Ford Mustang News (23/6/2006)

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YSSMAN

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More news arrived about the Mustang's future today...

leftlanenews.com
Ford will offer "new product content" each year with the Mustang, company executives said earlier this week during the 2007 model year rollout. Executive Derrick Kuzak told Edmunds Carroll Shelby will work every year on the Mustang. When asked if a 600+ hp model will be offered, he said, "never say never to anything." In an interview with Mr. Shelby himself, Edmunds managed to get further details. Shelby said GM "better not dream" of having more horsepower than the Mustang with the new Camaro. Recent rumors have suggested GM could drop the Corvette Z06 engine into the Camaro. Shelby said it would be "very easy" to push the 'Stang to over 600 horsepower and still offer the company's 50,000-mile warranty. He also confirmed an all-new Mustang is due in 2009.

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If I may comment for a moment, I think Ford is getting a little bit ahead of themselves with the whole "face off with Chevrolet" odeal with the new Camaro. We are still more than a year before any kind of pre-production Camaro will be driving around, and given Chrevrolet's tendancies to tie the Camaro to the Corvette, it will undoubtedly be a better performer given it's IRS suspension, more powerful V8, and extra cog in the transmission.

Granted, a 600 BHP Mustang sounds great! Anyone up for the return of the GT500KR? Maybe build a production version of the GT500E?

...And I think it is funny that Shelby had to tell everyone that a "new" Mustang is on the way for 2009. I presume by "new" he means "signifigantly updated," as I doubt Ford has the money to develop a brand-new RWD chassis for the next-gen Mustang.
 
That's interesting for sure. I am sure 600hp is crazy but if they are going to go gunning for the Vette or even the new Camaro I think they need to work on chasis refinement and things of that nature. They also need a better gearbox, the one they have is not up to par IMO.
 
Why doesn't the new GT500 have independent rear suspension? If it's supposed to be the Ubermustang in terms of power and handling, why give it a cheap rigid axle rear suspenion?
 
YSS the thought of a new Mustang gives me a special feeling "somewhere". And mmmmm a 600bhp Mustang is JUST what the doctor ordered. :sly:
 
3-Wheel Drive
Why doesn't the new GT500 have independent rear suspension? If it's supposed to be the Ubermustang in terms of power and handling, why give it a cheap rigid axle rear suspenion?

"Because the people demanded it."

No, really, that's what Ford said. They claimed that the public wouldn't accept a Mustang with a modern rear suspension. Granted, there's a lot of fun from being able to eat up 5,000 miles worth of tire treat in just 30 feet, but I think evidence of the true nature of Ford's reasoning lies in the Mustang's interior. Pure plasticky goodness; "My First Muscle Car" from Fisher Price. Rarely has an American legend made Kia look so good.

Don't get me wrong, I like this Mustang. In fact, I like most Mustangs (although I like to pretend the Mustang was on hiatus from 1974 to 1995), but the 2000 Cobra R is my favorite, which had a fantastic INDEPENDENT REAR SUSPENSION. But that strayed from the tired old stereotype that Mustangs are only good in a straight line, which near-sighted Ford thought wasn't good for the bottom line. God forbid you should try and evolve your products. We all know that just kills sales, right Toyota?
 
Ford's offical reason, or atleast what they had said to their performance magazines was that the Mustang was getting a LRA because it was better for drag racing, and thats what most Mustang fans wish to do with it.

...And it's not like Ford didn't bake corners into the LRA setup to begin with...

But, I look at it this way. We could have waited an extra year for an IRS and had an extra $1500-2000 straped to the bottom line just to pull a few extra lateral g's around a track... Quite frankly, it is fine the way it is...
 
leftlanenews.com
Shelby said it would be "very easy" to push the 'Stang to over 600 horsepower and still offer the company's 50,000-mile warranty.
:scared: Are they putting in a Toyota motor?

leftlanenews.com
He also confirmed an all-new Mustang is due in 2009.
I'll believe it when I see it.
 
You ever seen what happens to a Terminator Cobra's IRS when you pump about 500 Hp through it, rev it up, and drop the clutch?

BOOM!

Ford did the right thing, as the GT-500 has cruiser/drag champ written on it. Put the IRS in a cheaper, lighter, track oriented model...GT-350 anyone?
 
Onikaze
You ever seen what happens to a Terminator Cobra's IRS when you pump about 500 Hp through it, rev it up, and drop the clutch?

BOOM!

Ford did the right thing, as the GT-500 has cruiser/drag champ written on it. Put the IRS in a cheaper, lighter, track oriented model...GT-350 anyone?

A guy on one of my other forums is putting 600 to the wheels in his terminator, and it's holding up fine.
 
YSSMAN
More news arrived about the Mustang's future today...





If I may comment for a moment, I think Ford is getting a little bit ahead of themselves with the whole "face off with Chevrolet" odeal with the new Camaro. We are still more than a year before any kind of pre-production Camaro will be driving around, and given Chrevrolet's tendancies to tie the Camaro to the Corvette, it will undoubtedly be a better performer given it's IRS suspension

Other than engines they hardly ever share anything. And according to some GM magazines I read, lots of camaro fans are clamoring for LRA too.

more powerful V8,
GT500 already makes a Z06 equalling 500 hp, how is the camaro's gonna be more powerful?


and extra cog in the transmission.
Gt500 comes with a 6 speed, so unless GM's goin with 7...



...And I think it is funny that Shelby had to tell everyone that a "new" Mustang is on the way for 2009. I presume by "new" he means "signifigantly updated," as I doubt Ford has the money to develop a brand-new RWD chassis for the next-gen Mustang.
The Mustang is one of Ford America's best sellers, so if there is any car they're willing to spend money on, it's this one. Besides, they're in slightly better shape than GM.
 
super cirrus
GT500 already makes a Z06 equalling 500 hp, how is the camaro's gonna be more powerful?
Gt500 comes with a 6 speed, so unless GM's goin with 7...
I believe he was referring to the GT.
super cirrus
The Mustang is one of Ford America's best sellers, so if there is any car they're willing to spend money on, it's this one. Besides, they're in slightly better shape than GM.
I'm not so sure. GM and Ford are both pretty bad off, but Ford still seems to stick to the same idea that put them there in the first place. The 500 and Lincon Zephyr show this, and the Freestyle and Fusion show the fight against it. All of GM's actual new products seem to be going in a different direction than what got them there (such as the attempt to make Saturn not suck).
 
super cirrus
A guy on one of my other forums is putting 600 to the wheels in his terminator, and it's holding up fine.

How often does he do high RPM launches on slicks?

I know that some IRS Cobra's hold up miraculously, but that doesn't change the fact that they grenade regularly at dragstrips.
 
@ Super Circus:

...Most of the references when I speak about the Mustang there to the GT model, not the GT500. The ongoing horsepower war would theoretically be between a 325-350 BHP Z/28, a 400 BHP SS, and the possibility of a 505 BHP ZL1. Thus, Ford would have to boost the output of the GT on every level. However, the faceoff between the GT500 and ZL1 would be very different. Given the Camaro's probable IRS setup (given it's Aussie Monaro roots), the Camaro will not only handle better, but will probably be a good deal faster as well, assuming of course they can keep the weight down on the Camaro.

In reference to the transmission issue, they should all have six-speed units, automatic or manual. GM will most likely be using the 6L80E automatic in the Camaro (possibly the 5L40E in the V6?) as well as the standard-issue Tremec T56 as well. So why can't Ford do it? Oh wait, because they can't build good enough transmissions for the job... Sure, they co-developed the 6T70E with GM for their FWD cars, but they can only handle 300 BHP at Ford (315 at GM), and being that they were designed for transverse use, won't go in the Mustang either...

As for Ford versus GM in terms of money and where they stand in the market, GM is FAR better off than Ford in most circles. Not only are they re-aligning their entire US-lineup, but they are also becoming more of a global company, and hope by the end of the decade to begin selling truely global models all across the world. That means our Aura will be the same as the Vectra, our Monte Carlos and Monaros will be similar, etc. This reduces production costs, allowing one design to be used throughout the world, and thus all of the models can be built in one place (see Kappa models).

If you need further proof, here's the scoop:
Leftlanenews.com 23/6/06
Many analysts now feel Ford is now more likely than General Motors to default on its debts. The companies' shares have also moved in opposite directions in recent months. "The switch centres on concerns about the viability of Ford's Way Forward plan, which aims to return its North American operations to profit by 2008," explains Richard Beales of the Financial Times. "Analysts and others have doubts about Ford's ability to staunch recent losses in market share and have questioned the quality of management at the family-controlled carmaker."

...and from the week before...

Leftlanenews.com
General Motors may be struggling, but as far as industry insiders are concerned, Ford is worse off. "The reasons are as obvious as the new models on the showroom floor, which are for the most part dull and uninteresting," says Don Hammonds of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette. "I've thought Ford was in worse shape than GM for the last six months or so," said Jack Nerad of Kelley Blue Book. "A lot of us were looking at what we already have from Ford and what we know is coming from Ford, and we are less positive about what's coming up for them vs. what GM has been announcing." Ford sorely needs a car like the Chevy Corvette, Pontiac Solstice or Saturn Sky, says Hammonds. Ford has the Mustang, but interest may be waning, he says.

...more bad news from the financial world...

Leftlanenews.com
Shares of Ford closed at $6.66 after an investment firm cut the company's rating Thursday. The ominous stock price marks a 52-week low for the struggling automaker, according to the Detroit News. The combined value of Ford's shares has fallen to $12.7 billion, about one-fifth of its value in mid-2001.

...And from last month...

Leftlanenews.com
Ford seems to lack the direction and focus necessary to create a strong product line and revive sales, according to three analysts. "Of all the automakers, I am most negative on Ford," said Erich Merkle, director of forecasting, with the consulting firm IRN. "There is no continuity to their product development." And Merkle is not alone in his feelings. "There's been a real lack of direction on Ford's part," said industry research expert Karl Brauer. "Ford does not appear to have a focused product plan." Brauer says he's seen a lot of "thrashing about" in Ford's product line that doesn't seem to accomplish much — such as the renaming of all Lincoln vehicles and the sudden elimination of two high-performance vehicles. Joseph Barker, senior manager of global sales forecasting for CSM Worldwide, said Ford badly needs "edgier cars and trucks that exude passion." "Ford must address its conservative design theme (and) their inadequate powertrain lineup," Barker said.

...Mind you, Leftlanenews.com is not biased twards any company from any particular part of the world. Ford is in rough shape just like any other American automaker is right now, but generally speaking, I'd put Ford in worse shape compared to GM and DCX at the moment...
 
If anything, this is stuff that GM should have done years ago. Finially they realised that they can't run the company like it's 1956, and someone finially got real with the UAW and realised how GM, Ford, and DCX have been screwed over by the unions...
 
YSSMAN
Ford's offical reason, or atleast what they had said to their performance magazines was that the Mustang was getting a LRA because it was better for drag racing, and thats what most Mustang fans wish to do with it.

...And it's not like Ford didn't bake corners into the LRA setup to begin with...

But, I look at it this way. We could have waited an extra year for an IRS and had an extra $1500-2000 straped to the bottom line just to pull a few extra lateral g's around a track... Quite frankly, it is fine the way it is...

I guess I'll be in the implosive minority thinking that Ford has a chance to be considered slightly - just slightly - more upmarket by including a real IRS in a top-level Mustang. Leaving in the LRA only promotes the redneck stereotype for musclecars. In fact, going IRS would help them in the European market. Why? Chrysler's starting to make progess there, as is Cadillac/GM. But I guess that would be why Ford is in such dire straits.

It's a shame, because the LRA is what's keeping me from buying the GT500. I've always wanted a Mustang, and the GT500 would have kept me from searching out a 2000 Cobra R, but no longer. The search goes one for someone looking to part with one....
 
harrytuttle
I guess I'll be in the implosive minority thinking that Ford has a chance to be considered slightly - just slightly - more upmarket by including a real IRS in a top-level Mustang. Leaving in the LRA only promotes the redneck stereotype for musclecars. In fact, going IRS would help them in the European market. Why? Chrysler's starting to make progess there, as is Cadillac/GM. But I guess that would be why Ford is in such dire straits.

It's a shame, because the LRA is what's keeping me from buying the GT500. I've always wanted a Mustang, and the GT500 would have kept me from searching out a 2000 Cobra R, but no longer. The search goes one for someone looking to part with one....

I think Ford is on the right direction as long as they stay the course by re-engineering Mazdas and Volvos. Their SUV lineup needs to be streamlined in my opinion...they are almost as bad as GM with the sheer amount of pointless SUVs.
 
I'd say IRS on the higher models, with the option to go to a drag axle. Seriously... all the dragsters are going to be buying the cheap one and pumping it up anyway, right?

As to Ford's condition and product offerings... they're doing all right by Mazda and Volvo, but the way they handle Ford itself is puzzling... nothing but platform-sharing with Mazda and Volvo?

I desperately want to like the new Focus, I surely do. It's a great car. But just the thought of it being a middle child between the Mazda3 (which is more like the old Focus was) and the Volvo S40 leaves me scratching my head. It's sort of like a Mercury, in a European kind of way. Just halfway between a Mazda and a Volvo, like a Mercury is halfway between a Ford and a Lincoln.

It doesn't help, either, that Ford's regular Focus shares engines with Mazda, while their top-line ST shares one with with the S40.

Everything new is shared with either Mazda or Volvo, and they're encroaching on the market of those two (or is it the other way around) at both the top and the bottom of the scale.

The most ridiculous thing is the Mazda6/Fusion/Milan/Zephyr. Sure, they're all decent cars... but who wants to pay more money for a watered down Mazda, when the "base" Mazda is more exciting and more pleasing to the eye?
 
Well, if we had the new Focus in the US, I'm sure that everything would work out fine. Granted of coure, the price might have to raise up a few grand, but when you are getting a car that generally is better than any other small car in America (VW MKV, other Ford D1 products not included).

It is kinda funny how Ford is the red-headed step-child in Europe, but I really do not see the same situation here in the US. May it is because, as you said, because we have Mercury for that spot.
 
niky
I'd say IRS on the higher models, with the option to go to a drag axle. Seriously... all the dragsters are going to be buying the cheap one and pumping it up anyway, right?

This makes perfect sense to me. Why mess with a more expensive, more complicated supercharged V8 with more expensive replacement & upgrade parts, when you can get a low-optioned GT and put your supercharger on. For less. Or put in a 427, which you'd probably do on a GT500 anyway if you're serious about drag racing.

And what's wrong with beefing up an IRS? The Ford 9-inch rear end has such widespread use in drag racing, Honda Civic drag cars use them, so obvioulsy the possibility is there for it. And if Chevrolet can tie an IRS to the LS7 in the Camaro (pure speculation), then won't Ford look like the poor child again?
 
A production version of the GT500E would be something to see but isn't going to happen.

Unique Performance makes too much money as it is restoring Fastbacks to give up their near 725Horsepower "Shelbys" to Ford.
 
Don't be surprised to see a GT500E conversion kit come out for the new GT500. Its only a matter of time...
 
I'm won't be surprised because it's already done by on the Mustang now. I don't expect it to look any nicer than a GT500E anyways.
 
By the time SEMA rolls around, someone probably will have it done.

BTW: Is that Kristin Holt (from G4) as your Avatar?
 
YSSMAN
By the time SEMA rolls around, someone probably will have it done.

BTW: Is that Kristin Holt (from G4) as your Avatar?
I know. But hopefully, someone does a better job than what I've already seen. They look nothing like the original except being painted in the famous silver w/black stripes color. (Looks oh so much more sexier in black w/ white stripes.)

Yes, it is Holt.
 
I've seen the Foose-Design Mustangs driving around out here, and although they look great, they just do not have the performance to match the car that it is supposed to be like.

I wonder how hard it would be to get the Foose Design kit thrown on a GT500? But of course, it would be pretty stupid to do so, given that the GT500 allready looks quite nice to begin with.
 
True, they aren't up to par, the most being a 425Hp upgrade.

But I only went to Unique for the Shelbys and '69 Foose Camaros. ;)

Foose will just need to leave the GT500 alone. He's already working with GT500E's factory.
 
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