RUF 3400s Understeer issues

  • Thread starter panjandrum
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Uruguay
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The RUF 3400s understeers like crazy. Personally, it irks me when I turn the wheel and pretty much run straight ahead :-) Anyone had luck with getting this tuned-out? I'm looking for specific suspension values as I've been unable to resolve the issue with any of the suspensions settings I've tried. The best result so far has been accomplished by adding weight to the rear and trying to force the rear to slide around corners to produce oversteer. It works OK, but isn't an ideal solution and the machine still understeers more than I would like.

Thanks in advance!
 
panjandrum
The RUF 3400s understeers like crazy. Personally, it irks me when I turn the wheel and pretty much run straight ahead :-) Anyone had luck with getting this tuned-out? I'm looking for specific suspension values as I've been unable to resolve the issue with any of the suspensions settings I've tried. The best result so far has been accomplished by adding weight to the rear and trying to force the rear to slide around corners to produce oversteer. It works OK, but isn't an ideal solution and the machines still understeers more than I would like.

Thanks in advance!

You could get a fin and add more force to the front also.

Gimme a day to play with it... I'll get back to you on it...

Till then try this one out...

http://www.gtvault.com/SetupDisplay.cfm?SetupID=0402J844508E887CA0A240441

Works very decent... I'll wait till you try this out and lemme know if you still want me to work on it. Later
 
Wow, those settings really helped. Thing is, they really weren't all that different from what I was doing (rear softer sprung, front with more camber, rears with some toe-in). But I was running considerably softer springs as I've been racing Nuremberg a lot and it is brutal. It's amazing how much of a difference those specific settings made even though I was working along the same lines.

Also, the brake controller settings worked like a charm, the car now steers while braking instead of trying to go straight ahead. I tried similar settings on my Lotus Elise and it now steers while braking much better than it did. My tires also wear more evenly. Now, call me stupid, but I never tried adjusting the brakes for more power in the front - I always just assumed it would cause the front wheels to lock more easily and then you get no steering at all. I had tried the opposite (more power to rear brakes), it didn't help, and I gave up on the brake controller and just went with racing brakes. I expect I'll be spending some time next week playing with brake settings on all my favorite cars.

I did make a couple changes to the suggested settings. For one thing, the settings appear to be for GT3, so in some cases I had to choose the closest setting possible.

P.S. Thanks again for the help. I've read many of the tuning guides, but most of them try to combine the theory of the game physics with Real Life physics, which can cause some confusion. Someone who really knows his stuff should write up a short, concise, 2 or 3 page guide that simply states what works in the game to solve common handling issues.....
 
panjandrum
Wow, those settings really helped. Thing is, they really weren't all that different from what I was doing (rear softer sprung, front with more camber, rears with some toe-in). But I was running considerably softer springs as I've been racing Nuremberg a lot and it is brutal. It's amazing how much of a difference those specific settings made even though I was working along the same lines.

Also, the brake controller settings worked like a charm, the car now steers while braking instead of trying to go straight ahead. I tried similar settings on my Lotus Elise and it now steers while braking much better than it did. My tires also wear more evenly. Now, call me stupid, but I never tried adjusting the brakes for more power in the front - I always just assumed it would cause the front wheels to lock more easily and then you get no steering at all. I had tried the opposite (more power to rear brakes), it didn't help, and I gave up on the brake controller and just went with racing brakes. I expect I'll be spending some time next week playing with brake settings on all my favorite cars.

I did make a couple changes to the suggested settings. For one thing, the settings appear to be for GT3, so in some cases I had to choose the closest setting possible.

P.S. Thanks again for the help. I've read many of the tuning guides, but most of them try to combine the theory of the game physics with Real Life physics, which can cause some confusion. Someone who really knows his stuff should write up a short, concise, 2 or 3 page guide that simply states what works in the game to solve common handling issues.....

Well I'm glad it worked for ya...

The breaks thing helps to keep the tire wear even and as long as it's not too over done... I've found it works like a charm... I break late so being able to turn while breaking is a key part of any set up I either make/use.

It is for GT3, but most of the set up on that site works pretty well. Some little things are changed, like the .5 thing for the toe setting and down force, but all in all, they're all pretty good. That one guy who made that set up rocks at setting cars... I model a lot of the set ups that he's made... I've got another thing on this site that give's a pretty good way to start set ups... I've found that basicaly all the cars can be set up pretty well if you start off the way that the post I made says... after that it's just a question of tuning small things... let me know what you find some of the big problems are that you're having, and I'll see what I can do to help you out.... just a thought... Later...
 
panjandrum
Wow, those settings really helped. Thing is, they really weren't all that different from what I was doing (rear softer sprung, front with more camber, rears with some toe-in). But I was running considerably softer springs as I've been racing Nuremberg a lot and it is brutal. It's amazing how much of a difference those specific settings made even though I was working along the same lines.

Also, the brake controller settings worked like a charm, the car now steers while braking instead of trying to go straight ahead. I tried similar settings on my Lotus Elise and it now steers while braking much better than it did. My tires also wear more evenly. Now, call me stupid, but I never tried adjusting the brakes for more power in the front - I always just assumed it would cause the front wheels to lock more easily and then you get no steering at all. I had tried the opposite (more power to rear brakes), it didn't help, and I gave up on the brake controller and just went with racing brakes. I expect I'll be spending some time next week playing with brake settings on all my favorite cars.

I did make a couple changes to the suggested settings. For one thing, the settings appear to be for GT3, so in some cases I had to choose the closest setting possible.

P.S. Thanks again for the help. I've read many of the tuning guides, but most of them try to combine the theory of the game physics with Real Life physics, which can cause some confusion. Someone who really knows his stuff should write up a short, concise, 2 or 3 page guide that simply states what works in the game to solve common handling issues.....

With GT4 a lot of real world pratice can be applied to the game, if you are looking for more info on brakes take a look at the GT4 & Brakes thread (its not short or consise i'm afraid - but it is well ordered).

One thing with the GT Vault setting you have used is that its a GT3 set-up. In GT3 the brake balance controller set only the ratio between front and rear, not the level of force (so 20:20 and 0:0 were the same). In GT4 the brake balance controller also adjusts the level of braking force applied (and will still work to control the ratio between front and back).

As such, the setting of 20:17 (front/rear) I would consider to be far to high, try starting with 5:3 (front/rear) and working up if you need (try to keep the ratio between the front and rear close). Generally brakes set to 20 cause the ABS to cut in to early and it will actualy take you longer to stop than with a lower brake force setting. This has been tested, again head over to the GT4 & Brakes thread (link in my sig) and have a look at the ABS tests.

To find out why your new front biased brake setting has improved things have a look at this, yes it is designed purely for real world racing applications, but it works very, very well when applied to GT4.

Why Brake Balance Matters

Regards

Scaff
 
Here a suspension set that works well with all modifications including frame stiffener and sport tires. It has a very nicely controllable off-throttle oversteer, just brake or gas it away and it steers in neutrally. It is also a pleasure to drive a car with sport tires that can use the ends of the rumble strips as braking markers (brakes on 5/5) and still slow in time for the turn. I believe this tune is very close to arcade or license specification because I changed so little. Look: I exactly split the difference betweeen the spring levels, added my basic unit of 30mm to the rear ride height, dropped the bound one click, and applied my "basic" rear wheel drive camber setting (2.8/1.7), which, after testing, I adjusted to 2.9/1.8, oh, and auto to 13. Nothing else was changed, seems very basic, no? Yet the car drives like a dream.
spring 8.4/8.4
height 115/145
bound 7/7
rebound 8/8
camber 2.9/1.8
stabilizer 5/5
enjoy
 
OK, after reading this tip (thanks again btw, now I love the 3400s, not as much as the Lotus Elise of course.. :-) I played with brake settings and saw immediately why I didn't attempt curing understeer by increasing the front brakes: The game instructions specifically state the *reverse* of what actually happens when you use the brake controller! Good grief! Now we have at least two clear instances of when the physics in this game are completely reversed. One is the suspension stiffness issue, and now the brake controller issue. Anyway, adjusting the brake controller does exactly the opposite of what the instructions at the bottom of the screen say they will.

All my cars get much better control with slightly increased front braking power.
 
rk
Here a suspension set that works well with all modifications including frame stiffener and sport tires. It has a very nicely controllable off-throttle oversteer, just brake or gas it away and it steers in neutrally. It is also a pleasure to drive a car with sport tires that can use the ends of the rumble strips as braking markers (brakes on 5/5) and still slow in time for the turn. I believe this tune is very close to arcade or license specification because I changed so little. Look: I exactly split the difference betweeen the spring levels, added my basic unit of 30mm to the rear ride height, dropped the bound one click, and applied my "basic" rear wheel drive camber setting (2.8/1.7), which, after testing, I adjusted to 2.9/1.8, oh, and auto to 13. Nothing else was changed, seems very basic, no? Yet the car drives like a dream.
spring 8.4/8.4
height 115/145
bound 7/7
rebound 8/8
camber 2.9/1.8
stabilizer 5/5
enjoy

Wow. this setup really works!! takes away the understeer ALOT.! i'm suprised ! and amazed hee. good job!! thank a ton!
 
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