Any Typists? Wife Needs a Keyboard.

[Danoff]

The keyboard would be for an office setting, she has walls and a door so some noise is acceptable, but hopefully not an insane amount of noise.

She's a proper typist (as am I), so the keyboard needs to have good tactile feedback and crisp response. I've been looking at mechanical keyboards, and I think that might be the way to go except that I think they may be unnecessarily and obnoxiously loud. We visited an electronics store here recently and tried every keyboard they had. 99% of them were horrible mushy things with no feel whatsoever. The one we eventually walked away with had decent key response but the backspace bar was small - a fatal flaw (which we knew at the time but purchased it anyway out of need).

So, recommend me a keyboard. At the moment I'm thinking of the Das Keyboard Soft Pressure Point model, but there's no place to test it (that I'm aware of).

 

[Solo]

You should talk to Azuremen, he's a keyboard aficionado and would be able to answer this I'm sure.

 

[nick09]

I'm not a big keyboard guru but I've recently heard of the Logitech K310. What is really interesting is that it's fully washable with water so it would be good if the wife spills a drink or something.

 

[Pako]

My wife is a 130wpm kind of gal. She goes through keyboards like I go through, well...lots of things.

Her latest purchase was a Dell Keyboard. Nothing fancy, but she likes the response, the clicking sound, and the feel.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0037H8AB4/?tag=gtplanet-20

This one last about six months until she got tired of it and has sense been through 4 other keyboards, but the Dell lasted the longest.

Some will say, "go mechanical or go home". It truly is a feel thing.

 

[Korza]

^ I got 3 years out of my last keyboard, and I only replaced it because I accidentally broke the little stands.

 

[Azuremen]

So, recommend me a keyboard. At the moment I'm thinking of the Das Keyboard Soft Pressure Point model, but there's no place to test it (that I'm aware of).

That is a solid option, as it uses Cherry MX Brown switches. They have a decent amount of resistance with actuation happening at around 45g of "pressure" (9 nickels of weight basically) with that happening 2mm into the 4mm travel distance.

I personally prefer Cherry MX Blue switches, which have 50g points at 2mm, with an audible click at the actuation point. Some people dislike them due to the more clicky nature of them - think old IBM Model M but a bit crisper sounding. Browns to me are a bit to vague feeling for when I am gaming and don't feel quite as satisfying to me, but if noise is an issue I'd go with them.

If you are curious about testing what Blues sound like, Best Buy generally stocks Razer Blackwidows, sometimes the Stealth version, which use Blue and Brown switches respectively. On sale, they can be had for $60 or so and generally are the best value for a mech keyboard on the market - decent keycaps and relatively nice feel. Newegg also has a Rosewill branded keyboard that is fairly well built, also with Blues and Browns for a fair price. Elitekeyboards has some other switch types, such as Blacks and Reds, which are both linear type switches - I'm not much of a fan of them personally. They also carry Topre keyboards, which are quite a bit more but people swear by them often.

If you are curious about the details of switch types, and some neat charts and graphs, this Mechanical Keyboard Guide is quite handy. And I'll try my best to answer any questions you may have.

As for the Logitech keyboards, don't waste your time or money - they are all garbage in terms of feel. Especially their "high end" ones, which are either just cheap scissor switches or really mushy domes. You'll have a better typing experience digging up an old Dell keyboard at a thrift store or, if lucky, an IBM Model M for cheap.

EDIT: Pako's suggestion, the Dell SK-8115, is a fairly decent membrane keyboard that can be found for a dollar or two at Goodwill. I personally prefer Dell's SK-8110 for my cheap, cheap keyboard projects and as a backup/travel board when I think it may get trashed.

 

[bergauk]

I can recommend the Razer Blackwidow. Even as a general typing keyboard, it's very nice. The build quality has improved since they first released it[I had issues with my first one having random keys stick down]. The sound isn't too loud or obnoxious either. Never heard any complaints from my Skype buddies or my dad.

 

[Danoff]

That is a solid option, as it uses Cherry MX Brown switches. They have a decent amount of resistance with actuation happening at around 45g of "pressure" (9 nickels of weight basically) with that happening 2mm into the 4mm travel distance.

I personally prefer Cherry MX Blue switches, which have 50g points at 2mm, with an audible click at the actuation point. Some people dislike them due to the more clicky nature of them - think old IBM Model M but a bit crisper sounding.

So if that's what the Razer Blackwidow has, then she's tested it and liked it. But it's pretty loud, I think it's a bit risky as to whether that would bother people near her at work.

For reference, here's my keyboard:

Lite-On (I believe this is rebranded HP) Model SK-2501, which I bought in 1997 or '98 and have loved ever since. Still works perfectly (despite the PS2 connection being somewhat of a chore).

I have no idea what kind of switches this has or how the keyboard is made, but I'm certain that if the feel were like this one it would be good enough.

Browns to me are a bit to vague feeling for when I am gaming and don't feel quite as satisfying to me, but if noise is an issue I'd go with them.

If you are curious about testing what Blues sound like, Best Buy generally stocks Razer Blackwidows, sometimes the Stealth version, which use Blue and Brown switches respectively.

So that'll be how we test out the Brown switches then. Gotta find a Best Buy with a Razer Stealth. Shouldn't be impossible. Then if she likes that we can order the Das Keyboard with Brown switches with a decent probability that we won't have to send it back.

EDIT: Pako's suggestion, the Dell SK-8115, is a fairly decent membrane keyboard that can be found for a dollar or two at Goodwill. I personally prefer Dell's SK-8110 for my cheap, cheap keyboard projects and as a backup/travel board when I think it may get trashed.

I use a Dell SK-8135 Rev Q for work which is okay... not as good as my personal keyboard but good enough. It prompted us to order a Dell SK-8135 Rev D? for her which was terrible and needs to be sent back.

 

[niky]

Looks at links... Type-gasm... Didn't realize these things existed. And to think, I've been putting up with and suffering standard keyboards for the past twenty years...

 

[DG_Silva]

The MS Natural keyboards are pretty good for very fast typists too.

 

[terminator363]

Two words: Cherry MX. (Whether that would be blue, red, black, etc; is up to you).

 

[Centura]

Review of three mechanical keyboards for Mac, but I think two of them has Windows versions: http://shawnblanc.net/2012/04/clicky-keyboards/

Personally, I'm using an Apple Wireless Keyboard since a year ago. I love it, mainly because I love "flat" keys (i.e. laptop style keyboards).

 

[Jordan]

I can type around 120 WPM, and use a blank Das Keyboard 2 (it's a few years old now, but I don't believe there's much difference between this one and the newer models other than some extra USB ports and a new design).

I haven't used many other "high-end" keyboards other than the old IBM Model M, but I can't imagine them being much better than this and can't imagine using anything else. If something happens to my Das, I'll be ordering another one as quickly as possible.

Also, the comedic value of having a "blank" keyboard when non-geeks ask to use your computer should not be underestimated.

 

[bergauk]

I can type around 120 WPM, and use a blank Das Keyboard 2 (it's a few years old now, but I don't believe there's much difference between this one and the newer models other than some extra USB ports and a new design).

I haven't used many other "high-end" keyboards other than the old IBM Model M, but I can't imagine them being much better than this and can't imagine using anything else. If something happens to my Das, I'll be ordering another one as quickly as possible.

Also, the comedic value of having a "blank" keyboard when non-geeks ask to use your computer should not be underestimated.

I wont ever understand the point of making them blank, if you don't need to see the key's why should it matter what's on them? I like having letters on mine just so I can orient my hand before I start typing stuff out. After I've started typing I generally don't need to look down at it after that. As much as I hate when people use my computers for anything, if they have a legitimate use, I'd prefer those who are non-touch typists to be able to enjoy the feeling of a mechanical keyboard. If someones first experience of a mechanical keyboard is with a blank mechanical keyboard, and you laugh at them, it'll put a sour taste in their mouth when you start smirking or laughing at their misfortune.

 

[Jordan]

I think you took my joke about the blank keys a bit too seriously.

Anyways, the point is that if you're not a fast touch-typist, the blank keys force you to learn where everything is by feel alone, thus making you faster. I was already a decent touch-typist when I got this keyboard, but I didn't have all the numbers or less-used characters and punctuation marks memorized. I do now, and I'm much faster, too.

 

[sesselpupser]

Sorry to hijack the thread, I didn't think starting a new thread would be suitable but I'd usually like to wait a little longer than this before wading in with my own questions...

I'm looking for a keyboard that's less than or equal to 460mm/18.1in long but definitely no longer than that. I've been using an Apple aluminium full wired keyboard and as good as it is compared to every other keyboard I've used (which have all been membrane keyboards, but still) I need a Windows layout. I mean I can't even play DCS: Black Shark because I don't have a pause/break key! Also I'd like to just have a keyboard for my Mac and another for my PC, really. And yeah, I primarily use my PC for gaming, I only do forum amounts of typing as my Mac is my work machine but I'm not interested in gimmicks like macro keys, LCD displays and all that useless yet price- and size-inflating 'gamer' stuff.

Das Keyboard is just narrow enough (18in) but is quite expensive, the Razer Black Widow is too long, my layout requirement may mean the Tactile Pro 3 is a poor choice (it says you can change the Command and Option keys into Alt and Windows keys, but can it add pause/break and insert?)... I've heard good things about the Microsoft Sidewinder X4 but it's too long (by about 37mm) and I've heard nothing but bad things about Logitech keyboards so I'm not even going to look.

Unfortunately I need a full keyboard, I'd like it to be mechanical (or a good membrane one like the keyboard it's replacing) and ideally I'd like it to be around £60, but if there are no other options I will probably get a Das Keyboad, I'd just like to know if I have any options at all. I'm guessing that as I've checked all that have been mentioned so far the answer will be 'get a Das'.

So... Any kind souls willing to both overlook the hijack attempt and provide some recommendations or suggestions?

Thanks!


Edit: Just found the Filco Ninja Majestouch 2, 440mm with Cherry MX Brown switches... £105, however. Also that's a UK layout which won't help the OP much, but here it is anyway. I like it but I think I like the Das more.

 

[Danoff]

I can type around 120 WPM, and use a blank Das Keyboard 2 (it's a few years old now, but I don't believe there's much difference between this one and the newer models other than some extra USB ports and a new design).

I haven't used many other "high-end" keyboards other than the old IBM Model M, but I can't imagine them being much better than this and can't imagine using anything else. If something happens to my Das, I'll be ordering another one as quickly as possible.

Also, the comedic value of having a "blank" keyboard when non-geeks ask to use your computer should not be underestimated.

The blank "Silent" Das Keyboard (which I'm not sure is going to win because I'm not sure why it's important to learn where extremely unusual keys are located) has Cherry MX Brown switches. How do you like those compared to the MX Blue, or compared to... anything else? How's the noise?

 

[Infinital-NG]

nevermind.

 

[Jordan]

The blank "Silent" Das Keyboard (which I'm not sure is going to win because I'm not sure why it's important to learn where extremely unusual keys are located) has Cherry MX Brown switches. How do you like those compared to the MX Blue, or compared to... anything else? How's the noise?

I haven't tried the "Silent" Das Keyboard, so unfortunately I can't comment on those switches. My Das Keyboard 2 model has the Blue switches, though, and it is somewhat loud. Not irritatingly so, but then again, I'm quite used to it and I'm usually the only one typing on it.

 

[bergauk]

I think you took my joke about the blank keys a bit too seriously.

Anyways, the point is that if you're not a fast touch-typist, the blank keys force you to learn where everything is by feel alone, thus making you faster. I was already a decent touch-typist when I got this keyboard, but I didn't have all the numbers or less-used characters and punctuation marks memorized. I do now, and I'm much faster, too.

Oh, no I'm not entirely serious about it.. I just don't see the point to it. I've managed to memorize my keyboard with no issues with regular keys, I feel as if the blank keys are a bit of a novelty thing though. They generally only come with mechanical keyboards as far as I can tell. I'm sure they come for membrane keyboards too though. I'd rather have a friend's first experience with a mechanical keyboard be an enjoyable one though. One that they'd remember as better than any membrane keyboard, not one where you're frustrated trying to figure out how to type on a blank keyboard. Maybe its just because I have a lot of friends and family that can't type without looking. I've been typing since I was in first grade, all the while learning to do so with one hand.

 

[BobK]

In typing classes (or at least the one my sister took) they use blank keyboards to force the students to learn the keyboard layout; that's probably the most common reason why people have them.

As far as orienting your hands before you start typing stuff out goes, the F and J keys have small pips on them for just this reason, as does the 5 key on the numeric keypad.

 

[Danoff]

I'm good with the following:

!()*&[]:;"'?/.,|-_+={}`~$@\

Not so great with the following:
#^<>

..but then, that's because I don't use those very often. I'm actually stunned now at how many of the symbols I do know. I guess it comes from typing things like this:


if ($s==2){
@a[1]=5;
}
else{
`grep string temp.txt | less`;
}

(done without looking)


Ok so for a thread update, we'll try to visit some Cherry MX Brown switches this weekend and see if they're up to the task. If so, probably a Das Keyboard will follow.


Actually, if I put the right programming context to it, I think I can figure out the other characters too:

grep string temp.txt > results.txt
if a<=5; #test to see if a is less than 5

Yup. Just ^ left to figure out.

 

[MSTER232]

The keyboard would be for an office setting, she has walls and a door so some noise is acceptable, but hopefully not an insane amount of noise.

She's a proper typist (as am I), so the keyboard needs to have good tactile feedback and crisp response. I've been looking at mechanical keyboards, and I think that might be the way to go except that I think they may be unnecessarily and obnoxiously loud. We visited an electronics store here recently and tried every keyboard they had. 99% of them were horrible mushy things with no feel whatsoever. The one we eventually walked away with had decent key response but the backspace bar was small - a fatal flaw (which we knew at the time but purchased it anyway out of need).

So, recommend me a keyboard. At the moment I'm thinking of the Das Keyboard Soft Pressure Point model, but there's no place to test it (that I'm aware of).

I'm a proper typist too but I don't really use any fancy keyboards to be honest. Right now I'm using a Microsoft Wireless Photo Keyboard and it has an okay feel to it. It doesn't click or anything if that's what you're after, but if you want a keyboard that clicks, why not consider a Das Keyboard? The normal model has a very loud click to it, but the silent model has the sound greatly reduced. They also have a blank model if you're a really good typist but that's completely optional 👍 .

EDIT: For reference, here's what my keyboard looks like, except my keyboard has a slight blue tint to the keys.

I can type around 120 WPM, and use a blank Das Keyboard 2 (it's a few years old now, but I don't believe there's much difference between this one and the newer models other than some extra USB ports and a new design).

I haven't used many other "high-end" keyboards other than the old IBM Model M, but I can't imagine them being much better than this and can't imagine using anything else. If something happens to my Das, I'll be ordering another one as quickly as possible.

Also, the comedic value of having a "blank" keyboard when non-geeks ask to use your computer should not be underestimated.

The last time I tested myself I got around 101 WPM so you're just a little bit faster than me, Jordan . And I can't imagine how funny it would be letting someone else use your computer with a blank keyboard on it, would be a really good prank for April Fools 👍 .

 

[sesselpupser]

Just ^ left to figure out.

Isn't ^ used to indicate indices? So 4 to the power of 12 is typed 4^12, I think. It's been a long time since I did any coding and even that was in a like-C-but-not-quite language developed to be easy to teach to idiots (aka Processing).

 

[Azuremen]

Looks at links... Type-gasm... Didn't realize these things existed. And to think, I've been putting up with and suffering standard keyboards for the past twenty years...

Yup, welcome to the world of nice keyboards.

Also, the comedic value of having a "blank" keyboard when non-geeks ask to use your computer should not be underestimated.

I quite love it when people sit down to use my computer - they use the mouse to get the browser up, then look down at the keyboard and kind go "wait, what?"

I wont ever understand the point of making them blank, if you don't need to see the key's why should it matter what's on them?

Honestly, I have blanks because it simply looks cleaner and modern. Plus, if I use Dvorak or Colemak, I don't find myself looking down at a QWERTY layout confusing myself.

And then all the reasons Jordan said.

The blank "Silent" Das Keyboard (which I'm not sure is going to win because I'm not sure why it's important to learn where extremely unusual keys are located) has Cherry MX Brown switches. How do you like those compared to the MX Blue, or compared to... anything else? How's the noise?

The Browns lack the mechanism that makes the click in the Blues happen, but you still have noise from bottoming out on the keys. Everyone bottoms out at first when switching to a mech keyboard, but if that noise is a bit much, people put small o-rings or such on the stems of the keyboard, which dampens the sound of bottoming out. Of course, orthodontic rubber bands work as well, so no need to purchase "specialty" o-rings.

Isn't ^ used to indicate indices? So 4 to the power of 12 is typed 4^12, I think. It's been a long time since I did any coding and even that was in a like-C-but-not-quite language developed to be easy to teach to idiots (aka Processing).

I believe he meant which key it is on, which is the "6" key on most standard layouts.

 

[sesselpupser]

I believe he meant which key it is on, which is the "6" key on most standard layouts.

I thought he meant if he could practice it in a programming context he'd learn where it is quicker, but maybe I am just being extremely dense.

 

[Danoff]

Both. I mean that I don't have the location on the keyboard memorized (the 6 key), but that I actually might have it memorized if I could put the right context to it. If you asked me to tell you where the { key is, I might not be able to tell you unless I thought about opening a bracket after an if statement, at which point it's muscle memory. 2^12 doesn't quite do it for me because I don't type that very often. Gotta think of another one, but I'm not sure it exists.

Edit:

Upon further reflection, I feel that even though I could use a blank keyboard for 99.99% of all typing activity, I, every once in a while, get into a situation where I need to hit the right key at the right time. If I'm doing a complex regular expression search in a file, sometimes I have to hit that ^ at the right time, and if I hit the wrong button, backing up and trying again might just be impossible... at which point I lose the entire expression and have to retype. During times like that, I think I'd curse myself for having a blank keyboard.

 

[MSTER232]

Isn't ^ used to indicate indices? So 4 to the power of 12 is typed 4^12, I think. It's been a long time since I did any coding and even that was in a like-C-but-not-quite language developed to be easy to teach to idiots (aka Processing).

Yes it is, but in addition to that you can use it to create this: ^_^

 

[Danoff]

The keyboard would be for an office setting, she has walls and a door so some noise is acceptable, but hopefully not an insane amount of noise.

She's a proper typist (as am I), so the keyboard needs to have good tactile feedback and crisp response. I've been looking at mechanical keyboards, and I think that might be the way to go except that I think they may be unnecessarily and obnoxiously loud. We visited an electronics store here recently and tried every keyboard they had. 99% of them were horrible mushy things with no feel whatsoever. The one we eventually walked away with had decent key response but the backspace bar was small - a fatal flaw (which we knew at the time but purchased it anyway out of need).

So, recommend me a keyboard. At the moment I'm thinking of the Das Keyboard Soft Pressure Point model, but there's no place to test it (that I'm aware of).

Well I took the plunge and got her a Soft Pressure Point Professional Das Keyboard - which has Cherry MX Browns - for Christmas. She loves it.

Thanks for the help guys. It's a great keyboard. Pretty much perfect as best I could tell. Not too loud, but not mushy either.

 

[Jordan]

Glad she's happy with her Das.