Asm

[94_XJ]

After a few searches turning up nothing (and if a discussion is already existing on ASM please delete this mods) and great curiosity on other's opinions, I'm proposing this thought I've had.

Reading other posts on GTP about suggestions for GT5 and some shortcomings of GT4, I've been thinking a lot about the ASM settings. Yes, I think about GT4 in my spare time with it's many settings and debate on what to try next; in short, I'm an addict.

Anyway...my thinking as to the purpose of the ASM is to create a more playable game for the casual gamer. With such an incredible amount of tuning available for suspensions (specifically, the racing suspension) a less mechanically inclined player/newbie GT player may not even change the suspension settings. Standard settings are OK at best and could cause a lot of problems for a new player so, in my mind, the ASM is a great way to counter the great amounts of under/oversteer a poorly set up suspension and poor driving would cause.

This leads directly into the traction control. Should a driver have the above mentioned problems, the only option to actually win races is to add large amounts of power. Without proper throttle control, which is also a big part of the under/oversteer problems, driving would be all but impossible.

That's my train of thought, I'm just wondering if anyone agrees or disagrees with me. I'm very curious to see what all of you have to say.

-94_XJ

 

[FormulaGT]

I see where you are coming from and I would agree with those points. Their is no problem with wanting to use ASM or TCS. It's when you get into whether or not it is beneficial that the fun begins. Sure, if you're a casual gamer why not use them? They're their to help you (however, some will argue that they do the contrary...- but I won't get into that, my knowledge is limited).

The issue becomes even more complex as soon as you start to question their effects on certain cars, their effectiveness as 'AIDS', etc. Whether you should or shouldn't use them is the other side of the coin- and there is, in reality, no °exact° answer. Some cars benefit from the use of AIDS and others don't, some peoples driving styles can icorporate the AIDS to great effect, others can't... The list goes on...

Anyway, there are my thoughts on the table.

FormulaGT

 

[gregc]

I would never say it's "wrong" to use ASM or TCS, each player to their own after all

My only gripe, and something I'd like to see in GT5, is there is no way to set global settings for driving aids - if I could just set them once the way I like them (all off for me, but that's just my preference) then I'd be happy

 

[Grayman222]

I think that asm would only help someone who has a lot of trouble controlling the car because they are using too large of motions.

More help would be to explain that the gear indicator works as a braking light when it flashes or to enable the blue/red racing lines on tracks.

 

[Moloch_horridus]

I find that ASM slows me down way too much - the slightest hint of a slide and the car slows down - a slight loss of traction is almost inevitable when you come out of a corner at the correct speed and the ASM penalises that. It is far better to get used to the correct corner entry speed than to rely on ASM.

 

[Philly]

so, could one say that AIDS develop bad habits? Should I practise more with them off?

 

[Keichi Tsuchiya]

Personally, I'm not sure. Attempting to drift in GT3 made the TCS, and ASM very noticeable, but when I first played GT4 and had no idea how to turn off the AIDS, I didn't notice any interference while I was driving. I've yet to trulyy drift in GT4 BTW.

 

[shabba]

I'm not a big fan of the ASM - though in *really* high powered 2WD cars I don't mind TCS. I find ASM really penalises the handling of the car, mainly with understeer. I like to powerslide through fast corners and use weight shifting to tighten/open my turn, and ASM doesn't let you do that. Then again, I suppose it can be quite useful when you're first learning to drive. Mind you I think I've only used it a few times in all of GT2,3 & 4.

Does it improve B spec Billy-bob Wally's performance, though? I make him race without it... (What a name for him! I'm surprised he hasn't quit on me.)

 

[MidnightRiot]

I find it less of a challenge for tuning high powered 2wd cars with ASM and TCS on. And like Shabba, powersliding is fun.

 

[94_XJ]

so, could one say that AIDS develop bad habits? Should I practise more with them off?

I'd say turn them off and you'll learn to be a much better driver. In order to maintain good control over the vehicle, you'll have to learn to drive smoother. The licenses are much easer when you can control the vehicle without the computer intervening.

 

[Grayman222]

so, could one say that AIDS develop bad habits? Should I practise more with them off?

TCS just removes learning throttle control. It might lessen turning a tiny bit in some cases where a very tiny amount of wheelspin will get you through the corner faster. Also in theory if you had perfect control of your throttle you would accelerate faster from a stop without tcs.

ASM badly affects driving lines because if you are driving close to the limits of the car the brakes are turned on. So if many of the better drivers were to drive with ASM on their racing lines would get taken away from them by the system.

When I first played GT1 me and all my friends oversteered a lot, especially in FR cars, even without throttle oversteer. ASM is ment to stop this I think. Braking earlier avoids the same problems ASM does while still allowing the car to be driven to it's ability.

 

[shabba]

I have more of a problem with understeer - my cars can't take corners as fast as I want them to...

 

[jessekatianda]

For me, ASM is pretty much off all the time, and it is especially useful (to be deactivated) on tight courses where I need quick corrections. On the other hand, I turn it on to reduce chronic understeer or oversteer on certain cars that need them, albeit very seldomly. But it's all about personal driving enjoyment, really.

And TCS is quite similar. It is needed at times, for driving pleasure, when the car is very powerful, such as the Viper SRT-10. For that car, I almost always prefer TCS to be on, to enjoy the whole power without wasting any of it on wheelspins. But on cars like the Z4, it is better turned off.

The TVR Speed 12 however, is still a bit too scary even when TCS are turned on. The TCS can barely control it. But that's another story.

 

[Christhedude]

my suggestion for gt5 and the driving aids should be done like in real life... cars with ESP (electronic stability programm) and ASR (anti slip regulation-traction control) should be the same as in real in the game.
lets say a Toyota supra doesnt have any aids, so it wont have any in the game...but, you can buy this electronic aids if you need them.

Anyway, most of the race cars have no aids in real life, just those high powered once, they use traction control.

In my opinion, the game should base on the driving aids from real live.
If your car doesnt have any, you can buy them.(like in real life)

best regards

chris

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

When playing with a DS2, I prefer AIDS but none with a DFP, just TCS 👍

 

[RICHARDO]

I haven't used driving aids in a VERY long time. And everytime I try to use ASM (just for the hell of it) it seriously screws up the car's driving characteristics.

 

[Grayman222]

my suggestion for gt5 and the driving aids should be done like in real life... cars with ESP (electronic stability programm) and ASR (anti slip regulation-traction control) should be the same as in real in the game.
lets say a Toyota supra doesnt have any aids, so it wont have any in the game...but, you can buy this electronic aids if you need them.

Anyway, most of the race cars have no aids in real life, just those high powered once, they use traction control.

In my opinion, the game should base on the driving aids from real live.
If your car doesnt have any, you can buy them.(like in real life)

best regards

chris

It might be tough for newer players, i think most people like to jump right into sim mode and learn to drive there. If they had to save up money for driving aids that could make the game inaccessable to some new players. The universal arcade settings applying to sim could help(maybe cap them after the beginner hall) or maybe light, medium, strong instead of the 1-10 scale thats hard to follow. I would picture "light" acm to only stop oversteer after a certain degree of angle(between 45 and 90) so that the system was less intrusive but stops donut crashes which really hit a newer driver hard.

Now the real life assists would be great. I would still like the option to fully remove them from the car if I choose though. Also it would be horrible for actually racing but it would feel more complete if some cars had the automatic model that worked like real life with 1,2,D.

 

[Philly]

I had an interesting experience regarding AIDS. (Just a "disclaimer," I just got done W/1000 miles, having not driven my Speed8 in about a month or two. For the last while, it was supercars and the G4.) So, today, I jumped into my Speed8 to take it for a spin. After many unsuccessful laps at Tokyo, I decided to turn my aids on. The car was oversteering all over the place with the aids on. I set around a 1'26" on a lap without anything major happening.

Looking at the settings, I realised I was using my settings from a previous drift experiment. I switched to my regular race specs. It drove much nicer, but instead of oversteer, the understeer was pretty extreme. I was disappointed when I only could manage a 1'31" on a lap without any crashes.

Then I turned aids to 10, 10, 5. Again, not a stellar drive, crashing in the right-left kink before T2. The anomaly is that this lap was a 1'25", 6 secs faster than without TCS & ASM. Could it be that for my style, driving aids make my car faster? Again, it could be because I am not accustomed to not having aids on and out of practise with a fast car, but I think a lap where I manage to keep the car in control w/ aids off shouldn't make me slower.

Any comments or am I jumping to conclusions too fast?