From 6axis to DFGT: My experience

[Tristar Racing]

Ok, I thought I would write this up for those who might be competing in GT Academy with a controller and thinking about moving up to a wheel to be more competitive. A quick background on myself, I'm an engineer who has worked in racing, have autocrossed and tracked my personal cars some, and have been playing race sims since the original Indy 500.

Even though I have always been into race sims, I have never used a wheel. After cramping up my hands every right without much improvement (around 40th overall in the Midwest) at any of the 3 tracks, I starting looking at a wheel purchase. I saw the DFGT was on sale at Best Buy for $99, so I went in search. Long story short, not a single Best Buy in the Midwest has one, but I did learn Sony Style stores price match.



The setup I came up with is admittedly second rate, but it was what I had around. I used a lucite nesting table to bolt the wheel to, and the pedals are buried in the carpet. I used a couch cushion to sit on, and the couch itself for back support. So basically I am on the floor, with little room for foot or leg movement. (I need to improve the setup; besides the limited range of movement the wheel is not very stable)

So I embarked on my first Gran Turismo experience with a wheel. I tried out a high grip car at the high speed ring, and was quite pleased with my pace. So I moved to the Academy, and started out with Rome. Ouch! I was nowhere near my pace with the controller. The most amazing thing was my strong points on Rome had now become my weakest. The chicane and the last three turns were killing me. After about 4 hours, I was about .17 seconds of my best controller time of 1:22.666.



Today I tried it again for about an hour, and am nowhere near that 1:22.8xx I ran last night. It’s a bit frustrating, but to be honest even being slower the wheel makes GT more enjoyable. The hardest part for me is trying to catch a car that is out of shape, I cannot do it. I am not sure if this will come with experience, but it seems almost impossible at this point to drive a car slightly sideways.

I will update this thread with more info as I continue with the wheel, I just wanted to offer up my experiences with moving from a 6axis to the DFGT. As far as the DFGT; no complaints so far. I read some have issues with the pedals; they don’t bother me in the least. Because of the limited movement in my setup though, I have taken to left foot braking. Not sure if this is helping or hurting me.

 

[blindsidefive0]

When I was a freshman I came back to MA after leaving my original DF wheel at CU-Boulder. I had to pick up a controller to play GT4. I really struggled with the FGT at la Sarthe because the sweeping turns were hard to modulate with the sticks. However, consistently nailing a braking zone or tight turn (like at Rome reverse) can actually be easier with the pad.

Overall the wheel is a bit faster, but it might take you a while to get used to it and become consistent with a wider range of motions.

 

[aargod228]

I began playing gt in 1998, and used the ps controller until summer of '08 when I got my first wheel (dfgt). It took me about a week (2-3 hours a day on gt5p) to become faster with the wheel. But, when I finally got the hang of it, I shot up in rankings from approximately 2000th place worldwide on most tracks, most cars..to around the top 300th or so, occasionally breaking into the top 100. It really adds so much more depth into the gameplay, I don't think I'll ever competitively play with a sixaxis again.

I have noticed in the seasonal events though, that a majority of the top drifters are using sixaxis. I feel your pain in catching those wild sideways events. Moderate and less drifts took a little while to figure out, but I still cant go big and succeed.

 

[skazz]

The DFGT motors are not the greatest, they definitely do get in the way if you need to throw the wheel through a big spin really fast. In that respect a G25 or particularly a Fanatec in drift mode freewheels so much easier.

One tip: Make sure you've enabled power steering in options. This seems to free up the wheel motors in some way so if you start turning the wheel hard it becomes easier to turn, allowing you to throw the wheel round faster, and therefore get the tyres pointed where you need to catch the back end.

Saying all that, though, there's no substitute to simply feeling the car and collecting the oversteer before it gets serious. You could say that pad guys are used to being able to correct heavy oversteer after the fact, but us wheel simmers need to "listen" to the car better since we have a much smaller window to take corrective action before it becomes physically impossible to turn the wheel fast enough. So just go and practice drifting for a while, get used to the audio, FFB and visual cues. It'll help.

 

[Cavalryblood]

I feel your pain in gt5 with the new physics system I just started to be able to move from a strictly grip racer to a hybrid grip/I can slide into that corner racer. When I went to the DFGT that all came crashing back to the grip side. Which is fine not every pro driver drives like tanner foust. I have only had the wheel for a week and for a comparison my Raybrig NSX was the first car I used when I got the wheel and it wasn't a very fun experience. Today I completed the Super GT comp and I had a blast I made the car look sexy going around 246. The speed will come the control when going sideways the jury is still out.

 

[Abscissa081]

When I was a freshman I came back to MA after leaving my original DF wheel at CU-Boulder. I had to pick up a controller to play GT4. I really struggled with the FGT at la Sarthe because the sweeping turns were hard to modulate with the sticks. However, consistently nailing a braking zone or tight turn (like at Rome reverse) can actually be easier with the pad.

Overall the wheel is a bit faster, but it might take you a while to get used to it and become consistent with a wider range of motions.

I can't wait to get my wheel i hope i get faster, but more importantly I hope I have more fun. but CU-Boulder - i was watching the 420 vids 👍

 

[chuyler1]

One tip: Make sure you've enabled power steering in options. This seems to free up the wheel motors in some way so if you start turning the wheel hard it becomes easier to turn, allowing you to throw the wheel round faster, and therefore get the tyres pointed where you need to catch the back end.

This is the first I heard that turning on the PS will help. I had been leaving it off with the assumption that I would feel the grip a little better. My times could use improvement so maybe I'll experiment with it on.

 

[Tristar Racing]

I just wanted to give an update...

I had been focusing on Rome to learn the ins and outs of using a wheel. I spent about two nights with the wheel, then a few hours on a different day. I knocked off about one 1/10 of a second on my time; an improvement but not much. I had not touched GT for a while until today, and after 45 minutes at the ring I knocked off 4/10 of a second.

I considered my two times at Rome and the Ring maxed out with a controller, so I will say yes once you get used to a wheel you can be faster. The thing is though a wheel changes everything. You almost have to relearn each track; as tough sections with a controller become easy but easy sections are now difficult with a wheel.

I am up to 78th in the midwest, and I think with more time at the ring I could knock another couple tenths off pretty easily. Overall, GT5 is much more enjoyable with the wheel. My tips to new wheel users is spend time relearning the tracks, have some patience, and increase the force feedback to 9 or so.

 

[dalejrfanfreak]

I just wanted to give an update...

I had been focusing on Rome to learn the ins and outs of using a wheel. I spent about two nights with the wheel, then a few hours on a different day. I knocked off about one 1/10 of a second on my time; an improvement but not much. I had not touched GT for a while until today, and after 45 minutes at the ring I knocked off 4/10 of a second.

I considered my two times at Rome and the Ring maxed out with a controller, so I will say yes once you get used to a wheel you can be faster. The thing is though a wheel changes everything. You almost have to relearn each track; as tough sections with a controller become easy but easy sections are now difficult with a wheel.

I am up to 78th in the midwest, and I think with more time at the ring I could knock another couple tenths off pretty easily. Overall, GT5 is much more enjoyable with the wheel. My tips to new wheel users is spend time relearning the tracks, have some patience, and increase the force feedback to 9 or so.

I got a wheel before GT5 came out and struggled to learn to use it until F1 2010 was released. The best thing to do for new wheel users is the license challenges/special events. Those events taught me more on how to use the wheel than anything else. I'm 67th in the Southeast btw.

 

[Tristar Racing]

Quick update:

After a few anger-filled nights, I finally made some improvements at the ring. I ended up 123rd in the midwest, not bad considering I took Saturday and Sunday off. I still have a lot to improve on, but in my opinion putting the 6axis down and using the wheel got me into round 2.

For anyone thinking about a switch, when you buy the wheel just put the controller away. Otherwise, going back and forth between the two is just going to lengthen the adjustment period.

 

[TRC Surly]

I've had my DFGT for a couple weeks now. This last weekend after talking to a team mate I turned the FFB up to 10 and added the bungee mod for both gas and brake. I also raised the back of the pedals up about 2" which made a big difference in my foot position. The overall effect has been really good. A lot more control and feel. Got a lot of golds I couldn't get before.

 

[dalejrfanfreak]

Ok, I thought I would write this up for those who might be competing in GT Academy with a controller and thinking about moving up to a wheel to be more competitive. A quick background on myself, I'm an engineer who has worked in racing, have autocrossed and tracked my personal cars some, and have been playing race sims since the original Indy 500.

Even though I have always been into race sims, I have never used a wheel. After cramping up my hands every right without much improvement (around 40th overall in the Midwest) at any of the 3 tracks, I starting looking at a wheel purchase. I saw the DFGT was on sale at Best Buy for $99, so I went in search. Long story short, not a single Best Buy in the Midwest has one, but I did learn Sony Style stores price match.



The setup I came up with is admittedly second rate, but it was what I had around. I used a lucite nesting table to bolt the wheel to, and the pedals are buried in the carpet. I used a couch cushion to sit on, and the couch itself for back support. So basically I am on the floor, with little room for foot or leg movement. (I need to improve the setup; besides the limited range of movement the wheel is not very stable)

So I embarked on my first Gran Turismo experience with a wheel. I tried out a high grip car at the high speed ring, and was quite pleased with my pace. So I moved to the Academy, and started out with Rome. Ouch! I was nowhere near my pace with the controller. The most amazing thing was my strong points on Rome had now become my weakest. The chicane and the last three turns were killing me. After about 4 hours, I was about .17 seconds of my best controller time of 1:22.666.



Today I tried it again for about an hour, and am nowhere near that 1:22.8xx I ran last night. It’s a bit frustrating, but to be honest even being slower the wheel makes GT more enjoyable. The hardest part for me is trying to catch a car that is out of shape, I cannot do it. I am not sure if this will come with experience, but it seems almost impossible at this point to drive a car slightly sideways.

I will update this thread with more info as I continue with the wheel, I just wanted to offer up my experiences with moving from a 6axis to the DFGT. As far as the DFGT; no complaints so far. I read some have issues with the pedals; they don’t bother me in the least. Because of the limited movement in my setup though, I have taken to left foot braking. Not sure if this is helping or hurting me.

If your rig is giving you trouble you can check out my tutorial on how I built mine...

http://kwysong.blogspot.com/

Many people think it's too wobbly but it really works great for me. Good enough to get 67th in the Southeast

 

[Tmortn]

Made the swap to a wheel in week two, and to DFGT in week 3. Scared myself because my lap times didn't start matching or dropping under my six axis times until this past week. I am still nowhere near as consistent with the wheel as I was with the stick.... but I have years worth of GT stick time and only three weeks with the wheel now. I think if I had stuck with the sticks I may have been faster this round... but I now know for certain that would have cost me ANY hope of making it further than the round with mandatory wheel usage. For those guys that made it through with six axis I highly recommend they go ahead and bite the bullet because they are not going to make this swap on the fly.

The single most annoying thing was my almost complete inability to recover the car for the first two weeks for anything more than the most minor goofs. My brain knew what to do but it was telling my thumbs and fingers how to react instead of my arms and feet. This made me uber conservative and very conscious about not mixing turning and braking. That was very frustrating considering the massive amount of trail braking going on in the top lap times.

Anyway, in the last week my feet started 'getting it' and my reactions to the car going past the limit became more automatic and suddenly I was doing far more laps without ending up in the wall. Obviously helped with confidence and started getting some lap improvements. I still can't rotate the car at will like I could with the sticks but I imagine when that finally gels I will be able to do so with much more control.

So now I find myself in round two still in the middle of learning the wheel and wishing I had made the jump back in GT 4 or at least Prologue. I seriously doubt I make the cut in round 2. A top 100 national finish in round 2 is my current goal. But honestly... I will be happy with any improvement on my current 360ish or so national ranking.

 

[Tristar Racing]

The single most annoying thing was my almost complete inability to recover the car for the first two weeks for anything more than the most minor goofs. My brain knew what to do but it was telling my thumbs and fingers how to react instead of my arms and feet. This made me uber conservative and very conscious about not mixing turning and braking. That was very frustrating considering the massive amount of trail braking going on in the top lap times.

What helped me was turing the force feedback up to 10, it seems a lot easier to control a car thats out of shape now. Not saying it will work for everyone, but it did for me...

 

[chuyler1]

Setting it to 10 can be one helluva work out on your arms if you run a 30 lap Daytona race. My arms felt like jelly after I was playing with some guys online a few weeks ago. I've had it at 10 for a while now but for GT Academy I dropped it back to 6 to see if I could get some faster times. It didn't help much.