Lifting one wheel in a turn.... I GOT IT!!!

Christhedude

Christhedude

2,344
United Kingdom
Bristol UK
GTP_Chris
hey guys,

i tried for a long time now, doing this. lifting a wheel like in real life when you in a turn.

i started trying to find settings for the ford focus RS, but that car just never lifted a rear wheel in a turn.

i tried and tried and tried.

just for fun i took my FGT for a ride, and i got sudden oversteering, and i controlled it, and i wanted to watch the replay....why that happened, and then i saw it. my FGT lifted the front left wheel while drifting.

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as you can see on the pic, in the drift the front wheel lifted, and now i know its possible that gt4 is letting your car lift 1 wheel, even if youre not boucning of a curb.

now guys, get you wheels airborne!!!!:sly: :)
 
If this is correct it could be very interesting - It could change the way we think about GT4's physics in some ways. Can you replicate this in any way to prove the theory? Then we need a tester extraordinaire to have a look (Shouts for Scaff!)

Dave
 
That's the shadow of the front wing. Note the rear wheel has no shadow either.
 
daan
That's the shadow of the front wing. Note the rear wheel has no shadow either.
Click to expand...


what do you mean. you can see that the front wheels airborne...:) or did i miss understand something?- correct me please if i'm wrong.

@dave. what do you mean in finding a way for that.

i just made my own setup for the FGT, and i drove a few laps on Cote d'Azur, and in the right hander- the turn before the very slow tide left hander- i got the over steer and there is lifted.

while the car was lifting it, the car was kinda wierd shaking.:)

what else do you need?
 
You can't tell if the wheel's airborn or not without a shadow to go by or a camera shot that clearly shows a gap between the wheel and the road. Can you upload a replay of this happening?
 

See the Top red area? That's the wheel shadow.

The bottom red line is wing's shadow.

That's what daan meant.
 
Christhedude
what do you mean. you can see that the front wheels airborne...:) or did i miss understand something?- correct me please if i'm wrong.

@dave. what do you mean in finding a way for that.

i just made my own setup for the FGT, and i drove a few laps on Cote d'Azur, and in the right hander- the turn before the very slow tide left hander- i got the over steer and there is lifted.

while the car was lifting it, the car was kinda wierd shaking.:)

what else do you need?
Click to expand...


I just meant can you replicate this on another track and prove that it happens? Ive never had a car do this, and it does look like it could be shadows, some work in the photomode would make it easier to tell perhaps.
 
*McLaren*

See the Top red area? That's the wheel shadow.

The bottom red line is wing's shadow.

That's what daan meant.
Click to expand...


so that means, that the wheels actually airbonre!

i drove again a few laps, but a funny and wierd thing is, when you go in the tide left hander in cota d'azur, the car starts shaking, i think, thats the point where the wheel should be lifting, but it doesnt.


FOR THE REPLAY.

i didnt have it saved, just the pic:scared:
 
To me, the shadow looks like it's coming straight from the wheel with no noticable gap there between thw wheel and road.
 
If you are trying to get a front (or rear) wheel to lift, if it is possible in GT4, using something like an F1 is a bit pointless - they have very little suspension travel, and are extreamly hard-sprung even on their softest settings. A large proportion of an F1's suspension travel comes from the high profile in their tyre's sidewall.

If you are going to do some serious experimentation you need to be using a road car with plenty of suspension travel, it also needs to be a rear driven car if you are going for a lifted front. In the 60's the factory Alfa GTA's couldn't keep up with the competition out of the corners. To get more rear grip under acceleration from the tighter corners, they set the front end very stiff and the rear end very soft.





It must have twisted the chassis something rotten, the 60's alfa you see racing theses days have a much more substantial roll cage than they did in period so the chassis won't flex to the same extent.

If you are going to try it in GT4 i would fit it with the racing suspension but not the chassis stiffening - a very stiff front roll bar with a very soft rear one should give you the desired effect if its possible at all.
 
@the cracker,

if you would have read my first post (correctly), you would have seen, that i wrote, that i tried plenty of cars...but it didnt work.

i am a race driver, so i am experiecend, and i know whats happening there.
that with the F1 car, was just a coincidence.
 
sar593
That's very cool.
Maybe this is old, anyway ...
Click to expand...


Reminds me of Brands Hatch at the weekend - all the Clio's had their rear wheel in the air right around the hairpin. Some of the quicker touring cars were doing the same. I would have thought to get the most out of all 4 tyres, you'd want them all on the ground.
 
Surely the 2nd picture posted proves this can happen, the Peugeot 106 clearly has lifted a rear wheel in that shot!

I remember when Peugeot released the 106, some owners with uneven driveways were complaining that their car would have one wheel off the ground when parked! Just a sign of a stiff chassis I think, and gives the suspension a good platform to work from....

Dave
 
RenesisEvo
Reminds me of Brands Hatch at the weekend - all the Clio's had their rear wheel in the air right around the hairpin. Some of the quicker touring cars were doing the same. I would have thought to get the most out of all 4 tyres, you'd want them all on the ground.
Click to expand...

In most cases you would be quite right, all four tyres in contct with the ground is going to give you the most grip, vital in fast sweeping corners.

Now think about the corners you saw it happen in, mainly (from my own experience) the slower and/or tighter ones, here front end grip is all important. Its a common set-up for FWD race cars, get the rear as stiff as possiable in comparison to the front (often done via the anti-roll bars), then brake very late into the corner apex and turn in hard. The front grips like mad and the rear is so stiff that it gets unsettled and the result is a wheel lifting and over-steer in some cases (who said FWD can't oversteer).

Its also one of the reasons why FWD race cars tend to run high negative front camber.

In regards to GT4 I have couple of shots wheels lifting.



The AZ-1 was the result of a stiff rear vs a softer front, but the Fiat was simply from hitting the curb at Paris in a light car.

Its however far more difficult in GT4 that it is in the real world.

Regards

Scaff
 
so, we got now 4 pics, where it is noticable, that it is acutally able to lift only one wheel.

in my opinion, its gives us all an nwe few of the physics of gt4!

would do you guys think?
 
Usually, small cars with lots of grip can get one wheel off the ground easily during tight corners.

I've been to a Rover Metro trackday where a guy was running a 1.4 gti on slicks and the rear wheel was constantly off the floor through the corners! I took a ride in it and the cornering was pretty quick, the wheel lift wasn't even noticeable.

Was cornering quicker than the 1.8 VVC that was also running :)
 
Awesome video!! Ha ha.

I love wheels stopped on air! Good example shown by TheCracker. To experiment with setups is useful to play "Live for speed" simulator. I hope next GT5 physics will be based on tyre and car weight (Where the weight goes, as LSF developers say...)

I've upload two examples. In 2nd look at tyre deformation. I think PS2's pad and sales makes GT4 so "physically simple". I'm very disapointed with rally cars on tarmac (In particular), wich doesn't lift a wheel on air correctly :( and i'm not sure if GT5 is going to fix this.



Salu2.alexwrc
 
i want to try this SOOOO BAD! my frikin disk is broken though because it got scratched when i threw my ps2 because my file corrupted. Ill probably rent it this weekend so i can try it. thats wicked cool though if i could get a car to lift one of teh front wheels it would be perfect. ive been wanting a front wheel lift pic forever.

kinda off topic but does anyone else have the blue autozam. actually i should say had. dam corruption.
 
Did this a long time ago. Peice of cake :) I guess the slight climb helped it. But if you're thinking I that I bounced it off the rumble strip you're wrong. It never touched it.

 
Scaff
Now think about the corners you saw it happen in, mainly (from my own experience) the slower and/or tighter ones, here front end grip is all important. Its a common set-up for FWD race cars, get the rear as stiff as possiable in comparison to the front (often done via the anti-roll bars), then brake very late into the corner apex and turn in hard. The front grips like mad and the rear is so stiff that it gets unsettled and the result is a wheel lifting and over-steer in some cases (who said FWD can't oversteer).

Its also one of the reasons why FWD race cars tend to run high negative front camber.
Click to expand...

It was known that Peugeots before the 206/307 had oversteer. The 106 and 205 had a stiff chassis, and often lifted a wheel. Even the big 306 could do that...
And, this explains how 106s compete in Rally-racing. I read an article this week about a professional 106 rally-car, still with the same chassis and drivetrain...
 

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