*Rumor* Gran Turismo 7 Prologue headed to PS4?

[Mulan]

If they let GT5 sell for say 15-20$ it would still continue to sell well. Now they had to kill it to force people to buy GT6.
But no matter, GT7 is coming and soon we will know more.

 

[Tenacious D]

Speaking of history, the GT series has never had to deal with new generation of consoles. GT6 released AFTER a new generation console that is the PS4. With rumors of GT7p and GT7 between 1-2 years away, it's a new situation that doesn't exactly favor GT6 sales. GT2 had a good two years to sell before GT3 arrived. GT4 had a good year before the PS3 arrived, and 2-3 years before GT5p came out. GT6 should be compared to GT2 and GT4, the second of the series per generation, and it's always behind the sales of the first. With that said, and the added fact that it's released cross generation, it just doesn't look good for me. Like I said before, previous GTs didn't have to deal with server issues either. I think 5 million would be the mark before it slowly trickles to a stop.

If GT5 took about 3 years to reach 11m, then GT6 would need at least 4 if history indicates anything. In 4 years time, GT6 will seriously be outdated. With GT6 sales selling less than half the pace of GT5 so far, what miracle can make GT6 reach close to GT5 sales?

This is very true. Gran Turismo and its fans both are in a weird position. GT6 just came out, and now, we're faced with this crazy rumor that GT7 Prologue may be just over the temporal horizon with 7 itself soon to follow. And it doesn't help that GT6's updates are beginning to crawl. If a next gen Gran Turismo came along within a year, even a Prologue, which made GT6 seem as outdated as GT4, that would put it on a dead end road to oblivion.

All this is hypothetical, but for me it's all very cool either way. If GT6 ends up with a number of polished updates by May, I'll have an awesomely expanded game to enjoy. If updates continue to crawl because most of PD are focused on GT7 and/or Prologue, I'll have a fantastic game to anticipate, and a GT6 to keep me occupied in the meantime. I know this is making some of you cringe, but this really is a weird time to be a Gran Turismo fan. I hadn't anticipated just how big a shadow PS4 would cast over the game, when all the hype was on Forza 5, P CARS, Race Room and Assetto Corsa doing it. Instead, other racing games are once again side issues for many of us, while the prospect of a next generation Gran Turismo tickles our fancies. Especially when a number of us, myself included, really wanted that next gen GT all along.

I'd rather not be bored, but this is getting a little nuts.

 

[berettagt88]

I'm not buying another unfinished Gran Turismo game

 

[Gran_Turismo]

This seems like a waste of resources to me. People are only excited because they want a GT game on the now current gen consoles to see all those pretty graphics and such.

 

[ildd]

This seems like a waste of resources to me. People are only excited because they want a GT game on the now current gen consoles to see all those pretty graphics and such.

That's the purpose of a prologue. To introduce an audience to what is possible and what to expect.
Otherwise known as a demo

 

[Mulan]

This seems like a waste of resources to me. People are only excited because they want a GT game on the now current gen consoles to see all those pretty graphics and such.

Well better have ps2 and play Gt3/4 all else is just better graphics on some cars. Why do they make next gen consoles at all is a mystery.

 

[The Stig Farmer]

Well better have ps2 and play Gt3/4 all else is just better graphics on some cars. Why do they make next gen consoles at all is a mystery.

Played NFS Rivals on a last-gen console? It's buggy as hell, but I hear few horror stories from players on next-gen consoles...

More power = games run better, smoother, faster. The last-gen is getting pushed beyond its limit.

 

[Gran_Turismo]

^^ When I said waste of resources. I mean't that it takes longer to release the official game. Remember people were complaining about GT5P delaying GT5.

 

[Tenacious D]

Remember people were complaining about GT5P delaying GT5.

Yes, and they were wrong. If anything, Prologue helped PD with things like online optimizations and physics, even if the end result was a little rough. Prologue may have taken three months to complete. What delayed GT5 was the PS3 itself, as well as an attempted damage build that no one liked.

And you may not have been here in 2009 when things were getting ugly with fans demanding GT5. If Prologue hadn't been here, GT Planet might have had to either restrict access or shut down for a while. Even if GT7 Prologue is more ambitious than GT5P, I doubt it will delay GT5 more than a few months.

 

[Johnnypenso]

^^ When I said waste of resources. I mean't that it takes longer to release the official game. Remember people were complaining about GT5P delaying GT5.

No question, putting out a finished product will take time away from developing the final game. How much time only PD knows for sure, but there's no question releasing a prologue will affect the release date of GT7. GT7P will simply be a cash grab like GT6 is turning out to be, a half-arsed, lame attempt at drawing in fans to the PS4 and hoping they don't notice Drive Club and PCars while doing so. Unless they really wow us with a new sound, AI and damage model along with a host of other changes, it'll just be more of the same with better graphics.

 

[eSZee]

Yes, and they were wrong. If anything, Prologue helped PD with things like online optimizations and physics, even if the end result was a little rough. Prologue may have taken three months to complete. What delayed GT5 was the PS3 itself, as well as an attempted damage build that no one liked.

And you may not have been here in 2009 when things were getting ugly with fans demanding GT5. If Prologue hadn't been here, GT Planet might have had to either restrict access or shut down for a while. Even if GT7 Prologue is more ambitious than GT5P, I doubt it will delay GT5 more than a few months.

Don't you think it's questionable for a company who makes a living making state of the art video games to over estimate the possibilities of a system they've had access to longer than almost everyone else?

I'm not denying that the PS3 was part of the reason why GT5/6 haven't been up to Kaz's expectations BUT don't blame the hardware when the software you develop is beyond its capabilities.

 

[ColouredBadger]

I'm interested in seeing the Next Gen's High Definition HD PS2 model 'Standards'.


But seriously. I don't think GT7 will be around as soon as some might suggest. I feel it was just marketing hype to go against the competitors as Gran Turismo is PlayStation's flagship racer and always has been so they need to 'stay in the game' so when Xbox One and Turn 10 announced Forza 5 I think Polyphony Digital had a sudden "Yeah well, GT7 will be coming soon" mentality just to try to get one up on them to say that they're no falling behind.

The things that a GT7 Prologue needs, irregardless of AI, Damage etc, it needs all premium cars, even if there is just HD versions of the current premiums (like GT5 copied the GT4 models and HD'd them). I'd be happy to have 350 - 400 Premium Cars which were re-worked for the next gen and it wouldn't take too much work on their part I wouldn't have thought. The tracks are fine for the most part, they again only need re-texturing and it's good to go in my opinion as a prologue. Which may be what they are suggesting.

Yes it needs new content to replace the old and boring GT4 car models and old modelled tracks (Indy Road Course, Trail Mountain) but I think a thinning of the crop, so to speak, is what is needed. Remove the standards, retouch and Super-HD the Premium Cars and then HD the tracks some more. Doing that will leave a lot of room for extra features to come in at a later date with the finished game.

AI is crap, we all know it but most people (I think) only ever race against them when they're grinding for money anyway so wouldn't we prefer crap AI for that? I'm an online person and race real people all the time and it's where the game really shines as a good racer. It would be nice to have realistic damage and forced retirements to discourage the smut online but again, it's not essential for a finished game in my opinion. The online features are fine so far, even if the community thing isn't there, it doesn't stop you having organised races with your friends, as I do twice a week in decent numbers of 10+ in a lobby.

All in all, I think a perfectly acceptable Prologue could be made by simply doing what has been mentioned. Copy over only the premium cars (reworked), copy only the Day/Night tracks (reworked) and add some races to do and that's it. It'd already have more content than it's competitors full games without really putting in too much effort to create it.

 

[Mulan]

I'm interested in seeing the Next Gen's High Definition HD PS2 model 'Standards'.


But seriously. I don't think GT7 will be around as soon as some might suggest. I feel it was just marketing hype to go against the competitors as Gran Turismo is PlayStation's flagship racer and always has been so they need to 'stay in the game' so when Xbox One and Turn 10 announced Forza 5 I think Polyphony Digital had a sudden "Yeah well, GT7 will be coming soon" mentality just to try to get one up on them to say that they're no falling behind.

The things that a GT7 Prologue needs, irregardless of AI, Damage etc, it needs all premium cars, even if there is just HD versions of the current premiums (like GT5 copied the GT4 models and HD'd them). I'd be happy to have 350 - 400 Premium Cars which were re-worked for the next gen and it wouldn't take too much work on their part I wouldn't have thought. The tracks are fine for the most part, they again only need re-texturing and it's good to go in my opinion as a prologue. Which may be what they are suggesting.

Yes it needs new content to replace the old and boring GT4 car models and old modelled tracks (Indy Road Course, Trail Mountain) but I think a thinning of the crop, so to speak, is what is needed. Remove the standards, retouch and Super-HD the Premium Cars and then HD the tracks some more. Doing that will leave a lot of room for extra features to come in at a later date with the finished game.

AI is crap, we all know it but most people (I think) only ever race against them when they're grinding for money anyway so wouldn't we prefer crap AI for that? I'm an online person and race real people all the time and it's where the game really shines as a good racer. It would be nice to have realistic damage and forced retirements to discourage the smut online but again, it's not essential for a finished game in my opinion. The online features are fine so far, even if the community thing isn't there, it doesn't stop you having organised races with your friends, as I do twice a week in decent numbers of 10+ in a lobby.

All in all, I think a perfectly acceptable Prologue could be made by simply doing what has been mentioned. Copy over only the premium cars (reworked), copy only the Day/Night tracks (reworked) and add some races to do and that's it. It'd already have more content than it's competitors full games without really putting in too much effort to create it.

Yes, but this is PD, they will complicate things. Id like to hear what they can do with sounds.
If that isnt good in GT7p and they say it will be fixed later on i give up GT totally. So sound, graphics, weatherchanges and physics is first.
Then they can ad extra cars, tracks and so on in the full game.
Oh, would be nice with live weather and sustainable trackchanges after each race/practice. Even details as safetycars, liftcranes and so on can be added later on.

 

[ColouredBadger]

Yes, but this is PD, they will complicate things. Id like to hear what they can do with sounds.
If that isnt good in GT7p and they say it will be fixed later on i give up GT totally. So sound, graphics, weatherchanges and physics is first.
Then they can ad extra cars, tracks and so on in the full game.
Oh, would be nice with live weather and sustainable trackchanges after each race/practice. Even details as safetycars, liftcranes and so on can be added later on.

Let's not push it too far. Safety cars, lift cranes and all that stuff really isn't needed, especially as there is a restart button in the game.
I'm trying to give a sensible and achievable limit of what would be acceptable as a next gen game, let alone a prologue to a full title and just adding stuff like safety cars is just ludicrous. Yes it's a nice idea but it'll never get used by the populous so a pointless feature. Similarly with the lifting crane, in fact, even more so ridiculous that you'd add something like that into a game.

Yes it's branded as a simulator but that's going too far. You might as well add ambulances that rush to your aid when you crash and have a helicopter on standby for a heavy crash to rush your driver to hospital. They could actually map the inside of a hospital room for when you wake up from your coma and make the login bonus work as a dream sequence until you wake up in real time. If your crash is really bad then your game blackscreens for good and that's game over... How realistic do you want a game?


I think what I said in my previous post is perfectly achievable and definitely acceptable as a prologue. Granted better sounds would be a bonus but that's missing the point. This is just to make an acceptable game to shove out as an essential beta to keep the competitors on edge. I'm sure most people would be happy with 400 premium cars and 20 day/night/weather tracks for what is essentially a demo.

 

[Tenacious D]

Don't you think it's questionable for a company who makes a living making state of the art video games to over estimate the possibilities of a system they've had access to longer than almost everyone else?

I'm not denying that the PS3 was part of the reason why GT5/6 haven't been up to Kaz's expectations BUT don't blame the hardware when the software you develop is beyond its capabilities.

You'll have to ask Kaz why he decided to load up the game with polygons and textures to the point that the PS3 struggled. I wouldn't have done that. The particle effect issues, I forget the method they used, but it's ugly. Shadows too. Beats me why they did that. Of course this is entirely off the topic of GT5 being delayed, and another reason for it is because GT PSP took the team away from GT5 work for a period of time.

Hey, GT5 and 6 are what they are. We can play them or not. Or spend time stirring up mud on message boards about them.

By the way, about GT7P, the Prologues are glorified demos or minigames. They aren't going to have more than a handful of tracks and a few dozen cars. I'd hope that GT7 itself will have more than 400 cars though. We have almost that many Premiums in GT6 now.

 

[Mulan]

Let's not push it too far. Safety cars, lift cranes and all that stuff really isn't needed, especially as there is a restart button in the game.
I'm trying to give a sensible and achievable limit of what would be acceptable as a next gen game, let alone a prologue to a full title and just adding stuff like safety cars is just ludicrous. Yes it's a nice idea but it'll never get used by the populous so a pointless feature. Similarly with the lifting crane, in fact, even more so ridiculous that you'd add something like that into a game.

Yes it's branded as a simulator but that's going too far. You might as well add ambulances that rush to your aid when you crash and have a helicopter on standby for a heavy crash to rush your driver to hospital. They could actually map the inside of a hospital room for when you wake up from your coma and make the login bonus work as a dream sequence until you wake up in real time. If your crash is really bad then your game blackscreens for good and that's game over... How realistic do you want a game?


I think what I said in my previous post is perfectly achievable and definitely acceptable as a prologue. Granted better sounds would be a bonus but that's missing the point. This is just to make an acceptable game to shove out as an essential beta to keep the competitors on edge. I'm sure most people would be happy with 400 premium cars and 20 day/night/weather tracks for what is essentially a demo.

You misunderstanf what i write.
I say first sounds and graphics as you say your self with small amount of cars just to show us.
But they can ad many features later on but primary is sound, graphics and physics. And since it is PD all is possible, if oilchange is so important to be shown then there is no limit
And i dissagree, safetycar is a perfect feature if we have longer races. Or should we once again have roling start and no real race?
If they show oilchange then why not liftcrane as a finishing picture if
there is a hardcore level of realism.
You see your driver go out and be upset, cameras tracking you and audience...you see your car getting lifted and you can continue see the rest of the race. That would be more live feel. And possible with ps4.

 

[Zuku]

You misunderstanf what i write.
I say first sounds and graphics as you say your self with small amount of cars just to show us.
But they can ad many features later on but primary is sound, graphics and physics. And since it is PD all is possible, if oilchange is so important to be shown then there is no limit
And i dissagree, safetycar is a perfect feature if we have longer races. Or should we once again have roling start and no real race?
If they show oilchange then why not liftcrane as a finishing picture if
there is a hardcore level of realism.
You see your driver go out and be upset, cameras tracking you and audience...you see your car getting lifted and you can continue see the rest of the race. That would be more live feel. And possible with ps4.

At the end of the day what everyone is trying to say is give us a COMPLETE PACKAGE that means (sounds, physics, premium cars, great selection of cars, more tracks, 24 cars on grid, Qualifying Weekend etc etc.)

As I said before if even one of these things is off the games always takes a hit.

 

[eSZee]

By the way, about GT7P, the Prologues are glorified demos or minigames.

That's fine with me, if they charge demo prices.
GT5P was limited in content because at the time of their production, there was almost no content. They released it with all they had ready at the time. They can't really do that with GT7P if all the current assets were in fact scaled back in quality for GT6 as Kaz has said.

 

[Tenacious D]

That's fine with me, if they charge demo prices.
GT5P was limited in content because at the time of their production, there was almost no content. They released it with all they had ready at the time. They can't really do that with GT7P if all the current assets were in fact scaled back in quality for GT6 as Kaz has said.

Uhm... not quite sure what you're saying. But if you insist that Prologue have all the content from GT6, Standard Cars aside, then it's not really a Prologue but GT7 itself.

Anyway, I know that a number of fans don't want Gran Turismo to advance very much, but I really think it needs to move into this racing sim area myself. PD can give us difficulty level settings to whittle out things like racing rules to an extent, but I really think the game would benefit if real life league racing was in GT7 and beyond, along with all the racing rules. This could be in its own section, GT Pro for instance, leaving Arcade and GT Mode for the traditional Gran Turismo everyone is used to.

I insist that Kaz and the development team sit down and, outside of the usual Gran Turismo Mode sandbox game, work on implementing as many racing leagues as possible in GT7, rules and all. And this means all the assets, from cars to tracks. For instance, getting the WTCC in the game. For that, they would need a number of tracks which would be appropriate for a WTCC season, and suitable cars with a number of liveries. I'm all for fudging and a bit of fantasy, because licensing and modeling every race team and venue on the planet just isn't feasible, so license as many teams and courses as can be modeled before release. Then for cars, go ahead and include similar types for variety. I'm not such a hard nosed purist and I like variety, especially if we get Race Mod back. Give us enough cars and tracks that a version of a WTCC racing "season" for a championship can be built in the game. The same for DTM, Super GT and other racing series which have assets in the game already. Build on them and give us a full blown racing experience. Some of the existing GT fantasy tracks would work with many leagues, so use them.

The FIA license is notoriously hard and expensive to get, so I'd be all for a fantasy version of the various FIA GT leagues through history, including cars. Let us use the cars in the game to beef up the field where appropriate, all those Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Aston Martins, Jaguars, Saleen and so on. Give us Race Mod for them and the ability to apply some kind of custom livery to them. Build a league, design a racing season, and let us tear though it. Do the same thing with as many leagues as you can, such as ALMS, BTCC, etc. For that matter, if Kaz is going to include NASCAR in the game, it should be well represented too.

Don't forget Rally racing, an old GT staple. The point to point races in GT5 were pretty fun, if the gravel physics were a little strange. Expand Rally into not just a series of races, but a WRC racing season, like the above examples.

Formula 1 is pretty much locked up, so unless SONY can work a miracle and wrest a license from Jean Todt, not to mention FIA GT licenses, PD can put those Formula GT open wheelers to good use in a Formula GT league, with tracks appropriate to such mind blistering racing.

Also, give us fantasy leagues to use all the cars in. I'd love to make up a racing Spirra, Cizeta and hundreds of other cars, but I'd really love a racing league appropriate for them. Like an Asia GT, which would be a great contrast to Japan's Super GT.

But one thing I'm hoping that GT7 does is reflect the entire motorsports world in its design. By that, I mean take the traditional GT Mode sandbox game and turn it into GT Academy. So before you get into all those racing leagues, you have to work your way up to them through GT Academy. And at this point, I'm unfamiliar with the bush leagues that Nissan and PD are working with, but either license them or give us fantasy versions. Let us work our way up through the ranks, and upon completion of this championship, we choose the league of our choice to move into, with greater challenges and rewards.

All this should extend to online too, with all the features promised for online racing in GT6. This means giving us all those club and league builder and manager tools, and a comprehensive Event Maker that's useful offline as well for creating events, series and championships.

One thing I'm hoping PD doesn't do is throw us the Event Maker, Course Creator II, Race Mod and Livery Editor, and leave it to us to create all these cars, leagues and championships. I could sure deal with that, but I want GT7 to have something special from Kaz and the team in the game, and you couldn't get more special than this. Outside of having some sort of GT Academy day for us to tear around a real race track in a race car for a day, but I don't see this happening. Imagine the carnage.

Do it, Kaz, you can. This could have been accomplished on PS3, so make this a reality on PS4, and you and SONY will rule the racing game field.

*whew!* I did say something about getting on with my day, didn't I?

 

[eSZee]

Uhm... not quite sure what you're saying. But if you insist that Prologue have all the content from GT6, Standard Cars aside, then it's not really a Prologue but GT7 itself.

GT7P=ALL NEW content, no GT6 carry over assets.
GT7=GT6-standards+GT7P+new content since GT7p.

 

[Tenacious D]

GT7P=ALL NEW content, no GT6 carry over assets.
GT7=GT6-standards+GT7P+new content since GT7p.

Hmm... not sure about that. I mean they could. GT5 Prologue had all new content, obviously, but I'm not sure that the fans would really demand that. For one thing, the traditional thing for a racing developer to do is keep prime real estate secluded until they can spring it on the world as a tantalizing carrot in the full game. I can't remember when we got word that Bathurst was in GT6, but I recall it being pretty late in the drama.

I know the whole matter of GT7 Prologue is up in the air, but if it happens, we'll have plenty of time to talk about it before it hits. Whatever PD does with it, it should be pretty darn cool.

Anyhow, I did mention something about a day and getting to it.

 

[Johnnypenso]

GT7P=ALL NEW content, no GT6 carry over assets.
GT7=GT6-standards+GT7P+new content since GT7p.

Plenty of the cars and track in GT6 are already next gen quality, they only need the system to bring out all the detail, so I don't think you'll see all new content for GT7P, at least not as far as the basics, cars and tracks that is. I can see stuff like filling the stands with animated people, more activity around the track like corner marshals, emergency trucks etc., more details to bring the track experience to life. If there is a prologue, expect some old, but premium tracks, a couple of new ones, mostly older cars but all premiums, a couple dozen new cars + a couple of old favourite standards premiumized, and then some added features, to make it feel different.

 

[eSZee]

Plenty of the cars and track in GT6 are already next gen quality, they only need the system to bring out all the detail, so I don't think you'll see all new content for GT7P, at least not as far as the basics, cars and tracks that is. I can see stuff like filling the stands with animated people, more activity around the track like corner marshals, emergency trucks etc., more details to bring the track experience to life. If there is a prologue, expect some old, but premium tracks, a couple of new ones, mostly older cars but all premiums, a couple dozen new cars + a couple of old favourite standards premiumized, and then some added features, to make it feel different.

I'm plenty sure PD will muck it up and give us a higher def GT6 rehash with 1/10th the content but full price. I'd be a fool to expect anything else.

 

[Mulan]

Easy. GT7p cost is drawn from the full game as discount. Like a preorder for PD and good beta testers. For us a smaller risk and a nice gesture when we buy the full version.

 

[pasigiri]

PD has to show some something on PS4 soon or they will loose a lot of sales to Project Cars.

 

[eSZee]

PD has to show some something on PS4 soon or they will loose a lot of sales to Project Cars.

No they won't. No one knows what Pcars even is and they'll be weary to buy it.
SMS doesn't have the luxury of throwing any title out there knowing millions will buy it without giving it a second thought.

 

[Zuku]

No they won't. No one knows what Pcars even is and they'll be weary to buy it.
SMS doesn't have the luxury of throwing any title out there knowing millions will buy it without giving it a second thought.

True, but it also depends on how much advertisements are being done for Pcars in the near future. More Adverts(successful ones) would lead to a lot of business for them.

 

[pasigiri]

No they won't. No one knows what Pcars even is and they'll be weary to buy it.
SMS doesn't have the luxury of throwing any title out there knowing millions will buy it without giving it a second thought.

Actually, considering the fact that, as it currently stands, PCars is the ONLY racing simulator on the horizon for PS4, it'll get people's attention by default. It's also completely gorgeous. They may not have millions of dollars to sling around, but what they do have is a bonified contender.

 

[daus26]

Actually, considering the fact that, as it currently stands, PCars is the ONLY racing simulator on the horizon for PS4, it'll get people's attention by default. It's also completely gorgeous. They may not have millions of dollars to sling around, but what they do have is a bonified contender.

Completely gorgeous? I don't know. It doesn't look anything special graphics-wise imo judging by that trailer. I hope next gen is much more than that, because in some parts of that trailer, GT6 looked better (no joke). It does have great sound though. If people are to judge by looks, Driveclub would be the go to racing game on the PS4. The Xbox One has Forza 5.

I think PCars will do as well as Codemaster's F1 series. The casuals make up for the majority of game sales, so great physics won't matter much as to the hardcore (which makes the minority of sales) and Drivelcub on the PS4 may just be enough for PCars to have some competition on the market.

 

[The Stig Farmer]

It doesn't look anything special graphics-wise