Beater or Sleeper? GT6 Car of the Week Thread



If you plan on joining us on Tuesday night, it's probably a good idea to pick up one of these...




Not sure i can make it this Tuesday. But i Got both cars... the new Lion and the little Marcos...

Wasnt too convinced with this new VGT, until i got a better time than our MCD in the allergy run...

My best time was 1.28.2xx, but it wasnt clean as i rubbed against some wall... imagine it was a clean lap, i would be in the 1.28.1xx :P

Will try to do a couple of laps on the Marcos tomorrow.
 
So, the Marcos Mini Marcos, the car that was named by the Department of Redundancy Department.
I decided to take it to Gemasolar and show how tiny it looks.
Behold, the tiny that is the Marcos Big Redundancy Marcos!
oTe1Zgg.jpg

Eh?
Someone parked their Audi infront of both the Camera and Marcos!
Hang on, i shall take a quick trip to Italy, and take a photo there.
Marcos Mini photo take two!
V01ujyS.jpg

...
You know, these photobombing Audis are ticking me off.
Seriously, that S4 could have atleast made the Marcos more noticeable!
Alright then... How about i go back to Spain and take the photo at night?
Yes, surely no A or S or RS whatevers will be up to take up the entire photo.
Take 3!
QBmHge4.jpg

AUDI IS A [BEEP]!!!
You know what?
I got the perfect perfectest idea!
Go to a race track in a country that is often forgotten in anywhere except said country or GTPlanet!
Surely, there can't be any freaking Audi to block the view of the Marcos mid race!
I can even imagine the Marcos doing a drift already!

Alright, Marcos is in position, and... *click*
idr6ThW.jpg

[BEEP]ING SON OF A [BEEP] WITH A PIECE OF [BEEP] ON TOP OF A [BEEP]!!!
CAMERAMAN JOE YOU SHOULDA BROUGHT SOME [BEEP]ING AUDI REPELLANT OR SOME [BEEP] LIKE THAT!
WHAT THE [BEEP] DO YOU MEAN THEY DON'T [BEEP]ING MAKE THOSE?!
Just... GIVE ME THE FREAKING PIECE OF PAPER WITH THE TIME ON IT.
...
WHO THE [BEEP] HAD THE TIME TO PUT A [BEEP]ING AUDI LOGO INSTEAD OF THE TIME?!
Hang on a second...
...
JOE YOU [BEEP]ING PIECE OF [BEEP] COME BACK HERE IM GONNA [BEEP]ING REDUCE YOUR PAY BY 99%!!!
No, i don't hate Audi, i just decided to think "What if the Top Gear presenters acted as if they noticed when an Audi was infront of them in the last two Series 18 episodes, and then turn that up to eleven.
And funnily enough, that joke actually made me want an Audi. :lol:
 
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So, the Marcos Mini Marcos, the car that was named by the Department of Redundancy Department.
I decided to take it to Gemasolar and show how tiny it looks.
Behold, the tiny that is the Marcos Big Redundancy Marcos!
oTe1Zgg.jpg

Eh?
Someone parked their Audi infront of both the Camera and Marcos!
Hang on, i shall take a quick trip to Italy, and take a photo there.
Marcos Mini photo take two!
V01ujyS.jpg

...
You know, these photobombing Audis are ticking me off.
Seriously, that S4 could have atleast made the Marcos more noticeable!
Alright then... How about i go back to Spain and take the photo at night?
Yes, surely no A or S or RS whatevers will be up to take up the entire photo.
Take 3!
QBmHge4.jpg

AUDI IS A [BEEP]!!!
You know what?
I got the perfect perfectest idea!
Go to a race track in a country that is often forgotten in anywhere except said country or GTPlanet!
Surely, there can't be any freaking Audi to block the view of the Marcos mid race!
I can even imagine the Marcos doing a drift already!

Alright, Marcos is in position, and... *click*
idr6ThW.jpg

[BEEP]ING SON OF A [BEEP] WITH A PIECE OF [BEEP] ON TOP OF A [BEEP]!!!
CAMERAMAN JOE YOU SHOULDA BROUGHT SOME [BEEP]ING AUDI REPELLANT OR SOME [BEEP] LIKE THAT!
WHAT THE [BEEP] DO YOU MEAN THEY DON'T [BEEP]ING MAKE THOSE?!
Just... GIVE ME THE FREAKING PIECE OF PAPER WITH THE TIME ON IT.
...
WHO THE [BEEP] HAD THE TIME TO PUT A [BEEP]ING AUDI LOGO INSTEAD OF THE TIME?!
Hang on a second...
...
JOE YOU [BEEP]ING PIECE OF [BEEP] COME BACK HERE IM GONNA [BEEP]ING REDUCE YOUR PAY BY 99%!!!
No, i don't hate Audi, i just decided to think "What if the Top Gear presenters acted as if they noticed when an Audi was infront of them in the last two Series 18 episodes, and then turn that up to eleven.
And funnily enough, that joke actually made me want an Audi. :lol:
You had me on the floor laughing!! God I miss that show...
 
Awesome @CSMDuty11 !!!

I cant bear looking at this Marcos anymore...

Such an ugly thing...

Its so ugly, an invisible wall had to come out of nowhere during our tuesday run, while i was leading, stopped me dead on my
track.

This car is so ugly i dont even want to take any picture of it...

This is a beater of a car, its so slow it is puttinh me to...... zzzzz. Sleepz


I had one good moment with this car: was when i drove from the cockpit view trying to complete the last lap at the LeMans as everyone pretty much finished...

The sun was rising and i crossed the line... it was bliss..
 
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Mini Marcos GT '70
1.3L
74 hp / 6,000 rpm
79 ft-lb / 3,000 rpm
559 kg (1,232 lbs)
384 pp



Top speed at Mid-Field: 100 mph

Cars within +/- half a second of the Marcos:

1:38.323 - 340 - Toyota Carina ED 2.0 X 4WS '89
1:38.351 - 344 - Nissan March 12SR '07
1:38.493 - 332 - Toyota Vitz RS 1.5 '07
1:38.651 - 384 - Mini Marcos GT '70
1:38.660 - 340 - Honda Accord Coupe '88
1:38.670 - 327 - Toyota Prius G Touring Selection (J) '03
1:38.728 - 330 - Volkswagen New Beetle 2.0 '00
1:38.734 - 346 - Nissan Skyline 2000GT-B (S54B) '67
1:38.794 - 341 - Toyota Voltz S '02
1:38.952 - 338 - Alfa Romeo Spider 1600 Duetto '66
1:38.969 - 331 - Citroën C3 1.6 '02
1:38.989 - 327 - Toyota Vitz F '12
1:38.997 - 331 - Volkswagen Lupo1.4 '02

The Mini Cooper 1.3i '98 is 7 seconds slower.

61 hp / 6,000 rpm
69 ft-lb / 4,000 rpm
720 kg (1,587 lbs)
318 pp



Top speed at Mid-Field: 95 mph

Put in that sort of perspective, the Marcos is a sleeper. It has the same size engine as the '98 Cooper, with 13 more hp, 10 more ft-lbs of torque, and 161 kg (355 lbs) less weight.
 
Well, going to have to point out the obvious: The Marcos needs.... MORE POWER! How anyone could set out to make a sporty and fast version of a car and then say, "Oh, 75 horsepower is plenty for the job" completely baffles logic. And after suffering through the Marcos' weak power and taking some middling results early during our race night, I decided it was time to bring out the Datsun 240Z at Brands Hatch. The Z was somehow seven points less on the PP scale from the Marcos but still ended up 15 seconds ahead after four laps in the practical experiment.


So long, boys.


Hey! I can see my competition from here!
And that's how I got my fourth and by far easiest win in COTW racing. However, much like my third win, I immediately paid for it the next go-round as I had to traverse the narrow confines of London on less grippy tires...oh, and suffer the wrath of some miffed Marcos drivers.


Rolling roadblock?! Seriously?!?!?!
Those travails aside, it still highlights the problem with the Marcos Mini. Some cars can punch well above their PP weight, the Marcos on the other hand, with its lofty 390 PP rating but speeds more in the ~340 PP range feels like a heavyweight punching with all the force of playful kitten. And that does a Beater make.
 
Now if only the GT-R LMP1 drove this smoothly, I'd be kicking butt instead of getting kicked. :lol:

I just drove the GTR LMP1 and its quite a challenge to figure out how to drive it smoothly and not run into the cones or drive off and DQ your lap time. What I found with the GTR LMP1 is that it does not like to brake and turn at the same time and it has a big turn radius.


Rolling roadblock?! Seriously?!?!?!

lol Jack I was trying to get around MC and Vic at this point in time and we blocked you in for a while. Also I have video from Brands Hatch and London race but trying to figure out how to transfer them from PS3 to computer and I have quite a few other videos from previous Car of the Week races.
 
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Try telling that to the Cobra... just one on a list of many. ;)

Cheers

I could also tell you Carlo Abarth produced cars that were considered sports / race cars, while outputing less than 40hp in the previous decade. Would you call today a Civic Type-R or a C5 Corvette too underpowered to be considered a sports car just because there are some Hellcats, P1 and Koenigsegg on the market ?
 
I could also tell you Carlo Abarth produced cars that were considered sports / race cars, while outputing less than 40hp in the previous decade. Would you call today a Civic Type-R or a C5 Corvette too underpowered to be considered a sports car just because there are some Hellcats, P1 and Koenigsegg on the market ?

Oh trust you me, I've raced in a number of low powered sports cars in real life that simply outperform the big boys in a number of situations... that's not my issue.

About the power issues : don't forget you're talking about a car from the 60's ;)

This is what I took issue with... especially here in North America, if there ever was a decade where power was KING it was the '60's. With numerous examples that were alive to mention, only to be killed off with the oil crisis in the '70's that signaled the death of the muscle car era. Yes I do understand that not all '60's sports cars were "speed goes up, gas goes down" monsters, but don't discount the ones that were either. Trust me, I know. I was there! ;)

Cheers
 
In its stock form, the Mini Marcos is simply a Beater. The PP it gets is too high for the results it turns out.

HOWEVER..

Tune the baby up, and it becomes a definite Sleeper. Under the right tunes, the Mini Marcos turns fantastic, and can zip its way around cars at higher PPs, such as the results that Baron Blitz Red has been showing.

I vote for sleeper based upon the blast we had Tuesday nite, plus the thing is so good
tuned up. It can even run down the Rocket at the British Lightweights!
 
My first review here, let me know what you think :cheers:


fmbMfSTPKBWOfp41W_0_zpsj8ccvct2.jpg


The 1970 Mini Marcos is basically a performance Mini Cooper with a new shell. This is already sounding good, given how great the Cooper is.

I wasn't expecting much from this car. I didn't expect seven gears, dual-clutch transmission, and a ridiculous top speed. With only 70 horsepower and a four-speed transmission, this car is beyond fun to drive. I even enjoyed it more than a 458 Italia.

I decided to take it to Brands Hatch. I drove on the Indy circuit, so it wouldn't take me ages to log times and there would be more room for me to screw up.


Fs2xLtZm69ftlBAd2_0_zpsj9sfhzs1.jpg


Coming into Paddock Hill, I was expecting massive understeer. By massive, I mean Honda Fit RS understeer. I was actually really surprised when I turned in, and the car glided through the turn perfectly. At this point, I had a huge grin on my face. Then came Druids Bend. Again, the car gracefully and almost effortlessly hit the apex perfectly. I continued logging lap after lap, and was never bored.

qG96MVgT69fV5r7u8_0_zpskd1bh7hq.jpg



So the car drives great and feels great, what else?


To my taste, I'm not so sure on the styling. Don't get me wrong, I still think it's nice, but it isn't beautiful.

comp_zpsrvi7cedz.png


Every time I see the face of the car, this first thing that pops in my head is that guy in some cartoon that says "Uhhh okay boss!" (With a dopey accent). The back of the car is the thing I like about the car the least. It sort of references a 250 GTO, but with a roof line of a bug. It just doesn't look good to me.


How fast is this car?


With this class of cars, they tend to be very slow and boring to drive. This Marcos will be an exception. This thing is a blast to drive, and its nimble handling and lightweight body make good use of all the 75 horsepower and can take on a BMW M3 if the track doesn't have long straightaways! I took it to the Nurburgring Nordshleife, expecting a very boring and time consuming lap. The track before Karussell Corner was basically full-throttle not that fun. The car seemed to have bitter resentment for 4th gear. Every time I shifted up to it, the car started dropping in revs and speed. After the karussell, the fun part of the track came on the Marcos was an absolute blast! It tore up the track from Hohe Acht all the way to Galgenkopf! On the straight, it reached a top speed of 110mph! For a car that little and sub-100hp, that looks pretty impressive.

Its big brother is the original Mini Cooper. How does little brother Marcos compare to it?

It obliterates it. Marcos beefed up the engine, making it have 14 more horsepower. With the new body, it weights 170 kilograms less.

To see if there was anything I was missing, I took an old Cooper to the same track

kc9d4ScnhYVaKIVcT_0_zpsc6e63kmw.jpg


The Marcos' lap was 1:02.402. The Mini, while it felt like it was ripping up the track, did a 'meh' lap time of 1:06.465. In short, the Marcos is a real upgrade to the Mini Cooper. This is good news, since it is more expensive.

*the Marcos uses CS's and the Cooper uses CM's, but the a 4-second gap between the cars is huge, so the Marcos is still faster.


Beater or Sleeper?
A total sleeper.

I only drove the stock version, not a thing done to it. Not even the paint, since that red really suits it. With power upgrades and some tuning wizardry done to it, I reckon it could take on a Lamborghini at a small and curvy track.
 
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My 450pp tune if anyone would like to try. It's where I've got to trouncing AI supercars.

I use the same setup from 400pp to maxed out 470pp ish, CS to SS. A nice middle ground is NA, around 430 pp on CS.


Mini Marcos GT '70

450pp
172bhp, 709kg
Weight dist 55:45

Tyres: SH-SS (CS), ABS 1

Wheels: standard

Full custom suspension
RH: 92 88
Spring Rate: 5.00 3.53
Damper Comp: 3 3
Damper Ext: 5 3
ARB: 3 4
Camber 0 0.5
Toe: -0.08 0.10

Racing Brakes
BB 5 6

Power
Engine Stage 1
CPU
Semi-Racing Exhaust
Manifold
Cat
Intake
High RPM Turbo

Limiter 98.1%

Triple plate clutch

Full custom Diff'
Initial: 10
Accel: 16
Brake: 6

No Weight reduction
Ballast 145Kg @12

Full custom Trans:
Can't remember exactly what I did :dunce:, I think I just set the default numbers and
adjusted from there, as I was doing this setup with the tranny bug :

Max speed 155 mph
1st 3.455
2nd 2.310
3rd 1.655
4th 1.265
5th 1.000

Final 3.100


For fun, I recommend this in the Gornergrat League of Nat A, race 1. You will probably need SS to gain advantage over the Group B cars, but what fun!

matterhorn-rotenboden_10-jpg.351021


Edit: the car carries a lot of ballast, which perhaps is contrary to the idea of being super lightweight. I've reached this stage to give a more competitive power output at given pp levels.
 
My first review here, let me know what you think :cheers:


fmbMfSTPKBWOfp41W_0_zpsj8ccvct2.jpg


The 1970 Mini Marcos is basically a performance Mini Cooper with a new shell. This is already sounding good, given how great the Cooper is.

I wasn't expecting much from this car. I didn't expect seven gears, dual-clutch transmission, and a ridiculous top speed. With only 70 horsepower and a four-speed transmission, this car is beyond fun to drive. I even enjoyed it more than a 458 Italia.

I decided to take it to Brands Hatch. I drove on the Indy circuit, so it wouldn't take me ages to log times and there would be more room for me to screw up.


Fs2xLtZm69ftlBAd2_0_zpsj9sfhzs1.jpg


Coming into Paddock Hill, I was expecting massive understeer. By massive, I mean Honda Fit RS understeer. I was actually really surprised when I turned in, and the car glided through the turn perfectly. At this point, I had a huge grin on my face. Then came Druids Bend. Again, the car gracefully and almost effortlessly hit the apex perfectly. I continued logging lap after lap, and was never bored.

qG96MVgT69fV5r7u8_0_zpskd1bh7hq.jpg



So the car drives great and feels great, what else?


To my taste, I'm not so sure on the styling. Don't get me wrong, I still think it's nice, but it isn't beautiful.

comp_zpsrvi7cedz.png


Every time I see the face of the car, this first thing that pops in my head is that guy in some cartoon that says "Uhhh okay boss!" (With a dopey accent). The back of the car is the thing I like about the car the least. It sort of references a 250 GTO, but with a roof line of a bug. It just doesn't look good to me.


How fast is this car?


With this class of cars, they tend to be very slow and boring to drive. This Marcos will be an exception. This thing is a blast to drive, and its nimble handling and lightweight body make good use of all the 75 horsepower and can take on a BMW M3 if the track doesn't have long straightaways! I took it to the Nurburgring Nordshleife, expecting a very boring and time consuming lap. The track before Karussell Corner was basically full-throttle not that fun. The car seemed to have bitter resentment for 4th gear. Every time I shifted up to it, the car started dropping in revs and speed. After the karussell, the fun part of the track came on the Marcos was an absolute blast! It tore up the track from Hohe Acht all the way to Galgenkopf! On the straight, it reached a top speed of 110mph! For a car that little and sub-100hp, that looks pretty impressive.

Its big brother is the original Mini Cooper. How does little brother Marcos compare to it?

It obliterates it. Marcos beefed up the engine, making it have 14 more horsepower. With the new body, it weights 170 kilograms less.

To see if there was anything I was missing, I took an old Cooper to the same track

kc9d4ScnhYVaKIVcT_0_zpsc6e63kmw.jpg


The Marcos' lap was 1:02.402. The Mini, while it felt like it was ripping up the track, did a 'meh' lap time of 1:06.465. In short, the Marcos is a real upgrade to the Mini Cooper. This is good news, since it is more expensive.

*the Marcos uses CS's and the Cooper uses CM's, but the a 4-second gap between the cars is huge, so the Marcos is still faster.


Beater or Sleeper?
A total sleeper.

I only drove the stock version, not a thing done to it. Not even the paint, since that red really suits it. With power upgrades and some tuning wizardry done to it, I reckon it could take on a Lamborghini at a small and curvy track.

Welcome to the COTW review section, iName. And for your first review, it's not a bad start, at all. You touch most of the key points, while keeping it simple. You lean more on the actual perfomance of the car, and how did you find it, but even so you have managed to show all the key portions of that part.

I do have to ask, do you need to use the large and bolded font? Just asking out of curiosity.
 
"Marcos's Mayhem of Miniature proportions"

From the high powered, turbo charged, rear engined and rear wheel drive RUF from Germany, we go to a car that is quite literally a complete opposite.

The low powered, non-turboed, front engined and front wheel drive Mini Marcos (or Marcos Mini :P) from Britain. ;)

The Mini Marcos is based on a similar aged Mini Cooper, but ironically it's the older of the two when compared to the "Old Mini" it's based on, the one we have here in GT6 which is a '98 model. :boggled:

So with such an age gap, you'd think the Marcos is royally screwed, but let's look closer.

Both cars have 1.3 inline 4 engines, but Marcos is up by 14 horses and 10 more torques 1000rpms earlier at 3000rpm.

What truly splits these two is the weight, aero design and gearing.

They both have 4 speed gearboxes, but the Marcos has shorter gearing

The Marcos is more aerodynamic, but not as good looking as the Cooper.

Then again sometimes you have ugly, but fast cars and beautiful, but slow cars. :)

The final and biggest difference is the weight, 161kg lighter is the Marcos and when both cars have less than 80hp, that weight loss is a major advantage.

Of course, compared to other cars of similar PP, the odds aren't in its favour as its lack of power is more noticeable against them.

As was demostrated in the nights racing, Mommentum was king.

As long as you kept it going, it flies around turns, but one slip up would make a big difference in speed and lap times.

I would call it a sleeper on the basis that it does way more than the car it's underpinnings are based on, but it'll struggle against a lot of cars of a similar PP.

Verdict: Sleeper (barely:D)

Also I've decided to review the VGT's as well so they also get talked about as let's be honest, they are quite unique, you could even call them Visionary. :lol:

So into the spotlight steps the Peugeot VGT. 👍

Based on the underpinnings of the record breaking 208 T16 Pikes Peak, the Peugeot has a turbo charged 3.2 V6 Making 875hp (over 910hp with an oil change) in a 875kg body. :drool:

Couple that with 4WD and a close ratio 6 speed gearbox, this car flies out of the box and through the gears to a gear limited top speed of 209 mph.


It's been said that it can understeer at the limit but that's expected with 4WD's.

It's biggest flaw is the suspension as its not brilliant by race car standards, but also too stiff for a road car so it's in an awkward spot there.

On tracks like Le Mans, SSR7 etc, its stock gearbox isn't cut out for them (for short tracks however it's brilliant).

It's definitely one of the quicker VGT's that hasn't gone completely Over The Top ('cough' 2X 'cough' :P), but I do see a problem for it on the horizion.

Make that 3 problems. :sly:

Verdict: Neutral
 
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