guys i need help, 14yr old amateur here^_^

  • Thread starter NSXtacy
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Okay i got a couple questions which weren't answered when i used the search future so here goes. What exactly does bound and rebound do in terms of cornering performance? I think i have the jist but havent quite understood what the benefits are. Also ive experienced driving with a high spring rate causes the car to sometimes react violently when it "straightens out" after a sharp corner, how do i remedy this in terms of suspension settings. I found it weird it was easier to handle a renault clio sport with STOCK suspension settings around opera than it was with a high spring rate nsx-r concept :scared:
 
NSXtacy
Okay i got a couple questions which weren't answered when i used the search future so here goes. What exactly does bound and rebound do in terms of cornering performance? I think i have the jist but havent quite understood what the benefits are. Also ive experienced driving with a high spring rate causes the car to sometimes react violently when it "straightens out" after a sharp corner, how do i remedy this in terms of suspension settings. I found it weird it was easier to handle a renault clio sport with STOCK suspension settings around opera than it was with a high spring rate nsx-r concept :scared:
spring ratio. you want these as stiff as poss. but the stiffer they are the more susceptible to bouncing and loss of traction your car will be. so the setting you want is as stiff as poss,but not so stiff you cant cope with the bumps.so basicaly the smoother the track the stiffer the springs.

Dampers. dampers are used to reduse the latteral roll of the car,that is the side to side tipping when the carattemps to corner. the softer they are set the more the car will roll in and out of a corner,the harder they are the moreunstable the car will be over bumpy ground.with smaller lighter cars,high damper settings can result in the wheels leaving the tarmac altogether,with a resulting drop in acceleration and handling. soften the spring settings to get the wheels back on the ground. hope this is of some help. GTSR..
 
gtsr
spring ratio. you want these as stiff as poss. but the stiffer they are the more susceptible to bouncing and loss of traction your car will be. so the setting you want is as stiff as poss,but not so stiff you cant cope with the bumps.so basicaly the smoother the track the stiffer the springs.
Actually you want your springs exactly stiff enough to not bottom or bumpstop on the worst bump on the track you are tuning for. Your overall goal with the springs is to allow the tires to travel over the irregularities in the road transferring acceleration and braking while disturbing the car as little as possible. I am sure you can picture a car with solid axles chattering over rough terrain as bumpily as a car with very soft springs. from the physicists point of view, the spring absorbs the energy that a bump would use to deflect the chassis upward...
Which is where dampers, or shock absorbers, come in to play. The shock body is filled with oil and attached to the frame, inside the body is a piston with holes in it, it is attached to a rod that connects to the travelling part of the suspension. As the suspension compresses when hitting a bump, the oil in the shock body must pass through some of the holes in the piston, this causes friction, and some of the energy of the bump is bled away as heat. Too much friction, or "damping", and the bump will push the car up into the air acting like too hard springs, this is the "bound" stroke. What energy that didn't get converted to heat has been stored in the springs (assuming the suspension didn't hit the bumpstop, in which case the energy is kinetically propelling the car away from the road). Now, as the spring uncoils, or re-bounds, oil must again pass through what are usually smaller holes in the piston. If the holes are too small, the suspension will not extend fully before the next bump and will soon run out of travel, becoming disabled; if the holes are too big the spring will bounce after fully extending, causing a dangerous pogo condition.
The settings for bound and re-bound are also very useful for controlling transitional turning conditions. The best guide I have found for understanding this was posted by sukerkin here:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1563175&postcount=20
 
Many thanks for the kudos, RK; it's always nice when people find your posts useful enough to pass on to others 👍.

Plus, in this case, it also helps in that I didn't have to go into "Dampers 101" scholastic mode once again :D!

@NSXtacy, the violent suspension reaction you observed on corner exit may actually be down to the fact that the NSX is an MR car (I assume the Concept is as well?).

I've found that in-game it is helpful to treat MR's as having something like a 40/60 weight distribution and set spring rates accordingly. The cure for exit 'kick-back' I discovered was to soften the front Stabalisers and stiffen the rear (something akin to 2/6 worked on my Elise 190).

Hope that helps.
 
Canadian Speed
Hey... that's a great little guide there... not to complicated. I'm sure many people could gain from reading this... Great info you've got there...
Did you notice in the body of the text that it actually said GT2? I think people learn faster from scratch than they do from having to unlearn dis-information. Personally, I think the only thing of value at that link is the tire wear comparisons. it casts a sobering light on the logic of exotic tire matching for endurance races.
If you want a "lower height, lower lsd, raise springs, raise dampers" kind of tune, there is one at this very website, it was written specifically for GT4 (which means it was developed and tested on GT4 cars) and you can find it using the very capable search function under the term "Noober Tuner Guide".
The fact that Gran Turismo 2 is referred to in the text indicates that parts of the guide were written over 5 years ago (the bottom of the page says copyright 2000), and no one has edited the GT since, and they likely never will. It was probably written in a flood of passion, the prolific author being enamored with his fascinatingly complex jewel of a game. As he unraveled the mysteries, he set his discoveries in (e-)stone, so that all could come and marvel and benefit...GT3 did not re-kindle his passion, so he left it unedited, nor did GT4 (so far). So we are left with (and wondering what to do with), like the great statue of Saddam, this enormous body of work. We have a brand new Gran Turismo (3) to play and this boomin GT3 (formerly GT2) website we host. Are we going to go HTML fishing and edit the site to anal accuracy? Um, NAH!
So now it's June 6, GT4. We have had at least 5 months to get bored with GT4 and all the GT3 information that gets regurgitated through here shows me where the curve is going, heck our own stickied tuning guide refers to GT3 and 2, how embarassing. (How is it gonna be come GT6?) Who cares if the earlier versions didn't have a lateral g-force indicator? Or if Polyphony themselves said they'd revised the physics engine for GT4? Who can really tell if their car is working properly and how much freakin easier is it to edit a freakin stickied post than it is to write this drivel?:banghead:
From my own perspective, Gt4 is farther removed from real life automotive physics than any previous version. However, that removal has freed the programmers from restraints that force the physics engine to attempt to emulate difficult and obscure real world traights, and the result is that the process of tuning actually can expose the tuner to MORE real world automotive physics.
An excellent example of this is the emulation of ground effect downforce. Although provision for chassis DF has been in the software since at least GT2, it wasn't "emphasized" as in GT4. Before I could get certain cars to work properly, I had to research and learn what chassis DF was and how it works. Now THIS is valuable, this is stuff that will make me sound cool to my non-geek, non-GT4 racing friends.:cool:
NSXtacy, it is a very valid question and hopefully you get or got the help you seek. Please remember in the greater context that there are many people who have similar feelings that read what we post, it is as much for them as you that I reply.
:D
 
I'm removing/editing this post due to the fact that I was not the one who posted it. I appologize to any this may have offended and agree that it was out of line. What has occured is that this account is on a common terminal and my co-worker (who's very much into the game as well, I might add) has gone in and used my account. Once again, sorry.

P.S. I've since changed my password and also unticked the "remember me" field, so this shouldn't happen again.
 
Steady, CS :). I don't know if the above is the result of 'battles' elsewhere but, regardless, fairly scathing and personal comments aren't really suitable in the forums.

If you disagree with RK then it's perfectly fine to say so but ridicule is hardly the tool for the job. That is particularly true when, so I believe, English is not that persons first language - given that fact then, other than a lack of paragraphing, I reckon he does pretty well.

On the matter under discussion, the web page referenced is rather out of date and even in GT2 days was somewhat too simplistic (Gasmans guide was much superior). It is a good starting point to get a reference for which piece of kit does what but, once read, the budding suspension engineer is well advised to seek additional sources (especially with regard to Damper Tuning as that's where Spika's notes are off kilter a bit).
 
sukerkin
Steady, CS :). I don't know if the above is the result of 'battles' elsewhere but, regardless, fairly scathing and personal comments aren't really suitable in the forums.

If you disagree with RK then it's perfectly fine to say so but ridicule is hardly the tool for the job. That is particularly true when, so I believe, English is not that persons first language - given that fact then, other than a lack of paragraphing, I reckon he does pretty well.

On the matter under discussion, the web page referenced is rather out of date and even in GT2 days was somewhat too simplistic (Gasmans guide was much superior). It is a good starting point to get a reference for which piece of kit does what but, once read, the budding suspension engineer is well advised to seek additional sources (especially with regard to Damper Tuning as that's where Spika's notes are off kilter a bit).

I couldn't agree with you more.
 
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