S.Q.A.T.

  • Thread starter BlueShift
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France
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BlueShift
Hello guys,

Here's come a new software, the Speedy Quasicool Adaptative Tool, or SQAT for short.
It's developped in C# 4.5 and would help you to tune your car. This is not an "autotuning" tool.

Garantied virus free, but don't be careless, have a virus check on the file if you don't thrust me and don't download this anywhere else than here, this will be the only place where I'll post it.

SQAT.jpg


Weigth & Springs tab
- Look at the weigth of your car in the game, put the number you found in the box.
- Next, go find on google the gaz tank capacity of your car and put the number in the tab.
- The app will tell you how many kg that makes and update the weigth consequently.
- Go in the game, use same amount of ballast kg and the position of the gaz tank (usually rear).
- Check in the game if the weigth balance changed
- Put the weigth balance in the app
- The app will calculate stiff springs at 100mm rh for you.
-> if you want to lower a RH, check the rear RH and move front rh. The app will auto-calculate the springs you should have.
-> if you want to lower a spring without touching the rh, check the rear spring and move front spring. The app will auto-calculate the springs you should have.

(etc, etc).

After the weigth selection phase, you can also put numbers you have from an existing tune and move the rh/spring the way you want, ticking a spring or rh so the spring balance stays the same.

Gearbox tab
- First select your transmission type. For the moment, 4WD transmission is not supported.
- Find on internet the tire code of your car. Enter them in the app.
- select the number of your speeds, enter the gear ratio, final. Values are the Chevrolet C7 2014 by default (but 7 check).
- The app will calculate ateignable topspeeds for you but this doesn't account air effect on your car
- Click on the "aero" checkbox, then click on the set aero button.
- Check if you know : track temperature, heigth of the track, humidity of the air. Value are SS-Road-S characteritics by default, when entering the track via Arcade and no change but the "Realistic" option.
Humidity of the air is (i think) NOT the humidity of the track. I don't know why I put it, but it have an effect on air density, so why not.
- Go run on road-x, with a very high max speed autoset. The car should block at top speed without reving on the second straigth of the track or that won't work.
- Save replay, eventually.
- Watch replay, note the highest speed you got and it's rpm on a paper.
- Go find a ruler.
- Go in the setup menu. Find with your ruler, find how much Power or Torque you had at this rpm. Don't look stupid if you got a wife and/or kids.
- Put RPM, Torque or Power in the app. The app will calculate "somehow" A.Cd (or S.Cx). I'll explain the "somehow" later.
- Click set.
- Enter the torque peak, the power peak and eventually the rev "peak" either in torque or power (same as top speed, you need to find with a ruler, this is optional but it will give you the shifting points, so set this at rev rpm if you want with high Power or Torque if you're lazy and don't care "aero effects" there).
- Tada ! The app will show you where the car have not enough power to counter the "air".
- Latest fast addition, the app will compute a gear ratio according to your final to show you the best speed in this car with the current power she have +/- 1 km/h or +/- 1mph and it will give you the gear ratio (+/- few clics I think), you need to setup to atteign this speed... So This is a good tool for drag racing I think.
- Okay that was not so Speedy but Quasicool for sure :)
- You can vary gear ratio before or after the air is done, check/uncheck the aero checkbox, set the air again, change units via UK/US checkboxes, no problems (had an hard time with GB unit system).

To implement:
- Rolling resistance. Currently, the A.Cd is not really the true A.Cd. Ingame Aero losses + ingame Rolling resistance losses + ingame Transmission losses are computed into a "virtual" A.Cd set at very high speed. So to gain a few mph/kmph, this value will be extrapolated to be only A.Cd losses. That's why it's +/-1 kmh because most of the time you are very close to the Power Peak at top speed. If you are far, this virtual A.Cd will compute bad air top speeds. I need to perfect this, but rolling resistance is a little more difficult to find (I have an experiment involving the Road X hill maybe but we will see this later).
- Transmission losses could be computed maybe because they may be related to rpm at top speed vs power peak rpm.
- 4WD : yet to understand how the torque is given to the wheels. I think it's more difficult than the default 30% front 70% rear because if the front tires does 30% of the rolling, the rear tires, if same size should do 30% to. See what is my problem ? :)
- Accel checkbox to switch the view from speed to accel to help 1/4 mi drag :P
- If I've got plenty of time and you too, a way to take a photo of the power/torque curves and implement the files in the app. Very far future if not science-fictional.
-... Things I've forgot like lift after studying drag => aero tab I think, after all losses are identified.

Unit tab
- Enter a value in one unit to see the value in various units. HP to PS (or various other power units all based on PS), Lbsf.Ft to N.m to kgf.m, etc.
Not meant for tuning but can help and was easy to make.

---

Version 0.0.1
- basic weigth and spring support, garage and gearbox tab not working yet.

Version 0.0.2
- gearbox tab, air effect on topspeed, compute topspeed with air.
- unit tab
- SI / US / UK unit support (damn you, british ppl ! :))
- undamped springs frequencies (spring tab)
- corrected a bug on mass instead of mass / 2 in the first tab.
- the numeric updown should display with no screen res issue. The app should be resizable (i have not tested the new unit and gearbox tab, damn it).

Next :
- Basic LSD support. Will make people understand easier the LSD for those who didn't understood it my way, that's quite propaganda :)
4WD won't have support until I 100% understand the transmission, so after the 4WD in gearbox tab I think.
For other people, this will have no great purposes I think. I'm thinking about a few usefull thing maybe, you will see that.
- Maybe garage. The more I wait, the more difficult it will be... But that's quite unfun work :/

Please do tell if you find bugs (there is some).
 

Attachments

  • SQAT 0.0.2.zip
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I get an error statement from zip when I try to download this file.
I get an error statement from zip when I try to download this file.

Re-zipped via 7zip, in zip algorythm.
What happened was originaly, I created a new .rar, changed the name to SQAT.zip and compressed the file that way, by drag and dropping. It may be a little harsh but it worked here... Maybe that's because I had WinRar.

Does it work now ?

@breizhboss : no, you're not the boss of her, the boss of her is my grandfather :) :) :)
 
"I'm a fellow American Unit user and I love bugs."

:lol:

And the name is pretty sweet too. 👍
 
Any chance you could add spring frequency to the app? It's helpful for comparing spring rates in different cars.

The formulas are:

Front frequency = 1 / (2 * PI) * sqrt(front spring rate in N/M / (weight of car in kg * front weight distribution / 2))

Rear frequency = 1 / (2 * PI) * sqrt(rear spring rate in N/M / (weight of car in kg * rear weight distribution / 2))


BTW I had no problem opening the original ZIP file. It all works fine this end, except for some of the boxes are slightly too small for the number they contain.

KUTGW!
 
Any chance you could add spring frequency to the app? It's helpful for comparing spring rates in different cars.

The formulas are:

Front frequency = 1 / (2 * PI) * sqrt(front spring rate in N/M / (weight of car in kg * front weight distribution / 2))

Rear frequency = 1 / (2 * PI) * sqrt(rear spring rate in N/M / (weight of car in kg * rear weight distribution / 2))


BTW I had no problem opening the original ZIP file. It all works fine this end, except for some of the boxes are slightly too small for the number they contain.

KUTGW!
Thanks for the formulas, I'll be putting them in the next update. I need to understand them before. Got a master in physics (but in electronics) so it's not a pain to try understanding for me :)
For the small boxes, do you use different char size in Windows by any chance ? I was allready putting "999" in boxes with 3 digits or "99.99" for springs for exemple. Do you miss a few pixel or more than a few ? Screenshot or it doesn't exist :)
 
This is how it looks on my computer. It's windows 7 64 bit if that helps!
How uncool, everything is messed like if you reduced the app window :(
1920*1080 ?

For the spring freq, that's undamped frequencies (ie comp = 0, ext = 0), I'll try to see what's possible to do with damped springs. The purpose of the dampers is to reduce those oscillations, I don't know if this is good to show because it doesn't represent anything in the game (you can't set <1 dampers).

I was about to study springs hysteresis anyway, that's the next step after the garage tab (0% done but I can copy paste some code from a previous project) and the gearbox tab (20% done).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damping
 
Ah that might be it, my resolution is 1600x900. I can't go any higher than that!

Spring freq was nothing technical - I just use is to get a starting point for the springs. So for example if I tune one car and it has a freq of say 2.5, if i then go onto another car that's much lighter/heavier and set the springs to the same freq it should "feel" roughly the same in terms of spongeyness/stiffness if that makes sense? So its just a way of carrying over a starting point from car to car if you see what I mean.
 
Ah that might be it, my resolution is 1600x900. I can't go any higher than that!

Spring freq was nothing technical - I just use is to get a starting point for the springs. So for example if I tune one car and it has a freq of say 2.5, if i then go onto another car that's much lighter/heavier and set the springs to the same freq it should "feel" roughly the same in terms of spongeyness/stiffness if that makes sense? So its just a way of carrying over a starting point from car to car if you see what I mean.
That's okay, I'll make it. Spring hysteresis / dampening is of better use I think, but I can see what you need, and it's easy to do. For the res... I have to figure how to bypass this pb aswell.
 
This is quasicool!! I want to be part of the journey. If ok with you I will start a live log of me tuning a car with SQAT in my Car & Tune thread and I will report bugs in this thread. What do you think would be a good choice to start with, FR or MR?

May I suggest that you add the version number to the file name (SQAT_0.01.exe)? This way if we have to rollback we can pick the right file.
 
@donpost : I don't really know how to solve this, so I may use bigger textboxes instead losting time in searching a difficult solution i don't know yet. Next update, that will be with the gearbox (basic version and no 4WD because there's something I don't understand on 4WD gearboxes) + your spring freq.

This is quasicool!! I want to be part of the journey. If ok with you I will start a live log of me tuning a car with SQAT in my Car & Tune thread and I will report bugs in this thread. What do you think would be a good choice to start with, FR or MR?

May I suggest that you add the version number to the file name (SQAT_0.01.exe)? This way if we have to rollback we can pick the right file.
Ok for the version number.
No problems, but please report bugs here if it's not what you're saying, so I don't chase bugs around everywhere...

I know there's some. The app have lots of problems if you start to use strange ammounts, like 99.99 springs, tick the springs and make -1 on the associated RH. It will crash.
Also, when using "tab" the order of the focus is not set rigth.
Donpost said there was a res problem aswell.
Resizing has been fixed in 10m this evening (couldn't work so much on it today)

I'm sorry guys, it's quite artisanal coding. I'm suposed to be a pro coder in C# web, so for this kind of software I'm still learning.
 
@donpost : I don't really know how to solve this, so I may use bigger textboxes instead losting time in searching a difficult solution i don't know yet. Next update, that will be with the gearbox (basic version and no 4WD because there's something I don't understand on 4WD gearboxes) + your spring freq.


Ok for the version number.
No problems, but please report bugs here if it's not what you're saying, so I don't chase bugs around everywhere...

I know there's some. The app have lots of problems if you start to use strange ammounts, like 99.99 springs, tick the springs and make -1 on the associated RH. It will crash.
Also, when using "tab" the order of the focus is not set rigth.
Donpost said there was a res problem aswell.
Resizing has been fixed in 10m this evening (couldn't work so much on it today)

I'm sorry guys, it's quite artisanal coding. I'm suposed to be a pro coder in C# web, so for this kind of software I'm still learning.
Yup, I meant my experience goes in my thread and bugs go in this one (yours).

Unable to run the program. It asks for .NET 4.0xxx and I am running 4.5. Program just crashes with no message. Do I have to install 4.0 or do you think you may be using a deprecated function somewhere?

ps. program wont work on .NET 3.5 either... seems that it needs a specific version of 4.0
 
Just checked that project was really generated in .NET 4 Framework... It is.
Using Win 7 64 but I don't think there's an incidence. Will look into that aswell but the nigth is GT6 play time :)
 
I'm sure Blue will correct me if I'm wrong, but this is just a (very useful) tool to help you tune suspension - and to automate a few calculations. It will help with handling, but you need to be able to use it. It's not a win button.
 
Currently, it helps having a balanced "weigth under the chassis". The same weigth can be applied to front train or rear train to make the car touch the floor.

It's supposed to help growing speed in apex, for the spring and RH part.

Speed in apex = 95% of the time better performances. Not 95% of performance, but better performance that the same model with a "stable" setup (ie, need to brake normal, throttle in apex, accel normal, no drifting, no strange crab cornering or anything unusual). For the drift cars, that will make the drifts balanced "by spring" aswell.

People and me thinks that when in Apex, only lateral force works for grip. So if you have 400 kg in front and 600 in rear (40:60), with the same RH, rear spring should be equal at rear springs * 60/40. More grip = more speed. That what the app tries to do.

It's not a perfect solution because :
- RH is not by any means spring courses
- Real front spring course may differ from real rear spring course, esp in case of different wheels
- Braking effects on the chassis is usually more violent than accel effects. I won't be qualifying this for the current version.

It's a very basic model especially because of the spring course problem but it'll help moving Spring / RH around if you try to follow Front Spring x Front RH should be balanced to Rear Spring x Rear RH, balanced with the true front : rear weigth ratio.

That model will give you some "clues" to start a tune with. Following the balance "law" will give you nice results but they usually can be better. That's why it's not an autotuning tool.

So by helping tune, is this helping top speed or the relative handling?
Top speed soon, I'm studying aerodynamics and their relation to the gearbox rigth now and I migth have something. "Theorical gearbox" is finished, fonctional and bug free but it gives stupid results due to the lack of air.
But... If I can ask the player a topspeed measurement, maybe gearboxes will be adaptable.... Maybe I can measure the aerodynamics of the car like that too, if i compare to the theorical gearbox :)
Now that part would be usefull for everyone. The problem is I can't rely on that much documentation (for the game) other than "more aero = more grip, less aero = more speed".

@donpost : I think the size problem will be gone.
@pipntick : really sorry, I didn't study the framework problems for now. The bug should stay in the next version.

Somehow unrelated (:)) look how übercool is the link I just found : http://www.mayfco.com/tbls.htm

The garage is not done yet. Putting a tune is quite tedious now, its the next thing I do after "aerogearbox" because the subject is quite fascinating :)

edit - have to quit programming tonigth for now, I'm gonna try to make a drifter out of a 2CV due to a stupid bet this morning... In RS tires :D
I also had to post a GT-R since two days but some elements of the tune are not finalized.
 
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Few questions that are blocking me rigth now, I need help:

I've got a question for those of you american guys.
- What is the unit of your ride heigth in the suspension setting screen ?
- What is the unit of your power @ x rpm in the main garage screen ?
- What is the unit of your torque @ y rpm in the main garage screen ?
- What is the unit of track temperature ?

I've got a question for those of you english guys.
- What is the unit of your ride heigth in the suspension setting screen ?
- What is the unit of your power @ x rpm in the main garage screen ?
- What is the unit of your torque @ y rpm in the main garage screen ?
- What is the unit of track temperature ?

Anyone else.
- Do tell if you're not using mm in the suspension screen.
- Do tell if you're not using ch / rpm (or bph/rpm i think it's the same) in the main garage screen for the power.
- Do tell if you're not using Nm / rpm in the main garage screen for the torque.
- Do tell if the unit of track temperature is not °C.
 
Hi Blue, I just downloaded again (from the first post) and the size problem is still there.

I can't get on the PS right now, but off the top of my head that on the English version ride height is in mm and power is in HP. I'll check the other two tomorrow.
 
Hi Blue, I just downloaded again (from the first post) and the size problem is still there.

I can't get on the PS right now, but off the top of my head that on the English version ride height is in mm and power is in HP. I'll check the other two tomorrow.
That's normal, there is no new version for now. I fixed your stuff in my local version, which contain the gearbox tab with ot much usefull information there (giving the theorical gear is not good enough, I have to take into account aero / power, if I take into account power, I must document myself on bph/ps/hp difference and torque aswell).
After I'll have this, I will be able to look into speed calculated with lot more precision. The spring freq will be in this build too. I think I'll have ~4h of work on it to make it in european units + ? for USA units. Or I drop USA, that's not if I would care :)
 
Got the rest of the units for you:

Temperature is in °C
Torque is in kgfm (kilogram-force metres)

I hate kgf as a unit - why can't they just use Newtons!?
 
Got the rest of the units for you:

Temperature is in °C
Torque is in kgfm (kilogram-force metres)

I hate kgf as a unit - why can't they just use Newtons!?
I assumed you were english ?

I put a new tab named "Units" to convert some units in what I knew to be used in GT + a few US moment units i found on the web.

Next release with the aerogearbox in +/-8h if everything is allrigth + ingame tests proven good enough.


Main new screen so far (just saw the "infinity bug"):
Screen1.jpg
 
Just a quick update if people are waiting...
I'm sorry, I'm "slow". I had a lot of problems with this recently because aerodynamics is lot more simple and lot more complicated at the same time than I though. I isolated last important bugs in the software (but I need to sleep).
The problem is what I did for the gearbox is not as usefull as I originally though.

Drag and air doesn't reduce speed to your car, in fact it prevent it to accel (sum of forces = m.a), and I took a wrong way since a few days, trying to qualify drag as something that would reduce your car speed.
I need to recenter and rewrite parts of the software because it's a mess rigth now (but a stable mess compared to this morning).

I would need to put rolling resistance too but there will be a release before, with content about the differential maybe to make it a little more usefull.
 
0.0.2, "drag edition", will take screenshots later.

People have not found my geeky easter egg yet :)
 
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