Possible change in voting system.

[balang_479]

Hi, in the large polls like 2.0 comps and PMC and stuff there is generally 1 or 2 who dominate the votes, i know this doesn't always happen, but i think what would help spread out the voting is by being able to chose more than over picture to vote....

Say if there are more than 6 pictures you can vote on 2 and if there are more than 10 you can vote 3.

I wanted to know who would like to possibly use this system? I really think it could work, atleast we can give some credit to the pictures which aren't the best yet we still like.


Ben

 

[Boffin]

yeah....it keeps it close and this would be good in the tourneys.

 

[Moglet]

there is generally 1 or 2 who dominate the votes....

....Say if there are more than 6 pictures you can vote on 2

I think that explains why I think this is a bad idea.

 

[Watchman]

yeah....it keeps it close and this would be good in the tourneys.

+ 1

 

[waggles]

I think pick your favourite three.

Favourite gets 3 votes.
Second favourite gets 2 votes.
Third favourite gets 1 vote.

All posted, and then counted, of course.

 

[Lucas]

It's kinda sad seeing two pictures always dominating the polls and not changing at all. Especially when the pictures are bad but the effects make up for them. Not everyone has graphic edition programs. 👎

 

[Bram Turismo]

That's kind of the point in the 2.0 competitions. You can try to take a shot with great panning, depth of field, and some nice levels. But in the end, it's the whole package that brings out the result. Search through the history of 2.0 and you'll see that all winners are photoshop-nutheads. That's why we have the PMC and un-edited competition. So the point of people not having graphical programs that are necessary doesn't make sense related to those

There is a reason it is called 2.0, if you don't have heavy graphical programs, there are other competitions that do not require Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro or whatnot.

This is also why I think the current voting system works perfectly fine. Imagine two people in the Tourney finals, your favorite guy gets 3 votes, but the other one 2. This'll result is some rediculous vote numbers for each person. Choosing a winner is either yes or no, not yes and maybe. Having one vote means determination in your chosen winner. here is a reason why people win, because their shots are just better. I'm not trying to sound insulting now, but if I have 20 votes, and you have 1 vote, it is like this for a reason.

 

[Lucas]

Because you did an astounding photoshop in a photo that just sucks while mine was better stock vs stock? Not that you did so, since I have never really been in a tournament. But things happen that way, and many people have complained about it.

 

[Bram Turismo]

Because you did an astounding photoshop in a photo that just sucks while mine was better stock vs stock? Not that you did so, since I have never really been in a tournament. But things happen that way, and many people have complained about it.

Think about it, is it unfair for an editted image to win over a stock photo in the 2.0? Or do you reckon it's more fair if you win over mine in a stock vs stock in the un-editted competition?

People often, if not always, take the image with the goal of creating a photoshop image. Take my latest Cooper shot for example; It looks silly stock, bad angle, no scenery, crappy rims. But if I didn't take the image like that, it wouldn't look that great after my job in Photoshop was done. Meanwhile, I could've left the RUF RGT image un-touched and it'd look great, because it was my goal to keep a 50-50 balance between GT4 and Photoshop. I hope this is a clear explanation. In other words, people often think the stock images are crap, but forget to realize that the submitter took it exactly like that to make it into what it turned out to.

 

[Lucas]

You are right. Though sometimes I think they go way over the top with effects. It's not banned, alright, but it really seems they don't care about the shot itself as the main reason to vote, rather they think "Wow, shiny. Got to vote."
You are absolutely right, though. That's why I stick to un-edited competition, though I always lose

 

[Bram Turismo]

Well, I rarely win either, even though some say I'm very good. I've won so far one H2H comp, one tourney, and one 2.0 competition. Those are the only ones I seem to remember, and I've been around since 2005, so it takes just more than crazy photoshop skills

 

[Lucas]

Remember this, though: I voted for you most of the times

 

[balang_479]

To clear things up, I don't mean your favourite gets 3 votes and then 2 and so on... you can vote for 3 pictures and they all the 1 vote. Then the winner is the picture that most people have picked, i've used it for other forums and it works because there are more votes and more spread out, it's kinda hopeless for some people to enter if there is one or two amazing shots, like this it gives a few more people a chance maybe.

 

[Moglet]

To clear things up, I don't mean your favourite gets 3 votes and then 2 and so on... you can vote for 3 pictures and they all the 1 vote. Then the winner is the picture that most people have picked, i've used it for other forums and it works because there are more votes and more spread out, it's kinda hopeless for some people to enter if there is one or two amazing shots, like this it gives a few more people a chance maybe.

If there are 2 amazing shots then it will just mean they get even more votes than usual though.

Think about it, if you have a poll where 2 entries stand out against the rest, and you have 2 votes to give, where are those votes going to go? They will go on the 2 standout images. Meaning they will end up with even more of a huge lead over the rest of the pack!

 

[balang_479]

If there are 2 amazing shots then it will just mean they get even more votes than usual though.

Think about it, if you have a poll where 2 entries stand out against the rest, and you have 2 votes to give, where are those votes going to go? They will go on the 2 standout images. Meaning they will end up with even more of a huge lead over the rest of the pack!

I understand, the winners are not going to change, and they shouldn't. But at least there will be more votes for everyone, and pictures that would normally never get a vote get a few if people think that there is something about it they like.

 

[tupacrulez]

no, there won't be.

instead of, say, Franz beating Moglet 5-3, he'd just win 10-6. the people who get zero votes will still get zero votes.

I'll agree that sometimes people pass over the up and coming folk to vote for the vets because the perceived quality of the reg's shots are better, but that is simply the way it goes.

 

[Nicknamealguem]

I'll agree that sometimes people pass over the up and coming folk to vote for the vets because the perceived quality of the reg's shots are better, but that is simply the way it goes.

I know where you are coming. I think some people don’t vote for the photo but for the person doing it (the tournament qualifier is a clear example of it, especially this one: clicky), though I've also seen people that never entered any competition and the first time they entered it they won it.

Balang, since there is no option limiting the number of votes on the poll, that system would not work perfectly. You can see that in the tournament. There is a warning saying: Do not vote in the matches titles or your vote will not count. and there are still people that vote.

Think about it, if you have a poll where 2 entries stand out against the rest, and you have 2 votes to give, where are those votes going to go? They will go on the 2 standout images. Meaning they will end up with even more of a huge lead over the rest of the pack!

I understand, the winners are not going to change, and they shouldn't. But at least there will be more votes for everyone, and pictures that would normally never get a vote get a few if people think that there is something about it they like.

instead of, say, Franz beating Moglet 5-3, he'd just win 10-6. the people who get zero votes will still get zero votes.

Not at all. It is true that people that get zero votes will still get zero votes, but just sharing an experience that I’ve done in the Artistic Competition, where when there was more than 10 images, I opened a multiple choice poll, where it was chosen the bests images, that would go to a one choice final poll. The number of images going to that one choice poll, was dependent of the number of votes the images had.

Let’s say, there was three images with 15 votes, one with 14votes, another two with 13 and the rest with 10 or under, since there was a interval gap between the ones with 13 or more votes and the ones with 10 or less votes, and no gap untill the images in the front, only the photos with 13 or more votes would pass through the final stage.

Pros:

• The field decided which photos they wanted to see in a final poll, so only the best of the best would be chosen.
• In the case of a tie in the final poll, the points of the first poll would be added to the point of the final poll. Another poll would be created if they ended in a tie on the first two polls

Cons:

• Shots that were chosen could get 0 votes in the final (being a bit unorthodox).
• It gives a little too much work to pull it of.
• I only tried it in open themes, don’t know if the result would be the same in closed themes.
• Only workes in a more than 10 entries poll (a rare case nowdays)

Here you can match the results from the Qualify Multy Choice poll, to the One Choice Final poll

So, balancing the number of entries competitions get nowdays, I think it isn't worth it, and the current sistem cover it up nicely.

 

[Bram Turismo]

• The field decided which photos they wanted to see in a final poll, so only the best of the best would be chosen.

This is no different from the current system. The ultimate winner would still be the winner from both systems. The only you've done through this system is to take 10 days, instead of a 5 day poll. You'd be using nearly 2 weeks just to get a winner. No, I think your system more fits the Tournament; those with a certain amount of votes go through to the next round. (As it is right now)

There is no real solution to what some see as a problem, I don't see a problem anyway. If you come out as the best in the poll, you win. Fair is fair. Also, I looked at that link about the fact that some vote on the names, which is a silly thought. Yes, some were stupid enough to name their username in the link, but it were only a few entrants who did this. The top 8 that went through there were simply the best out of all of them.

 

[Nicknamealguem]

Sorry, I didn’t explain myself clear.

In normal competitions I think some people vote for the name and not the photo. The tournament, being anonymous, it is a clear sign of that. If the shots has name on it, I was clearly seeing some other people passing it, and others staying. I think I was a clear stay (if I had the name me on my), and I am certain Slipztrem would be a clear pass (if it had the name in the photo). That is why O like it so much anonymous poll. Another thing about it, is that you don’t know what other people entry will be like, so you will do your best.

And in the last links, you can see that in the first poll, the best ended in a draw, and in the last poll, the difference on votes was big.

 

[Swiss Legend]

That's kind of the point in the 2.0 competitions. You can try to take a shot with great panning, depth of field, and some nice levels. But in the end, it's the whole package that brings out the result. Search through the history of 2.0 and you'll see that all winners are photoshop-nutheads. That's why we have the PMC and un-edited competition. So the point of people not having graphical programs that are necessary doesn't make sense related to those

There is a reason it is called 2.0, if you don't have heavy graphical programs, there are other competitions that do not require Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro or whatnot.

This is also why I think the current voting system works perfectly fine. Imagine two people in the Tourney finals, your favorite guy gets 3 votes, but the other one 2. This'll result is some rediculous vote numbers for each person. Choosing a winner is either yes or no, not yes and maybe. Having one vote means determination in your chosen winner. here is a reason why people win, because their shots are just better. I'm not trying to sound insulting now, but if I have 20 votes, and you have 1 vote, it is like this for a reason.

Think about it, is it unfair for an editted image to win over a stock photo in the 2.0? Or do you reckon it's more fair if you win over mine in a stock vs stock in the un-editted competition?

People often, if not always, take the image with the goal of creating a photoshop image. Take my latest Cooper shot for example; It looks silly stock, bad angle, no scenery, crappy rims. But if I didn't take the image like that, it wouldn't look that great after my job in Photoshop was done. Meanwhile, I could've left the RUF RGT image un-touched and it'd look great, because it was my goal to keep a 50-50 balance between GT4 and Photoshop. I hope this is a clear explanation. In other words, people often think the stock images are crap, but forget to realize that the submitter took it exactly like that to make it into what it turned out to.

+1:tup: That is pretty much what I was gonna say.

I know where you are coming. I think some people don’t vote for the photo but for the person doing it (the tournament qualifier is a clear example of it, especially this one: clicky), though I've also seen people that never entered any competition and the first time they entered it they won it.

I felt that way in that poll too! Of course that was my first tourney.

I always thought that the winner of a particular week should get just one more perk besides being able to pick the theme.
I think their vote should by worth two votes in that themes poll. Since he picked that theme.
It also seems very apparent that once someone gets 3 or 4 votes in a particular week, others seem to jump on that shots bandwagon. Then it gets too the winner having something like 17 votes, the next person had like 5 or something. Seen it time and time again. I've been on both sides of that too.

One more thing. I think people really need to take into account which picture best suits the theme! Forget being hit by a blast of color or contrast. Hell forget composition. Take for instance drift week 43. Theme was S-curve drift. The strongest shot and the only one that actually pulled off "the theme" didn't win.
[/gripe]

 

[Boffin]

I think pick your favourite three.

Favourite gets 3 votes.
Second favourite gets 2 votes.
Third favourite gets 1 vote.

All posted, and then counted, of course.

I had this idea...it's a bit like the voting system on Big Brother - but will the GTP poll making software handle it?

 

[Bram Turismo]

What I'm having a problem with when it comes to the 3-2-1 voting system are finals. When in the final tourney rounds, voting 3 votes for the winner, and 2 votes for the runner up sounds a little rediculous. In my opinion, the finals are a matter of yes or no, so only 1 vote in the finals.

 

[in.s@ne]

I think that even in 2.0, shot composition beats outright photoshop-nutness.
I've seen PMC shots that will easily beat 2.0 shots, by their composition.

Also, the current poll system I think is fine - So what if certain people win all the time? Motivation to do better to try and steal votes from them!
I remember when I first got some votes in a PMC competition, I was ecstatic! It meant I was on the improve, whereas if I was always getting votes, I'd think I was always alright, and that's not quite right...

 

[waggles]

I had this idea...it's a bit like the voting system on Big Brother - but will the GTP poll making software handle it?

No, you have to post your votes.

 

[CamryFan]

Not relevant but why are all of us using Bram's Avatar. Makes it damn hard to follow.

+1 to ins@ne though.

 

[Bram Turismo]

Not relevant but why are all of us using Bram's Avatar. Makes it damn hard to follow.

Read the week 102 Photomode 2.0 thread and you'll understand

 

[CyborgGT]

The best photo is still going to win, and the worst pic is just going to look worse when the top three get dozens of unnecessary votes. I vote no.

 

[Swiss Legend]

Not relevant but why are all of us using Bram's Avatar. Makes it damn hard to follow.

+1 to ins@ne though.

It was mine first

 

[waggles]

The best photo is still going to win, and the worst pic is just going to look worse when the top three get dozens of unnecessary votes. I vote no.

This system rewards consistency, however. Someone who gets three votes every second vote, will have 6 votes for every 3 posts. Someone who comes second in each will have the same tally.