Struggling to improve with controller

[the_steel_rat]

Hi folks. I'm a long time GT player, on GT Sport and previous versions.

I've not played it for a while, but in the last couple of weeks I decided to try and improve my DR. In the past in GT Sport, I've won races and finished on the podium.

But I'm now struggling to even qualify in the top ten, and finish usually out of the top ten.

I'm using controller, so my questions are what's changed that would now make it so hard to get a result?

And am I expecting too much using a controller? I'm a casual player, so not going to get a wheel and pedals just to get good results.

In this week's race C, my best laptime is 1.27.5, and I'm struggling to improve on that. I've tried a few different cars, and set my best time in the Merc AMG.

My DR has completely crashed.

https://www.kudosprime.com/gts/stats.php?profile=3727993#dr

 

[barak181]

Hi folks. I'm a long time GT player, on GT Sport and previous versions.

I've not played it for a while, but in the last couple of weeks I decided to try and improve my DR. In the past in GT Sport, I've won races and finished on the podium.

But I'm now struggling to even qualify in the top ten, and finish usually out of the top ten.

I'm using controller, so my questions are what's changed that would now make it so hard to get a result?

And am I expecting too much using a controller? I'm a casual player, so not going to get a wheel and pedals just to get good results.

In this week's race C, my best laptime is 1.27.5, and I'm struggling to improve on that. I've tried a few different cars, and set my best time in the Merc AMG.

My DR has completely crashed.

https://www.kudosprime.com/gts/stats.php?profile=3727993#dr

Do you have a replay you can upload for us to look at? It's tough to say what you need to work on without knowing specifics.

But it is possible to be fast with a controller. Believe it or not, there's some people in DR.A/A+ that use a controller.

 

[the_steel_rat]

I'll try and get a replay. I'm practicing a bit tonight. Turned ABS down to weak, and traction control to 1 (it was 2), and managed a 1.26.9.

I'm tying trail breaking too, but doesn't feel like I can get much faster.

 

[Redneckchef]

I'll try and get a replay. I'm practicing a bit tonight. Turned ABS down to weak, and traction control to 1 (it was 2), and managed a 1.26.9.

I'm tying trail breaking too, but doesn't feel like I can get much faster.

There are a lot of things you can do to get faster. Controller player here so doing a similar set up to you. And for reference I've got a 1:22.4 qualifying lap for race C. Was running 24s in the race. Done in the '17 Lexus.

First, what controls do you use? I made the decision to learn to change controls when I started GTS. I use the triggers for gas and brake and the L3 for steering. This doesnt mean an advantage or anything, just to give you an idea of what I'm using so if, how and when my advice can apply.

Try and keep your lines smooth. Slow in, fast out is a real key to success in GT Sport. Over driving will really penalize your lap times, and at tracks like Laguna Seca those losses are brutal. Braking and then letting off the brakes for the turn helps a lot. At Laguna and others there is also a bit of coasting to do. Be patient on getting back on the throttle.

The idea is to have as few inputs as possible. When you brake, it should be the once, turning should be the one smooth input, and when you get back onto the gas instead of slamming it all out I ease on with a slightly slow squeeze. Still taking less than second to get all the way on though.

Dont try to super late brake for the turns. The main focus of getting through the turn will be to have the best exit line for speed. So for instance that first right hander at LS I brake hard at the notice sign right before the gravel change on the left, then coast for a hair, then turn in, aiming it so that I can get on the gas as I just pass the sausage curb on the right. For the next right I simply lift off the gas at a point before the curb goes white and disappears on the left, aim it to the apex beside the curb, and if done right i am full on the gas as I get past that sausage as well.

Try going around through the driving school again as well. It sounds silly, but pushing it through there till I had all gold easily helped me. And paying attention to whatever point it is they are supposed to have you focus on. Also, if you are looking at Laguna Seca in particular @Tidgney had a great ultimate track guide.

And yeah, nothing beats patience and practice. It took ages for me to find the speed. Every time you slide or squirm on exit it costs. When running my laps if I wiggle getting on the gas a bit too soon exiting the final corner it is anywhere from 1 to 4 tenths lost. Just on the 1 turn.

Good luck and keep at it. I struggled mightily for a while, but the people here have great advice and help. And yeah, watch the replays of others showing the inputs, it helps you see what they are doing, including times spent just coasting.

Hope I have helped some.👍

 

[the_steel_rat]

There are a lot of things you can do to get faster. Controller player here so doing a similar set up to you. And for reference I've got a 1:22.4 qualifying lap for race C. Was running 24s in the race. Done in the '17 Lexus.

First, what controls do you use? I made the decision to learn to change controls when I started GTS. I use the triggers for gas and brake and the L3 for steering. This doesnt mean an advantage or anything, just to give you an idea of what I'm using so if, how and when my advice can apply.

Try and keep your lines smooth. Slow in, fast out is a real key to success in GT Sport. Over driving will really penalize your lap times, and at tracks like Laguna Seca those losses are brutal. Braking and then letting off the brakes for the turn helps a lot. At Laguna and others there is also a bit of coasting to do. Be patient on getting back on the throttle.

The idea is to have as few inputs as possible. When you brake, it should be the once, turning should be the one smooth input, and when you get back onto the gas instead of slamming it all out I ease on with a slightly slow squeeze. Still taking less than second to get all the way on though.

Dont try to super late brake for the turns. The main focus of getting through the turn will be to have the best exit line for speed. So for instance that first right hander at LS I brake hard at the notice sign right before the gravel change on the left, then coast for a hair, then turn in, aiming it so that I can get on the gas as I just pass the sausage curb on the right. For the next right I simply lift off the gas at a point before the curb goes white and disappears on the left, aim it to the apex beside the curb, and if done right i am full on the gas as I get past that sausage as well.

Try going around through the driving school again as well. It sounds silly, but pushing it through there till I had all gold easily helped me. And paying attention to whatever point it is they are supposed to have you focus on. Also, if you are looking at Laguna Seca in particular @Tidgney had a great ultimate track guide.

And yeah, nothing beats patience and practice. It took ages for me to find the speed. Every time you slide or squirm on exit it costs. When running my laps if I wiggle getting on the gas a bit too soon exiting the final corner it is anywhere from 1 to 4 tenths lost. Just on the 1 turn.

Good luck and keep at it. I struggled mightily for a while, but the people here have great advice and help. And yeah, watch the replays of others showing the inputs, it helps you see what they are doing, including times spent just coasting.

Hope I have helped some.👍

I'm using the same control setup as you. I was breaking early, and trying to coast in. But now this trail breaking has me confused as it seems to be breaking all the way into the corner, but easing off.

What do you use for ABS and TCS?

Thanks for the tips, I'll keep practicing.

 

[Redneckchef]

I'm using the same control setup as you. I was breaking early, and trying to coast in. But now this trail breaking has me confused as it seems to be breaking all the way into the corner, but easing off.

What do you use for ABS and TCS?

Thanks for the tips, I'll keep practicing.

I am on default ABS and TCS 2. Honestly for trail braking it depends on the car and corner. For turn 1 I trail brake, hard brakes at the start, then easing as I near the 'first' apex while turning in, making sure I am completely off throttle at that point, then as soon as the car pivots I am very gradually easing onto the corner. Then those 2 right handers I have to coast. That left to start heading uphill I have to attack hard, braking early and hard, releasing and turning as soon as I release the brakes and accelerate as soon as I have turn in. It is certainly something that practice and repetition beds in more and makes easier. Some tracks I am good, others I am still way off the pace. Good luck.

 

[the_steel_rat]

I uploaded my best lap from tonight. This was the best of a bad lot, but 3 tenths faster than my previous best. I made a few mistakes, but I don't see where I could find 4 seconds. The theoretical best was 1.26.01

 

[the_steel_rat]

It was the same story last week at brands hatch, which is a track I like. I could break into the top 10.

 

[NevilleNobody]

You say you are a long time player but your kudos profile shows only a handful of playing days.

First thing first, with Group 3 cars i'd move controller sensitivity to 7, default feels so understeery. Secondly, I absolutely guarantee you are braking too late and not getting on the gas early enough.

 

[Redneckchef]

So just to compare I have gone and run some laps on my Alt account in the AMG as I believe that is the car you were using. The first lap in the video is the first lap I did in the car. You can see it is a bit scruffy with some sliding and slightly off lines. But in that little bit you can also see it be smoother than the lap you posted. I followed that lap up with the replay of the last 3 laps I did. I went back and thought that it would be good to try and show some smoother laps instead of simply a faster one.

If you watch, the braking points and aim of the garage are very different from what you were doing. While I brake a little later I also add some slight steering near the end of some braking maneuvers as I ease off the brakes in order to aim the car a bit better for when I coast. Also in those laps you can see where the sliding or drifting onto curbs affects the times and slows things down. Those laps could definitely be better, for example my optimum at the end of those 5 total laps was a 1:22.1, which I am not going to get. But it shows what a difference it makes getting the right lines through all the turns.

I noticed in particular your first turn was both slow and wide. You cut in really sharp on the first part, then went way wide on the exit. If anything you need to reverse that. This game is set up to focus greatly on exit speed.while tou want to carry speed into and through the turns, you have to stop forcing it if it is slowing your exit speed.

Good luck and good racing. 👍

I will say you've got wins faster than I ever did.

 

[the_steel_rat]

You say you are a long time player but your kudos profile shows only a handful of playing days.

First thing first, with Group 3 cars i'd move controller sensitivity to 7, default feels so understeery. Secondly, I absolutely guarantee you are braking too late and not getting on the gas early enough.

Thanks, I'll have a play around with the sensitivity. As far as being a long term player, I meant more that I've played the series since PS2, rather than just on GT Sport. I suppose 101 days isn't much, but it's what you do in those days.

So just to compare I have gone and run some laps on my Alt account in the AMG as I believe that is the car you were using. The first lap in the video is the first lap I did in the car. You can see it is a bit scruffy with some sliding and slightly off lines. But in that little bit you can also see it be smoother than the lap you posted. I followed that lap up with the replay of the last 3 laps I did. I went back and thought that it would be good to try and show some smoother laps instead of simply a faster one.

If you watch, the braking points and aim of the garage are very different from what you were doing. While I brake a little later I also add some slight steering near the end of some braking maneuvers as I ease off the brakes in order to aim the car a bit better for when I coast. Also in those laps you can see where the sliding or drifting onto curbs affects the times and slows things down. Those laps could definitely be better, for example my optimum at the end of those 5 total laps was a 1:22.1, which I am not going to get. But it shows what a difference it makes getting the right lines through all the turns.

I noticed in particular your first turn was both slow and wide. You cut in really sharp on the first part, then went way wide on the exit. If anything you need to reverse that. This game is set up to focus greatly on exit speed.while tou want to carry speed into and through the turns, you have to stop forcing it if it is slowing your exit speed.

Good luck and good racing. 👍

I will say you've got wins faster than I ever did.

Thanks so much for the advice, and doing the laps. Really appreciate it. I'll concentrate more on breaking and being smooth, than trying to be fast, and I suppose the speed will come from that. It looks as well I need to work on not breaking 100% for every corner.

As the circuits reset tomorrow, I'll have a look at the next ones and practice on them.

 

[Norrin Radd]

No advice as your I'm getting tips here, but I play controller and your going to go up and down DR wise it's just the way it goes. As to where you finish it's all to do with who your racing so I try not to gauge my performance on position but rather on time. My quali for race C is 1:25:252 and I can't remember what car I did that in, I've been running the Z4 since I won it the other day and I just try my best to get every lap under 1:28. I know if I can consistently put in decent times I'll eventually get better....or that's the hope at least. I sometimes watch one of the top 10 guys laps and/or load up their ghost to help get the lines etc. it doesn't always help too much as they are just so far above me but at least I can see where I'm really slow and where I'm actually doing close to the right thing.

 

[Vegard]

If you're just getting back into the game it's perfectly normal to need some time to get rid of the rustiness. Practice, practice and practice some more.
Laguna Seca and Brands Hatch are very unforgiving if your timing and rhythm is a little off.

I've taken long breaks from GT Sport and always find myself severely lacking in pace for a while when I get back on.

 

[NevilleNobody]

Turn on the racing line guide too, its not perfect but pretty good.

And again, exit speed, exit speed, exit speed.

For practice, use the jaguar group 4 car and go to bathurst, T1 is a perfect example of exit speed, sector 1 should be below 21 seconds, don't stop practicing until you regularly hit below 21 seconds.

 

[barak181]

And again, exit speed, exit speed, exit speed.

So much this.

You said earlier that you didn't know where you could find 4 sec in your lap time. It comes from a tenth or two in a corner that then translates into a half a second on the following straight. I really noticed that in FP where you have a running clock showing your interval to your fastest lap. When I started to become a little bit decent at cornering, I really noticed that. It was crazy how much and how quickly those tenths add up.

@Redneckchef gave you some great advice and videos. Pay attention to that. The biggest thing I saw watching your lap was going wide in most of the corners and scrubbing speed getting the car back under control. Also, be careful getting back onto the throttle in Gr 3 cars. A little too soon or too quickly and you'll get mad oversteer. That's probably why I'm still better in Gr 4 cars, I still tend to get all mashy on the throttle too much...

 

[Gt_usv67]

So just to compare I have gone and run some laps on my Alt account in the AMG as I believe that is the car you were using. The first lap in the video is the first lap I did in the car. You can see it is a bit scruffy with some sliding and slightly off lines. But in that little bit you can also see it be smoother than the lap you posted. I followed that lap up with the replay of the last 3 laps I did. I went back and thought that it would be good to try and show some smoother laps instead of simply a faster one.

If you watch, the braking points and aim of the garage are very different from what you were doing. While I brake a little later I also add some slight steering near the end of some braking maneuvers as I ease off the brakes in order to aim the car a bit better for when I coast. Also in those laps you can see where the sliding or drifting onto curbs affects the times and slows things down. Those laps could definitely be better, for example my optimum at the end of those 5 total laps was a 1:22.1, which I am not going to get. But it shows what a difference it makes getting the right lines through all the turns.

I noticed in particular your first turn was both slow and wide. You cut in really sharp on the first part, then went way wide on the exit. If anything you need to reverse that. This game is set up to focus greatly on exit speed.while tou want to carry speed into and through the turns, you have to stop forcing it if it is slowing your exit speed.

Good luck and good racing. 👍

I will say you've got wins faster than I ever did.

Were you using TCS during those laps it seemed you got on power a lot earlier bad managed somehow being aggresive and managed not to oversteer unlike what I've seen with TCS to 0. I keep getting over steer if I start accelerating before I've gotten my steering straight. Even if I hit those bumps a little the car becomes unsettled and I can't accelerate at once (crucial in a race)

Edit: sorry didn't read your post where you mentioned the TCS you use.

 

[Redneckchef]

Were you using TCS during those laps it seemed you got on power a lot earlier bad managed somehow being aggresive and managed not to oversteer unlike what I've seen with TCS to 0. I keep getting over steer if I start accelerating before I've gotten my steering straight. Even if I hit those bumps a little the car becomes unsettled and I can't accelerate at once (crucial in a race)

Yes. I have TCS at 2 in Gr3 cars. I have tried managing with TCS 0 and found that no matter how I managed the throttle it was costing me massive amounts of time and the odds of wiping out were huge. I found I kept more time having the safety net and being able to keep the car on track.

I do alter TCS depending on the car and group though. Most road cars I am TCS 0. Most Gr4 it is 1. I know it will be faster ultimately if I learn to do TCS 0, but I am more interested in having fun and keeping the car on track.

Also, specific to Laguna Seca, some curbs are deadly, in fact most of them. But the last 2, the hard right and the final corner aren't so bad.

 

[Gt_usv67]

Yes. I have TCS at 2 in Gr3 cars. I have tried managing with TCS 0 and found that no matter how I managed the throttle it was costing me massive amounts of time and the odds of wiping out were huge. I found I kept more time having the safety net and being able to keep the car on track.

I do alter TCS depending on the car and group though. Most road cars I am TCS 0. Most Gr4 it is 1. I know it will be faster ultimately if I learn to do TCS 0, but I am more interested in having fun and keeping the car on track.

Yes completely agree. I'm still learning and thought I had to do TCS 0 in races for better exit speed. But in this race C it seems I was wrong since I really lost out massively in all the races kept bottling it especially with tire wear and it got really frustrating

 

[Redneckchef]

Yes completely agree. I'm still learning and thought I had to do TCS 0 in races for better exit speed. But in this race C it seems I was wrong since I really lost out massively in all the races kept bottling it especially with tire wear and it got really frustrating

Yeah. I think I tried it a few times at different tracks, and while i can gain some small speed advantage sometimes, it is more than canceled out with the number of times I lost it and wrecked. I have managed to take many places and a couple of wins from TCS 0 heroes just by keeping it on track. You have to gain massive time differential to be able to cancel out the crashes. I cant do that.

 

[Kermit_2142]

I uploaded my best lap from tonight. This was the best of a bad lot, but 3 tenths faster than my previous best. I made a few mistakes, but I don't see where I could find 4 seconds. The theoretical best was 1.26.01

The most important thing I believe is to learn brake/turn/apex/acceleration points/markers around the circuit. You can do this via watching videos online or watching the laps on the top 10 leaderboard in game. (You can also load their ghost to follow).
Watch them and pay very close attention to where they are braking/turning/accelerating etc then try to replicate but brake before the markers they use as you will crash to begin with. Start slow and work up to their markers, aim not to crash and try to stay as relaxed as possible. Slow is smooth, smooth is fast so the saying goes. Good luck 👍.

https://youtu.be/_v7sXAHOhjg

 

[the_steel_rat]

Bit more practice tonight, and times heading in the right direction. Best of 1.24.9, and even my bad laps are better than my times at the start of the week.

 

[The_Tullster]

Hi folks. I'm a long time GT player, on GT Sport and previous versions.

I've not played it for a while, but in the last couple of weeks I decided to try and improve my DR. In the past in GT Sport, I've won races and finished on the podium.

But I'm now struggling to even qualify in the top ten, and finish usually out of the top ten.

I'm using controller, so my questions are what's changed that would now make it so hard to get a result?

And am I expecting too much using a controller? I'm a casual player, so not going to get a wheel and pedals just to get good results.

In this week's race C, my best laptime is 1.27.5, and I'm struggling to improve on that. I've tried a few different cars, and set my best time in the Merc AMG.

My DR has completely crashed.

https://www.kudosprime.com/gts/stats.php?profile=3727993#dr

You're skills have gotten rusty, it's going to take a couple of weeks to get back to where you were.

Most of the rest of the community have been playing regularly and have gotten better. It's going to take time to catch up.

 

[meekrab]

I uploaded my best lap from tonight. This was the best of a bad lot, but 3 tenths faster than my previous best. I made a few mistakes, but I don't see where I could find 4 seconds. The theoretical best was 1.26.01

You don't see where you can find 4 seconds, but I see at least one mistake in every corner on this lap. You wiggle the steering under braking and run wide onto the dirt in Andretti, get onto the dirt under braking and almost spin for T3, too much braking for T4 (apex speed should be 95-ish mph, not dipping to 87 past the apex), T5 you brake on a diagonal line towards the apex instead of going straight along the curbing and taking the widest possible arc through the corner, which ruins your speed along the whole straight to T6 (even if you didn't hit the sausage, which I assume you already know is an error ).

T6 almost looks good but again you're braking on the way to the apex instead of before you turn in. Try hitting the brakes around the 2 and turning in on the 1. If you can't make the corner like that you need to up your steering sensitivity, I had the same issue. The corkscrew is tough for everyone but stay in 2nd gear and hit the first apex around 50-52 mph, it will minimize traction control cutting your exit speed.

On the downhill left you basically just missed the turn in point and missed the apex by about a car width, but you can also start the turn all the way on the right side of the track and gain a few more mph. T10 and 11 same thing, use the whole track.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, but this is all stuff everyone can learn to do.

 

[Groundfish]

You don't see where you can find 4 seconds, but I see at least one mistake in every corner on this lap. You wiggle the steering under braking and run wide onto the dirt in Andretti, get onto the dirt under braking and almost spin for T3, too much braking for T4 (apex speed should be 95-ish mph, not dipping to 87 past the apex), T5 you brake on a diagonal line towards the apex instead of going straight along the curbing and taking the widest possible arc through the corner, which ruins your speed along the whole straight to T6 (even if you didn't hit the sausage, which I assume you already know is an error ).

T6 almost looks good but again you're braking on the way to the apex instead of before you turn in. Try hitting the brakes around the 2 and turning in on the 1. If you can't make the corner like that you need to up your steering sensitivity, I had the same issue. The corkscrew is tough for everyone but stay in 2nd gear and hit the first apex around 50-52 mph, it will minimize traction control cutting your exit speed.

On the downhill left you basically just missed the turn in point and missed the apex by about a car width, but you can also start the turn all the way on the right side of the track and gain a few more mph. T10 and 11 same thing, use the whole track.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, but this is all stuff everyone can learn to do.

I noticed the driving line was OFF which is the single most important aspect, especially at Laguna Seca. That track banking makes a world of difference and being off line loses massive time.
My advice? Turn on driving line, drive it, brake at the two cones, do not throttle until apex or later.
Understand that the number one trigger for TCS to limit power is the steering angle.
Generally in most cars the trigger point for TCS is about 90 degrees of turn input. Once you hit that if you add more than 1/4 throttle you’ll get shutdown.
Using the driving line is simple brake at cones, turn in while still braking, let off brakes after turning in smooth, get tight to apex, wait then smoothly throttle on only at or after apex.
If you throttle before apex you’ll just run wide on exit and have to lift which is a huge loss of time.
The widest possible entry is not always the best line because you cover unnecessary distance. Also you will be turning in at a point where grip is less because you’re not in the banked groove.
In many cases you’re off camber because of the crown in the track. Further, in race driving the widest entry is begging people behind to dive in inside you.
Better to practice the racing line than copying a top ten one off line, jmo
That’s what I see on these tracks in game.
The racing line is dictated not by a theoretical ideal on a flat turn on graph paper at all.
It’s dictated by where on track the “groove” (banking) is which is the area of best grip.
This applies to braking points and turn in points as well, the cones are very very close to important little mini ramps and humps of track banking that give grip...
Anyways learning the racing line is always the first thing.
If you’re off line nothing matters.
Don’t be too proud to use the aids such as line. They were provided by the designers for the purpose of learning the track.
Just use the aids, they are the fastest way to get better.

 

[NevilleNobody]

Also Laguna Seca is super tough, imho you're easting your time a bit. I'd try an easier track.