Car cannot turn tight corners

[YoMushi]

Hi guys.
If there is a thread on this I’m sorry I did tried searching.

Some cars like the EK or R32 and other cars cannot make a tight turn I.e. deep forest second for last turn hairpin. Some cars can turn at ease and some no matter how much u turn u will run wide or hit the wall. What am I doing wrong? Thank you in advance.

 

[Moguzi]

Hi guys.
If there is a thread on this I’m sorry I did tried searching.

Some cars like the EK or R32 and other cars cannot make a tight turn I.e. deep forest second for last turn hairpin. Some cars can turn at ease and some no matter how much u turn u will run wide or hit the wall. What am I doing wrong? Thank you in advance.

Hi, that happens when front ride height is too low.

 

[YoMushi]

Hi, that happens when front ride height is too low.

Ok I will try to raise the ride height and go from there. Is this confirmed or speculation? Would buying the steering angle fix this as well or best bet is raising the car? Thank you Moguzi

 

[Moguzi]

Ok I will try to raise the ride height and go from there. Is this confirmed or speculation? Would buying the steering angle fix this as well or best bet is raising the car? Thank you Moguzi

Nb, This an official explanation found on ”Beyond the Apex”:

Ride Height:
”There are limitations to this principle, however. For example, there may be bumps on the road surface that could hit the car's underside. The car may bounce, the tyres may hit the wheel housings, or the operational range of the suspension arms may exceed their allowed range. Therefore, it is not a good idea to set the ride height so low that it scrapes the ground: ride height must be appropriate to the car and the track. You can set the ride height lower on flat circuits and increase the height incrementally for bumpier courses. Unpaved dirt tracks require the suspension to be set much higher, for example. In rainy weather, you must not lower the suspension too much to prevent the car's underside from hydroplaning. Considering these factors will help you to determine the proper target ride height.”

 

[lbpomg95]

I've had this. Although it isn't made very obvious by the games tutorials, they've modelled the possibility for the wheels to hit the arches if the front end is too low, thus you literally can't turn the steering. Some cars can't go low enough to do this, others can.

 

[AlfaDog89]

Similar experience but I was using racing hards on an EK touring car in the rain and it could barely turn right. Putting on racing wet tires solved that problem in my case

 

[demonchilde]

There are a lot of things that you can try.
All the above mentioned about hight adjustment is a good start.

ARB's, if your ARB's are set even (like 5-5) you can drop the front down 1, and up the rear up 1 (so 4-6 or whatever). Then test corners again.

Dampers, if your turn is too wide off throttle you can try to adjust the weight shift.
Like, front compression +1, rear -1, and then extension front -1, and rear +1.
Then go test corners again to see if there's any difference.

LSD, drop the initial torque down to like 7 or 8 and go test corners again.

Displacement, if theres way too much weight in the rear of the car (like 46/54 or worse) you can ballast a little weight to -50 and try to get it down some, maybe 48/52 even might make a huge difference.

Toe, if your front toe is at 0 or actually "in" any at all and your car turns wide, try setting it to "out" like maybe .05
Try it.
Try again at .10 out, see how that goes.

Can front downforce be added to your car? Or is it? Front downforce will push the tires into the pavement more and in effect force them to grip better in turns.

Camber, careful with camber as a little goes a long way. But every point of camber adds to grip on the corners. Too much and you lose exit grip slowly and start losing straight line speed and all that.

And as always, test only ONE thing at a time. Use a second saved spreadsheet so your original never gets erased.
Good luck ^^

 

[wiseslee91]

Hi, that happens when front ride height is too low.

I was so happened to do time attack at tsukuba, and realized some of my car had serious understeer while going through the tight hairpin. My first guess was I messed up the LSD setting too much the car couldn't turn. After 2 days of researching about real life LSD and the in game LSD, i decided to scratch the tune and redo it again. After 2 disastrous days, it was the freaking ride height that causes the ****** problem! =.=

 

[demonchilde]

I was so happened to do time attack at tsukuba, and realized some of my car had serious understeer while going through the tight hairpin. My first guess was I messed up the LSD setting too much the car couldn't turn. After 2 days of researching about real life LSD and the in game LSD, i decided to scratch the tune and redo it again. After 2 disastrous days, it was the freaking ride height that causes the ****** problem! =.=

Yeah, the LSD is like a structured basic tuning tool. Everything in the suspension section, (hight, dampers comp and ext, toe, camber) is like the FINE tuning of the LSD settings.

Thats why I try to tune using the LSD first, to get it "somewhere in the ballpark" to where I want it. THEN do the suspension adjustments.
Because technically if you go back and change the LSD later, you kinda should start all over again retuning the suspension.

 

[marioho]

Another thing with the ride height is how much body roll there will be. A tall ride will increase the lateral load transfer, while a low ride will decrease it a lot. The effect is similar to anti roll bars, you could be running with a car so low and so stiff that you do not load the outside wheels well enough to push the car around the corner.

There's that saying, as stiff as possible, as soft as necessary or something along those lines. Same for ride height: as low as possible, as high as necessary. If you go too low, your car will have a hard time cornering.

Dampers, if your turn is too wide off throttle you can try to adjust the weight shift.
Like, front compression +1, rear -1, and then extension front -1, and rear +1.
Then go test corners again to see if there's any difference.

I'm still wrapping my head around dampers. I thought it would be the other way around here?

Relatively softer (lower setting) for front compression to allow the weight to shift to the front of the car quickly. The front is the one pulling the car laterally, the better the grip there the tighter you'll corner. Conversely, a stiffer front rebound rate will make the weight unload slowly from the front, maintaining your turnability throughout the corner. Same reasoning for the rear dampers, but obviously in the inverse.

Thank you for the informative post!

 

[Streeto]

I experienced this with the R32 and thought the car was bugged, but later learned the ride height thing.

Fair enough, in previous games the wheels would just clip through the body and not affect anything.

 

[demonchilde]

Another thing with the ride height is how much body roll there will be. A tall ride will increase the lateral load transfer, while a low ride will decrease it a lot. The effect is similar to anti roll bars, you could be running with a car so low and so stiff that you do not load the outside wheels well enough to push the car around the corner.

There's that saying, as stiff as possible, as soft as necessary or something along those lines. Same for ride height: as low as possible, as high as necessary. If you go too low, your car will have a hard time cornering.

I'm still wrapping my head around dampers. I thought it would be the other way around here?

Relatively softer (lower setting) for front compression to allow the weight to shift to the front of the car quickly. The front is the one pulling the car laterally, the better the grip there the tighter you'll corner. Conversely, a stiffer front rebound rate will make the weight unload slowly from the front, maintaining your turnability throughout the corner. Same reasoning for the rear dampers, but obviously in the inverse.

Thank you for the informative post!

What I have found is 2 things;
1, as much as it should be 100% based on real life and real racing physics, it's not. It's more of a vague guideline they used. We see discrepancies in many areas between life physics and game physics.
2, along those lines, I first dug into the different things that worked in gt5, gt6, and sport, mainly to see the paths the game designers have stuck to over the years. Some work, some don't, some a little.

I threw in those words 'off throttle' as thats 2 entirely different settings compared to corner center on out with gas.
When the engine isn't pushing from throttle the weight shift is different then when it is, we know that. The "slight" increase in front compression and rear extension I have found to help that shift... again... while off throttle.
This also worked (kind of) in sport, but was this way in gt6 more apparent. (And this, really only for FR and MR, as its obvious a way different shift for the others)
As the game is still new and we are all still learning this games specific emotional quirks, we basically have to reach into our bag of tricks and play trial and error until we find things consistent. Thats also why I urged the the OP to try only 1 thing at a time and never overwrite his main tune sheet, in case something didn't pan out.

One thing thats really getting on my nerves right now is the PP changes when you fine tune gears in the transmission. I've had like 5 or 6 cars tuned within a point or 2 from my goal and destroyed it by tuning the transmission, lol.
Same thing with various other settings. From ride height to everything else the PP rate changes sometimes a lot, and it's really making it difficult to max tune for a specific PP range.
I've gotten to the point now where I get to like 25pp under my goal, tune the car, and see where I am after that before adding anything else.
Anyway, good luck man.
Most of these tiny details we will have down packed a couple months from now, we just all have to learn from each other from now till then to get there ^^

 

[marioho]

@demonchilde thanks for clarifying, bud!

I mostly play F1 games, ergo my unfamiliarity with fine tuning dampers. In Sport I was more often than not happy with the stock setups. Now with GT7 it became apparent very fast that a quick visit to the tuning shop could be enough to drastically skew the handling of these cars on "stock" setup, so I unbuttoned my cuffs and got to work.

I really love tweaking setups and learning how stuff works. Asked you to expand on that precisely for not liking feeling clueless. Your point about the weight balance being different when coasting compared to on the gas or even braking is very true, I'll think over it regarding the dampers!

But for how much I love learning about handling and mechanics, haha I'm not keen onto bashing my head against a game's quirks! If that's an unexpected behavior that GT7 favors for whatever reason, I'll just stick with my guess and take a little L on the performance.

 

[GTRanger]

Hi guys.
If there is a thread on this I’m sorry I did tried searching.

Some cars like the EK or R32 and other cars cannot make a tight turn I.e. deep forest second for last turn hairpin. Some cars can turn at ease and some no matter how much u turn u will run wide or hit the wall. What am I doing wrong? Thank you in advance.

Try adjusting your front camber angle, in road car usually starts at 0.5 or 1, try upping it to 1.5/1.8, usually the rear doesn't need anything unless the car has mega power, if you look at race cars the fronts are as high as 3 and the rears like 1.5/2. Makes a huge difference.

 

[Seikenfreak]

I still think something is weird with the system though. I think they probably designed it so things would hit wheel wells, but didn't think about it for specific cars.

I put together a bunch of 60s-70s vintage race cars and most of them had an extremely hard time going around the Deep Forest hairpin. Mini's, muscle cars, euro cars etc. Everything was widebody. Sometimes the wheel would just turn super slowly and you have to go around the corner at like 25mph to make the turn. I heard about the ride height issue awhile ago but jacking the suspension up didn't affect it at all. Tried camber, tried LSD etc. Even the first turn on Deep Forest, I had to slow waaay down because the steering speed was so slow. I'm not sure but I think it feels more broken than realistic.

This was with no assists on and I was just experimenting with my controller and not on my wheel setup.

The ride height/wheel clearance idea makes sense except on cars that have clearly been modified to work around it. The old Trans Am race cars are lower in real life than you can even get them in the game.

Something is off.

 

[NAVE 15x]

Try messing with lsd. That will make your head spin. I think the lsd has the most influence on your cornering. I've been messing around with the lsd and you can get some huge improvements on cornering. Depending on the way you set it up, the speed of your cornering can change. But my issue is I can't find the sweet spot, I either got too much torque coming out, or not enough.

But yea mess around with the brake section on the lsd. It makes a Massive difference on cornering.
Trying to learn how it works in the game is a challenge for me, I think because the inputs are so sensitive, and there is alot of variables you need to consider, like rwd, weight of car, power etc. Hard to find that perfect balance