LSD Discovery: 4WD :)

[Niels]

Well, I never liked the non-countersteer of AWD. So today I tried to eliminate the effects of MASSIVE oversteer during a decelerating drift.

I never saw a topic like this, never heard of it so here is the simple solution:
If you set up your LSD Accel ie like this:
F/R: 11/45

Then set your LSD Decel for the braking on front to 45 as well, also do that with LSD Initial. I use the oposite of LSD Accel wich means the rear will be getting 11 for me as well but I dont think thats really deciding for my trick.

👍 Thought I'd share it because I havent seen it around

Edit: I'm not drifting 4WD then, I know, but this is meant for the people that drift FR and just like the looks of the Skyline and Subaru for drifting.
Drifting them like FR is now possible!

 

[Perfect Balance]

This would affect all cars differently, so it isn't just a universal setting that wil work for all 4wd cars.

 

[Niels]

Well I'm suprised if it would only work for a Subaru honestly. And offcourse the EXACT number isn't correct for every car, but increasing front Decel and Initial definatly helps in every car, it's such a drastic change in handling that I dont think this totally depends on the car.

 

[Delphic Reason]

Bad idea, on so many different levels... If you want to drift AWD's like RWD's, then go to town... There is a much easier way of doing it, but I am definitely not going to make it easy for anyone to figure out... Drifting AWD's in a RWD fashion is just pointless, in my opinion...

 

[Funkshen]

Bad idea, on so many different levels... If you want to drift AWD's like RWD's, then go to town... There is a much easier way of doing it, but I am definitely not going to make it easy for anyone to figure out... Drifting AWD's in a RWD fashion is just pointless, in my opinion...

DR has made this point numerous times before, and i am inclinded to agree. Learn the AWD characteristics if you want to drift an AWD. Simulating FR characteristics with LSD and VCD is well... looked down upon among the community.

This has been brought up before, so i wouldn't call it a discovery. But it has never had a thread dedicated to it... So it would be tough to search.

 

[nos2]

I actually found the opposite, I lower the front LSD's values to half of the rear LSD's values, and use the VCD to set only 10% power to the front. This way the car behave almost like an FR car.

 

[ForcedInduction]

Bad idea, on so many different levels... If you want to drift AWD's like RWD's, then go to town... There is a much easier way of doing it, but I am definitely not going to make it easy for anyone to figure out... Drifting AWD's in a RWD fashion is just pointless, in my opinion...

👍 👍 👍

 

[road kill]

Bad idea, on so many different levels... If you want to drift AWD's like RWD's, then go to town... There is a much easier way of doing it, but I am definitely not going to make it easy for anyone to figure out... Drifting AWD's in a RWD fashion is just pointless, in my opinion...

yea it is... a waste of all that extra grip a awd has to offer...

 

[Niels]

Bad idea, on so many different levels... If you want to drift AWD's like RWD's, then go to town... There is a much easier way of doing it, but I am definitely not going to make it easy for anyone to figure out... Drifting AWD's in a RWD fashion is just pointless, in my opinion...

Well I'm an FR drifter, but I simple love how the Impreza looks. This is not the traditional way of drifting AWD but come on, we can choose ourselves how to handle with AWD cars and how to drift with them.
I posted this up for the members that dont really care about "what others think about your AWD drift style", and just want to drift an Impreza like FR sometimes.

This is for the people that want to have fun.

yea it is... a waste of all that extra grip a awd has to offer...

I'm not here for grip, I dont think you are in the drift forums for grip either??

 

[Delphic Reason]

I'm not here for grip, I dont think you are in the drift forums for grip either??

Drifting is more about utilizing traction (grip), rather than losing it... Having the powered front wheels allows you to achieve far bigger angles, and longer drifts than is possible with a RWD... This is why it's so silly to try and make an AWD into a RWD... Not to mention, you don't have to set the cart up differently to drive it like a RWD... You just have to drive it differently...

 

[Niels]

Drifting is more about utilizing traction (grip), rather than losing it... Having the powered front wheels allows you to achieve far bigger angles, and longer drifts than is possible with a RWD... This is why it's so silly to try and make an AWD into a RWD... Not to mention, you don't have to set the cart up differently to drive it like a RWD... You just have to drive it differently...

Well I'm not gonna argue on this will all kinds of facts and explainations. I just wanted to drift a Subaru Impreza like FR and I'm sure I'm not the only one who sometimes wants to do that.

 

[vinsion]

Bad idea, on so many different levels...

Hahahaha...DR, sometime's you can be so blunt.

If you want to drift AWD's like RWD's, then go to town... There is a much easier way of doing it, but I am definitely not going to make it easy for anyone to figure out... Drifting AWD's in a RWD fashion is just pointless, in my opinion...

He's right though. AWD drifting is soooo very different from FR drifting, that with the exception of a car sliding sideways around a corner, they really are two different beasts to tame (BEASTS I SAY!). DR is a very knowledgable drifter, he drifts in GT games very well, and drifts in real life most likely near the same level. I've been on [and off] this forum for about 3.5 years now, using a slew of names (never can just pick one), but I've always known DR (or SilviaDrifter, as he used to be known) to be dead on in his replies.

Dorifto,

//Vin

EDIT: That reminds me, I know it's still technically AWD (as far as the game goes), but I'm curious if anyone has created a RWD STi (with the VCD) like the orange D1GP car that sounds like a bat[mobile] of out hell.

 

[Niels]

Well so far, I have been able to drift while countersteering but somehow non countersteer works best.
I am not giving up though and yeah, vinsion was talking about the orange Subaru in RL and thats the car that kind of inspired me.


Some people here now say that drifting like RWD in a 4WD car is a waste of grip, and useless and stuff. Only arguement I got is that it's more fun for me and that:
-Drifting itsself is just pointless, waist of grip. Why drifting for speed when you can race?
-For FR drifting, why would you want to drift with lower BHP than is possible? Because it's a challenge and it's more fun, wich brings me to the next point:
-4WD drifting and the non countersteer style isn't challenging at all. I started out with AWD drifting in GT4 simply because it was so darn easy, and trust me I tried to make it harder while changing VCD settings and stuff, but it was not challenging. Now I want to drift them like FR and suddenly people call it pointless? Whats the point of drifting AWD without countersteering then? There's no point for that either.


I think it's just a lame habit to drift AWD without any countersteer, you are not cool if you try to drift AWD like FR or something like it

 

[ForcedInduction]

Well so far, I have been able to drift while countersteering but somehow non countersteer works best.
I am not giving up though and yeah, vinsion was talking about the orange Subaru in RL and thats the car that kind of inspired me.


Some people here now say that drifting like RWD in a 4WD car is a waste of grip, and useless and stuff. Only arguement I got is that it's more fun for me and that:
-Drifting itsself is just pointless, waist of grip. Why drifting for speed when you can race?
-For FR drifting, why would you want to drift with lower BHP than is possible? Because it's a challenge and it's more fun, wich brings me to the next point:
-4WD drifting and the non countersteer style isn't challenging at all. I started out with AWD drifting in GT4 simply because it was so darn easy, and trust me I tried to make it harder while changing VCD settings and stuff, but it was not challenging. Now I want to drift them like FR and suddenly people call it pointless? Whats the point of drifting AWD without countersteering then? There's no point for that either.


I think it's just a lame habit to drift AWD without any countersteer, you are not cool if you try to drift AWD like FR or something like it

1. The grip that AWD gives is for more control...not for speed.

2. AWD is easy? Initiating the drift maybe easy...but the hard part is find the correct line. AWD drifting focuses more on the lines to take. You'll find that linking turns with AWD is challenging because once your line is off, it's very hard to pull off.

3. AWD produces much more angle BECAUSE it's drifted without countersteer. Why take away an advantage AWD has by setting it to drift like an FR?


I thought'd I'd provide some insight.

 

[Niels]

2. AWD is easy? Initiating the drift maybe easy...but the hard part is find the correct line. AWD drifting focuses more on the lines to take. You'll find that linking turns with AWD is challenging because once your line is off, it's very hard to pull off.

Well, on the other hand, when you have learned the timing for AWD line taking, then you have mastered AWD.

3. AWD produces much more angle BECAUSE it's drifted without countersteer. Why take away an advantage AWD has by setting it to drift like an FR?

But I dont drift for angle, I drift for the challenge.
Tell me, why would someone try to drift a stock Toyota Trueno if they could as well make it easier and completely modify it?
Drifting is not only focussed on results, it's how you get to those results that matters too.

I thought'd I'd provide some insight.

I know I am talking about the things you told me too btw. It's not like I have anything against you guys.
Sometimes arguements can appear to be personal, but I'm just trying to open up the drift community for FR like drifting in 4WD cars.

 

[Valve Timing]

wow some people just dont get it do they !! tisk tisk

 

[too cold]

Geez man! Just throw something out there that YOU are having fun with and people want to get all "not proper drift etiquette" about it! Sheesh... It's not like he's entering a competition with it or something. Thanks for the info dude and hey... i'll try it out because i'm just as wacky as you and like to try new sh...errr...stuff! Heh, i've always liked doing things differently just to throw a different slant on it.

 

[Perfect Balance]

-Drifting itsself is just pointless, waist of grip. Why drifting for speed when you can race?
-For FR drifting, why would you want to drift with lower BHP than is possible? Because it's a challenge and it's more fun, wich brings me to the next point:
-4WD drifting and the non countersteer style isn't challenging at all. I started out with AWD drifting in GT4 simply because it was so darn easy, and trust me I tried to make it harder while changing VCD settings and stuff, but it was not challenging. Now I want to drift them like FR and suddenly people call it pointless? Whats the point of drifting AWD without countersteering then? There's no point for that either.


I think it's just a lame habit to drift AWD without any countersteer, you are not cool if you try to drift AWD like FR or something like it

1. Drifting is not always slower, on some turn like hairpins and stuff, it is noticable faster to drift.

2.The point of 4WD drifting is basically to not countersteer, that way you go way faster by using all of the tires grip to move forward, and in a 4wd car, if you countersteer and step on the gas, your car will suddenly flip around the other way and spin out.

3. Drifting a 4wd like an FR IS pointless, why would you purposly want to make a car slower? If you want FR, then drift an FR, but trying to make a car into something it's not by making it worse, is definantly not a smart thing to do, regardless of how challenging it is.

4. Drifting a 4wd is very challenging in real life if not in GT4. Maybe not as challenging as an FR, but definantly not something to complain about.


My 2 cents.👍

 

[Niels]

1. Drifting is not always slower, on some turn like hairpins and stuff, it is noticable faster to drift.

2.The point of 4WD drifting is basically to not countersteer, that way you go way faster by using all of the tires grip to move forward, and in a 4wd car, if you countersteer and step on the gas, your car will suddenly flip around the other way and spin out.

3. Drifting a 4wd like an FR IS pointless, why would you purposly want to make a car slower? If you want FR, then drift an FR, but trying to make a car into something it's not by making it worse, is definantly not a smart thing to do, regardless of how challenging it is.

4. Drifting a 4wd is very challenging in real life if not in GT4. Maybe not as challenging as an FR, but definantly not something to complain about.


My 2 cents.👍

I dont know if you guys (in general except for too cold) avoid the point I'm making on purpose.

PB I'm trying to compare FR/4WD drifting with drifting/racing.
Agreed, on some corners drifting is faster than grip. But on some corners FR drifting is faster than 4WD, take the 2 very long corners on midfield in beginning. With 450BHP HKS Silvia I'm faster than a 450BHP Subaru.

Drifting 4WD like FR is pointless because your wasting the grip that you can achieve with 4WD???
I'll tell you drifting around a track is pointless when you can race, why waste the grip of racing?

I hoped SOME of you would respond as too cold, but I'm getting the feeling that I'm talking to some 80 year olds about some ancient tradition about 4WD drifting.
Be a bit open minded, gosh, why post all this complaining about FR drifting with 4WD cars? Is it because if you do that, you will all look like car experts and will "prove" your knowledge to the rest of the forums.....I wont even bother to put a ? there, I just know that this is the answer.

Anyway, before you think you've "proven yourselves" and other rediculous stuff, this is handy for noncountersteer drifting too. Eventually you'll have to countersteer to get out of a drift and if you slow down at the exit of a turn while countersteering you'll get punished. This is gone now so you can perfectly exit your corners while maintaining non countersteer through the midsection of the corners.

When I made the thread I expected something nice like:

Reaction of members: thanks
Niels: No prob

I guess I was expecting too much from the drift forums...

 

[Perfect Balance]

I could have responded like you wanted us to, and I understand your point. It's just I like to use cars to their full potential, and I like seeing them used how they were designed to be used. Using a 4wd car like an FR appears as a waste to me, so thats why I don't like the idea of doing it that way.


P.S. Bad comparison of cars, a d1 car against a a regular tuned car. Try an regular s15 silvia, then see which one is faster.


Sorry if I sounded harsh in my earlier post.


EDIT:

I'll tell you drifting around a track is pointless when you can race, why waste the grip of racing?

That's probably why you don't see people drifting in races other than D1GP and mountain races.

 

[Niels]

I could have responded like you wanted us to, and I understand your point. It's just I like to use cars to their full potential, and I like seeing them used how they were designed to be used. Using a 4wd car like an FR appears as a waste to me, so thats why I don't like the idea of doing it that way.

It's not a waste of drifting IMO, because what I was trying to say, drifting is for fun, not for extra grip. Drifting is for the looks, the control, the show off style. I think FR drifting fits it better than 4WD drifting so I made the 4WD car handle like FR too.

P.S. Bad comparison of cars, a d1 car against a a regular tuned car. Try an regular s15 silvia, then see which one is faster.

Lol, this little part is not about winning this arguement, but I had a one week experience with the S15, because I was out to drift it faster than my HKS Silvia, and I managed to do it with like 0,50 secs on Midfield reverse lol. It is possible!!!!!!!

 

[Dorifto~Dan]

yes, but look at it this way, lower angle gives you more speed, so you cant really go by times in drifting....

 

[Perfect Balance]

It's not a waste of drifting IMO, because what I was trying to say, drifting is for fun, not for extra grip. Drifting is for the looks, the control, the show off style.

Partly true, drifting is for fun, but it is also for extra grip, thats was the original point of it, but then drift exhibitions have made it into crowd pleasing entertainment event. There isn't much people to show off to in the mountains, where it first began. I personally hate show drifting, speed is definantly more entertaining than angle or smoke IMO.👍

 

[Niels]

Partly true, drifting is for fun, but it is also for extra grip, thats was the original point of it, but then drift exhibitions have made it into crowd pleasing entertainment event. There isn't much people to show off to in the mountains, where it first began. I personally hate show drifting, speed is definantly more entertaining than angle or smoke IMO.👍

Well I'm an exhibition drifter, like the majority of the drift forums