Fun Cup 25 Hours of Spa

[Peelster1]

The Race​

The concept is simple, a one-make 25 hour race at Circuit de Spa-Francorchamps in a Volkswagen Beetle based of the the 25 Hours of Spa race that is a part of the Fun Cup. We would be using the weather change version. The race would have to be done in the Free Run configuration in a private lounge so random people don't just join the room and get on track. I plan on holding this race on a weekend in July. The actual race this year is on the 13th, so I'm thinking a week before or after the actual race, (in case people want to watch the actual race.) or we could hold it during the actual race.

Unfortunately, the Circuit de Spa-Francorchamps does not have dynamic time so the race would be stuck at an in-game time of 3:40pm Belgian Time (GMT +2). As a result, I have decided that the best time to begin the race would be at 1:40pm GMT. This way, we will pass that time twice during the race and for 2 moments during the race the in-game time will be accurate.

Teams can be made up of at least two people that will be using the same console. It is expected that you and your co-driver(s) know how to drive cleanly and fairly and will do so. (For example, if you have a friend that hasn't played GT5 before but is willing to be your co-driver for something like this, then it is your responsibility to teach them about driving on GT5.

Teams can also be made up of multiple PSN accounts. It will need to be made clear who is on what team in both cases.

The Car​

The actual Fun Cup car is a replica of an older Volkswagen Beetle running with 130 bhp at 1800 cc with a weight of 760 kg. (There is also a separate diesel engine, the 1900 cc TDI with 170 bhp.) Here is a picture of a Fun Cup car.

Some lap time data I was able to gather was that the fastest lap during the 2011 Spa race was set by James Pickford, with a 3:00:41 lap – over half a second faster than 2nd place. So the average lap time I'm looking for the GT5 cars managed by good drivers to get are 3:01:xx-3:02:xx.

Fun Cup cars use standard road tires and have no engine, chassis, suspension or brake upgrades, and do not have anti-roll bars. Unlike the original Beetle, the Fun Cup car’s engine rides ahead of the rear axle. It’s a 2.0-liter, SOHC eight-valve VW four that uses a five-speed manual transmission. The Fun Cup car uses a spec tire. In Europe, it’s supplied by Uniroyal. For the U.S. series, BFGoodrich supplies its g-force Sport, a high-performance street tire. These tires generate 1.2 G of grip, according to the Fun Cup meter.

The Gran Turismo 5 Equivalent ​

Firstly, I would like to talk about the tire model. I feel like Sport tires would be the best to use as Racing tires provide far too superior grip (especially Racing Softs ) and Comfort tires may not provide enough grip.

I've attempted to do g-force testing, however the only way I know how to get a specific number is in the Speed Test on Special Stage Route X and that track just isn't suited to testing g-forces other then in the acceleration sort of way. Looking at the Data Logger I only have a line that doesn't appear to match up with any number either. There is also the bar at the bottom of the Race Screen. I was clearly past the 1 on a side of it and the Max. G-Force display in the Acceleration Capabilities portion of Speed Test at Special Stage Route X only said 0.43. If I could figure out if Sport tires were able to grip above 1.2 G than I would be able to figure out if we should use Comfort tires instead. For each of these cars I will be judging by the bottom of the screen.

I would be looking for a Beetle in-game that can get as close as possible to the actual specs. I have tested every single Beetle that is in the game (not including DLC) and the following are my conclusions on how to best make them measure up to the actual Fun Cup car. As I mentioned earlier, the Fun Cup car does not have any engine, chassis, suspension, or brake upgrades.

New Beetle 2.0 '00
This car has a displacement of 1984 cc. With no upgrades and a fresh Engine Overhaul, this car has 117 HP. There are many different ways to get it from there up to 130 HP. Seeing how engine upgrades are not allowed, I will not be visiting the Engine or Turbo Kits areas of the tuning menu, which leaves Intake System and Exhaust. I'm going to classify these upgrades to get the car to 130 HP as part packages. NOTE: Due the the likeliness that I will increase the HP this part packages will very likely be changed.

Part Package 1 uses the Intake System section heavily and includes a Sports Intake Manifold, a Racing Air Filter, and from the Exhaust section a Catalytic Converter: Sports.

Part Package 2 is the exact same thing as Part Package 2 except it removes the Catalytic Converter and instead has a Sports Exhaust instead of the Standard Exhaust.

Part Package 3 uses the Intake System less with only a Sports Air Filter and from the Exhaust section it includes a Catalytic Converter: Sports and a Sports Exhaust.

Part Package 4 gets more away from the Intake System section and uses Exhaust upgrades even more. This package includes a Racing Air Filter and a Titanium Semi-Racing Exhaust.

Part Package 5 is the exact same thing as Part Package 4 except it removes the Racing Air Filter and adds a Catalytic Converter: Sports.

With all 3 weight reductions and a Window Weight Reduction (which the Fun Cup cars do use standard windows, however that's the only part on the car that's actually from a Beetle.) the car weighs 1046 kg.

When driving, because it's a FF car that front tires are the only ones that really warm up the rear tires take a while to warm up. I consider myself an average driver I was able to get a 3:22.109 on Comfort:Mediums. Which seem like the appropriate tire because it starts to lose grip around 1.2-1.5 G even though certain turns put a lot of pressure on the tires so we might have to run Sports for this. Even though this car is a five-speed transmission I never needed to shift past fourth.

Beetle 1100 Standard (Type-11) '49
I really like this car. First of all, the Fun Cup car body looks a lot like it. Secondly, you actually don't need any Weight Reductions, you actually need to add weight to get it to 760 kg. The downside is that it has extremely low HP and when you have every single HP upgrade installed and the car is broken-in it is only 88 HP with a displacement of 1131 cc. While this is the only Beetle that can actually get to the the Fun Cup car's weight of 760 kg. However, it is also the only one that cannot get to the Fun Cup car's HP and due to only being able to get up to 88 HP it's slower as well. The tires would definitely need to be Sports for this car as it was losing grip when it was barely getting 1 G and Eau Rouge was quite rough on cold tires for that first lap, probably due to the drivetrain being RR. The default transmission is four-speed, however the custom transmission is five-speed, but you redline early with this car at about 5000 rpm so that would make drafting almost not even a factor for the race.

New Beetle Cup Car '00
This car needs the engine limiter to get down to 130 HP as it's displacement is larger then what I've mentioned so far, being 2800 cc. so that makes that part really easy. However the weight of the car can only be lowered to 1160 kg as all it can get is a Window Weight Reduction. Sticking with Confort:Mediums I was able to run a 3:19.783 after a few laps. The car has a much better grip than the New Beetle 2.0. It's a six-speed transmission however I only needed 5 gears which is good because this is supposed to be a five-speed car. What we could do for this car is just extend fifth gear all the way up.

New Beetle RSi '00
This car also needs the engine limiter to get down to 130 HP with a displacement of 3189 cc. Unlike the Cup Car this car can get Weight Reduction Stage 3 in addition to the Window Weight Reduction. However, this car is heavier than the Cup Car weighing in at 1232 kg when all of the Weight Reductions are applied. In addition, it's a 4WD car which just doesn't seem to be anything like I'm looking for. Staying with Comfort:Mediums I was only able to get a 3:24.304 and the car was losing grip around 0.9 G. The standard transmission is a six-speed, but I barely needed fifth gear. I don't think we'll be using the car at all.

1200 '66
It seems pretty similar to the Beetle 1100 Standard, however slightly more powerful with a displacement of 1192 cc and a 1.2 liter 4-cylinder engine giving it 33 HP. I don't have the DLC for this car and I have no idea if it could actually be tuned up to 130 HP. I highly doubt it. This car weights in at 1160 kg, so it just might be able to get down to 760 kg. I only slightly doubt that.

Based on the lap times I was getting at 130 HP I'm probably going to bump up the HP to 150 (which is the median average of 130 HP and 170 HP.) If the lap times don't improve that much I'd probably just have the HP be 170. Granted I'm only an average driver and someone else would obviously be able to get a better lap time. However, I doubt that they could be an entire 17 seconds faster. Bumping up the engine power would make it more likely that six-speed transmission would need to shift into sixth gear. Therefore, that would mean that the New Beetle 2.0 would need to be used. Based on my Comfort:Medium testing a do think that we will need to use Sports tires. for anything except maybe the Cup Car if that is the car that will end up being used.

Any questions and feedback on car tuning (which is intended to be minimal) and anything else would be much appreciated. Obviously, if there is no interest in a race this long, than there will be no point for myself to work on it any further. Once interest has been obtained, I will continue to work on the car setups and update as needed. Oh, and before anyone asks, I do plan on running a 4 hour test race a week or two before the 25 Hour race.

 

[coxbox]

I like the idea, but I think staging this race over 25h would be difficult. There are issues with this idea. Internet connections, I did a mock 24 with the 2CV and Fiat 500 f68, over half dropped out in each race. 25 hrs of racing is also far to long to race, I doubt many people have that amount of time to race. I would love to race the fun cup,I do love this idea, not enough interesting racing on GT5, however the race length is the main issue.

 

[Peelster1]

I'd also like to get a 4 hour practice race in before the main 25 hours event as practice. I do agree that the main issue is the length, but the point of the race is also the length. Too many people do shortened endurance races. For example, the 2.4 hours of Daytona. Full length online events of 24 Hours Nürburgring and Le Mans 24 Hours have been successfully done. This is another endurance race, but it's a different one that hasn't been done.

If your main concern is connection, first of all the race would be run in Free Run mode and there would be a race steward, (likely myself) keeping track of everyone's total laps. If someone gets disconnected, they resume racing by getting back on track and continuing to turn laps. Drivers would be required to hardwire their connection to minimize connection issues, and the host would be chosen based on whoever has the best connection speed.

The length issue is fixed by having a co-driver. You let your friend take over and go eat or sleep or do something else. It's not healthy to be sitting in front of the screen racing for 25 hours with no breaks. This is why the event would be held a Saturday into Sunday as I figure that people could get the weekend off to race starting halfway through Saturday into Sunday and then getting some sleep after the event. (Even though drivers would be able to sleep during the race with a co-driver.)

Length aside, any feedback on regulated setups? So far, I'm thinking that the New Beetle 2.0 would be the best choice on car. I do know that different part combinations would affect the car in different ways, but I'm not exactly sure how.

 

[Furinkazen]

I have tinkered with the idea of a Fun Cup race for a while, I'd certainly be interested.

 

[Peelster1]

I have tinkered with the idea of a Fun Cup race for a while, I'd certainly be interested.

Great! If we can get people for the 25 hours that would be great. I think the best way to handle this would be to start off with that practice 4 hour race and then if people are interested in the 25 hour race then we run it. Personally, I'm not interested in the 4 hour race as I do not like scaled down versions of anything. However, the 4 hour practice race is necessary to make sure the 25 hour race goes smoothly. Any feedback from the tinkering you've done would be much appreciated.

 

[Furinkazen]

I did a car spec for the 66 Beetle, i'll send it if ya interested?

 

[Peelster1]

I did a car spec for the 66 Beetle, i'll send it if ya interested?

I don't have the DLC and only plan on getting it if we end up using the 66 Beetle for the race. My main concern for that car is; can it get to 130 HP? Also, can it get to 760 kg with Weight Reductions? If it can reach both than that automatically makes it the ideal car as the other cars can do neither.

If that car can reach both that HP and weight, what lap time does it run? If not, get it as close as possible and than what lap time does it run? My original plan was as the cars are set up the same the have the drivers use the same setup. No engine, chassis, suspension, or brake upgrades/changes with anti-roll bars turned to minimal. (If that's possible.) If engine upgrades are necessary to get the car up to 130 HP than we'll use them.

I honestly think we'll end up running with 150 HP or 170 HP as the lap times I was running at 130 HP were way to slow in comparison to the actual Fun Cup lap times. Target time is 3:01-3:02.

 

[Racingworld68]

I have always shown intrest in a full 24hr run. So defenitly into this. Altough I do think running this with 2 persons is not engough, 3 would be more intresting. When someone sleeps/eats/whatever there is still another person to guide the one and assist who is racing. I am able to find 3 already excisting GTP members used to play GT5 in the WRS.
I will talk about this with them as soon as possible. as this event would be run during my hollidays....it is a defenite yes !!

Only possible dates this could work for me : 6/7 july - 13/14 july - 20/21 july

 

[Peelster1]

I have always shown intrest in a full 24hr run. So defenitly into this. Altough I do think running this with 2 persons is not engough, 3 would be more intresting. When someone sleeps/eats/whatever there is still another person to guide the one and assist who is racing. I am able to find 3 already excisting GTP members used to play GT5 in the WRS.
I will talk about this with them as soon as possible. as this event would be run during my hollidays....it is a defenite yes !!

Only possible dates this could work for me : 6/7 july - 13/14 july - 20/21 july

Great! Welcome aboard. The 2 people per team is actually a minimum. Some people don't have more than 1 other friend that's good enough at GT5 to keep the car on track that they can share a console with. Personally, I don't even have 1 friend that can come over to my house that is good enough at GT5 to be my co-driver so I'll probably be forced to be the Race Steward. I do have one friend that is trying to get good at it though. Feel free to have 3 people on your team as long as the other 2 can also keep the car on track and not get into other drivers.

As for the specific date: While it would be cool to host the 25 hour on July 13/14, (as that's when the actual race is going to be run this year) that would force the 4 hour practice race to July 6 which might be too soon as we're still trying to figure out car specifics that must be finalized by the time of the 4 hour practice race. I have a feeling the 4 hour will end up being July 13 and the 25 hour will be July 20/21. However, that's not final as it really will depend on what will absolutely work for people.

 

[Racingworld68]

How many teams do you already have ? July is comming fast, if you want to get this going we should not wait to long on final rules/date/etc.

 

[Peelster1]

How many teams do you already have ? July is comming fast, if you want to get this going we should not wait to long on final rules/date/etc.

If Furi is confirming his interest in the 25 hours, and if he has a co-driver. That would be 2 teams counting your team. (Do you have a co-driver confirmed?) Please let me know when you're able to talk to your other GTP friends and better yet, direct them to this thread.

We're about 1 month away from the race date as it's mid to late July that we're talking about. As soon as Furi gives me that info on the 1200 '66 I'll be finalizing the car choice and then we can talk about which weekend to host on. Really there are 2 possibilities here: 4 hour practice race on the 13th and 25 hour 20th into the 21st. Or 4 hour on the 20th with 25 hour on the 27th into the 28th. I like the first option much better.

I'd like the 6th for the 4 hour with the 25 on the 13th into the 14th, but I don't think we'll have enough teams by then. I have other people expressing interest, however they have yet to get co-drivers. I will also be bringing this event up at my IndyCar event tonight.

I have the rules finalized, it's just the final setup for the car that isn't.

 

[Racingworld68]

FYI here is a google transelation of the RL organisers of this event :

AMBIANCE!
Saturday was the big family of the Be Cox found near the Hospitality Kronos Events for a highly appreciated ... BBQ, which was a good reflection of the atmosphere that prevails during the meetings of the BE Trophy back: cool, relax & fun. Both in the H.U. Kronos Events as in the big tent that the promoters of the ... Trofeo Abarth Benelux had cleared for placing the rows of tables, it was all night and into the early hours "fulling bin".

THE ITEMS IN THE CHAMPIONSHIP
Back to the sport after Dijon and Zandvoort we get a good idea of ​​the differences and the names of some contenders in the different categories.

General classification: Colson Racing (Simul-Gressens-Crosset-Fumal) won three of four races and lead the dance with 136 points. Follow thereon Delahaye 1-Racing4All (Visnovsky-Tanghe-D. Van Dalen - 128), Delahaye-Retrodor (Viron-Engisch-Chatin-Bordet - 111.5), McDonald's Racing (Bouillon-Thewissen-Van Oppens-Vervisch - 103 5) et TML Racing (The Liedekerke-Jadot-De Liedekerke - 99.5) that the Top 5 close. The followers are not far behind with AC Motorsport 2 (Abrams Hoogaars-quedé) and Leader Racing Events (Ouassini-William Gerard-Feron) with equal points, 97.5 points. Then there Allure Team (Bouvy-Jussy-Bulbs-Coens - 96.5), the unlucky ones in the Dutch dunes, AC Motor 1 (Weiss Haupt-Krueger-Godart - 96) and DDS Racing (Debersaques-Debersaques-Deschepper-Mouton - 92).

Evo1: the latter are leaders in the class Evo1, where we find the Cox Be the first generation (1.8 petrol engine, gearbox ordinary). With 92 points the riders of the DDS Racing "pappys" Vanderfeesten-Gascard-Gascard-Reynens (85.5) and Race Lux (Da Palma-Close-Jacques Rizzo - 47) in advance.


Evo2: This class is reserved for the Be Cox with TDI engine and it's called the leader, logically, Delahaye-Retrodor (Viron-Engisch-Bordet-Chatin). (- 97.5 Ouassini-William Gerard-Feron). With a total of 111.5 points, the outgoing champions the boss of Leader Racing Events continue The 3rd place goes to the second team of Delahaye-Racing4All (Vandenbussche-Sillis-From Gyzeghem - 48.5) that were absent in Zandvoort, the Italians of the Michelson Racing (Chimentin-Marchesini-Caprotti-Cosaro) and Jac Motors (Jaspers Nulens) ex aequo with 48 points.

Evo3: this is the class of the Be Cox of the latest generation (2.0 engine VW Motorsport, sequentielle gearbox) which we got at Zandvoort see both the prevalence and Dijon. The two teams that dominate are Colson Racing and Delahaye-Racing4All, and they go to McDonald's Racing, the TML Racing and Team Allure advance.

Be Twin: Be the Trophy does not exist without the presence of the Be Twin, the two-seaters that an exciting "race within the race" contest. Here we see the domination of the TML Racing (The Liedekerke-Jadot-De Liedekerke) with already 100 points on the counter! They lead for Trendy Foods (Plunus-Jardon - 78.5) and CBRS-AC Motorsport (Dupont-King-Fissette - 77.5), the three formations that also invoke the standings in Be Twin Evo3. Furthermore, we still note the "Pappy's" (Vanderfeesten-Gascard-Gascard-Reynens - 71), leaders in Be Twin Evo1, and WRT for Fun (35) Be in 1st Twin Evo2.

THE PRICE FOR MOST PECH
Two teams were chased to the North Sea by repeated bad luck. Old acquaintances Gilles Debrus, David Wust, Jean-Pierre Baudart & Co names, e-Race, the thread with the Be-Cox racing. And that return was no fluke. During the free practice of their car ran so heavy damage, that they were forced to move to the Twin Be the team, which, unfortunately, also struggling in the job match,. Pierre Piron in turn had already measured some damage during the Spa Euro Race, with two badly damaged Ginetta, but also the Be Cox Evo3 of Astur Car left the Dutch paddock with some bumps and bruises. In anticipation of the 25 hours, the mechanics some extra hours may knock ...

UPGRADING THE CLASS
The technical teams of Kronos / WRT working hard to secure a balanced grid, so that we can speak of an open battle in the 25 Hours of Francorchamps. Again On the circuit of Spa-Francorchamps walk performance «evo2» and «Evo3» equal, although the new generation has a slight advantage in terms of lap times. In matches of long-term consumption and make the strategy, however often the difference and that will always play an important role in determining the hierarchy in the endurance race, which bonus points are awarded.

THREE, FOUR OR FIVE?
Little by little lay their favorites cards are viewed to share with three, four or even five riders. A car on the table for this big event and multiple options The leaders in the championship going into the Cox Be Evo3 No 19 already for four riders (Simul-Crosset-Gressens-Fumal), while a second car, possibly a Evo2, make its appearance in the ranks of the successful Colson Racing. When Delahaye-Racing4All one builds a powerful counter, which will shortly be published, while Team Allure apparently chooses three riders (Bouvy-Jussy-Spheres). Fred Vervisch, one of the candidates for the "pole" is expected behind the wheel of the Be Cox Evo3 McDonald's Racing, which he shares with François Bouillon, Philippe Thewissen and Marc Van Oppens.

 

[Peelster1]

I'm thinking that we should have an 1-2 hour long practice race just to determine which car we're using. I'm on the fence between the 2.0 New Beetle '00 and the 1200 '66. I've seen proof that the '66 can hit the speeds we're looking for and an extra bonus is that it looks like the Fun Cup car. I'm worried about using it though because I've heard and seen how easily it rolls over. The videos I've seen are from a year ago and I'm not sure if PD has patched it or not.

So the idea there is a 1 or 2 hour practice race with the idea of 2.0 New Beetle vs. '66 Beetle. Maybe two races with the first hour we're in one car and then the second we're in another? Another thing to factor in is if we want to have both models on track at the same time or if we want to do two separate one-makes to test that. The main thing the 1-2 hour race would be about would be car selection and by getting people in a room together I believe we all will be able to have a good discussion about it. After that we can finalize a date for the 4 hour practice race to make sure that the actual process goes smoothly and plan the date for the 25 hour practice race.

I'm finishing up my IndyCar series this coming Wednesday and then we have a week or two off before switching to NASCAR so I'll have some extra time to work on this and some of my drivers are expressing interest in this event, I'll talk to them about it as well.

 

[Peelster1]

It's been decided that we'll be using the New Beetle 2.0 '00 for this event as the 1200 '66 is prone to rollover. Unless I hear otherwise from a lot of people.

In addition, drivers will not need to share a console with their co-driver (even though this is preferred if possible.) Drivers will be able to have their co-drivers as someone on their PSN friends list as long as they make it clear who is on their team.

 

[Peelster1]

It's going to be held on the middle two weeks of July. The 4 hour practice race will be on the 13th and the 25 hour event will be the 20th to 21st.

 

[Peelster1]

New thread up in the Spot Races section. https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=285535