Final two: MR2-Spyder or 25GT?

[GT Pro]

So my decision has come down to two cars. While the two are slightly different in terms of price, body-style and layout, both bring out within me one of the most important elements of car selection: emotion.

Keep in mind that these cars WILL inevitably rack up substantial mileage with my ~50km two-way commutes to uni 3-4 days a week.

Note also that I am in the fortunate position where I do not need much space at all. I don't have a family, and don't expect to any time soon nor do I carry around much more than my books and laptop.

Without further ado, here are the specs for the two nippy J-starters:

1998 25 GT sedan (what the particular model I've got my eye on looks like):

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Make[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Nissan[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Family[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Skyline[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Model
Variant[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]25GT[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Year[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]May 1998 to 1999[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
New Price[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]239.5 ten thousand Yen[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Body Type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Sedan[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Seating Capacity[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]5[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Engine Code[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]RB25DE[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Engine Type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Water cooled Inline 6 cylinder DOHC 24 valve[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Engine Size[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]2.5 litres (2498 cc)[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Bore × stroke[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]86mm × 71.7mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Compression ratio[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]10:1[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Fuel system[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Max power[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]147kW @ 6000rpm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Max torque[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]255Nm @ 4000rpm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Forced Induction[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]No[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Fuel Tank Capacity[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]65 litres[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Fuel type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Unleaded premium gasoline[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Fuel Consumption[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]9.4 l/100km
[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Transmission[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Dual matic M-ATx (full range electronic control 4 speed automatic)[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Drive Layout[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]FR[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Steering Type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Power assisted rack & pinion[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Front Suspension[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Independent suspension multiple link system[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear suspension[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Independent suspension multiple link system[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Front brakes[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Ventilated disk[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear brakes[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Ventilated disk[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Front tyres[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]205/60R15 91h[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear tyres[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]205/60R15 91h[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Turning circle[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]10.2 m[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Exterior Length[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]4705mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Exterior Width[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1720mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Exterior Height[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1375mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Interior Length[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1875mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Interior Width[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1440mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Interior Height[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1120mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Wheelbase[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]2665mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Front Track[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1480mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear Track[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1470mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Ground Clearance[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]140mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Weight[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1400kg
[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Standard features[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Rear window wiper, Driver airbag, Front passenger airbag, Anti-lock braking system, Front seat belt pre-tensioners, Front seat belt force limiters, Rear seat lap sash belt, Child seat attachment, Side impact protection bars, Power windows, Central door locking, Steering wheel height adjust, Leather steering wheel, Ultraviolet reducing glass[/FONT]


2000 MR2-Spyder (what the particular model I've got my eye on looks like):

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Make[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Toyota[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Family[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]MR-S[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Model Variant[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]MR-S S Edition[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Year[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]August 2000 to 2004[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
New Price[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]205.5 ten thousand Yen[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Body Type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Open[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Seating Capacity[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]2[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Engine Code[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1ZZ-FE[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Engine Type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Inline 4 cylinder DOHC[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Engine Size[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1.8 litres (1794 cc)[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Bore × stroke[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]79mm × 91.5mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Compression ratio[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]10:1[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Max power[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]103kW @ 6400rpm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Max torque[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]171Nm @ 4400rpm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Forced Induction[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]No[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Fuel Tank Capacity[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]48 litres[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Fuel type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Unleaded regular gasoline[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Fuel Consumption[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]7.0 l/100km
[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Transmission[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]5 speed sequential manual[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Drive Layout[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]MID[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Steering Type[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Power assisted rack & pinion[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Front Suspension[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Strut type coil spring[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear suspension[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Strut type coil spring[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Front brakes[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Ventilated disk[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear brakes[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Ventilated disk[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Front tyres[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]185/55r15 81v[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear tyres[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]205/50R15 85v[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Turning circle[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]10.0 m[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Exterior Length[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]3885mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Exterior Width[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1695mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Exterior Height[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1235mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Interior Length[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]895mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Interior Width[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1350mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Interior Height[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1055mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Wheelbase[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]2450mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Front Track[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1475mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Rear Track[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]1460mm[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Ground Clearance[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]135mm[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]
Weight[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]980kg[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Standard features[/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Driver airbag, Front passenger airbag, Anti-lock braking system, Front seat belt pre-tensioners, Front seat belt force limiters, Power windows, Central door locking, Steering wheel height adjust, Leather steering wheel, Alloy wheels[/FONT]

Note also:

• My major concerns are spare part pricing and reliability
• Both the cars in question are completely stock (sans the MR2-S has an aftermarket gearknob)
• The colours shown in the pictures are the actual colours
  
• I've been told the MR2-S is a bit feminine (but I'm not convinced).
• The resulting drive-away prices for each will likely end up to be AU $11k and $15.5k respectively...
  

 

[Time_Attack]

If you really don't need the space you'll have much more fun with the MR2. I don't see a non-turbo skyline sedan being much fun.

 

[Jondot]

Have you driven both? I'd just go off which I thought was more fun.

Which I suspect would be the MR2.

 

[Bram Turismo]

All Skyline models that are not GT-Rs look plain dull in my opinion, especially that sedan. Sorry to say it, but I think it looks hideous to say the least

Also, I don't understand why an MR-S would be a feminine car. A guy at university has a grey MR-S with some nice shoes on it, I think it looks badass and there certainly is nothing girly about it.

 

[homeforsummer]

You've said you don't need much space. Admittedly, the MR2 has less than not a lot of space (interior is fine, boot space not so much), but the Skyline seems like overkill. I reckon the MR2 would be more than up to the task of commuting (it's economical, light, torquey enough in a light body) and more fun the rest of the time.

I'd say MR2. Think of it as a mini-Boxster. They're that good.

 

[TsLeng]

MR2.

Definitely. Lighter, faster, convertible. Should be cheaper to run due to better fuel economy especially on your high mileages.

 

[JCE]

MR2. Why? Its tiny and nippy.

 

[Jim Prower]

I'd get the Skyline...but that's me living here, where they're incredibly exotic vehicles. The MR-S should do well for you.

 

[CDailey]

I would stay away from the Skyline just because it has a 4 speed automatic. I have one (4spd auto) and it's not the most fun thing.

 

[Murcie_LP640]

I'm going to be the only one here that says the Skyline, I can feel it.

 

[NISM0_SKYLINE]

I'd say the Skyline. I may look a little biased, but the Skyline just seems better. I really don't have any reasons to say the Skyline over the MR 2, other then it being part of the Skyline family and being rarer, although in Australia it probably isn't true. I'd almost take a normal Skyline over a GTR because it has a lot of potential. Plus you could make a 4 door GTR

 

[Northstar]

I would go for the MR2, it's funner to drive(probably) and would be way better on gas.

As far as the whole "girly" thing goes, you're the one driving it not them so it really only matters what you think of it.

 

[NissanSkylineN1]

The Skyline. Why would you ask? Its a given.

 

[niky]

Do you need space for extra passengers? If not, get the MR-S. Much more fun.

A four-door Skyline with the 2.5 wouldn't be so bad... but with the 4AT? No thanks.

 

[Paulie]

Skyline, Skyline, Skyline. Because I feel that generation of MR2 is too far into the timeline of the Camryfication of Toyota's line-up. It's softer and slower than its predecessors and IMO isn't much to look at.

 

[TheCracker]

MR-S. Unless you're a huge JDM fanboy, the Skyline is just a large family saloon.

 

[Time_Attack]

I disagree. The MR-S is the last decent car toyota made. They're the lightest of all MR2s and pretty fun cars. On the other hand there is nothing special about the skyline. Its an average run of the mill model with an automatic trans. If it were say a GTS-T or whatever then I'd probably be more interested.

 

[Paulie]

Hmm, I missed the auto transmission part, just get the Toyota then......

 

[Eric.]

I would stay away from the Skyline just because it has a 4 speed automatic. I have one (4spd auto) and it's not the most fun thing.

You have a Skyline in Alabama?

 

[Leonidae@MFT]

MR2 easily.

 

[Jim Prower]

You have a Skyline in Alabama?

a 4-speed auto, I think is what he meant.

 

[Eric.]

a 4-speed auto, I think is what he meant.

Probably...


If the MR2 isn't too impractical for you, I'm sure it would be a much more enjoyable car to own. Pretty quick, great handling, good gas mileage, top-down fun (do you guys do that in Aussieland or is the A/C on 365 days a year?).

 

[EA11R]

You're asking a group of car enthusiasts whether you should buy a sedan with a slushbox, or a mid-engined sportscar with a proper gearbox.

How do you even come to consider these two cars? I can imagine maybe 525i v Skyline, or Miata v MR-2. But this doesn't make sense at all to me.

However, one caveat: How can you not think the MR-2 is girly? It looks like a tiny, bulbous Boxter. It's a convertible, and has an unremarkable engine. It won't win many drag races. My stepmom loves it.

 

[CDailey]

You have a Skyline in Alabama?

Sorry, guess I didn't word that properly. I meant I had a car with a 4spd auto.

Though, there is an R34 GT-R about 20 minutes from here, and in the next town over there's quite a few new GTRs.

 

[Azuremen]

Having owned an MR-S for a year, and using it as my daily driver, I can tell you they are a blast to drive, despite being only quick-ish at best. However, don't expect to ever put more than a duffel bag and maybe two back packs in the car with a passenger... cargo room is extremely limited.

Also, the 2000-2002 models of the MR-S had a pre-cat issue that caused failures of the motor by leading to oil blow by, so make sure to gut the pre-cats immediately on purchase, or at least have it looked at. Other than that, the engine is the 1ZZ-FED found in the 138 HP Celica and Matrix models, and the transmission is fairly basic as well, but several options exist if you want an LSD or 6 speed later on. The 2000 models are also 15kg lighter than later models, and have some slight differences, such as no fog lights and different headlights and tail lights, along with 15 inch wheels all around versus 15/16.

The car is extremely fun to drive though, and for an MR car, relatively well mannered (certainly more so than the AW11 MR2s I've owned) when you lift off the gas mid corner. I still have managed to spin the MR-S out a few times, but that was at the track pushing it to a bit too much, etc.

 

[GT Pro]

do you guys do that in Aussieland or is the A/C on 365 days a year?.

A saying well-known to Australians, or at least Melbournians, is that 'if you don't like the weather, just wait a minute'. 15-20 degrees-celsius changes from morning to midday are not uncommon here.

How do you even come to consider these two cars? I can imagine maybe 525i v Skyline, or Miata v MR-2. But this doesn't make sense at all to me.

I took a different approach to filtering my car selection than the norm. I looked in two categories (4d mid-size sedan/coupe or smaller and 2-seater convertibles). The common filtering that applied to both, however, was an automatic transmission, little to no modifications done (which isn't easy to find with many imports down here), no damage, airbags, light fuel consumption, relatively-cheap maintenance (not a euro) and 10-18k price tag. After dropping cars one-by-one from each category, I was left with the two you see here which stood ahead of the rest in their respective categories

However, one caveat: How can you not think the MR-2 is girly? It looks like a tiny, bulbous Boxter. It's a convertible, and has an unremarkable engine. It won't win many drag races. My stepmom loves it.

Did you know that in Melbourne the majority of Supra drivers, it seems, are in fact females? They don't appear to be a female's preferred car so much from the outside, but the driver would fool you. The inverse seems to apply to MR2-S here.

Having owned an MR-S for a year, and using it as my daily driver, I can tell you they are a blast to drive, despite being only quick-ish at best. However, don't expect to ever put more than a duffel bag and maybe two back packs in the car with a passenger... cargo room is extremely limited.

Also, the 2000-2002 models of the MR-S had a pre-cat issue that caused failures of the motor by leading to oil blow by, so make sure to gut the pre-cats immediately on purchase, or at least have it looked at. Other than that, the engine is the 1ZZ-FED found in the 138 HP Celica and Matrix models, and the transmission is fairly basic as well, but several options exist if you want an LSD or 6 speed later on. The 2000 models are also 15kg lighter than later models, and have some slight differences, such as no fog lights and different headlights and tail lights, along with 15 inch wheels all around versus 15/16.

The car is extremely fun to drive though, and for an MR car, relatively well mannered (certainly more so than the AW11 MR2s I've owned) when you lift off the gas mid corner. I still have managed to spin the MR-S out a few times, but that was at the track pushing it to a bit too much, etc.

Thanks for the detailed info, I will keep pre-cat issue in mind.

Update: I happened to talk in detail with a fellow uni student today whose father owns several car dealerships around the city, and who goes to and purchases from auctions on a very regular basis. Apparently, they see roughly up to four MR2-S' per week, with prices tending to below 13k regularly. A lucky acquantance indeed.

 

[Time_Attack]

So you're getting an automatic either way. Just go with the skyline then. No point in having a sports car if it does the driving for you.

 

[Azuremen]

So you're getting an automatic either way. Just go with the skyline then. No point in having a sports car if it does the driving for you.

Umm... what the hell are you talking about? The SMT wasn't introduced till 2002 in the MR-S, and even then it is rare. But it is still a true SMT, not some slushbox you can shift.

Take note all, the SMT takes about forever to upshift, but apparently has the most perfect rev-matching down shifts.

 

[astrosdude91]

If that was any other Skyline model, I'd say get the Skyline. But if you don't need the extra room, get the MR-2. Good thing the one you have picked out is stock. I know at least here in the states, it's near impossible to find a stock MR-2. They've all been been modded and ruined by the ricers.

 

[Azuremen]

If that was any other Skyline model, I'd say get the Skyline. But if you don't need the extra room, get the MR-2. Good thing the one you have picked out is stock. I know at least here in the states, it's near impossible to find a stock MR-2. They've all been been modded and ruined by the ricers.

I rarely find the MR-S models to be modded at all. Maybe some wheels that are in poor taste, but that is about it. It is the SW20/21 models that have been hit hard by the rice stick.