- 466
OK, you knew some fewl had to do it, so enyways, give it a try, and don't spam me too hard, remember, you have yet to post your "expert tuner guide." I will try to avoid rhetoric and superlatives whenever possible and stick to the facts. This guide works on all rear wheel drive and front wheel drive cars I have applied it to, which is about 80, BUT they all have had all possible upgrades including frame stiffener and wing where allowed; and no steering aids enabled. It is important to note that the technique works equally well on un-winged cars. I tune cars to race my friends, Skylines and R8's and the like, so FF don't get much exposure but it should work fine for them too (I have a little sleeper Alfa that rocks).
Step 1 Preparation:
Now to tune. Get your car, get all your hook-ups, if it's used, apply the frame refresh. If you get some cool carbon rims it will help you think your suspension is more responsive. Now swing down to boring Original Circuits and pony up the 5c to practice at Deep Forest. The "jagged", well, rough then, front straight at Deep is key for dialing in your dampers once you get the springs down; and the first hairpin is where I test my brake level and balance. The goal is to be able to go full spurt from the hairpin to the hard right at the tunnel; ok, so you might have to tap the binders to line up with the esses, but this tune should put you in the tunnel at about 22-24 seconds, depending on HP.
Step 2 Initial Set-up:
Before you even start, go to the tune screen. Select your tire; I use racing hards for anything over 300hp because they expose weaknesses in the tune and are what I usually race with. I don't use or tune for mixed compounds currently.
1) Go to suspension; springs first. For race cars: find the highest value and drop it 4 clicks, raise the other value to match. For purchased suspensions: add between 4 whole numbers (40 clicks) and 6#'s. Now this is where is gets a little tricky because I have no solid rule for this; "smaller" cars need less, "bigger" cars need more, but it is not by weight, the Speed12 is very light but its proper spring is astronomical at 14.7 and it's not exactly by speed (load) because the TVR is fine at low speeds with 14.7. Basically you want to be in the 12 to 14 range and never under 10.
2) Drop the bound front and rear one click.
3) Ride height is almost universally at 15 mm above min. That is one limit I carry over from past GT's and it has served me ok. One recent exception was the Minolta 88C-V which had obvious (to me) chassis bottoming presumably from excessive downforce, it only happened on rough roads above 200 mph, adding 7mm seemed to mostly cure it. Yes I am perplexed by the cars that come pre-tuned at minimum height (I always raise them), I will leave that for you to improve upon in your expert guide.
4) Camber goes to 2.2 and 1.6, I tune to these values and adjust for final preference, usually it acts as about half of a stabilizer value, like if 2 is too whippy and 3 is too solid, I might set stabilizer to 2 and add a degree or 2 to camber.
5) Take 3 or 4 clicks out of each stabilizer so the setting is 2 or 3, same front and rear.
6) Back out of suspension, brakes to 3 front 3 rear.
7) Steering aids, ASM oversteer and understeer to 0, tcs 3 (tcs 2 under 500hp).
8) Downforce max front and rear, lsd default and with this guide you will never have to touch it, even with 4wd.
Step 3 Fine Tuning:
Springs
---------
Ok, lets go drive. Hold that throttle button (or pedal) DOWN. Notice how effortlessly it snakes toward the first left (even if it does overshoot into the grass)? You're welcome. Now, pay CLOSE attention, does the engine note rise and fall as the wheels seamlessly follow every contour in the road? No? Go back and drop a click of spring front and rear until the engine sort of sounds like a mixer happily churning cookie dough while going up the first straight. Now, as you crest the hill at start/finish, with your thumb still firmly mashed on the throttle, pick a braking point: where the pit lane lines start, the grease stain, the beginning of the rumble blocks, whatever, and go directly from mashing the gas to mashing the brake (remember, anything else is just coasting). If you overshoot, start over until you have a good spot, but it is too early to dial in brakes.
As you accelerate out of the hairpin you can get a feel for your springs. If the car is sliding alot they are too stiff, if it is vague or wallowy they are too soft. This is very subjective and you will just have to experement and get a feel, at least I have narrowed it to one component. Get that set and it is on to steering control. So you've got em where you like em and you are ready to do a lap; not yet hotshot. Accelerate over the rise and really flog the car; does it turn through the esses or does it slide (sideways) or push (straight, instead of turn)? If it slides, drop em another click, if it pushes drop the front one. If it still doesn't turn well enough after 3 front reductions, or if it becomes more vague instead of less after one click, raise each spring 1 click until you reach the highest value the suspension was originally. If it still doesn't turn well enough, drop both stabilizers, keep at it until it feels reasonably good. (I have never gone more than 2 clicks over the highest original spring rate, btw.)
Now it is time to knock off a lap. If during the lap the car seems unbearibly whippy or sluggish, use springs (more is nimble/whippy, less is stable/sluggish) or stabilizers to tame. All settings (between front/rear) at all times should be within a few clicks of each other.
Dampers/Shocks
--------------------
Now that you've turned a lap, you have a precious ghost. How did your dampers feel? Think they need some massaging? Your ghost will tell you here at bumpy Deep Forest. You must, of course, strive to maintain the same speed and approach, but it isn't hard at all. Change one damper one click the way you think is better. Go on out and check your shadow, which of you is accelerating away? In extreme cases, you will have to run another lap to get a better ghost. You will likely find that bound one click less than rebound is better, that front one click lower (on each) is better; but results vary so it's best to test. As you get experienced, you will start to notice how more or less bound or rebound affects handling, I am already using my ghost less.
Brakes
--------
Finally you can concentrate on your brakes and you shouldn't need a ghost at all. Proceed through start/finish at full throttle. As you clear the crest, find your brake marker. Stomp the brakes when the marker hits the hood; if you run up into the grass, pick an earlier marker. In this way you can EASILY see the difference one click makes as you approach proper tune. Try adding 2 clicks to both, if it's better or you can't tell, add 2 more, if it's worse, drop one; continue this procedure until you have the shortest possible stopping distance. I have gotten best values anywhere in the 3 to 17 range, usually with rear one click higher for brake steering, but again, results vary. Chirping means your wheels are actually hopping, like drawing nails across a chalkboard, turn the binders down pah-leez.
Final adjustments
----------------------
Now for the wind up lap, really you just need the esses again. Go ahead and bump up the stabilizers until it just won't row through the ess fast enough then back down one. Sometimes adding stabilizer actually INCREASES turnability. Generally you should need more stabilizer to support the end with softer suspension and less stabilizer that would constrict stiffer suspension, but there are many exceptions as the stiffer spring also does not necessarily get the higher damper values; oh, well, this guide is about what works, not why.
Remember settings should be close, same settings (front/rear) are best but often not possible. Notice we never touched the downforce, the lsd or vcd, you are welcome to experement. If your settings get too extremely different from front to back, you will have unexpected and possibly spectacular results in transitional areas.
Let's see, I think that about covers it, I will be happy to (reasonably) edit for clarity and of course, omissions. If it works for you, please post a reply so this post stays current and others might enjoy and, if I am lucky, the detractors will see the merit in allowing this to die silently in archive
Step 1 Preparation:
Now to tune. Get your car, get all your hook-ups, if it's used, apply the frame refresh. If you get some cool carbon rims it will help you think your suspension is more responsive. Now swing down to boring Original Circuits and pony up the 5c to practice at Deep Forest. The "jagged", well, rough then, front straight at Deep is key for dialing in your dampers once you get the springs down; and the first hairpin is where I test my brake level and balance. The goal is to be able to go full spurt from the hairpin to the hard right at the tunnel; ok, so you might have to tap the binders to line up with the esses, but this tune should put you in the tunnel at about 22-24 seconds, depending on HP.
Step 2 Initial Set-up:
Before you even start, go to the tune screen. Select your tire; I use racing hards for anything over 300hp because they expose weaknesses in the tune and are what I usually race with. I don't use or tune for mixed compounds currently.
1) Go to suspension; springs first. For race cars: find the highest value and drop it 4 clicks, raise the other value to match. For purchased suspensions: add between 4 whole numbers (40 clicks) and 6#'s. Now this is where is gets a little tricky because I have no solid rule for this; "smaller" cars need less, "bigger" cars need more, but it is not by weight, the Speed12 is very light but its proper spring is astronomical at 14.7 and it's not exactly by speed (load) because the TVR is fine at low speeds with 14.7. Basically you want to be in the 12 to 14 range and never under 10.
2) Drop the bound front and rear one click.
3) Ride height is almost universally at 15 mm above min. That is one limit I carry over from past GT's and it has served me ok. One recent exception was the Minolta 88C-V which had obvious (to me) chassis bottoming presumably from excessive downforce, it only happened on rough roads above 200 mph, adding 7mm seemed to mostly cure it. Yes I am perplexed by the cars that come pre-tuned at minimum height (I always raise them), I will leave that for you to improve upon in your expert guide.
4) Camber goes to 2.2 and 1.6, I tune to these values and adjust for final preference, usually it acts as about half of a stabilizer value, like if 2 is too whippy and 3 is too solid, I might set stabilizer to 2 and add a degree or 2 to camber.
5) Take 3 or 4 clicks out of each stabilizer so the setting is 2 or 3, same front and rear.
6) Back out of suspension, brakes to 3 front 3 rear.
7) Steering aids, ASM oversteer and understeer to 0, tcs 3 (tcs 2 under 500hp).
8) Downforce max front and rear, lsd default and with this guide you will never have to touch it, even with 4wd.
Step 3 Fine Tuning:
Springs
---------
Ok, lets go drive. Hold that throttle button (or pedal) DOWN. Notice how effortlessly it snakes toward the first left (even if it does overshoot into the grass)? You're welcome. Now, pay CLOSE attention, does the engine note rise and fall as the wheels seamlessly follow every contour in the road? No? Go back and drop a click of spring front and rear until the engine sort of sounds like a mixer happily churning cookie dough while going up the first straight. Now, as you crest the hill at start/finish, with your thumb still firmly mashed on the throttle, pick a braking point: where the pit lane lines start, the grease stain, the beginning of the rumble blocks, whatever, and go directly from mashing the gas to mashing the brake (remember, anything else is just coasting). If you overshoot, start over until you have a good spot, but it is too early to dial in brakes.
As you accelerate out of the hairpin you can get a feel for your springs. If the car is sliding alot they are too stiff, if it is vague or wallowy they are too soft. This is very subjective and you will just have to experement and get a feel, at least I have narrowed it to one component. Get that set and it is on to steering control. So you've got em where you like em and you are ready to do a lap; not yet hotshot. Accelerate over the rise and really flog the car; does it turn through the esses or does it slide (sideways) or push (straight, instead of turn)? If it slides, drop em another click, if it pushes drop the front one. If it still doesn't turn well enough after 3 front reductions, or if it becomes more vague instead of less after one click, raise each spring 1 click until you reach the highest value the suspension was originally. If it still doesn't turn well enough, drop both stabilizers, keep at it until it feels reasonably good. (I have never gone more than 2 clicks over the highest original spring rate, btw.)
Now it is time to knock off a lap. If during the lap the car seems unbearibly whippy or sluggish, use springs (more is nimble/whippy, less is stable/sluggish) or stabilizers to tame. All settings (between front/rear) at all times should be within a few clicks of each other.
Dampers/Shocks
--------------------
Now that you've turned a lap, you have a precious ghost. How did your dampers feel? Think they need some massaging? Your ghost will tell you here at bumpy Deep Forest. You must, of course, strive to maintain the same speed and approach, but it isn't hard at all. Change one damper one click the way you think is better. Go on out and check your shadow, which of you is accelerating away? In extreme cases, you will have to run another lap to get a better ghost. You will likely find that bound one click less than rebound is better, that front one click lower (on each) is better; but results vary so it's best to test. As you get experienced, you will start to notice how more or less bound or rebound affects handling, I am already using my ghost less.
Brakes
--------
Finally you can concentrate on your brakes and you shouldn't need a ghost at all. Proceed through start/finish at full throttle. As you clear the crest, find your brake marker. Stomp the brakes when the marker hits the hood; if you run up into the grass, pick an earlier marker. In this way you can EASILY see the difference one click makes as you approach proper tune. Try adding 2 clicks to both, if it's better or you can't tell, add 2 more, if it's worse, drop one; continue this procedure until you have the shortest possible stopping distance. I have gotten best values anywhere in the 3 to 17 range, usually with rear one click higher for brake steering, but again, results vary. Chirping means your wheels are actually hopping, like drawing nails across a chalkboard, turn the binders down pah-leez.
Final adjustments
----------------------
Now for the wind up lap, really you just need the esses again. Go ahead and bump up the stabilizers until it just won't row through the ess fast enough then back down one. Sometimes adding stabilizer actually INCREASES turnability. Generally you should need more stabilizer to support the end with softer suspension and less stabilizer that would constrict stiffer suspension, but there are many exceptions as the stiffer spring also does not necessarily get the higher damper values; oh, well, this guide is about what works, not why.
Remember settings should be close, same settings (front/rear) are best but often not possible. Notice we never touched the downforce, the lsd or vcd, you are welcome to experement. If your settings get too extremely different from front to back, you will have unexpected and possibly spectacular results in transitional areas.
Let's see, I think that about covers it, I will be happy to (reasonably) edit for clarity and of course, omissions. If it works for you, please post a reply so this post stays current and others might enjoy and, if I am lucky, the detractors will see the merit in allowing this to die silently in archive
Paragraphs are your friend.
You have no idea how much this will help me.
