Is it possible to win the WTC 800 races with all of the Group 3 cars, in general?

[benjoi84]

As title, but for a bit more background...

I just attempted the Sardegna Grind favourite for the first time, using my Manufacturer's Suzuki rental (for Manu practice) and I finished a lowly 10th. Hard difficulty, pitting twice (5-lap stints, replacing tyres each time). I only made one bad mistake and my pace is half decent.

I know common opinion here is that you need to adopt a 1-stop strat to beat the AI, but I would have had to short shift to a silly degree to make it happen.

What's everyone's experience with the Group 3s, which the races are ostensibly designed for?

On a side note, how the hell is this a reliable grind go-to? The bottleneck point at the chicane after the uphill section, and the exit of the final turn where the AI love to brake happen to be the best overtaking opportunities, and you lose so much time (and usually a good chance your CRB, also) for me, make it a perilous adventure in credit grinding.

 

[Greycap]

At least with Medium difficulty it's outright easy. I've now driven the Sardegna race with some 20 different Gr3 cars with stock power and Racing Hard tyres, ranging from the woefully underpowered Z4 GT3 to the monstrous Viper, all with two stops and the total times being roughly between 25'30 and 26'30. The margin of victory has been upwards from 25 seconds or so, someone with experience about the Hard difficulty can put my times into perspective.

 

[kraftwerkd]

On a side note, how the hell is this a reliable grind go-to? The bottleneck point at the chicane after the uphill section, and the exit of the final turn where the AI love to brake happen to be the best overtaking opportunities, and you lose so much time (and usually a good chance your CRB, also) for me, make it a perilous adventure in credit grinding.

Lord that chicane is hell. I do not understand why the AI need to take that section so friggen' slowly, but yet absolutely rip thru Tokyo.

My strat around those two turns is just.. stay the hell away from the AI. Same with that hairpin after the long uphill - the amount of times I've been spun out by the AI at that corner is egregious. You have a long enough flat-out section after the last hairpin to gain positions, the first sector is great for overtaking as is the long uphill, then just hang back until you get to that final hairpin. Avoiding the AI in sectors 2 and 3 seems to be my best strategy.

 

[Chikane_GTR]

I have never tried the Sardegna race with a GT car I always use the gr10 with IM tires and PP at 799 you only need 1 pit stop and its a easy win.

 

[GTvsForza]

I did it with the Suzuki VGT, pretty fun. But most of the time, I run with the Lexus or Mercedes. Hell, I recently downtuned the Audi e-Tron and it was a Titan!

 

[benjoi84]

Lord that chicane is hell. I do not understand why the AI need to take that section so friggen' slowly, but yet absolutely rip thru Tokyo.

My strat around those two turns is just.. stay the hell away from the AI.

Easier said than done... how are you meant to avoid them, park on the hard shoulder?

I mean, I'm flying towards them at 240kph!

I have never tried the Sardegna race with a GT car I always use the gr10 with IM tires and PP at 799 you only need 1 pit stop and its a easy win.

Not a fan of detuning cars, I'm afraid. Hence I'm looking to complete these races in the vehicles they are more or less aimed at.

All said and done, looks like I'll need to find the strat to find those 25 seconds I'm missing at Sardegna. Maybe it's in those two sections, maybe it's in the fuel or tyre strategy. Either way, useful input to know that it can be done.

 

[benjoi84]

Lock thread. 🤣

I just did it in the Suzuki.

Put on a quicker tyre which would actually need changing when pitting (RM was suitable), eliminate mistakes.... and guess what? Improve general race pace by being braver with mid-corner momentum and exit speed (the better tyres helped with this).

I thought I had a battle on my hands with Portillo 3 seconds behind me into lap 13, but incredibly he had to pit again in order to top up his fuel. It's almost as if he wanted to try and get out in front of me on the previous stop so he stopped refueling too early!

1st place and CRB, and as a bonus the roulette gave me a 918 Spyder in Rosso Corsa

Onto the next car!

 

[Tommy_D]

You shouldn't have to worry about the CRB at Sardegna. You can make it a demolition derby and still get the CRB. Unlike Tokyo where if you even look at an AI wrong they take your CRB away. Very inconsistent about the CRB rules in this game. I think PD needs to fix that and make it more consistent throughout the races.

I haven't tried Sardegna with any of the Gr.3 cars yet. I'm just now buying some classic Gr.1 cars and taking them out there. Kind of laughable running 1:33 lap times and lapping the whole pack by the end of the race, but the challenge for me is to keep bettering my overall race time. Now I'm shooting for 24:15 in the Mazda 787B. First try was 24:30's so I need to improve my average lap time by a little over 1 second.

 

[Boxster]

I find it impossible to win Sardegna on hard difficulty with stock Gr3 cars, I can only do it with the increased power through a mid-range turbo.
I am a high end DR B rated player.

 

[RoadRacer2556]

To win a 2-stopper on Hard you need to lap below ~ 1:40. Its not easy with an unmodified Gr3 car IMHO.

 

[i386]

I think I won it a few times on hard with the group 3 mclaren f1, but just two or three seconds in front of the viper.

Kind of laughable running 1:33 lap times and lapping the whole pack by the end of the race, but the challenge for me is to keep bettering my overall race time. Now I'm shooting for 24:15 in the Mazda 787B. First try was 24:30's so I need to improve my average lap time by a little over 1 second.

That's impressive. My best time with the 787b is seomething like 1:36.xxx

 

[Arkseven]

Without BoP or tuning, some cars are bound to have a horrible time in this race. Some of them are just too slow to catch the Viper or the Merc.

A stock Viper is pretty good, even if you're playing on Hard. My strategy with this car is short-shift a little bit in FM 4 so I can pit at lap 5. Then between laps 5-9 I try to go as fast as I can with FM 1, enough to pass the Merc just before the 2nd pistop. Then it's just a matter of staying in range of 20 seconds from the Merc (will pit at lap 10) and the Viper (will pit at lap 12). Laps 11 and 12 I do using FM 6, lap 13 and 14 is FM 4 and the final lap can easily be done at FM 1. Average lap is 1:39 using FM 1 or 1:42 with FM4+. I'm using RM tires for the whole race. Total race time is ~26:27.x

It seems that the AI behavior is linked to what car you're using. I don't know how to exactly explain this, but when you use some cars (like the Viper gr3) the AI will 90% of the time do a 3rd pitstop at lap 14. If you take a different car (a RCZ gr3 with medium turbo) the AI will do only 2 pitstops and very rarely you will see them pitting at lap 13/14.

I don't think this is a race designed for stock gr.3 cars. Yeah, it's possible to win, but I think the intention is to use tunes. Completely stock gr3 can see better use in 730pp races.

 

[benjoi84]

It seems that the AI behavior is linked to what car you're using. I don't know how to exactly explain this, but when you use some cars (like the Viper gr3) the AI will 90% of the time do a 3rd pitstop at lap 14. If you take a different car (a RCZ gr3 with medium turbo) the AI will do only 2 pitstops and very rarely you will see them pitting at lap 13/14.

I don't think this is a race designed for stock gr.3 cars. Yeah, it's possible to win, but I think the intention is to use tunes. Completely stock gr3 can see better use in 730pp races.

As I said, I had to race pretty hard and apparently I "scared" the fastest driver AI into messing up his pit strategy, so maybe you're right.

The difference between online racing and these contests is clear, without ghosts and YouTube guides to practice from your relying solely on your own common sense as to how to improve your race time. It's certainly not a guaranteed win.

 

[Tommy_D]

I think I won it a few times on hard with the group 3 mclaren f1, but just two or three seconds in front of the viper.

That's impressive. My best time with the 787b is seomething like 1:36.xxx

24:15.371 with many 1:33 lap times. 1 pit after lap 8. FM1 the whole way. This is a pretty amazing car.

 

[pedrocor]

At least with Medium difficulty it's outright easy. I've now driven the Sardegna race with some 20 different Gr3 cars with stock power and Racing Hard tyres, ranging from the woefully underpowered Z4 GT3 to the monstrous Viper, all with two stops and the total times being roughly between 25'30 and 26'30. The margin of victory has been upwards from 25 seconds or so, someone with experience about the Hard difficulty can put my times into perspective.

On hard you will need a time under 26'00-26'10 to win. Portilla and Fraga will do 1:38s, but still stop 3 times.

 

[Greycap]

On hard you will need a time under 26'00-26'10 to win. Portilla and Fraga will do 1:38s, but still stop 3 times.

So doable on medium tyres on most cars, I'd say. Many can do that already on hards and stock power, it's mainly the ones below 720PP that struggle but that's to be expected as the Viper in particular has no business in being in the same class with other Gr3 cars.

One thing greatly affecting the time though, that nobody ever mentions, is the wind. I can just about guarantee that on a strong south to southeastern wind the total time is 10-15 seconds slower than on a north to northwestern one. You'll lose a ton of downforce coming onto the back straight which kills the exit speed, and the same goes for the death chicane. On a northerly wind both are under headwind conditions and the speeds are easily as much as 20 km/h higher.