F1 2019: Talking Realism with Car Handling Designer David GrecoF1 2019

[GTPNewsWire]

This is the discussion thread for a recent post on GTPlanet:

F1 2019: Talking Realism with Car Handling Designer David Greco

This article was published by Kyle Patrick (@SlipZtrEm) on May 3rd, 2019 in the F1 2019 category.

 

[ICEMAN_ZIDANE]

...
I will just leave it here

edit: Whatever i will comment.

-will go over well with the hardcore sim racers is I have given much more grip loss to the tire when you’re outside the peak. So in theory — at least this is how I feel, and is what has happened to me — you have to be much smoother, and more like real life. Less sliding around!

-a racing car is easy to drive. But it’s difficult to be fast with it. So being easy to drive, automatically, anybody can just pick it up and play with it. And if that’s not enough, we put an available layer of assists on it. All of this combined I think makes it so that we can reach a very broad audience.

-Be fast with it, well then, that’s skill. But I think in F1 2019, 2018, 2017, it’s been easy to drive the car, but to be fast, to be at the esport final is pretty difficult.

As someone with real race experience and Simracing experience i can tell you that:
Before i start, iam playing racing games/racing simulations for roughly said 20 years. I started with cheap plastic toy wheels and went all the way up to Direct Drive wheels. Today, i dont own any wheels, sold all of them, iam playing Assetto Corsa from time to time with Gamepad (no aids/assists,).
Knowing Codemasters F1 series, i can DEFINITELY tell that F1 2019 will not be a Sim. The same way older versions were no simulations aswell. Iam always very honest and thats why some people dont like me sometimes. But i like being honest. Thats what i expect from GtPlanet and David Greco aswell.

Ofcourse driving fast is more difficult, the issue with Codemasters F1 games is, that the "physics" are just ****. The games arent hard to drive cause you are driving fast. They are hard cause the physics dont mak sense and they implemented stupid spins when reaching a certain point. Its not simulated, its more scripted. And as a player you can clearly feel that. This is what makes Codemasters F1 games hard. You always feel as a passenger in the car. No feedback, connection to the car.

Like i said, a more sim heavy game like AC is easily playable for me with a gamepad. Its not a bad thing when F1 2019 ends (and it will) up being a arcade game (maybe with a "touch of sim"). The issue is that they advertise it as a Sim, i even read words like "hardcore players".

Just be honest ! And for the GTPlanet comments, i thought as a "journalist" you always need to ask questions to get the true answer, i kinda feel like you didnt want to "step on his (David Greco's) foot".

 

[The Cake]

...
I will just leave it here

edit: Whatever i will comment.

-will go over well with the hardcore sim racers is I have given much more grip loss to the tire when you’re outside the peak. So in theory — at least this is how I feel, and is what has happened to me — you have to be much smoother, and more like real life. Less sliding around!

-a racing car is easy to drive. But it’s difficult to be fast with it. So being easy to drive, automatically, anybody can just pick it up and play with it. And if that’s not enough, we put an available layer of assists on it. All of this combined I think makes it so that we can reach a very broad audience.

-Be fast with it, well then, that’s skill. But I think in F1 2019, 2018, 2017, it’s been easy to drive the car, but to be fast, to be at the esport final is pretty difficult.

As someone with real race experience and Simracing experience i can tell you that:
Before i start, iam playing racing games/racing simulations for roughly said 20 years. I started with cheap plastic toy wheels and went all the way up to Direct Drive wheels. Today, i dont own any wheels, sold all of them, iam playing Assetto Corsa from time to time with Gamepad (no aids/assists,).
Knowing Codemasters F1 series, i can DEFINITELY tell that F1 2019 will not be a Sim. The same way older versions were no simulations aswell. Iam always very honest and thats why some people dont like me sometimes. But i like being honest. Thats what i expect from GtPlanet and David Greco aswell.

Ofcourse driving fast is more difficult, the issue with Codemasters F1 games is, that the "physics" are just ****. The games arent hard to drive cause you are driving fast. They are hard cause the physics dont mak sense and they implemented stupid spins when reaching a certain point. Its not simulated, its more scripted. And as a player you can clearly feel that. This is what makes Codemasters F1 games hard. You always feel as a passenger in the car. No feedback, connection to the car.

Like i said, a more sim heavy game like AC is easily playable for me with a gamepad. Its not a bad thing when F1 2019 ends (and it will) up being a arcade game (maybe with a "touch of sim"). The issue is that they advertise it as a Sim, i even read words like "hardcore players".

Just be honest ! And for the GTPlanet comments, i thought as a "journalist" you always need to ask questions to get the true answer, i kinda feel like you didnt want to "step on his (David Greco's) foot".

nice!

 

[DriftShock]

I hate to rain on your parade here mate, but F1 was never supposed to be a simulator. It’s supposed to work on a controller as well, so actually you’re just crying for the hell of it
On a controller, 2018 was actually a pretty good game (especially since they near enough eliminated the Input Lag)
All you sound like is an elitist Sim Racing ****
Maybe you should look up what a controller is before complaining about physic
Rant over

...
I will just leave it here

edit: Whatever i will comment.

-will go over well with the hardcore sim racers is I have given much more grip loss to the tire when you’re outside the peak. So in theory — at least this is how I feel, and is what has happened to me — you have to be much smoother, and more like real life. Less sliding around!

-a racing car is easy to drive. But it’s difficult to be fast with it. So being easy to drive, automatically, anybody can just pick it up and play with it. And if that’s not enough, we put an available layer of assists on it. All of this combined I think makes it so that we can reach a very broad audience.

-Be fast with it, well then, that’s skill. But I think in F1 2019, 2018, 2017, it’s been easy to drive the car, but to be fast, to be at the esport final is pretty difficult.

As someone with real race experience and Simracing experience i can tell you that:
Before i start, iam playing racing games/racing simulations for roughly said 20 years. I started with cheap plastic toy wheels and went all the way up to Direct Drive wheels. Today, i dont own any wheels, sold all of them, iam playing Assetto Corsa from time to time with Gamepad (no aids/assists,).
Knowing Codemasters F1 series, i can DEFINITELY tell that F1 2019 will not be a Sim. The same way older versions were no simulations aswell. Iam always very honest and thats why some people dont like me sometimes. But i like being honest. Thats what i expect from GtPlanet and David Greco aswell.

Ofcourse driving fast is more difficult, the issue with Codemasters F1 games is, that the "physics" are just ****. The games arent hard to drive cause you are driving fast. They are hard cause the physics dont mak sense and they implemented stupid spins when reaching a certain point. Its not simulated, its more scripted. And as a player you can clearly feel that. This is what makes Codemasters F1 games hard. You always feel as a passenger in the car. No feedback, connection to the car.

Like i said, a more sim heavy game like AC is easily playable for me with a gamepad. Its not a bad thing when F1 2019 ends (and it will) up being a arcade game (maybe with a "touch of sim"). The issue is that they advertise it as a Sim, i even read words like "hardcore players".

Just be honest ! And for the GTPlanet comments, i thought as a "journalist" you always need to ask questions to get the true answer, i kinda feel like you didnt want to "step on his (David Greco's) foot".

 

[ICEMAN_ZIDANE]

I hate to rain on your parade here mate, but F1 was never supposed to be a simulator. It’s supposed to work on a controller as well, so actually you’re just crying for the hell of it
On a controller, 2018 was actually a pretty good game (especially since they near enough eliminated the Input Lag)
All you sound like is an elitist Sim Racing ****
Maybe you should look up what a controller is before complaining about physic
Rant over

Maybe you didnt read my post but i clearly stated that iam playing with a gamepad (a controller). I also told you that i have experience with many different input devices, you will not believe, while waiting for my DD Parts i joined a couple of iRacing races with a gamepad (controller) and won a few of them.

"but F1 was never supposed to be a simulator"

Maybe read the article and my post again ! Thats exactly what iam trying to point out.
Thats why i said they should be honest.

You should look up what a gamepad is, hilarious !

 

[Interstellar9]

Doesn't have to do with the car handling but did GT Planet ask whether there are classic tracks this time? Classic cars need classic tracks. Sure, we have Spa, Monza, Silverstone etc. but a) these are tracks which are always there and b) even these tracks have slightly other sections compared to the early 90s/00s.

 

[Veinz]

I hate to rain on your parade here mate, but F1 was never supposed to be a simulator. It’s supposed to work on a controller as well, so actually you’re just crying for the hell of it
On a controller, 2018 was actually a pretty good game (especially since they near enough eliminated the Input Lag)
All you sound like is an elitist Sim Racing ****
Maybe you should look up what a controller is before complaining about physic
Rant over

It's not the most realistic game out there but it's still a simulator.

 

[Auditore]

The f1 games simulate alot of things in a f1 car im not sure if arcade is the right word for these games and i kinda hate the word "simcade" a "entry level simulator" could be a good definition for it?My english isnt very good sorry if the name doesnt make sense.

 

[F1Aussie]

Would be nice if they finally gave you to option of navigating the menus with a mouse, seriously how friggen hard can it be to implement! The ability to use multiple programs like sli max manager and Sim commander at the same time should be implemented as well,very other racing game I play has this option!!

 

[Sloppy Shades]

It's not the most realistic game out there but it's still a simulator.

I thought realism and simulation were mutually inclusive? Or better put entirely dependent on each other? Less realistic equals less sim and vice versa.

 

[Auditore]

I thought realism and simulation were mutually inclusive? Or better put entirely dependent on each other? Less realistic equals less sim and vice versa.

Kinda hard to use your definition when there is no objective answer about what game is the best simulator,some think its AC,some think its Rfactor and others prefer Iracing.Even if some are less realistic than others they still could be considered simulators.

 

[ICEMAN_ZIDANE]

Does F1 appear in this combo? No, and it will not. Each Sim has pros and cons, they are not flawless, but they all do a very good job when it comes to simulating real cars... F1 doesnt do that, and it probably never will cause of Codemasters target group..

 

[MagpieRacer]

I'd say realism and simulation are different when being talked about in this way. You could say it is unquestionably a simulation as it is simulating the sport of Formula 1.

 

[Auditore]

I'd say realism and simulation are different when being talked about in this way. You could say it is unquestionably a simulation as it is simulating the sport of Formula 1.

They also simulate alot of what goes in F1 practice sessions,tyre wear,tire compounds,fuel mix,drs and mechanical damage,while the driving physics might not be great there are alot of little things the f1 games simulate

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Before i start, iam playing racing games/racing simulations for roughly said 20 years. I started with cheap plastic toy wheels and went all the way up to Direct Drive wheels. Today, i dont own any wheels, sold all of them, iam playing Assetto Corsa from time to time with Gamepad (no aids/assists,).
Knowing Codemasters F1 series, i can DEFINITELY tell that F1 2019 will not be a Sim. The same way older versions were no simulations aswell. Iam always very honest and thats why some people dont like me sometimes. But i like being honest. Thats what i expect from GtPlanet and David Greco aswell.

Well that's strange. I've got the same time put into the genre, and all manner of input devices too, and I don't feel the same way as you do. The difference being that I've played the game.

Is F1 2019 the most realistic simulation title out there on the market? No. But that doesn't mean it isn't a sim, because its developer is actively trying to simulate the real world.

Ofcourse driving fast is more difficult, the issue with Codemasters F1 games is, that the "physics" are just ****. The games arent hard to drive cause you are driving fast. They are hard cause the physics dont mak sense and they implemented stupid spins when reaching a certain point. Its not simulated, its more scripted. And as a player you can clearly feel that. This is what makes Codemasters F1 games hard. You always feel as a passenger in the car. No feedback, connection to the car.

There was nothing "scripted" about the spins I witnessed with the F2 cars at the event. They were driver error — and each one, I knew what I had done wrong.

Like i said, a more sim heavy game like AC is easily playable for me with a gamepad. Its not a bad thing when F1 2019 ends (and it will) up being a arcade game (maybe with a "touch of sim"). The issue is that they advertise it as a Sim, i even read words like "hardcore players".

F1 2019 is much more playable on a pad than AC, at least compared to the last time I ventured into that game on a pad. It's not perfect — I'll expand on that more tomorrow — but IMO it's certainly more in the realm of GT/FM in terms of approachability. Which is key: this is the world's biggest motorsport, and it's selling primarily on consoles where the majority of players will be playing on pad.

Just be honest ! And for the GTPlanet comments, i thought as a "journalist" you always need to ask questions to get the true answer, i kinda feel like you didnt want to "step on his (David Greco's) foot".

What do you believe was dishonest about our questions? What are the "true answers"?

We get these sorts of accusations almost every interview we do. GT included. The implication is that we're not being "hard" enough. Asking a developer point-blank "hey, why does [x] feature suck so much?" is what we call a two-fer: it won't get an answer, and it will close the door on future questions. An interview is about mutual respect: we asked questions about the balance between realism and approachability because at the end of the day, that's a balance all racing games need to address. And having a more approachable package does not necessarily have to impact realism.

Admittedly this is an anecdote, but one of my fellow journalists told me how much more he gelled with the physics and the believability once he hopped on a wheel setup. He said it felt more like what he'd expect an F1 car to feel like, specifically compared to F1 2018.

One thing we shouldn't come into these events with is a pre-determined decision. Your definitive "not a sim" statements, when you haven't even played the game, is the perfect example of that.

The f1 games simulate alot of things in a f1 car im not sure if arcade is the right word for these games and i kinda hate the word "simcade" a "entry level simulator" could be a good definition for it?My english isnt very good sorry if the name doesnt make sense.

No apologies needed: it makes sense. 👍