GT5's reaction to EA's lock down on Porsche, Pagani Huayra, etc.
- Thread starter pasigiri
- 626 comments
- 72,949 views
- 2,583
- Kelowna, Canada
- Antonisbob
- No...
Aside from missing Porsche (Which both games at the moment are) I feel that FM4s car list is much better than GT5 in a few ways, not so much with missing brands, but missing models of said brands.
Most cars I've been wishing for from the start, Ferrari 250, BMW M1, Dodge Dart & Coronet Super Bee, DeTomaso, Buick GSX, Audi R15 (No R18 though haha), Austin Martin DBR1, AMC Javelin, Ford Fairlane, Falcon & Mustang II, D-Type (And the list goes on).
Many of those cars already have their licensed manufactures in the game. The fact that they're missing is what really gets me, but on the bright side they still can be added in the future. 👍
Then there's manufactures with one or two models in the game.. Like Chaparral, if you're going to include them why not add the 1, 2, 2H, 2E, 2G, 2F ect? Isn't that somewhat of a waste of a license? I'm thankful that Chaparral is atleast represented in GT5. No other game I can think of has their wonderful automobiles, and by no means am I upset or ungrateful for what GT5 has to offer. It's just the offering doesn't appeal as much to some people.
Most cars I've been wishing for from the start, Ferrari 250, BMW M1, Dodge Dart & Coronet Super Bee, DeTomaso, Buick GSX, Audi R15 (No R18 though haha), Austin Martin DBR1, AMC Javelin, Ford Fairlane, Falcon & Mustang II, D-Type (And the list goes on).
Many of those cars already have their licensed manufactures in the game. The fact that they're missing is what really gets me, but on the bright side they still can be added in the future. 👍
Then there's manufactures with one or two models in the game.. Like Chaparral, if you're going to include them why not add the 1, 2, 2H, 2E, 2G, 2F ect? Isn't that somewhat of a waste of a license? I'm thankful that Chaparral is atleast represented in GT5. No other game I can think of has their wonderful automobiles, and by no means am I upset or ungrateful for what GT5 has to offer. It's just the offering doesn't appeal as much to some people.
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- 467
- THE_LAST_FAOLIU
I like GT5's car selection. It probably covers the widest range of vehicles of any console game. Don't quote me on that, but I've yet to see another game with 1,000 cars from all walks of life. It's not all about Lamborghinis, Paganis, and Porsche. In fact, some of my favorite vehicles you'd never find in a EA or T10 game but only in a Gran Turismo title. EA and T10 have a great car selection, lots of models I'd love to drive and own but I can't say they have a better overall selection just because GT5 doesn't have the latest glitz and glam.
You know, the cars that you think the least of but eventually grow to love are the ones that keep you coming back and this is something Gran Turismo does very well... and that is the mark of a good car game for a true gear head.
You know, the cars that you think the least of but eventually grow to love are the ones that keep you coming back and this is something Gran Turismo does very well... and that is the mark of a good car game for a true gear head.
- 2,948
- Austria
- GTP_SnowCrash
Ok. So you're complaining that 3 of 4 from the DLC are FF. Wrong. The Golf is 4WD. That leaves 2 FF-cars, and you are saying at the same time that one of those is the very reason you bought the DLC. That leaves 1 FF car (the latest Mini Cooper) that you're actually complaining about...?
You're complaining that there's 5 models of the Toyota 86 GT, but no "real" one. Wrong. The 86 GT is real in every part of the world, but the US. In the US, it's only sold under the brand "Scion", but it's the exact same car. Duplicates from EU/JP/US are one of the things most people feel PD should get rid of, so how is not having a Scion that actually IS a Toyota anyway, make the game any better? Why you are also complaining that 2 models of the first concept were included when the final car had not been presented to the public, I have also no clue about. The 4th model is the 2nd FT-86 Concept, which you only get as a special prize for buying multiple DLC packages from the first batch. They had modeled this most likely for Toyota anyway and just added it, because they had it. You would have preferred not to be able to get it?? Which one the 5th 86-model is you are referring to, I have no clue.
You seem to have a point about people being "whiney".
- 1,449
- San Antonio Tex
- Vaxxtx
- Vaxxtx
I have to disagree, and probably just because we have different taste in cars.
T10 does have a great selection of supercars, from legends to the latest ones, but also has lots of non-supercars that I have not seen anywhere else. Huge selection of American muscle, Euro's, and Asian cars, but also those odd ones, like the El Camino, the Ford Pinto, and the Shebly Omni, the Aussie V8 Supercars, etc.
I guess if you prefer more Japanese obscure cars GT5 fits the bill, but for a more rounded selection FM4 has done wonders.
Back on topic...EA is just smart. Popular? No. But they are doing something right consodering how sucessful they are while also being so hated. Locking up exclusives has made them. NFL anyone?
- 83
Couldn't have said it better myself. I agree completely.. I was already getting worried that this thread is starting to fill with Turn 10 astroturfers
Forza is nice, but not that nicer as its being conveyed here..
- 982
lol you cannot argue with facts....GT's cars go back in time far longer than any forza game.....not only that it has so many unique not just japanese cars and so many series like NASCAR, karts, DTM, GTE, GT1, N1, its got one V8 lol, LM, group c, group b, group a, open wheelers, concepts, pick up trucks, and even f1. Its clear GT has by far the most diverse line up in any racing game. Forza does not have even half of those in some considerable amount.
Porsche is the missing key in GT and FM. Each have the big racing manufacturers but Porsche has some of the best car models in history and so deserve to be in both games. It looks like EA know the fall of NFS and what you said so they are hoping that buying exclusive deals will prevent that fall....that being said all this petition stuff is stupid. As with most things only time will tell.
- 158
- NB, Canada
- JTpwnface
How about this for an idea.
I originally posted this in another thread, but it fits in this one better.
Its too late for Porsche to be in GT5... I just don't think that's a reality, however, I think Porsche in GT6 is a real posibility.
Its true that if enough people write about it, there's a good chance they'll listen. If nothing else, it will at least get them to notice there is a problem here.
Use this link to write a letter to Porsche. Tell them what you think..
https://my.porsche.com/canada/en/dia...ion/contactus/
A few points that might be good to mention?
EA has a pretty bad rep in the gaming community, with EA having exclusive rights to who gets to use Porsche cars in-game, this may inherently damage Porsche's reputation.
The agreement between EA and Porsche was a long time ago (if someone knows the date range feel free to add it!) Times have changed, and maybe its time to re-negotiate the terms.
A lot of people want Porsche in games, MUCH better games, than those produced by EA. Give the cars the justice they deserve, instead of some cheap arcade game.
I'm sure many of you can think of better points, but these come to mind off the top of my head...
I originally posted this in another thread, but it fits in this one better.
Its too late for Porsche to be in GT5... I just don't think that's a reality, however, I think Porsche in GT6 is a real posibility.
Its true that if enough people write about it, there's a good chance they'll listen. If nothing else, it will at least get them to notice there is a problem here.
Use this link to write a letter to Porsche. Tell them what you think..
https://my.porsche.com/canada/en/dia...ion/contactus/
A few points that might be good to mention?
EA has a pretty bad rep in the gaming community, with EA having exclusive rights to who gets to use Porsche cars in-game, this may inherently damage Porsche's reputation.
The agreement between EA and Porsche was a long time ago (if someone knows the date range feel free to add it!) Times have changed, and maybe its time to re-negotiate the terms.
A lot of people want Porsche in games, MUCH better games, than those produced by EA. Give the cars the justice they deserve, instead of some cheap arcade game.
I'm sure many of you can think of better points, but these come to mind off the top of my head...
- 1,449
- San Antonio Tex
- Vaxxtx
- Vaxxtx
Facts? Its opinion. Also you are incorrect, since FM has most of those, sans karts (which are not cars, but whatever), and 1 F1 car.
I take you have never compared a list of cars between the game, huh? Right, of course not. So if you want to argue facts, do that first. Then pay attention to the number of Japanese cars in GT. Then compare the list against FM4. Since you dont own both games, I guess thats the only way you can do it.
So in a desperate attempt to defend GT5 you attack my opinion of more well rounded car list in FM4. Bravo!
And NFS games are not "falling". They are still selling and will continue to do so because of the name NFS. Just like another series I know.
- 3,626
- misteruno1
Wow though their car selection is good, I prefer Gt's for the group c cars GT cars, LM cars, N1 cars, group b cars etc. I have to sya this but that car looks like its made out of plastic
Also the older RUFs are much better dont you agree?
the plastic look comes from my eh...processing, but these two games do have different looks for sure.
My most sincere apologies, miss. Of the four Golfs we already have, three of them are front front, and I haven't driven the new Golf because I'd rather not have the waste of space stuck in my garage-seeing as how they cannot be sold or even deleted. Although the Golf is NOT ff, I guess you don't see how it is similar to the other two. Well, I believe it uses the exact same engine from the Scirroco. Hence 257 hp stock. Both use the same frames, and everything is just about identical, except the body, most likely suspension is a tad different, and as you mentioned, one uses the rear tires.
And the new Cooper is totally different from any other Mini's in the game. It would be stupid to add the Countryman, or the Coupe, or heck even the Clubman.
We have six Mini's. One technically isn't a Cooper, it's a One. So we have five Coopers. Three of those are Cooper S's.
2002 2005 2007
26k 28k 29k
1120kg 1180kg 1210kg
164hp 171hp 176hp
But the 2011 is way different, yo!
2011
30k
1140kg
181hp
Man, that is astonishingly different. And we got the never before seen GT-R. I'd make up a number of how many there are, but then you'd have to go through and count every single one and recant to me how important each individual model is, so I will leave out that snide remark.
But being on the topic of DLC, and GT5's latest batch of totally random unexpected diverse bunch, what has Forza been up to?
Well, they had a DLC in November. It was for seven dollars, three more than GT5.
2012 Lamborghini Aventador LP700-4
2012 Aston Martin Virage
2011 #2 Audi Sport Team Joest R15++ TDI
2011 Audi RS3 Sportback
1957 Chevrolet Bel Air
2012 Dodge Charger SRT8
2011 Ferrari #62 Risi Competizione F458 Italia
2013 Ford Focus ST
1992 GMC Typhoon
2011 Volkswagen Scirocco R
So they got our Scirocco, except months earlier, and a couple others. Hmm. I'm gonna just say make a generalization and say that if GT5 users could choose between the two, they would probably pay three dollars more for this. But is this there only one?
No, lets check out Decembers.
2011 Monster Sport Suzuki SX4
2011 Mazda RX-8 R3
2011 Ford F-150 SVT Raptor
1967 Chevrolet Chevelle SS-396
1977 Ford Escort RS1800
1981 Volkswagen Scirocco S
1986 Alfa Romeo Spider Quadrifoglio Verde
1988 Pontiac Fiero GT
2010 Maserati GranTurismo MC GT4
1957 Maserati 3
Well that's lame. That's only 10 cars for seven dollars. I'd rather pay at least 1 dollar per car. Four cars that are 2010 or sooner? Some older models, some historic models, some cruisers, some performance vehicles, some off road vehicles. My favorite brand, Maserati (except they don' have the Quattroporte
). Yea, that's lame. Especially since they only have two packs out...well, wait. Don't they have three out?January:
1970 Alfa Romeo Montreal
2011 Audi RS5
1996 Chevrolet Impala SS
1986 Dodge Shelby Omni GLHS
2000 Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo
1973 Ford Pinto
2011 Honda #33 Level 5 Motorsports Lola
2012 Honda Civic Si Coupe
2011 Lamborghini #08 West Yokohama Gallardo LP560-4
2012 Pagani Huayra S
Hmm. This seems a little more diverse than GT5's GT-R, Scirocco, Golf, and Cooper S. But hey, they paid three dollars more than us.
So what was your point again?
- 83
Don't confuse pure numbers with diversity. The GT5 car selection is not diverse, not greatly anyway. It has 1000 cars but 600 of those are from one country. That is already not very diverse. Imagine I had 1000 bottles of beer but 600 were from Belgium, that doesn't make the selection diverse, not worldwide anyway which the car market is.
Going from Famines car list:
1061 Cars
3 Australian
640 Japanese (28 are pre 1970, 64 are 1971 - 1990, 271 are 1991 - 2000, 231 are 2001 - 2011. The rest are undated)
1 Belgian
2 Canadian
1 Spanish
48 French
61 Great Britain
108 German
57 Italian
9 Korean
1 Dutch
3 Swedish
125 United States Of America
That is not a wide range of cars from across the world and across the automotive eras, that's a heavily biased selection which covers one walk of life far more than any other, ie Japanese cars from the 90s and 00s. Where are the 50s and 60s US cars, the 70s and 80s British cars, the very modern cars in general? Where are all of the iconic Ferrari's and Alfas? Nowhere.
I'm not going to compare it to the other game because that isn't wise to keep this thread on topic but safe to say it's much more diverse when you look at the hard facts.
- 2,059
- Under your bed.
- Ask me, man.
To be fair, a lot of the Japanese standards will likely be gone forever. You know, the duplicates, the junk boxes, the ones you have to trudge and avoid tripping over in the Used Car Dealership. Many cars that have had little effect on the market, but were convenient to create when the idea of "premium" was non-existent.
When we're talking about the premium dealership, which is the future of Gran Turismo cars, there is a more balanced view of cars. Still, Nissan laughs at all the rest, with their looooooong lineup, but that's to be expected. GT6's Japanese % will likely still be higher than European or American cars, but to a far less degree. That's how I view it all.
To me, GT5 represents PD's and KY having to narrow down the best of the best and the most current of the current. Now that premium cars require so much build-time, they have to put more thought into which cars make it to premium-hood. Hopefully they nail it because other games have. Forza has. Applause.
When we're talking about the premium dealership, which is the future of Gran Turismo cars, there is a more balanced view of cars. Still, Nissan laughs at all the rest, with their looooooong lineup, but that's to be expected. GT6's Japanese % will likely still be higher than European or American cars, but to a far less degree. That's how I view it all.
To me, GT5 represents PD's and KY having to narrow down the best of the best and the most current of the current. Now that premium cars require so much build-time, they have to put more thought into which cars make it to premium-hood. Hopefully they nail it because other games have. Forza has. Applause.
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We're not talking about GT6 and what might happen in the future though, we're talking GT5s car lineup and it's just not diverse.
Even if you do only count the premium, again by Famines spreadsheet:
248 cars
43 US
1 Swedish
122 Japan
26 Italian
30 German
14 British
11 French
1 Canadian
So just about 50% Japanese. Then overall by year there are 16 up to 1970, 8 from 71 to 90, 20 1991 to 2000 and 158 2001 and later. Again that isn't a great balance and wide spectrum of motoring years. Just eight cars from 1971 to 1990 even shocked me when looking it up, that's awful.
- 2,059
- Under your bed.
- Ask me, man.
It's true, GT6 has a lot to make up for. My approach would be to keep adding new manufacturers. That helps minimize the many holes the game will still probably have. Maserati, Lamborghini Ferrari and McLaren are all excellent but there are plenty premium manufacturers missing:
Cadillac
Pontiac
Chrysler
Buick
Bentley
De Tomaso
Noble
RUF
Koenigsegg
Gumpert
Caterham
Even if only 2 models are found in these premium dealerships, it at least looks much better and is more representative of the world's manufacturers. But to be truly fair, you make each of those manufacturers complete. That may take time.
Cadillac
Pontiac
Chrysler
Buick
Bentley
De Tomaso
Noble
RUF
Koenigsegg
Gumpert
Caterham
Even if only 2 models are found in these premium dealerships, it at least looks much better and is more representative of the world's manufacturers. But to be truly fair, you make each of those manufacturers complete. That may take time.
I really don't want to change this to a GT6 vs Forza thread, so I hope no one takes it that way. I understand everyones point of view about not wanting old and ugly standards, but since we have them, I would like to keep them. If anyone here has Forza or knows about it, I am under the impression with 3, you had say 200 cars available on the disc. And if you wanted an extra 500 or so, you could install them with a second disc that was included.
So I really hope GT6 has that as an option, so when we get it (lets hope 2-3 years) we still have access to some of the most amazing vehicles that may otherwise be forgotten, personally like the Volks Nardo. Maybe my favorite European concept car of all time.
I understand when we switch consoles [to PS4 or whatever] this possibility may leave, but as long as we can we might as well take advantage of 700+ vehicles.
I do assume it takes longer to make GT5 cars than it does Forza 4 cars, but is there anything to prove it? Like technological differences between PS3 and XBOX?
So I really hope GT6 has that as an option, so when we get it (lets hope 2-3 years) we still have access to some of the most amazing vehicles that may otherwise be forgotten, personally like the Volks Nardo. Maybe my favorite European concept car of all time.
I understand when we switch consoles [to PS4 or whatever] this possibility may leave, but as long as we can we might as well take advantage of 700+ vehicles.
I do assume it takes longer to make GT5 cars than it does Forza 4 cars, but is there anything to prove it? Like technological differences between PS3 and XBOX?
- 2,059
- Under your bed.
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PD and KY have been notoriously obsessive about their games. This can be seen in their premium cars and other things (Nurburgring graffiti).
And I imagine Turn10 has at least double the staff working on cars. PD has been a small company, even though they brought in more staff for GT5. Maybe with the selling of DLC, they can afford to create more jobs!
- 40,919
You need to pay far, far closer attention to the arguments being presented then you usually do in debates like this before you throw this out. It is getting rather annoying at this point to see you use the word "facts" to mean "things I think are true" and "opinions" as "things other people say are facts but I don't agree with them so they can't be."
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- 1,019
- Canada
- n00bxqb
That is truly garbage reasoning. Sony knows exclusives are one of the big reasons why people buy one console over another and Gran Turismo is one of their big-time exclusives. Sony should be hooking a money-pump directly to PD if they want to sell their next-gen console because if they don't have GT6 at or soon after release, they're going to lose a ton of console sales.
- 2,059
- Under your bed.
- Ask me, man.
To be honest, I was trying to single out their obsession with car detail, which can be both good and bad.
When we look at how many cars they produced for GT5 (pre-DLC), and we compare it other franchises like Forza, we see FAR fewer cars. Since GT4, there have been 3 Forza titles (technically they all came out after but let's not aruge that too much). Now, this is not about ratings or gameplay, simply the sheer numbers of cars. I believe Forza 4 had about 500 at launch. With their DLC packs, I think it's upwards to 550. GT5 is struggling to reach 300.
At any rate, it's about the sheer number of cars being produced. While GT5 DLC offers a random number (15 touring cars in the 1st batch and 4 cars in the 2nd batch), Forza pumps out about 10 on average/pack. And PD is behind. For some reason. There has to be a reason. That's the main idea we want to explore. Staff? Super detail? Who knows?
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Whilst none of us obviously know for sure from what we've seen and heard I would have to assume it's a combination of both. We've seen interviews where they have told us how detailed premium cars are, going so far as details that aren't even visible on the PS3. Then on the other hand their staff size is well known and a lot smaller than T10 (Cue Tenacious D to tell us again about how the evil M$ corporation through T10 outsources all of their work) and so you have to assume it's a combination of both that results in so few cars.
So the solution lies in both answers. They need to hire more staff and they need to not go so mad on the car detailing. Now this is obviously a big talking point because what is too far is very objective. Only the die hard fan boys would disagree that GT5 premium cars look better than Forza but hypothetically take those cars out of the Forza engine and plant them in the GT5 engine would they look much worse than the current cars? Probably not, so I'd say the level of detail put in the Forza cars is enough, combined with the slightly better and more polished graphics engine of GT5.
- 2,059
- Under your bed.
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I don' even really believe it's detail that truly holds PD back/slows their progress. Both Forza and Gran Turismo vehicle interiors look great. I think PD is simply being beaten by a team of more employees. Strength in numbers is a powerful force, as history has stressed.
PD is a tight-knit group, I understand. But everyone can use a helping hand sometimes....you know?
PD is a tight-knit group, I understand. But everyone can use a helping hand sometimes....you know?
- 133
- sheepborg
Wow though their car selection is good, I prefer Gt's for the group c cars GT cars, LM cars, N1 cars, group b cars etc. I have to sya this but that car looks like its made out of plastic
Also the older RUFs are much better dont you agree?
You are right on all counts here man.
Forza has a good and interesting set of cars with a wide range of performance and range and all. But then also GT5 has sheer quantity so you can pick out what you like with plenty to choose from. In gt i enjoy cars i would never have considered before. And the plenty of cars translates to a number of racecars, which i also enjoy.
Forza has better dlc though, like many xbox games have. I would love to have the monster go pro car and the old maserati and so on... not another golf.
And those photos look plain old awful
. I wonder if that is a graphics issue, a photomode issue, or a user issue?
- 488
Seeing how PD have marques in the game that are underused (as has been stated) such as, Aston Martin, Bentley, TVR, Ferrari, Lamborghini, and MANY others, i would not like to see Porshe in GT if that means we only get a select few cars from the Marque.
I would prefer PD got their lazy fingers out and do the right thing. THEN they (and everyone else) can moan till the cows come home how unfair the whole thing is and how bad EA's racing games are....
Just for the record, i HATE NFS with a passion!
- 950
- Las Vegas, USA
- Bobby-Vegas
I love the Pontiac Trans Am and over 30...I don't see how this hurts Porsche. The company existed well before video games. Anybody who knows anything about cars will know the name Porsche. As far as kids getting excited about a WRX, they're how old do you think? When I was about 11 years old everyone of my classmates thought that the Pontiac Trans Am was the coolest car on wheels.
