Stereotypes in Sports

[D3ATHS1NBUNCH3S]

I read an online article the other day, saying boxer Orlando Diaz was gay. I thought, "A thread about gays in sports would be an interesting topic", and I have therefore decided to post it (apologies if this belongs in the "Gay Marriage" thread in OACE).

Some of the more famous names of gay athletes include Diaz, US Women's National Soccer Team Player Megan Rapinoe, and Basketball Hall of Famer Sheryl Swoopes.

Most reactions have been positive. Rapinoe has said numerous times that her team supports her being a lesbian.

Others, not so much. I have an instance that is close to home for me: A center on our High School's Basketball Team who graduated a few years back, was indeed gay. His teammates greatly supported him being gay. However, when he received a scholarship to play college basketball, he was heckled by his teammates after they found out he was gay. He left the university two months later.

Should gay athletes stick to a policy similar to "Don't Ask, Don't Tell", or should they be open about it?

Edit: Stereotypes. What are your opinions about it in sports?

 

[Joel]

I think it's absurd that someone should have to hide their sexual orientation from their team, but unfortunately that is the reality for some teams in some sports. There aren't any openly gay players in the NHL yet, but in the last couple years there's been an initiative called the "You Can Play" project, which is about accepting gay rights. The hockey community has been outwardly supportive about it, but there's still a lot of progress to be made.

Unfortunately, sports seems to bring out some of the worst kinds of people. There's a lot of people involved with athletics who are just the scum of the earth. Sounds like the center on your High School's basketball team ran into some of them at college. I think don't ask don't tell is a joke, and any team I've ever played for or will ever coach in the future will ever have a DADT policy.

 

[Adrenaline]

Anyone who wants to be open about information, has to be willing to accept the criticism for it, whether justified or not. Has nothing to do with being gay, as it applies to everything in life. Knowledge is power.

There's not a single decision in life, that someone in the world won't disagree with.

 

[XPOWER180]

In this day and age what the hell does it matter?!!! The fact that a thread has even been started about it shows the world still has a long way to go. Pathetic.

 

[Skuh]

Anyone who wants to be open about information, has to be willing to accept the criticism for it, whether justified or not. Has nothing to do with being gay, as it applies to everything in life. Knowledge is power.

There's not a single decision in life, that someone in the world won't disagree with.

A black person has to be willing to accept racism for being black?

Same rule applies to homophobia.

 

[Liquid]

Justin Fashnau - the most high profile gay association footballer. Got nothing but criticism and abuse, ended up going off the rails and killing himself.

Gary Speed - hugely successful football player and former Wales manager. Committed suicide last year with no apparent reasons. However, it was rumoured that the national newspapers were going to print a story saying that he was a homosexual. Allegedly.

Graeme Le Saux - happily married heterosexual, but was dogged by rumours of his sexuality his entire playing career. It culminated in an incident against Liverpool where Robbie Fowler was bending over towards him, pointing his backside in his direction. Le Saux punched him. Fowler has never apologised for the incident, saying it was all a joke.

Gareth Thomas - one of the finest rugby players of his day, came out as gay after he retired.

 

[Adrenaline]

A black person has to be willing to accept racism for being black?

Same rule applies to homophobia.

Yes... In the same way a white person has to accept racism for being white. Racism can, and does, go more than one way. Doesn't matter what race, or ethnicity you are, being that ethnicity(Caucasian included) means you are susceptible to being disliked for being said ethnicity.

Also, race isn't really 'personal information', so even if you had a point, it would still be invalid in regards to my initial statement.

 

[Skuh]

Yes... In the same way a white person has to accept racism for being white. Racism can, and does, go more than one way. Doesn't matter what race, or ethnicity you are, being that ethnicity(Caucasian included) means you are susceptible to being disliked for being said ethnicity.

Also, race isn't really 'personal information', so even if you had a point, it would still be invalid in regards to my initial statement.

No, you dont have to accept racism for being white. This is wrong. So is racism and homophobia. Therefore they are unacceptable. This is the link between the two. This is valid.

 

[D3ATHS1NBUNCH3S]

A white person absolutely has to accept racial stereotypes in sports. For example, if you see a black man playing basketball, or an asian man playing chess, you assume they are good at it. The common racial stereotypes for white people are in hockey and soccer/football.

 

[Villain]

Homophobia is not okay. It's not okay to heckle a player for being gay, just like it's not okay to hoot like a monkey or throw bananas onto the pitch every time the black player touches the ball.

I think society is getting slightly better about this, but there is still a ways to go. I would prefer a player (and all gay players) to be open about it, but I can understand why they wouldn't want to make something like that public.

 

[dylansan]

A white person absolutely has to accept racial stereotypes in sports. For example, if you see a black man playing basketball, or an asian man playing chess, you assume they are good at it. The common racial stereotypes for white people are in hockey and soccer/football.

I don't assume that at all, and I don't think most people do.

Yes, there are a lot of black basketball players, but that doesn't mean all black people are good at basketball. I know there's a stereotype for Asians being smart, but they're not all good at chess.

Personally, if I see someone playing a sport on a professional level, like in a chess tournament or something, I'm going to assume they're pretty good. This means most of the basketball players I'm going to assume are good will be black, but not because they're black.

It seems you want us to accept racism because you are slightly racist yourself. You also seem to assume everyone else thinks the way you do, but I assure you many don't.

 

[D3ATHS1NBUNCH3S]

I'm not the only one who thinks that, trust me. Jeremy Lin, the asian basketball sensation who stormed onto the scene last year, even has said that his race affected his recruitment, as he was offered no Division I Basketball Scholarships out of high school. Says Lin:

I'm not saying a top-five state qualification automatically gets you offers, but I do think (my ethnicity) affected the way coaches recruited me. If I was a different race, I think coaches would've treated me differently.

Rex Walters, the head coach of the San Francisco University men's basketball team, also said this about Jeremy's little recruitment:

People who don't think stereotypes exist are crazy. If Lin is is white, he is ethier a good shooter or heady. If he's Asian, he's good at math. We're not taking him.

Another analyst has also said that he did not think Lin's race affected his recruiting until he watched one of his games, in which about ten scouts were there. Not for Lin, but for a black player who he thought was only good enough for junior college basketball.

So, as you see, I'm not alone. When most scouts see a black man, they think: "Athlete". When most scouts see a white man, they think: "Good shooter". When they see an asian man, they think: "High Basketball IQ".

(Can someone change the thread title to "Stereotypes in Sports"? My mobile isn't working)

 

[MUSC4EVER]

In the UK, there has been a lot of racial incidents in the last few years, on the pitch we have had the Suarez-Evra incident last season and more recently the Terry-Ferdinand incident..which the implications are still being felt!, also there has been a lot of abuse on Twitter directed to players and pundits..

.. i think that there are a few sports stars who are homosexuals, but are too scared to come out because of the reaction they would get from the fans and maybe theyre own teammates if they did..

..can you imagine the abuse they would get from the fans!

 

[Villain]

Since this thread has moved away from homosexuality as a topic, would it be better to re-name the thread? I say that because the off-topic move doesn't necessarily appear to be a negative.

"Prejudice in Sports" ?

 

[D3ATHS1NBUNCH3S]

I said "Stereotypes in Sports", but I need it to be changed by a mod, since my mobile isn't working.

 

[Adrenaline]

No, you dont have to accept racism for being white. This is wrong. So is racism and homophobia. Therefore they are unacceptable. This is the link between the two. This is valid.

Are we arguing the point that it's unacceptable, or that it exists for both sides? Because I don't think you're following along with the point of the discussion.

You act as if a person can only be criticized for being different than the 'norm' and you are incorrect. Put any 2 people in the same room, and any difference between them, can become an arguing point, or reason to dislike the other. Doesn't have to be race, doesn't have to be sexuality, or religion. It could be the simple fact that Person A is a Vegetarian, and Person B thinks that person A is stupid for making that choice. There's nothing wrong with being a vegetarian, but guess what, eventually you're going to run into someone who will mock you for doing it. There's nothing wrong with being gay, black, white, christian etc etc etc, but any information you share with another person in this world, is just one more opportunity to disagree with you on how you live your life.

That doesn't mean it 'should' be that way, it doesn't mean it's justified, it just means people are ignorant. I wish it weren't that way, that people could be accepted for who they are, and the decisions they make. Maybe one day it'll happen and I hope it does. But any knowledge you voluntarily give to a stranger, is just potential leverage for them to dislike or criticize you for being different than them. Not than the norm.

 

[Villain]

You can't just accept that people are ignorant and keep your life a secret forever. Change will happen and the ignorant ones will be left behind.

 

[Adrenaline]

You can't just accept that people are ignorant and keep your life a secret forever. Change will happen and the ignorant ones will be left behind.

I didn't say you have to accept it, but you have to at least understand it. Giving up personal information, puts you at risk of being criticized by people too ignorant to accept 'change'. Having said that, I don't think anyone should have to keep their life a secret, but you also don't have to share intimate details about your life. If you choose to share personal information, then I have no issue with it, what I have an issue with, is being acting so surprised or shocked, that someone in the world disagrees with them.

If you're bold enough to share personal details, you also need to be strong enough to withstand some verbal abuse from people who disagree with your point of view; right or wrong, just or not.

 

[Villain]

Yeah, I get what you're saying. That's the basic logic behind don't ask, don't tell except that the military made it a policy, and not a personal choice for the individual servicemen/women.

I would imagine that homosexuality might be more common in sports than we are aware. It might take a big name to break that wall down by saying "hey, I'm gay, this is who I am, accept me."

I hope that whenever that happens, the public is ready. Right now, I don't think they are - but I think they are more ready that ten years ago. Maybe in a few more years people will come around.

 

[CAM]

Rapinoe from the women's soccer team had a while bit in SI about that a couple months back.

 

[Villain]

I'd be surprised if Rapinoe was the only lesbian on that team...

 

[CAM]

I'd be surprised if Rapinoe was the only lesbian on that team...

I'd say a couple.

But really, other than Rapinoe, I can't of that many that have the stereotypical "lesbian" look (which I disagree with). Abby Wambach and Amy Lepeilbet (sp?) come to mind, but not much else.

 

[D3ATHS1NBUNCH3S]

Read an interesting article today in Sports Illustrated about Minnesota Vikings punter Chris Kluwe. He fits the personality of an anti-jock: He's an avid fan of World of Warcraft, supports gay marriage, and had a 1490 SAT score out of high school.
Some support his ideas, some don't.
Any opinions on this?

 

[Joel]

Punters/kickers are stereotypically kinda weird