Best A.I in a racing game.

[MagpieRacer]

Did a search, pretty sure I have not seen a thread on this.

A.I is always a tough one for developers to get right, from too aggressive and downright impossible to catch to being line hogging pushovers (looking at your GT).

But which games caught your attention, which games made you feel like you could be racing a human, or at least more than a mundane computer with a one line script.

Bring me your thoughts and views on the games that have impressed you.

 

[Aldo]

TOCA Touring cars for PS1.... They were fairly random and they made mistakes.... Win in my opinion!

 

[Sureboss]

The AI in Dirt2 is pretty good from what I've found. Early TOCA was pretty good too.

 

[Northstar]

Codemasters has always had the best AI racing game wise(at least the ones I've played(which is Toca 3, Dirt and Grid), which gives me high hopes for F1 2010's AI.

 

[SuperShouden]

GT2 had some pretty dynamic AI. They're would always be at least one driver in an endurance race that couldn't drive. And they fought you pretty hard for positions. It was always scary to try and past them going into the corkscrew at Laguna Seca.

 

[Tornado]

I always liked the GT2 AI because they actually made mistakes trying to get by you that you could conceivable make (Laguna Seca being the most obvious example), but they didn't do the same mistake every single lap (like the AI in GT4 does).




However, I'm gonna have to say Viper Racing had the best racing game AI by a pretty wide margin. It had by far the least predictable, most "human" AI I've ever seen, and no two races were ever alike even if you didn't involve yourself in them.

I still recall one race where two of the AI drivers were racing for position when they both caught up with a third AI driver who was slow coming off the previous turn (which is already pretty cool, because he was slow because he started sliding and had to slow down to correct. A very realistic mistake to make). They attempted to drive around him on both sides for the next turn, and almost pulled it off. Then the driver that took the inside line around the third car cut the turn just a bit too much, dug a wheel into the gravel on the inside of the turn, had the rear come around into the side of the car in the middle, and ended up taking out all three cars. Keep in mind that this happened about 5 car lengths in front of me to properly understand just how awesome the AI in this game is, because I had absolutely nothing to do with it. Also keep in mind that the AI generally acts like professional drivers, unlike typical aggressive AI of today where they make mistakes because they do things that just don't make sense.
Coupled with the perfect collision physics and entertaining (though not that realistic) damage system and you could barely tell the difference between the single player mode and the multiplayer mode. I'd like to show a video, but almost all of the ones on Youtube have people messing with the hornball, so I'll probably have to upload one myself.

 

[RaidoGT]

GT4 had some of the worst AI I've ever had the displeasure of encountering (but then, that's a well-known failure of the game).

Wasn't too impressed with the AI in TOCA3 and most other games either. I've done hundreds of online races in GPL, but compared to online most AI is just way too dumb and overly aggressive.


Only in rFactor I've found them passable.... since you can regulate them with some sliders. I leave them at 100% strength (or a bit more, depending on the mod), but turn the 'agressiveness' way down to about 2 to 4 per cent.

That's the only setting imho that results in AI that drives somewhat like humans - people who generally don't want to crash.
Set as such with lowered aggro, it doesn't let them drive like maniacs and dive into gaps which aren't there, punting you off. They will pass, but only if there's a clear gap. It depends a bit on the mod in use, but set like this it's one of the few sims where racing the AI almost feels like racing humanoids.

 

[niky]

Grand Theft Auto.

The racing AI is no great shakes, not by any stretch... and there's a lot of rubber-banding in the racing... but getting sideswiped by inattentive drivers, rear-ended by someone coming up to a stoplight to fast, and attacked by another driver with a two-ton weapon of mass destruction and a serious case of road rage is something you can't quite find anywhere else. It's all scripted, but I love the scripts.

 

[dylansan]

Grand Theft Auto.

The racing AI is no great shakes, not by any stretch... and there's a lot of rubber-banding in the racing... but getting sideswiped by inattentive drivers, rear-ended by someone coming up to a stoplight to fast, and attacked by another driver with a two-ton weapon of mass destruction and a serious case of road rage is something you can't quite find anywhere else. It's all scripted, but I love the scripts.

Vice City and San Andreas were annoying because the traffic would make 90 degree corners and change lanes instantly without slowing down, or generally abiding by the laws of physics. Really, only the scripted cars were any good.

 

[niky]

Vice City and San Andreas were annoying because the traffic would make 90 degree corners and change lanes instantly without slowing down, or generally abiding by the laws of physics. Really, only the scripted cars were any good.

They abide by the game physics. They just don't abide by the laws of the road . One of my favorite pastimes is jumping on a car, shooting into the engine bay and holding on as the driver goes wild.

 

[kikie]

Best AI in a race game!

And the winner is:

1nsane

http://1nsane.invictus.hu/

Anyone whom ever played this off-road race ............ .
​

 

[Tornado]

1nsane had pretty good AI, but it occasionally had problems determining paths (1nsane was basically Motorstorm half a decade earlier) for the races that didn't follow actual trails. This is particularly notable in Capture the Flag, where the AI would make a direct beeline for the flag and ignore all objects (usually buildings being the biggest problem). That being said, it would usually pick terrain that the cars could actually traverse rather than just heading going in a straight line through everything.

They abide by the game physics. They just don't abide by the laws of the road . One of my favorite pastimes is jumping on a car, shooting into the engine bay and holding on as the driver goes wild.

Cars (and only cars. All other transportation is handled differently, including police vehicles) in San Andreas don't abide by the game physics unless you interact with them, nor do they really have "AI" to speak of. I'm pretty sure it was the same way with Vice City.

That being said, after spending several days worth of hours fiddling with the physics of San Andreas so they are much more realistic, I can personally vouch that, when the AI actually is in control of the vehicles, it is generally pretty competent.

 

[dylansan]

I can personally vouch that, when the AI actually is in control of the vehicles, it is generally pretty competent.

But not always.

 

[Golfman]

Absolutely no question: Formula 1:Championship edition on PS3. It's why it is the best offline racing to be found on the system. In fact, all of Studio Liverpool's F1 games have high quality A.I. But F1:CE is the best.

 

[niky]

1nsane had pretty good AI, but it occasionally had problems determining paths (1nsane was basically Motorstorm half a decade earlier) for the races that didn't follow actual trails. This is particularly notable in Capture the Flag, where the AI would make a direct beeline for the flag and ignore all objects (usually buildings being the biggest problem). That being said, it would usually pick terrain that the cars could actually traverse rather than just heading going in a straight line through everything.


Cars (and only cars. All other transportation is handled differently, including police vehicles) in San Andreas don't abide by the game physics unless you interact with them, nor do they really have "AI" to speak of. I'm pretty sure it was the same way with Vice City.

That being said, after spending several days worth of hours fiddling with the physics of San Andreas so they are much more realistic, I can personally vouch that, when the AI actually is in control of the vehicles, it is generally pretty competent.

Well... considering the physics is pretty bouncy and wild... I don't know how much less realistic the handling physics of the cars can get!

Only difference I see with police vehicles is the extra speed boost and grip they get. Physics regarding mass and grip seem consistent between player cars and AI cars... but then, I'm no GTA:SA expert... I've only just started playing again (up to Los Venturas... starting airplane training... just finished a two-hour vigilante marathon with the tank to make the money to buy the airfield... and I still have half a million bucks left over... )... probably a topic for another thread.

It's interesting how well they managed to implement the AI... mixing in preset scripts (yes, I know... MOST AI actions are pure script) with actual AI reactions to the players in order to have large numbers of AI actors on stage at any single time. Something that gets better with every GTA.

---

Pre-scripted routines are realistically the only way to get large numbers of AI to interact with the players... which is what sets up that GTA:SA video. In racing games, you can't rely completely on scripts... but scripted actions and waypoints are a must in order for a processor to handle all the cars. What differs is the randomness allowed by the scripting... something with GT hasn't handled very well in the past... and how good the waypoints programming is. What sucks in most driving games is that they don't have a separate set of waypoints for different vehicles... (GT4's poor handling of FWD is a case in point).

Still... with AI, either you're up against AI that have absolutely no issues with poor traction, wobbly cars or tricky curves and can drive faster than any human can... or AI that's "dumbed down" to an arbitrary speed. For racing, nothing beats a real live human opponent of similar skill to you.

 

[Peter]

TOCA 3's AI would slow down if there was an accident or a slow driver, but they did not back down if you're in their way, and will bump into you, and they can't even get penalised for it, you do

 

[Tornado]

Well... considering the physics is pretty bouncy and wild... I don't know how much less realistic the handling physics of the cars can get!

By which I mean I took the time to OCD over every single car and bike in the game, look up the speculations for the closest real life basis for each car or bike, and then tune the acceleration, top speed and handling to be as close as possible to real life. It literally took dozens of hours, but the game is tons more fun than it was originally. Especially the street races.

Only difference I see with police vehicles is the extra speed boost and grip they get.

I worded that poorly. What I meant was that the police vehicles in the game are never scripted. While the pedestrian vehicle AI basically doesn't exist until the player does something to interact with them, the police AI is constantly simulated. This is most noticeable in the highway systems in the game. The police cars (and bikes and tractors) all have AI that is completely non-scripted (outside of being programmed to follow the road paths), so they don't do the go-the-exact-speed-of-the-player stuff that Rockstar programmed into the highways in San Andreas.

Still... with AI, either you're up against AI that have absolutely no issues with poor traction, wobbly cars or tricky curves and can drive faster than any human can... or AI that's "dumbed down" to an arbitrary speed.

I really have to upload a Viper Racing replay. With only two exceptions, it has neither of those issues. In Viper Racing, the only reason the AI is faster than you is if they took a better line, and the only reason they are slower is if they took a poor line or made a mistake.

 

[niky]

By which I mean I took the time to OCD over every single car and bike in the game, look up the speculations for the closest real life basis for each car or bike, and then tune the acceleration, top speed and handling to be as close as possible to real life. It literally took dozens of hours, but the game is tons more fun than it was originally. Especially the street races.

Must have a lot of time on your hands... ...I guess the cars and bikes are faster now? What really strikes me going back to GTA:SA or VC after GTA4 is how slow everything feels... where they've limited the speeds to make the city seem bigger... as compared to GTA4, where you can hit some insane speeds in many of the cars.

I worded that poorly. What I meant was that the police vehicles in the game are never scripted. While the pedestrian vehicle AI basically doesn't exist until the player does something to interact with them, the police AI is constantly simulated. This is most noticeable in the highway systems in the game. The police cars (and bikes and tractors) all have AI that is completely non-scripted (outside of being programmed to follow the road paths), so they don't do the go-the-exact-speed-of-the-player stuff that Rockstar programmed into the highways in San Andreas.

Gotcha. 👍 However, I'd say that the bystander/civilian vehicle AI changes scripts also if and when other AI interact with them... which adds a nice air of authenticity to the proceedings when you come up to an intersection to find two guys shooting at each other after a collision. You're right, though... I have noticed that police tend to drive differently in free traffic compared to other AI.

I really have to upload a Viper Racing replay. With only two exceptions, it has neither of those issues. In Viper Racing, the only reason the AI is faster than you is if they took a better line, and the only reason they are slower is if they took a poor line or made a mistake.

What system is it on?

 

[Tornado]

Must have a lot of time on your hands... ...I guess the cars and bikes are faster now? What really strikes me going back to GTA:SA or VC after GTA4 is how slow everything feels... where they've limited the speeds to make the city seem bigger... as compared to GTA4, where you can hit some insane speeds in many of the cars.

They have higher top speeds, but almost all of them accelerate slower than they originally did (except the bikes, which I had to make a bit faster in acceleration). As I recall, the fastest car in vanilla San Andreas was the Turismo, which went 110-120 MPH in game. I took the car as being some weird street version of an F40 LM, and made it go 240, with a realistic acceleration curve. The way San Andreas handles acceleration is all detailed here, if you are interested. I basically used that as a springboard for what I ended up doing.

What system is it on?

PC.

 

[doblocruiser]

Toca 1 & 2 on PSX 👍

 

[Minardi]

Definitely Superstars V8 Next Challenge. Although TOCA was good too. Can't agree with Grid or even DTM Race driver 1/2/3. Another overlooked game; Atari's F1 Grand Prix Challenge on the PS2.

 

[Spagetti69]

Definitely Superstars V8 Next Challenge. Although TOCA was good too. Can't agree with Grid or even DTM Race driver 1/2/3. Another overlooked game; Atari's F1 Grand Prix Challenge on the PS2.

You are joking about supercars are you.
I recently purchased this game and started doing Tiffs schooling.
I thought this feels good. Excellent with a wheel. Some cars are better than others etc.

Following day I decide to try an event. The AI is horrible, they always pile up on the first corner. What a let down. I had high hopes for this game and I can no longer bare to play it, shame.

Edit read my silly mistake. Sorry wrong game. I've never played v8 so I take it back. Supercar challenge AI is pants though.....
F1ce isn't bad. The AI make believable misstakes but can be aggressive if your in front. If damage is on this usually ends up as a wheel coming off.
Not bad though. IMHO.

 

[Golfman]

Yeah, on PS3 it's F1:CE.
On PS2, I think any one of Studio Liverpool's F1 games.
On PS1, Toca 1,2 or World Touring Cars.

 

[CAMAROBOY69]

Oh yeah the Toca games had excellent AI even with 20 cars on the track at the same time. I cant believe I forgot about how great that game was. Well the AI was great for a while then once you get to the open wheel they got quite frustrating.

 

[Golfman]

Oh yeah the Toca games had excellent AI even with 20 cars on the track at the same time. I cant believe I forgot about how great that game was. Well the AI was great for a while then once you get to the open wheel they got quite frustrating.

The original PS1 Toca game never had open wheel events. That's what made them so good. The move to PS2 saw Codemasters completely ruin the series by adding multiple motorsports and a daft story/career mode. Even the AI took a hit.

 

[Tommi]

The original PS1 Toca game never had open wheel events. That's what made them so good. The move to PS2 saw Codemasters completely ruin the series by adding multiple motorsports and a daft story/career mode. Even the AI took a hit.

Race Driver 3 wasn't too bad(aside from the rallying), the physics made up for a lot of the previous two game's failures, but even still A.I were pretty poor.

___________

I believe TOCA 1, 2 & World Touring Cars were the best on PSX/1 also.👍

 

[NotThePrez]

ToCA Race Driver 3 had very challenging AI, especially in the open-wheel cars. I have this one game for the PS2 called Super Truck Racing which was based somewhat around the FIA European Truck Racing Championship. The A.I. was not only fast, but bery hard to get by (obviously since you're racing Lorries).

Honorable mentions: Ford Racing 2 (PS2), Tokyo Extreme Racer 3 (PS2).

 

[gtracedriver]

Yeah I think Toca3 had good AI also F1 Challenge99-02 and GP4 are 2 PC games which have good AI IMO

 

[somebody]

Best AI I can remember is from Indianapolis 500 on my old Amiga. Of the newer bunch I'd go with the TOCA series.

 

[sems4arsenal]

I would say Pepsiman on PSX .I would say Grid's AI is great coddies have the AI figured for some reason but considering Kaz saying that A.I is the most undeveloped aspect of racing games then I suspect GT5's Ai to be alot better than GT4.