Driving Etiquette!!!

Z

ZippyGeorge

2
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Hello,

I love playing Gran Turismo but constantly get frustrated by a friend that I race with who always has to blame me for doing something wrong.

I don't take racing too seriously, I like to have fun yes, but I always try to be a clean driver.

I've outlined below a few situations that have resulted in me getting angry and leaving the race early as I get fed up of being blamed for something I didn't do, I'd like to hear your opinions of who was at fault please, here we go:

Scenario 1 (Braking into a corner, Nurburgring Nordschielfe)
I'm in 3rd place (1st and 2nd place are miles away so don't worry about them), 4th place (let's call him Stephan) is right on my tail not so much that he can't see the track but maybe a car's length behind), I get to a sharp corner, brake heavy as going quite fast, Stephan DOES NOT hit me but swears at me for braking too heavily, I get round the corner fine.

Is this my fault for going too fast before the corner? I brake heavy as I believe in keeping as mush speed for as long as possible before braking, as long as I still get round the corner then it's OK. Stephan says I shouldn't break so hard, but if I ease the brakes on aren't I slowing the car too early and losing speed unnecessarily?

Scenario 2 (Left hand bend)
I'm ahead of Stephan, but again he's close behind. We approach a left hand bend, I'm out on the right so I can turn in and hit the apex. Stephan is in the middle of the track, he gets almost level with me as I turn in to the corner, I hit him as unaware that he's there.

Who's to blame? Surely he shouldn't be entering the corner there knowing full well that I will be turning in soon?

Scenario 3 (Left hand bend)
Similar to Scenario 2, but this time I'm going slightly too fast and slowly drifting toward the outside of the bend. Stephan is trying to overtake on the outside, but keep shouting at me "you're pushing me off, stop it!"

Is this my fault? or should he be aware and slow down?

Scenario 4 (Stephan goes off track)
OK, Stephan is in front but has just come off the outside on a left hand bend, I take the bend fine but as I rounding the corner Stephan drives back on the track and straight into the side of me, he then blames me for driving into him!

Shouldn't he look where he's going?



Thanks.
 
Doing a very quick analysis of all the situations as you report them...I got the feeling that Stephan is a bit stupid...
Even so... situations 2 and 4 may have something to do also with your lack of awareness and knowlegde of the correct procedure... so...
 
Scenario 1: No ones fault. Stephan is the trailing driver and has to avoid rearending you in the braking zone. Typically I brake early when tailing a car due to longer braking distances associated with slipstream. Also this can be avoided if Stephan moved off the driving line in case you brake earlier than him he might even find himself in the lead into the corner if he does this.

Scenario 2: your fault. It is your job to be aware also. Use your radar! And expect people to be on the inside if they are close.

Scenario 3: again your fault. You should reduce your speed when side by side on the inside of the corner. The inside driver has a shorter distance around the corner but a slower cornering speed while the outside driver has a longer distance but can carry a higher speed. This is the trade off in door to door racing and part of why racing is slower than hotlapping and why overtakes slow both drivers down. You should not force another driver off the track.

Scenario 4: his fault. When a driver leaves the track it is thier responsibility to re-enter cleanly and without creating an incident. However, this being said, if you see him leave the track you should expect him to be out of control and attempting reentry. So while it is his fault, you may have been able to avoid it, so keep that in mind
 
Scenario 1 (Braking into a corner, Nurburgring Nordschielfe)
Stephan was too close and tried to brake at the same time as you, which will always result in a collision. Remember, if both you and Stephan are chasing each other closely, and you both intend on using the same braking point, then you are going to hit because your braking speed will put you both in the same place at the same time. The tailgating driver needs to brake slightly earlier especially if they are gaining on the lead car.

Scenario 2 (Left hand bend)
If your cars are physically overlapped then the apex is now Stephans and not yours. You are only legally allowed to turn in deep enough to leave 3/4 car width on the inside of the track for Stephan to use. So it's your fault.

Scenario 3 (Left hand bend)
Again, if the cars are overlapped on the exit, then the outer 3/4 car width on the edge of the track belongs to Stephan and you need to cut your exit line short to not hit him. Again, it's your fault.

Scenario 4 (Stephan goes off track)
Stephan's fault. It's the responsibility of the off track driver to re-enter the track only when it's safe to do so.
 
Indeed some footages would help. Anyway
Scenario 1
I would say the driver ahead always has the right to choose braking point and line (well, of course within reasonable limits) and the driver behind must be extremely cautious.
Scenario 2
Usually it's really hard or impossible to manage a turn in the optimum racing line during racing. It's not like during practicing or qualifying. You better try to defend the inside than turning wider. (Typical place is the hairpin at Kyoto)
Scenario 3
If you were on the outside and Stephan is on your left then you'd simply went off track, so how you could ruin his apex? There must have been somethign else. Or if it was like you were on the left side and lost traction due to late braking or such, and then you forced him wide then well that's your fault.
Scenario 4
I again take the hairpin in Kyoto as example. It seems to me that pretty much always lost cars get ghosted in such cases so you can't make a mess. Anyone around will just pass as you weren't there.
 
2, 3, 4, are all avoidable things because you and him should be aware of your surroundings. I know It's hard to anticipate someone eles move but it can be learned. Almost like riding a motorcycle on the street you don't know what idiot is going to pull out or come over on you so you just have to assume everyone will all the time and be prepared for it. Same thing here if someone is behind you then just assume they will try to pass you in a place that's not ideal and be ready for it at all times.

As for your 1st question there is absolutely nothing wrong with hard braking once your in that braking zone and have your timing down for late braking. There are many different factors that come in to play here that effect braking. ABS on weak, default or off will result in people braking at different times as will wheel users vs DS4 users sometimes. But as long as your in that zone its up to the person behind you to anticipate all kinds of different braking scenarios and not hit you.

I'm not going to assign any blame here because without video proof it's just impossible to know exactly who was more at fault.
But don't let your friend get into your head and believe everything is your fault because I guarantee you that he is just as much at fault.
 
I mostly agree with everyone being scenarios 2 and 3 your fault, and scenario 4 his

However, for scenario 1, I'd like a bit more context for this. Maybe you have different braking points, at which it's mainly his fault. The lead car has control over the pace and should dictate it. But if you brake too early though it could be considered a brake check, which would mainly be your fault.
 
Replay would be nice, but S1/S4 (although maybe you just think you are braking late) sound like his fault, while S2/S3 (depends on your definition of "almost level" though) sound like your fault, so you are even, case closed :D
 
Mirror_man
Nice one!!!! Should also be on GTS Forum.. and not only on GT6 Forum...
Click to expand...

Thanks all for you replies! I agree that a degree of spatial awareness is required on both parts abd can see now where I may have been in the wrong.

I don't consider myself a particularly good racer, I usually like to just get on and have a good thrash about (whilst not annoying anyone else) but when I do try to race properly I like to know that I'm abiding by the rules as much as possible and being a considerate racer.

I always kick myself if I forget to save the replay after a race as they would be good to see what went wrong.

The etiquette videos within the game aren't much help, I'll have a good read through the link you've supplied. No doubt I'll be back here soon!
 
Last edited:
ZippyGeorge
Thanks all for you replies! I agree that a degree of spatial awareness is required on both parts abd can see now where I may have been in the wrong.

I don't consider myself a particularly good racer, I usually like to just get on and have a good thrash about (whilst not annoying anyone else) but when I do try to race properly I like to know that I'm abiding by the rules as much as possible and being a considerate racer.

I always kick myself if I forget to save the replay after a race as they would be good to see what went wrong.

The etiquette videos within the game aren't much help, I'll have a good read through the link you've supplied. No doubt I'll be back here soon!
Click to expand...

Good racing driver or not, I'd say you have absolutely the right idea of becoming better.
Seeking advice, learning from mistakes, yours or someone else's, and being able to receive constructive criticism, is important to learn and improve.
That and practice, practice and practice.
 
Last edited:
ZippyGeorge
Hello,

I love playing Gran Turismo but constantly get frustrated by a friend that I race with who always has to blame me for doing something wrong.

I don't take racing too seriously, I like to have fun yes, but I always try to be a clean driver.

I've outlined below a few situations that have resulted in me getting angry and leaving the race early as I get fed up of being blamed for something I didn't do, I'd like to hear your opinions of who was at fault please, here we go:

Scenario 1 (Braking into a corner, Nurburgring Nordschielfe)
I'm in 3rd place (1st and 2nd place are miles away so don't worry about them), 4th place (let's call him Stephan) is right on my tail not so much that he can't see the track but maybe a car's length behind), I get to a sharp corner, brake heavy as going quite fast, Stephan DOES NOT hit me but swears at me for braking too heavily, I get round the corner fine.

Is this my fault for going too fast before the corner? I brake heavy as I believe in keeping as mush speed for as long as possible before braking, as long as I still get round the corner then it's OK. Stephan says I shouldn't break so hard, but if I ease the brakes on aren't I slowing the car too early and losing speed unnecessarily?

Scenario 2 (Left hand bend)
I'm ahead of Stephan, but again he's close behind. We approach a left hand bend, I'm out on the right so I can turn in and hit the apex. Stephan is in the middle of the track, he gets almost level with me as I turn in to the corner, I hit him as unaware that he's there.

Who's to blame? Surely he shouldn't be entering the corner there knowing full well that I will be turning in soon?

Scenario 3 (Left hand bend)
Similar to Scenario 2, but this time I'm going slightly too fast and slowly drifting toward the outside of the bend. Stephan is trying to overtake on the outside, but keep shouting at me "you're pushing me off, stop it!"

Is this my fault? or should he be aware and slow down?

Scenario 4 (Stephan goes off track)
OK, Stephan is in front but has just come off the outside on a left hand bend, I take the bend fine but as I rounding the corner Stephan drives back on the track and straight into the side of me, he then blames me for driving into him!

Shouldn't he look where he's going?



Thanks.
Click to expand...

You and Steffen (let's call him that) go here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ng-behaviour-how-gts-should-be-played.375408/

Read the rules, then you buy a few beers and sit down and watch some replays.
Everytime one of you admits a mistake you can take a sip of your beer.
 

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