Boy, 11, Shot Dead in Liverpool

[Alex.]

Boy, 11, dies after pub shooting

Police outside the Fir Tree pub
The 11-year-old was hit by one of three shots fired

Reaction to the shooting
An 11-year-old boy has died after being shot in the neck in the Croxteth area of Liverpool.

The incident happened at about 1930 BST on Wednesday in the car park of the Fir Tree public house on Fir Tree Drive.

A witness said the victim was one of three boys walking across the car park when a teenager on a BMX bicycle fired three shots, one of which hit the boy.

Merseyside Police have appealed directly to local gangs for information about the killing.

Officers have sealed off the scene, including a neighbouring parade of shops, and no-one has yet been arrested in connection with the shooting.

'Ripped apart'

Merseyside Police Assistant Chief Constable Simon Byrne appealed to the local community to help catch the killer.

He said: "Someone out there knows who put the gun in his hand and I want your help to get the community to turn that gunman in.

Map of Croxteth
"This is quite an awful crime, quite senseless, and the community holds the clue to solving this crime quickly.

"You can only imagine the heartache of the family that's been ripped apart.

"We urge anybody, particularly in the criminal fraternity, that this is quite an awful and senseless crime and please turn in who is responsible quickly.

"There is no hiding place and no time for silence."

The eyewitness, who did not want to be named but was drinking outside the pub, said a youth aged about 14 or 15, wearing a hoodie, rode up to the car park and fired three shots from a distance of about 30 metres.

One shot missed the boys and another hit a car, while the other bullet entered the victim's neck.

People came from the pub to help the victim, whose mother was also called to the scene.

A spokesman for North West Ambulance Service said: "We treated an 11-year-old with serious gunshot wounds."

He added the boy, who had been returning from football training on playing fields close to the pub, was taken to Alder Hey hospital where he was pronounced dead.

'Gangs of youths'

Councillor Rose Bailey, who lives nearby and is a member of the local police authority, appealed for people with information to come forward.

She added: "It sends shockwaves through the community of Croxteth and really it must be devastating.

"To think your young son is out playing football and then to get a call to say he's been shot, I really don't know as a parent how you would handle that."

The area around the pub was made a "designated area" by police last year, meaning officers could disperse groups and move people away from the area.

The decision was made in response to concerns raised by local residents about youths gathering outside the pub and local shops.

At the time, Neighbourhood Inspector Louise Harrison said: "The designated area has been introduced in response to concerns about gangs of youths who hang around the local area behaving in an anti-social way.

Gang Initiation task maybe?

 

[Rykon Zero]

good god. that is so close to my age. good thing i prefer gtp to lsd. and i am not talking about a limited slip.

 

[V1P3R]

I was thinking you were younger some how...

Anyway, What's up with you Brits? I've never thought of your country being as bad as here (US).

 

[Rykon Zero]

no. 1 year older.

 

[Muzaffar]

Oh my god....this is one bad news, i mean what are kids these days? Guns,drugs,alcohol,sex,what else? I mean the young generations are always the one who gets corrupted. This is just senseless, if it was just over a stupid accident at school (or something stupid) just leave the kid alone. But no, he thinks he's some sort of gangsta and kills this kid just to make him feel like a man. More like losing his balls between his legs....

 

[Only_in_f1]

These people aint found GTPlanet yet...
Joking aside, I dont think he was targeted by the teenager, i think it was a random attack. 3 shots 1 hit, which is unfortunate. Can't even walk home anymore.

Its 3rd fatal attack in 2 weeks i think.

Anarchy in the UK.

 

[Alex.]

I think it was something like:
"If you want to be in our gang you have to kill someone to prove you have the balls. Here's the gun."

 

[Only_in_f1]

I dont think it was even that.
I think he was lashing out. And the young lad was just in the way.

 

[ExigeEvan]

I think it was something like:
"If you want to be in our gang you have to kill someone to prove you have the balls. Here's the gun."

That's what everyone was thinking when the 18yr old and 14yr old were arrested. But they don't seem to be the killers.

 

[Azuremen]

I dont think it was even that.
I think he was lashing out. And the young lad was just in the way.

In all honesty, I would have to agree with that. Its just way to random for anything gang related. Gang stuff would be kill someone in the opposing gang, etc. And I dun think the 11 year old was "gangsta"

Only 3 fatal attacks in the UK in two weeks? Geesh, I must be way too use to the news here, seems like nothing at all.

 

[Only_in_f1]

i think its 3, one was that guy who tried to stop some destroying his car, the other was when he comfronted youths after they threw a half eaten mars bar through an open window at traffic lights and then this.

Im going to say something off topic, but it has a tad to do with it.

They say 'youths of today have no respect.' England must be the only country when the 'youths' get record exam, GCSE and A-level, results and the press dont say well done, they say the exams are getting to easy!
I know this may have nothing todo with what happend here, but its not helping.

 

[Lee]

UK has officially gone down the pan, there's no way I'd let my kids (whenever they arrive) grow up in this country.

Absolutley horrifying.

 

[ExigeEvan]

They say 'youths of today have no respect.' England must be the only country when the 'youths' get record exam, GCSE and A-level, results and the press dont say well done, they say the exams are getting to easy!
I know this may have nothing todo with what happend here, but its not helping.

I know it's not neccesarily an original thought but +rep for bringing it up.

 

[V1P3R]

UK has officially gone down the pan, there's no way I'd let my kids (whenever they arrive) grow up in this country.

Absolutley horrifying.

Soo... You'll come "to the states" as they say then? 💡

 

[Solid Lifters]

Soo... You'll come "to the states" as they say then? 💡

No, our restrictive gun laws don't work, either.

 

[Joey D]

While this is bad, I never like to hear about kids being shot, it really isn't that big of deal overall.

Come to Detroit, you hear about kids under the age of 13 being murdered all the time, while awful, it isn't uncommon nor is it really surprising. And as I said in the thread about stabbings in the UK, either the UK is really anal about making the biggest possible deal over one death or living near Detroit has skewed my sense of what's really big in the world.

But this is just evidence that shows taking guns away from the people doesn't prevent people from being shot. As much as I love the UK I don't understand the limitation you guys have on firearms, if you want to shoot someone you'll figure out how to get a gun...if not you'll just stab them.

 

[arora]

Cliche; Guns don't kill people, people kill people. another; If guns are outlawed then only criminals will own them.

More to the point, there is a very bad problem with children everywhere... perhaps a poor education system, perhaps an even worse media. What I think is that modern societies have lost the concept of the family, if momy needs to act as a man and not a woman, then she is too busy to raise her children, also she will be more prone to shunt her husband from dictating proper dicipline.

One tragic shooting is not nearly as concerning as the degregation of our society.

 

[Touring Mars]

UK has officially gone down the pan, there's no way I'd let my kids (whenever they arrive) grow up in this country.

No offense, Bee, but that's just BS... if you actually look at the figures, the trend in overall gum crime in the UK is actually going down... last year was the lowest in 7 years, and while some places (like London) have seen a small increase in gun crime, the national trend is downward. Knife crime is still far more prevalent, but still, the total amount of "incidents" far outweight actual fatalities, and the number of fatalities (of gun crime, relevant to this thread) is actually very low indeed... I think we need to put things in perspective and not pander to this whole tabloid culture of "Shock Horror, this country's gone to pot..."-attitude...

However shocking and sad the shooting of an 11-year old may be, you really shouldn't let it cloud your judgement of the facts, and the fact is that this is an extremely rare event...

 

[Azuremen]

No offense, Bee, but that's just BS... if you actually look at the figures, the trend in overall gum crime in the UK is actually going down... last year was the lowest in 7 years, and while some places (like London) have seen a small increase in gun crime, the national trend is downward. Knife crime is still far more prevalent, but still, the total amount of "incidents" far outweight actual fatalities, and the number of fatalities (of gun crime, relevant to this thread) is actually very low indeed... I think we need to put things in perspective and not pander to this whole tabloid culture of "Shock Horror, this country's gone to pot..."-attitude...

However shocking and sad the shooting of an 11-year old may be, you really shouldn't let it cloud your judgement of the facts, and the fact is that this is an extremely rare event...

On the flip side TM, it seems your stabbing problem has gone up. Gotta look at both sides of the coin when talking stuff like this.

 

[Mark T]

At the moment the UK media is on a crusade to publish as much news as they can about stabbings and gun crime. There favourite at the moment is "gang culture". The only reason the situation seems worse is because the media are continually bombarding everyone with stories.

A few months ago it was stories about paedophilia, before that global warming, before that I think it was probably something to do with underage pregnancy. They will print whatever sells.

 

[nk4e]

perhaps an even worse media.

Blame MTV?

Well, what I think that that this generation is like any generation ( but with some adds and minuses going with it). Alot of kids do have the respect for others but then again, others just don't take **** from anyone. Some of those kids that don't have respect, probably don't know how to attain it the proper way but they use fear to gain that respect in terms of guns or gangs. For instance, lately gang violence has been going up in my area. Is it that the teachers don't know how to reach to them. Is it that some underground rap group that they like is making them think this way. Or is it that they want some respect, power, and a family? I know this quote is from a movie but I think it went like this
" Sometime or another, someone is going to make the gang"

I need to rewatch it but its from Redemption: Stanley William's story.

 

[Touring Mars]

On the flip side TM, it seems your stabbing problem has gone up. Gotta look at both sides of the coin when talking stuff like this.

Yes, you have to look at the wider picture, but you also have to keep it in perspective. Saying that the whole country's going to pot just because there's been a child shooting is simply not justified... And if its knife crime you're talking about, there's been several highly publicised cases of late, and the public perception/awareness of these incidents may be at a peak right now, but given that reliable statistics on the number of knife-related crimes practically do not exist, it's impossible to say with any accuracy that the problem is actually any worse than it has been in the past...

 

[Dave A]

I agree with TM, this is tradgic, as it is anytime an innocent person get's killed let a lone a child. But gun crime in the UK is a lot lower than in a good number of other countries, the fact it's here is bad, but the media has it in it's spotlight at the moment, that's why your reading about it more lately. The actual number of people killed in gun crime though, as TM said, has dropped.

 

[GTkid2510]

I find it sad that the kid that was shot was the same age as me, but I have to agree with Joey D. Where I live in NI, there's quite a bit of gun crime(whole country), but there's a hell of a lot of stabbing and it's on the news all the time, and to me, it's common.

 

[Sureboss]

Most shootings are gang related in one way or another, in Notttingham a big gang leader was sent to prison and subsequently a massive fall in shootings arose. This is a horrible thing to happen, but it is very rare, and we still live in a safe county, despite what our 'intelligent' media say.

"Lose sight of your child and a peadophile will take them"

"Go out at all and you will be shot"

"Blame asylum seekers"

The British media love to get hysterical and unfortunately some of the public go with them.

 

[Azuremen]

Yes, you have to look at the wider picture, but you also have to keep it in perspective. Saying that the whole country's going to pot just because there's been a child shooting is simply not justified... And if its knife crime you're talking about, there's been several highly publicised cases of late, and the public perception/awareness of these incidents may be at a peak right now, but given that reliable statistics on the number of knife-related crimes practically do not exist, it's impossible to say with any accuracy that the problem is actually any worse than it has been in the past...

Quite true. I'm not saying the knee jerk reaction that someone had regarding the entirety of the UK made much sense. That similar to saying their was a car wreck on my street, I"m never driving there again.

In regard to statistics on knife attacks, those are fairly hard to track, but logic would follow that if you remove guns, people will resort to other implements.

 

[Sureboss]

Yeh, but we haven't removed guns have we? How long have guns been illegal in the UK? (Of course some people can still own guns, farmers, etc) Knife crime is again related to gangs, mostly. If I were in charge of trying to improve security on Britains pavements/streets I'd be aiming () hard at the gangs.

 

[ExigeEvan]

Yeh, but we haven't removed guns have we? How long have guns been illegal in the UK? (Of course some people can still own guns, farmers, etc) Knife crime is again related to gangs, mostly. If I were in charge of trying to improve security on Britains pavements/streets I'd be aiming () hard at the gangs.

Except the concept of a gang isn't always as clean cut as people like to think.

I won't deny there are established gangs in the UK, but very often they're no more than a 'us' and 'them'. For example, you may have one group of council estate youths calling themselves the East Estate Massives and another the West Estate Massives. Not today's media would immediatley call both these groups a gang, but 40 odd years ago when my dad was a kid youths from one area of a small town would often get into fights with youths from another group of youths from another area of town. Hell, it still happens just not on the same scale. But just because they don't go by a collective name their not dubbed a gang.

The thing is now, if this whole "gang" idea seeps anymore into the public mind then every group of youths collecting in one place on a semi-regular basis is going to be dubbed a gang. Does that mean that if I meet up with my mates for a game of footy in the local park on a weekly basis we're a gang?

 

[Sureboss]

By Gangs I meant Gangs, not groups of people.

 

[arora]

Some of those kids that don't have respect, probably don't know how to attain it the proper way but they use fear to gain that respect in terms of guns or gangs. Is it that the teachers don't know how to reach to them. Or is it that they want some respect, power, and a family?

I hacked your post to respond to a few points;

fear and violence to obtain respect that they are lacking from the home.
Teachers should only be there for respectful students wanting to learn.
Indeed, now you found my point, simply put, a family.

And no, I was not blaming mtv