F1 Returns to USA - COTA - Bring on 2013!!

[prisonermonkeys]

It's not a case of copying the mix from one circuit to another. The mix can be tailored to accentuate certain traits, and because of the way the tarmac is laid, those traits can vary around the circuit - for example, a high-grip mix might be used around a fast corner to encourage drivers to take it faster again - though I'm not sure what the FIA's stance on this is.

Whatever the case, the tarmac mix used in Austin will be the right mix for the circuit rather than simply borrowing the mixture from another surface.

 

[OK8]

The corner at CotA is, is downhill, faster, blind and has the minimum amount of run-off allowed by the rules.

Sounds absolutelty brilliant, that sequence of words. Hopefully this will turn out to be an exciting track.

 

[Seismica]

I agree. Despite facing serious problems, they're about six weeks ahead of schedule. They expect to be done some time in August-September, with the race due to be held on November 18. Two months before they were due to hold races, India and South Korea were nowhere near ready. Even construction at Abu Dhabi was still underway with two months left.

Have they not simply re-organised the schedule so they can get the track finished sooner, and maybe left other areas (Such as paddock, grandstands etc.) until later?

It would be a good tactic to create the impression that they are progressing faster than they actually are.

 

[ZohsixGT5]

Is anyone here going to the COTA race? It looks like I'm going to need to find a group to tag along with. None of my friends have enough money or interest to go in November. I need to go ahead and start booking flights and hotels.

 

[CodeRedR51]

I won't be able to attend F1 this year, but my long term plan is to move to Austin before next year, so I'm hoping that next year I can go. I'm actually looking more forward to the V8 Supercar races than anything else.

 

[ZohsixGT5]

Cool, I'm hope to attend the V8 race as well next year.

As a backup this year I have a Corvette group to go with, but they're all married and in their 50s, so I'd like to find a group closer to my age if possible.

 

[Northstar]

Have they not simply re-organised the schedule so they can get the track finished sooner, and maybe left other areas (Such as paddock, grandstands etc.) until later?

It would be a good tactic to create the impression that they are progressing faster than they actually are.

This pic was taken on the 1st.

Paddock exterior looks nearly complete, grandstands are coming along nicely as well.

Also shows how insane T1 is going to be.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Yeah those grandstands were a bare frame last week.

 

[BlacqueJacques]

Love the elevation changes 👍

 

[CodeRedR51]

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Any idea where that is on the circuit? I'm guessing it's either Turn 2, 6 or 8. Posibly the Istanbul-esque 16-17-18 complex, but I think Turn 2 is the best fit.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Yeah, it looks like turn 2 to me. The elevation for turn 1 in the background is quite distinctive.

 

[CodeRedR51]

More updates:

http://circuitoftheamericas.com/articles/cota-may-construction-update

 

[CodeRedR51]

I'll just leave this here.

 

[RACECAR]

Love it. Absolutely looking forward to the final product.

 

[Ardius]

Hmm, looks a little awkward like Korea. Starts well with the Maggotts/Becketts style section - the whole first sector is great - but then becomes a series of awkward tight corner sections connected by long straights.

Maybe they should have swapped the sectors around so that the awkward corners and long straights had the elevation to make them faster/more interesting and the high-speed sweepers were relatively flat.

Of course it might look a lot different in real life than in that game. Hopefully it does, that stadium sector needs to be a bit more like Hockenheim (which I find kind of enjoyable thanks to the bumps, camber and elevation) rather than flat like Korea or negatively-cambered like Abu Dhabi.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Kind of reminds me of the A1 Ring.

 

[TayTheDay]

Dammit I came here to post that video

Less than a second into the gameplay footage and Hamilton already has a penalty. Very realistic.

haha

 

[ZEROX]

That circuit have lots of other circuit characteristic.

A1+Bahrain+Silverstone+Valencia+Turkey+South Korea+Algarve+Brno.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Pretty sure it was designed that way on purpose...

 

[ZEROX]

Yea, if i'm not mistaken, it were taken from the F1 teams suggestion to make the circuit interesting.

 

[lbsf1]

Hmmn, seeing it now makes me think there won't be many overtaking oportunities apart from the first and last corners, there seems to be only one proper line round the mid section .

 

[Wardez]

Yeah, awesome video, as we know from playing Korea before the real life drivers got to in F1 2010, India in F1 2011, we can confident that this is pretty much exactly what the track's gonna be so it's great to get footage of CoTA so early, we didn't even get footage of the last two years' new tracks till late Summer, lucky bunch we are.

Anyway, I've never been a big fan of the track and the elevations are exactly what I expected (while still very well keeping in mind the fact that perspective from video, especially of that from a game, will always be different to real life). The "blind" turn isn't nearly as thrilling as hyped, but it does look interesting a bit.

T1's going to be ok, passes there will be pretty dramatic, but they just couldn't help themselves to make it so damn wide.

But after that the first sector's a wash for racing. there's not much new variety, it's Becketts, then another smaller Becketts starting off sector 2. I'm pretty sure the DRS zone will be at the end of sector 2, going into turn 12. It's such a huge straight, so with the DRS that'll be where most of the passing takes place.

The really slow sector 3 seems really like a chore and doesn't have good flow at all. They should've just linked turns 13 and 16. If they were supposedly going for a "Hockenheim" stadium feel, it's just not there. Hock's last few turns are the best part of the track and there's actually a bit of banking which makes the combination so awesome, which for whatever reason Tilke just avoids like the plague.

And that Istanbul Turn 8 mock up is hardly that, it's sterile, a flat turn sweeping multi-apex turn with a bit of camber at the end? No thanks.

There's just no character here and the racing's just going to be the same as it is at Abu Dhabi I'm sorry to say. That still doesn't mean I'm not over the moon excited to go see the race, I'm just giving my perspective from a pure drivers' and racing fan approach. At least the video made my mind up about where I'll sit, that'll be turn 12 now. Should be nice to see them coming in at full click then slow down so much, then see them take off around the next few slower turns.

It'll still be, like I said, pretty fun to drive around a few times since it's such a high speed layout, but I imagine a chase around the complex to be, in a driver's mind"
" Ok first sector, wait, wait, second sector, wait, wait, oh ok caught up a bit with the DRS, third sector, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, ok, next lap, ah... missed the pass at T1, ok wait...wait..."

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Hock's last few turns are the best part of the track and there's actually a bit of banking which makes the combination so awesome, which for whatever reason Tilke just avoids like the plague.

Tilke's firm might have been in charge of developing the circuit, but Tilke himself didn't actually design it. Tavo Hellmund came up with the basic concept, with some input from Kevin Schwantz. They then approached Tilke GmbH, and one of Tilke's engineers was charged with turning their scribbles and notes into an actual circuit. I believe it was Schwantz who suggested the Hockenheim section:

www.statesman.com/sports/formula1/t...out-should-2321735.html?viewAsSinglePage=true

 

[Wardez]

Good to know. So I'll adapt what I said to mean Tilke as an entity/firm, not the man himself. But it still stands of course, that for whatever reason, they like to keep it flat.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Tilke's original design philosophy was to put sharp corners after long straights to encourage overtaking under braking. But he seems to have learned a new trick for his circuit designs - exaggerating the sectors of the circuit. We saw this in Korea, where each sector of the circuit requires the team to focus on a different area of the car. And again in India, where half the circuit is long straights and heavy braking zones and half the circuit is fast and fluid driver-oriented stuff. And now we have the Circuit of the Americas, where the Hockenheim section seems to be designed to throw a spanner into the works of finding the perfect setup.

The end result is that Tilke seems to be trying to force the teams into making a choice: to develop a car setup that palys to the car's strengths, but is only really good for two of the three sectors; or, on the other hand, to choose a well-rounded setup that worked well everywhere, but the car won't be as good as it normally would be in individual sectors.

 

[Wardez]

And that's a sound strategy, but it's been used everywhere. Take Abu Dhabi, it has the longest straight of all in the back, the first couple sectors are extremely quick, then it comes down to the last sector, which is, to quote the drivers, "Like a karting circuit."

I do appreciate, if that is what he's going for, that he's trying to spice up the racing by giving most of the track a particular character then adding a section where the cars will suffer due to a low down force-partiality but if it's repeated then where's the challenge again?

Doing that is detrimental to the track's overall "flow." And I hate using that to describe most of the tracks, but it makes sense here.

A perfect example of this philosophy failing is Bahrain 2010. Remember when they added the new mid-track complex? It was ridiculous. I'm not sure exactly who was responsible, but that's an example of who throwing an out of character section in to a track for the sake of giving them a harder time with set up, or to not cater to certain team strengths, just doesn't work, even if it's done well. The same cars will still be faster and the only end result will be a feeling of arbitrarity.

P.S. India's pretty nice actually, at least it has balance.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

And that's a sound strategy, but it's been used everywhere. Take Abu Dhabi, it has the longest straight of all in the back, the first couple sectors are extremely quick, then it comes down to the last sector, which is, to quote the drivers, "Like a karting circuit."

No, he didn't use that for method Abu Dhabi. He was still working on the "long straight into sharp corner" philosophy, and the circuit owners requested a section along the waterfront like Monaco. The original plan was to build a Monaco replica, with a narrow circuit and difficult, blind corners, but the idea was abandoned.

A perfect example of this philosophy failing is Bahrain 2010. Remember when they added the new mid-track complex? It was ridiculous. I'm not sure exactly who was responsible, but that's an example of who throwing an out of character section in to a track for the sake of giving them a harder time with set up, or to not cater to certain team strengths, just doesn't work, even if it's done well. The same cars will still be faster and the only end result will be a feeling of arbitrarity.

Tilke disowned the circuit in 2010. He said that Formula 1 cars were never meant to race on the extended layout.

The Korean International Circuit, on the other hand, does work. We saw it in qualifying last year, where different cars were setting similar lap times, but wildly different sector times. McLaren was fastest in the first two sectors, Red Bull in the lst two, and Ferrari were fast in the first and the last.

 

[Wardez]

No, he didn't use that for method Abu Dhabi. He was still working on the "long straight into sharp corner" philosophy, and the circuit owners requested a section along the waterfront like Monaco. The original plan was to build a Monaco replica, with a narrow circuit and difficult, blind corners, but the idea was abandoned.

Well then he doesn't seem to committed to his ideals, if he understandably needs to keep folding to the wishes of the track backers then why not wait to hear what the people want then build around that concept rather than lay out your circuit then throw a wrench in it later? heh, if only you were Hermann yourself.

But anyway, what you're saying is worse than I imagined

The Korean International Circuit, on the other hand, does work. We saw it in qualifying last year, where different cars were setting similar lap times, but wildly different sector times. McLaren was fastest in the first two sectors, Red Bull in the lst two, and Ferrari were fast in the first and the last.

Yes I'll have to agree there, Korea wasn't exactly chocolate to vanilla but it did a fine job as an interesting developmental GP circuit.

I wish John Hugenholtz was still designing circuits, he's just a wizard with the few tracks he did put together. Suzuka, Hockenheim's stadium section, Zandvoort, Zolder - win.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Well then he doesn't seem to committed to his ideals, if he understandably needs to keep folding to the wishes of the track backers then why not wait to hear what the people want then build around that concept rather than lay out your circuit then throw a wrench in it later? heh, if only you were Hermann yourself.

I believe it was the FIA that intervened. Both Tilke and the organisers wanted the "half-street circuit, half-permanent circuit" concept, but the FIA said no.