Pop culture - a rant.

[milefile]

Sometimes I feel so boxed in by pop culture. All this "stuff" is supposed to be cool, deep, valuable, important, etc. And to me it's all stupid. Some popular things that are taken to be good, in an a priori sense, that to me are assinine fads for the lonely and existentially starved are:

Pop music. All of it. Turn on the radio.

Ann Rice, Michael Crighton, John Grisham, etc.

Public radio and television... begging and pandering to the weakest and basest instincts in the lowest types of people.

"Spiritual leaders". Deepak Chopra, John Edwards, the Dali Lama, and any other stupid comfort-food-for-the-"soul" type preacher.

New age religions. These people claim to be practicing ancient rituals, paying homage to the old gods. NEWS FLASH: The old gods liked blood and war and sacrifice. Get real. These freaks just like wearing pretty rocks. Pompous, faux meaning is just an afterthought to help them get over their insecurity complexes by pretending to be superior.

New American Christianity. Pure hypocrisy. Christianity without that bothersome crucifix. Morals without foundation in anything. This is probably the most desperate example of pop culture run-amuck, the corporatization of religion. I could stomach it when it was just those pagan freaks, but the tradition our civilization is based on? Watered down for the stupid, cud chewing herd?

The denuding of Sexuality. Very sad. If you don't know what I mean then I'm talking about you.

Everywhere I look this all I see, a free floating, purposeless civilization with only superficial conections to anything beyond what sells. It is not an American problem. It is a Western problem.

Sometimes I couldn't care less, and pop culture flows like water off a duck's back. Other times I look around and see zombies, walking dead, following orders received from anonymous senders, unconsciously, ignorant of consequences, blissfully sated by their aimlessness mistaken for progress.

In the last words of Hassan i Sabbah: "Nothing is true, everything is permitted."

 

[jay wilkie]

how come your the most hated member mile file?

 

[milefile]

Because I don't like pictures of dirty tramps, especially when it's somebody's sister who could beat me up. It goes with my aversion to and disapproval of the denuding of sexuality.

 

[Duke]

Originally posted by jay wilkie
how come your the most hated member mile file?

Did you totally fail to understand any word he wrote in the first post? Apparently so. Because that clearly explains why he is hated by the type of people that hate him. Duh.

Originally posted by milefile
It is not an American problem. It is a Western problem.

milefile, you're succumbing to the myth a little when you say it is a Western problem. It's a human problem. Pop Culture is Pop Culture whether the roots are 2 months old or 2 thousand years. The problem lies in people who buy what is sold, unthinkingly and completely.

Sometimes the product is a pantheon of ancient gods who govern the slightest details of their followers' lives and demand that hoops be jumped through and sacrifices be made.

Sometimes the product is a 15-second film clip of Britney tongue-kissing Madonna.

Honestly, it's not a Western thing at all. That's just what you happen to be inundated with.

 

[askia47]

Milefile, are you just going against anything popular? Just want to confrim.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by askia47
Milefile, are you just going against anything popular? Just want to confrim.

No. Food is popular. I like that.

The beach is nice, too. Lot's of people like the beach.

And the Simpsons. I think that's popular, no?

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by neon_duke


Honestly, it's not a Western thing at all. That's just what you happen to be inundated with.

That's true. I think I was probably subconsciously anticipating Australian or European responses based on this silly belief that America is corrupting the Earth.

In fact, I have felt similarly about Russia (talk about a bunch of hillbillys), China (so very hungry for the brave new world), and Japan (who, contrary to GTP belief, is, in reality, a culturally repressed, highly materialistic society who worships the stupidest things about American pop culture). For instance, did you know that Japan celebrates Christmas (which in and of itself is sad enough) by eating KFC? And they think we do to. Pure hillarity.

 

[regulate]

i share your sentiments, mile, and by the way the "boo hoo" joke was classic, but back on topic, yes pop culture has gotten to be tiresome in my opinion. from all the stereotypes to the urge to be "PC", whatever. i think from the earliest of men, there have been thoes that have gone against the grain to get away from it all, then others who feel sufficated by society take their ways from the outsider, thus making whatever the outsider popular, then the cycle continues in an endless cycle. untill humanity as a whole can accept the individual and do away with the insecurity of being accepted, pop culture will continue to haunt those who decide to be differnt, not necessarily anti-pop.

 

[Danoff]

The denuding of Sexuality

Please explain to me what is wrong with "denuding" sexuality.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by danoff
Please explain to me what is wrong with "denuding" sexuality.

Sex is becoming indecent in it's popular obtrusiveness. It's meaning no longer extends beyond recreational pleasure. It is brandished and abused. Promiscuity is the norm. Modesty is not only no longer popular, but downright strange, counter-cultural even. I see this as a loss.

 

[TurboSmoke]

Milefile,

have you ever thought of writing articles for a website? (other than GTP)...seriously...how do you manage to think of so much stuff in the space of 24 hours? i am sure someone somewhere will pay you for it....

i can see it now...

Milefile's Rant Page...

 

[Danoff]

Sex is becoming indecent in it's popular obtrusiveness. It's meaning no longer extends beyond recreational pleasure. It is brandished and abused. Promiscuity is the norm. Modesty is not only no longer popular, but downright strange, counter-cultural even. I see this as a loss.

Are you talking about within entertainment or among the general population or both?

If you're talking about the general population I think this is very dependent on the demographics you're talking about.

 

[Sleek Stratos]

If you're one of the lucky ones that doesn't form part in the Pop culture you should be proud. I am.
Simply ignore the phenomenon and think "I'm not them".

 

[Ghost C]

Originally posted by regulate
...and by the way the "boo hoo" joke was classic...

Classic in the sense that my great great grandfather told it to me when I was 5 years old. Anyway...

Pop culture is bad, because I get tired of seeing people doing something, then explaining to me that it's the cool thing to do, and I should do it too. Sometimes I'd like to know what crack people were smoking when they came up with these trends, because 90% of the time they're so retarded that it's actually hurting my brain right now trying to think of an example, I might come up with one later after I'm fully awake.

Usually I don't even dignify the "you should do this because it's cool" with a response, it just gets an eye roll and a shake of the head, then I go back to whatever I was doing.

 

[milefile]

Originally posted by danoff
Are you talking about within entertainment or among the general population or both?

If you're talking about the general population I think this is very dependent on the demographics you're talking about.

I'm talking about the growing overlap between the two.

 

[Danoff]

I'm talking about the growing overlap between the two.

I think it's fair to assume that you're not concerned with the entertainment industry becoming more sexually conservative... so you must be concerned about the gerneral population becoming more sexually liberal?

If there is an overlap, from what I can tell about your posts, you'd only be concerned with the side of the overlap that was becoming more liberal.

Hopefully I'm reading this right.

 

[milefile]

I'm not sure "liberal" is an accurate characterization. But I think you're on the right track.

 

[Timmotheus]

Originally posted by milefile
Michael Crighton

I like him. He usually has fairly intelligent plots, even if he doesn't do enough resarch to make it make complete sense, and there are occasional holes. He's one of my favorite authors. How is he a fad?

 

[Duke]

Originally posted by Timmotheus
I like him. He usually has fairly intelligent plots, even if he doesn't do enough resarch to make it make complete sense, and there are occasional holes. He's one of my favorite authors. How is he a fad?

Yeah, he's been writing for about 30 years. I usually like him, too, but do yourself a favor, Tim, and do not read Prey. It really really sucks.

 

[Danoff]

I'm not sure "liberal" is an accurate characterization. But I think you're on the right track.

Ok, then sense we're talking about the overlap, and since the overlap is only growing as a result of the general public... your problem is with an increase in promiscuity - sex for recreation among the general masses?

If this is the case, I would refer you to the 60's and 70's.

 

[milefile]

Not only the act of intercourse, but the representation of sex in popular culture. I don't know if looking to the past for comfort or consolation is good.

I am often reminded of the Past in another sense, and in another time: The Roman Empire. It became decadent, overblown, and was defeated in small bits over a long period in ways that uncannily resemble the present.

I don't know if looking to the past in this way is good either.

 

[Red Eye Racer]

The main problem with clture in general these days is that it's all way to materialistic.

People are far too hung up on how good they look and how well they can act like the latest pop star.

My biggest pet peeve has got to be all the little tramps runnin around with no clothes (or very little for that matter) on. If you dont know what I'm talking about, hang out at your local mall for a bout 15 minutes and I bet you'lll count 20 different "thong-ass-cracks" on 20 different little sluts under the age of 14. These displays lately (last 5-7 years) make me want to puke.

Parents are giving into their children who have been infected by MTV and E! television.

 

[milefile]

I've seen young, junior high aged, girls and their moms shopping at Victoria's Secret together. This is hard for me to resolve. Most of the girls I see in public would be in for a rude awakening if I was their father.

When you dress like a hooker you'll be treated like one.

 

[Sage]

Originally posted by Red Eye Racer
People are far too hung up on how good they look and how well they can act like the latest pop star.

Sorry if I'm technically straying "off-topic" with what I'm about to say, but I feel it's relevant as to why "pop culture" even exists.

One big point that Ayn Rand stressed in her books was the importance of selfishness. I can't do justice to the intricate story plots that she uses to prove this point, but basically it's important for humans to do what they want to do and think how they want to think.

Now, regarding RER's comments about how people are too hung up on how they look - This facet is practically pure selflessness. People are hung up on "style", rap, slang, etc., because they don't care what they think... they care what other people think. And again, as Ayn Rand so well showed in her books, this awareness of other people's wants and conforming to those wants sets itself up for a vicious cycle that expands and starts deteriorating society as a whole.

It could be argued that this is what "pop culture" is... widespread selflessness.

 

[Danoff]

I don't know if looking to the past for comfort or consolation is good

I was suggesting that perhaps the situation has gotten much better in the last 30-40 years.

I really don't see who this hurts. If people want to look like movie stars or singers, and if 14 yr olds want to wear thongs. I mean, I wouldn't let my kids do it, but other people do, and it doesn't really hurt anything.

What harm is coming to society? How is promiscuity going to bring about the fall of America?

 

[Duke]

Originally posted by Sage
Sorry if I'm technically straying "off-topic" with what I'm about to say, but I feel it's relevant as to why "pop culture" even exists.

One big point that Ayn Rand stressed in her books was the importance of selfishness. I can't do justice to the intricate story plots that she uses to prove this point, but basically it's important for humans to do what they want to do and think how they want to think.

Now, regarding RER's comments about how people are too hung up on how they look - This facet is practically pure selflessness. People are hung up on "style", rap, slang, etc., because they don't care what they think... they care what other people think. And again, as Ayn Rand so well showed in her books, this awareness of other people's wants and conforming to those wants sets itself up for a vicious cycle that expands and starts deteriorating society as a whole.

It could be argued that this is what "pop culture" is... widespread selflessness.

👍 👍 👍 Very well thought out and very well put, Sage. This idea is central to The Fountainhead.

danoff, I don't think that milefile is proposing that promiscuity is causing the downfall of America. I think he's simply lamenting the loss of the mystery and joy of sex by constant, purposeful, commercial overexposure.

I could be wrong.

 

[Gil]

Originally posted by milefile
Sex is becoming indecent in it's popular obtrusiveness. It's meaning no longer extends beyond recreational pleasure. It is brandished and abused. Promiscuity is the norm. Modesty is not only no longer popular, but downright strange, counter-cultural even. I see this as a loss.

OMG!!!
Yet again are we on the exact same page!
I agree with most everything you've said so far.
For example, I was watching a football game with my wife several weeks ago.
Sitting about two bleacher pews in front of us was a pair of attractive 14 year old girls. One of the Girl's fathers was in the row directly in front of us.
The Issue: This little girl was wearing low cut jeans and a top that would have barely touched the top of her pants if she had been standing up. As it was her back from just under her bra strap was hanging out as was everything from about an inch above her crack.
You'll never guess when her dad reprimanded her...
After she had wiggled about a bit and her panties were peeking out.
Hell, at this point, we've seen just about everthing else she had to offer! Just have her take it off and show the teeny bit we missed!(Heavy sarcasm)

Why is it that young women don't realize that they are still attractive w/o all the T & A hanging out for the world to see?
When did modesty become passe'?

Don't get me wrong, I like tasteful exhibitions of skin. But my philosophy is simply this: "A good woman's dress should be like a good preacher's sermon, (good politician's speech). It should be short enough to keep 'em interested, but long enough to cover the subject."
We are flirting with the destruction of our society. As you said, Rome gave in to depravity, and decandence and ultimately fell.

"Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."

 

[Sage]

Originally posted by neon_duke
Very well thought out and very well put, Sage. This idea is central to The Fountainhead.

Thank ya.

[...] I think he's simply lamenting the loss of the mystery and joy of sex by constant, purposeful, commercial overexposure.

That's what I was getting out of his posts too.

 

[milefile]

Neon duke, Gil, and Sage seem to have caught my drift.

Danoff, I think it hurts the people who are missing the full possibility of the experience of sexuality because of the fact that there is no longer anything special about it. The actual act of sex is diminished in both a qualitative and a quantitative sense. Sex is supposed to be different from normal experience, exceptional. The change I think I see is the gradual mixing of mundane existence (day to day living), and sexual experience, which should be a state of rapture (that could be said in different ways but that's my way). Although it may look like progress and liberation to some, the effect is to simultaneously hypersexualize mundane existence and dissolve sexual rapture into something mundane. The two extremes become watered down charicatures of eachother, and are lost, replaced with something dangerous, confusing, and incompatible with meaningful existence.

I just remembered the satirical representation of sex in the Huxley's Brave New World. It is refered to as "engagement". A date consists of "engaging" (sex). There is no ambiguity, nothing to interpret, nothing to anticipate, hence nothing beyond a routine recreational activity.

Indulging the senses to a transcendent degree is one of the great things about being alive, and this is the case only in contrast to most other times, which are not transcendent. When the contrast is gone, what was special becomes common.

I don't have a daughter, but if I did and she put on a t-shirt that said "porn star", the **** would hit the fan, and that means a lot of things.

*edit*

By "a lot of things" I mean it would be important for me that she understand why denuding and humiliating ones self in that way is sad and detrimental. Reasoning with adolescent, pubescent kids is difficult, to put it lightly. But if parents remembered their own lives and anticipated their children's they would be able to pass something valuable along. Of course this requires that the parents care and be capable of communicating well, on multiple levels, a complex (in its almost inaccesible simplicity), ambiguous, and essential part of life.

The parent should never lose sight of one simple and inescapable fact: their own sexual experience gave them the opportunity to pass this wisdom along to their offspring.

That is obviously a cyclical thing, and like all cyclical things, an interruption in it's orientation is magnified logarithmically in each iteration. Better to nip it in the bud. If the parents are already corrupted (yeah, I use that word to describe some people), there is much less hope. You can identify these types. They take their junior high aged daughters to Victoria's Secret and teach their kids that they better be ****able or they will be unhappy.

 

[jay wilkie]

Originally posted by neon_duke


Sometimes the product is a 15-second film clip of Britney tongue-kissing Madonna.

it's called french kissing... duh