people I stopped taking a lot of it seriously. It makes me upset when hear about talented drivers missing out.
The reason why it took my so long to realise was because when you compare to other sports, for example: any of the best Football clubs, when you see that a player is on the starting 11 for Real Madrid, you know it is because they are one of the best players in the world. When you see a tennis player in the finals of a grand slam, you know it is because they are one of the greatest tennis players at that time. But when you see some of these professional racing drivers, it's often not because they are the most talented drivers in the world, but because they are fortunate enough or marketable. Of course the circumstances of the sport are completely different, but it's still sad
Sorry but as someone who has played sport to the highest level in junior ranks and coached in many other sports at high levels, football and tennis and the same as F1. Actually, all sports are the same, I can say for a fact that in every sport at some points someone who is good enough to be there at the highest level has given up after being disfavoured by the system.
I know of one case in a nation running relay team where a faster competitor was left out in favour of someone's son who qualified with a slower time! Now, this isn't even opinion based it is a fact! The other lad quit shortly after and this is too often what happens.
In my opinion, this is why stories like Serena Williams are so great, she did actually get there completely on merit. What I am trying to convey is that all sports are like this. Some more than others, motorsport is one of the worst offenders, football is one of the least offending but it still happens all the time but because it happens at junior levels you never realise. Usually it is just continuously favouring a lesser athlete (with the right parents) at a junior level, this means they do actually become the better competitor at a senior level but lets face it if you put the same resources into the kid who didn't have contacts at the right age he/she would have been the better competitor.
In my opinion become a professional footballer is still at least 30% fortune based, I know plenty of great players who no longer play but many who aren't as good as them play for professional teams and sadly for those they do still play 3 out of the 5 have parents of influence
I am not meaning to shoot you down or anything just wanted to convey that from my personal experience you should just look at all sports on the surface if you dig too deep you won't want to watch any of them
But still, F1 needs to sort the paid driver business!
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- Oak Bay, NB, Canada
- Bic44
Why is it whimsical? I don’t actually think it’ll be a 50-50 split. But 10-20% women could be a more realistic number in the future. I know driving is very physically demanding, but (and I’ve never driven a real race car) it seems more endurance and mental based than almost any other sport. It’s not like I’m some social justice warrior. I don’t think there’ll ever be a woman in most top level sports leagues like the NFL or premier league. But with racing? I don’t see why there can’t be a few
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- United Kingdom
Motorsport needs more female drivers to be successful because it is one of the few sports where men and women can compete against each other fairly. Carmen Jorda's quotes have all been ludicrous. Women can be just as fit and strong as men, but the absolute peak strength is stronger in the male body, as you can see from comparisons from Olympic sports. However, racing drivers don't need to be at the peak of strength, just strong enough and with the endurance required.
However, of the female drivers out there, none of them are quick enough to be F1 drivers at the moment. De Silvestro may be quick, but her results are pretty unremarkable in Series like IndyCar, Supercars and Formula E, with only a couple of standout performances hidden amongst mediocrity. Susie Wolff was also not that impressive in the DTM, and with Calderon, she hasn't proven herself either. Women haven't been promoted to F1 race driver for ages, not because the teams are deliberately being sexist, no, they're looking at performance and seeing that the performance they need from a driver isn't there.
Wolff, Jordan, de Silvestro and now Calderon were all promoted to F1 team test drivers for great positive media attention, rather than because they were quick enough unfortunately.
If the role helps make Calderon quicker and more competitive so she proves she deserves a spot in F1, great, but I fell like the team are barking up the wrong tree.
The last truly great female driver was Desiree Wilson, and she was just unlucky to get her chance in F1 during the time of Ground Effect, which she struggled with. With the right car she could have fought for race wins against the Jones' and Piquet's of the day.
However, of the female drivers out there, none of them are quick enough to be F1 drivers at the moment. De Silvestro may be quick, but her results are pretty unremarkable in Series like IndyCar, Supercars and Formula E, with only a couple of standout performances hidden amongst mediocrity. Susie Wolff was also not that impressive in the DTM, and with Calderon, she hasn't proven herself either. Women haven't been promoted to F1 race driver for ages, not because the teams are deliberately being sexist, no, they're looking at performance and seeing that the performance they need from a driver isn't there.
Wolff, Jordan, de Silvestro and now Calderon were all promoted to F1 team test drivers for great positive media attention, rather than because they were quick enough unfortunately.
If the role helps make Calderon quicker and more competitive so she proves she deserves a spot in F1, great, but I fell like the team are barking up the wrong tree.
The last truly great female driver was Desiree Wilson, and she was just unlucky to get her chance in F1 during the time of Ground Effect, which she struggled with. With the right car she could have fought for race wins against the Jones' and Piquet's of the day.
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- Bristow, VA
- spacecowboy73
- spacecowboy73
Are we not considering sports cars? Christina Nielsen has done pretty well in IMSA.
This is true, me and my brother grew up playing ice hockey and were pretty good, but once it came time to move up to a certain level, like traveling tournament teams (which we tried out and made the team) it became very expensive and kids that had richer parents got to be on the team while others who were better did not.
I think motorsports is the extreme of this because it is one of if not the most expensive sport to get into. Maybe horse racing or something may be more, I don't know.
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- 1,112
- United Kingdom
This is true, me and my brother grew up playing ice hockey and were pretty good, but once it came time to move up to a certain level, like traveling tournament teams (which we tried out and made the team) it became very expensive and kids that had richer parents got to be on the team while others who were better did not.
I think motorsports is the extreme of this because it is one of if not the most expensive sport to get into. Maybe horse racing or something may be more, I don't know.
This is all too often the case, I think you nailed it with motorsport being the most extreme, even with horse racing there are still ways in but yeah the only thing I can think of that might be worse is sailing but even then I saw the other day (in the UK) that one of our major youth sailing cups was won by a group of African American teens whose teacher bought them a boat on ebay! It was a great story considering they live nowhere near anywhere that is particularly sailable and all there friends and family thought it was a stupid idea, still, the real MVP was the teacher as it was his idea
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- HamiltonMP427
By that measure I could ask, why hasn't there been many Japanese drivers in the sport, when their is a rich racing culture there, why not any Chinese drivers when they have the biggest populous in the world. Surely there must be someone, in that nation that can driver on par with the best of today, given the time and building up. Why do we see no drivers from the U.S. and so forth...
It's quite simple, we don't see these drivers because of some xenophobic problem with F1, we see it because of the tone that has long been set, that in the current form can't do anything about, no matter how much they want these drivers no matter what gender. You look at a series like F1, and you take the last 5-8 years let's say of drivers from GP2 and you look at the number of those participated, and then you see how many of them are in F1 today. I actually did this myself, in 2013 and 2015 GP2 had 35 drivers, of those that are active only 3 from 2015 and 1 from 2013. Take the lowest number of participants in a season like 2016 and again only 2 of those drivers are currently in F1. I could then put these into percentages on face value, but that wouldn't mean much since, it vastly more rare to see a person who participated in the 2010 or 2011 GP2 season in F1 today. And this is before I tell you stats like how 16 of the 32 participants in 2010 GP2 season, were part of F1 in some form, and of those only 3 of them are still active and all three are full time drivers.
So what does this have to do with the topic? Simple, this shows that F1 is difficult to stay apart of, with some backing, experience, and typically money anyone can become part of the sport, only a tiny portion become drivers, and an even smaller portion stay on as drivers. So you then put in the low yield of interested women, and it becomes quite obvious why more women aren't drivers of some capacity in F1.
No one is saying there can't be a few, hell there are a few in other Motorsports series. What we're talking about his the pinnacle of all auto racing, the highest paying, the highest turnover rate/most unsecured jobs, unless your absolutely amazing at it.
This is why I say it's whimsical to say what was said, when reality paints an obvious picture.
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- Netherlands
For the critics: Michele Mouton The most succesfull female driver ever... And she actually raced in the Rally Group B era, driving the original Audi Quattro. Although mostly marketing it would be great for the sport to have a female driver that can drive with the best!
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There's very little in the way of female drivers (outside of the usual hurdles for all amateur drivers coming up through the ranks). Motorsport is one of the few sports in the world where there are not delineated series determined by sex. It's a "put up or shut up" situation. If you've got the skills, speed, and financial backing - go for it.
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- United States
Yep, and as mentioned above, the largest "issue" (as some people would put it), is interest. I worked for several years at a prominent military college in the U.S., and each year our awful "human resources" people would come in and express dismay over the status of female:male ratio at the college (92% male, 8% female - of whom, 90% were there solely due to athletic scholarships). One even went so far as to say "Right now we have 8% female cadets and that's just wrong."
As if the college itself should somehow go out and force young women to be excited about going to a strict, boring, military academy. I do believe more women are interested in motorsports than something like a military college, but I'd bet money the interest levels are still massively lopsided. You can't "force" someone to be motivated or interested in something.
As if the college itself should somehow go out and force young women to be excited about going to a strict, boring, military academy. I do believe more women are interested in motorsports than something like a military college, but I'd bet money the interest levels are still massively lopsided. You can't "force" someone to be motivated or interested in something.
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- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
Why would young men be any more interested? I don't agree with quota-forcing in instances like this but I'd like to see a society where there wasn't still a "boy jobs/girl jobs" idea about life.
On the topic this is the key. Three or four of the massive pool of male drivers are the best in the world (imo Verstappen, Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel-on-a-happy-day). With such a small pool of female drivers the chances of that top talent emerging are proportionately very low.
It seems that Calderon might be the best of the bunch so far, we just have to wait and see.
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- HamiltonMP427
To add to that, some jobs are going to be better suited to those who are males, and some times to those who are females. Just like other traits, like some jobs are better suited to tall people, some to short, some to an acclimation to cold weather and those to hot, etc. The idea that just because something doesn't have a symmetry in social "equity" doesn't mean there is some inequity at all.
I find it frustrating and strange people still want to force this on the world at large, when it's not all that rational.
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How so, I don't see anyone discouraging and saying, they can't do it, I have seen people however state the realism of them making it and if that's discouragement then why bother trying anything ever? People need to know the reality of things so they can work toward their dream in a realistic fashion, by not telling them the reality of making it to F1 you've done a disservice.
I'm sure in certain parts of the world this may not be applicable. But in the nations that seem to particularly deal with racing and see drivers hail from those nation, I say all chance are equal, it's just less likely for a girl because again there seems to be a massive lack of interest. Kind of like me expecting a ice hockey player from Hawaii to make the pros, is it impossible? Nope, not at all. Is it very likely? No, because of various interest reasons.
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