Sub-1-Minute Lap in Laguna

[LeGeNd-1]

Has anybody been able to do this?(hybrids not included) I tried doing it with most of the top-end cars (GT One,R390,M12 LM,Atlantique LM,Speed 12,etc) but I can't seem to cut the time low enough. So finally I had to (VERY RELUCTANTLY, I might add) use the Excuseo/Estupido 👎(whatever you guys here call it). But guess what? I still can't get under a minute! My closest time is 1.01.408. I think with the right tuning you can do it, but as I'm a noob at tuning this is my best time.

Supersoft tires F&R
No TCS/ASC
Spring 20 20
Ride 95 95
Camber 0 0
Stabilizers 1 7
Gears: Tranny trick, Final at 3.500
Downforce Max F&R
LSD Int,Acc,Dec 1 1

 

[Speed Addict]

I did 1:00:034, it's not under 1 minute but I'm happy with my time because I think I can go better than that, I just need more time
settings that I changed
ride 95 95
camber 0 0
gears final-3500 auto-12
down max
With this settings this time is almost my maximum but if I change springs to 20 20 then it's a different story
In first sector I'm better half a second, in second I'm better one second but in corkscrew I lose more than a second so in the end I'm very close to best time but not close enough
With this settings car is faster in almost every corner but very hard to drive at corkscrew so if I drive that corner the way I want I can maybe go under not only 1 minute but 59 seconds, we'll see

 

[LeGeNd-1]

I did 1:00:034, it's not under 1 minute but I'm happy with my time because I think I can go better than that, I just need more time

That's fastGood work Speed Addict:tup:What spring rate values are you exactly using? I'll try to top your time

 

[Speed Addict]

When I did that time I was using default settings 7 6, but if you wanna go faster I think 20 20 is better choice, but as I said earlier corkscrew is the biggest problem,good luck!!!

 

[sucahyo]

You may try using TCSC at 51 too.

About tranny trick, do you try the same method as this link?
https://www.gtplanet.net/guides/index.php/Gran_Turismo_4_:_Tuning

Using lower final drive have the same effect as equipping lighter flywheel, it can help accelerating if the rpm needle move smoothly. thak jamin banter ("I guarantee it will be faster" in jawatimuran javanish) .

If you can control it or do not mind using speed trick, increasing rear ride height can improve acceleration and cornering speed. It improve handling at the corkscrew too.

But still, you have a very good laptime. I can't even reach 1.03 when I try it .

 

[LeGeNd-1]

Hey suc,long time no see! Where've you been?

I try as much as I can to avoid using TCS, but if that's the only way to go faster then I'll have to try it. Does the Excuseo have much wheelspin BTW? If it doesn't then wouldn't using TCS be redundant?

About tranny trick, no I don't get it from the GT4 forum, I NEVER went there (cause I don't own the game).I got it from the Specialized OLR forums, there's a thread there that states very clearly how to do the trick. I got most tuning tips from there too , I think it's a very very good forum IMO, too bad no one EVER went there.Oh, there's also this guy named boombexus in that forum and he is an awesome tuner, if there's any chance I would really like to sit down and have a chat with him (maybe race together as well).

When you say lower final drive do you mean decreasing the number from 3.500 to, say, 2.500? Wouldn't that reduce acceleration because the gears are longer(and consequently top speed on tracks with short straights such as Laguna)? But I agree on the smoother rev part.

On increasing rear ride height, I tried 95 100,is that enough difference? Because my lap times doesn't improve much with that. I can control anything (pretty much) so I'm not worried using strange settings.

Thanks for your praise! That means a lot coming from a GTP 'veteran' like you. I'm actually just good at manipulating the car, that's how I got fast times, I suck at tuning, you on the other hand, are an extremely good tuner.(BTW, are you also from Indonesia suc? You understand javanese. Do you have MSN? Maybe we can chat about GT stuff outside GTP.)

 

[sucahyo]

Hey suc,long time no see! Where've you been?

Converting track for Viper Racing, but still I play GT2 occasionally .

I try as much as I can to avoid using TCS, but if that's the only way to go faster then I'll have to try it. Does the Excuseo have much wheelspin BTW? If it doesn't then wouldn't using TCS be redundant?

Only if we set it at 51. TCS purposes is reduces spin. If we set it at 10 it will reduce spin better than at 1, but for some reason it will make car have better acceleration if we set it to 51. I test this on some FF, FR and 4WD, I post some experiment on this on my side by side comparison thread.

About tranny trick, no I don't get it from the GT4 forum, I NEVER went there (cause I don't own the game).I got it from the Specialized OLR forums, there's a thread there that states very clearly how to do the trick. I got most tuning tips from there too , I think it's a very very good forum IMO, too bad no one EVER went there.Oh, there's also this guy named boombexus in that forum and he is an awesome tuner, if there's any chance I would really like to sit down and have a chat with him (maybe race together as well).

I give you GT4 transmission tuning link because GT2 trans tuning is the same as GT4 trans tuning. I do many experiment on this in GT2 and Scaff help me test it on GT4. It is faster on drag test and laptime test. Faster when I let the AI do the driving too on all stock manufacture race.

When you say lower final drive do you mean decreasing the number from 3.500 to, say, 2.500? Wouldn't that reduce acceleration because the gears are longer(and consequently top speed on tracks with short straights such as Laguna)? But I agree on the smoother rev part.

You can have the same top speed even if you use different final drive. you have to change the auto setting again.

I will post the max speed of escudo using different method of applying auto gearing when I get time.
edit:
move auto to 25 when the final drive at 5.000 and then move final drive to 2.000. 138mph at first gear:


move auto to 1 when the final drive at 2.000 and then move final drive to 5.000. 54mph at sixth gear:


This can be done with racing transmission, no hybrid needed.

On increasing rear ride height, I tried 95 100,is that enough difference? Because my lap times doesn't improve much with that. I can control anything (pretty much) so I'm not worried using strange settings.

Try with max the rear, min the front.

Thanks for your praise! That means a lot coming from a GTP 'veteran' like you. I'm actually just good at manipulating the car, that's how I got fast times, I suck at tuning, you on the other hand, are an extremely good tuner.(BTW, are you also from Indonesia suc? You understand javanese. Do you have MSN? Maybe we can chat about GT stuff outside GTP.)

I always have difficulty controlling high powered cars, good thing GT also have low powered cars . I live in Sidoarjo . I don't have MSN though.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

Alright! Thanks for all the tips suc 👍. I'll try those settings when I have time (school is taking a lot of my spare time ATM).

I found your way of describing tranny trick funny you know. Instead of saying "move auto to 25 when the final drive at 5.000 and then move final drive to 2.000" wouldn't it be better (and clearer sequence-wise) to say "Move final drive to 5.000, move auto to 25, then move final drive to 2.000"? I often got my sequence of doing things reversed when reading directly from your post lol. It's OK tho, I can live with it (just need to be more careful when reading).

Not all hi-powered cars are THAT uncontrollable, there are some 'tame' ones such as GT-One and the like, it's only when you count Speed 12 or Ford GT90 then it starts getting scary to drive these supercars. Coincidentally, those 2 are my regular drives (I learn how to manipulate cars by driving those 2).

Hell, do you really live in Sidoarjo? That's where my old school is (I am currently studying in Melbourne). Gosh I don't realise someone of your calibre lives in the same city as me. Would be cool if we met someday and organise an "Official Indonesian Gran Turismo Cup" or something . Do you know anyone else here in GTP who's Indonesian?

If you don't have MSN then what do you have? You must have an email right? Otherwise you wouldn't be able to join GTP.

 

[dzinatars]

59.615 sec

 

[sucahyo]

That's cool dzinavatars

Instead of saying "move auto to 25 when the final drive at 5.000 and then move final drive to 2.000" wouldn't it be better (and clearer sequence-wise) to say "Move final drive to 5.000, move auto to 25, then move final drive to 2.000"? I often got my sequence of doing things reversed when reading directly from your post lol.

Well, some people still don't understand when I explain using the second one. It seems the second way still better then.

There is more explanation and example here:
Gearing, longer = faster?, not always

Not all hi-powered cars are THAT uncontrollable, there are some 'tame' ones such as GT-One and the like, it's only when you count Speed 12 or Ford GT90 then it starts getting scary to drive these supercars.

I find it hard not because it is uncontrollable, but it's hard to timing the control. I am sure sooner or later I can drive fast too, I feel faster each time I play GT2 again after playing Viper Racing for some time .

Hell, do you really live in Sidoarjo? That's where my old school is (I am currently studying in Melbourne). Gosh I don't realise someone of your calibre lives in the same city as me. Would be cool if we met someday and organise an "Official Indonesian Gran Turismo Cup" or something .

I am pleasantly surprise to see someone use Surabaya as location . I never thought I would see it here.

Do you know anyone else here in GTP who's Indonesian?

Only one that I know, Gery. He is active in GT4 section.

You must have an email right?

I'll pm my email.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

Wow oh wow dzinatars! Never thought someone would break one minute this fast. Good work 👍. What settings do you use? And your first lap, it's just amazing, I always got 1.05.xxx for my first lap. Now maybe we can try to break one minute with another car, Cultus anyone?

I tried messing around with the Excuseo again last night, but I can't replicate my lap, even with same settings, the car understeered on the corner exit too much. Do you have ways of eliminating exit understeer suc? Glad if you have.

Haven't got time to read the GT4 thread, I'll read it later when I'm free. I opened it and scrolled and said "What the hell...?This LONG?".

I believe you will eventually master the control of supercars, just need practice (practice=experience=speed). Is Viper Racing a PS1 game? Never heard of it before but sounds pretty good to me. If it's a PC game is it still available now? (If it's old then I probably have no chance of finding it off the store shelves.)

Yeah I use Surabaya, not because of patriotism or anything, just that...it seems right you know, GTP is a multination GT community and the more countries stated the better. I thought I'll represent Indonesia in GTP before I know you're a fellow Indonesian . I thought of changing it to Melbourne as that's where I am at now, but GTP9 changed 'Location' to 'From' so I'll leave it at Surabaya. Too bad still that there are very few Indonesians around. Maybe there are more but they won't own up, if there are: own up guys, it's cool to admit where you're really from, no matter where it is 👍, at least show that gamers in our country are a force to be reckoned with worldwide.

 

[dzinatars]

All the settings was as yours - Supersoft tires F&R
No TCS/ASC
Spring 20 20
Ride 95 95
Camber 0 0
Stabilizers 1 7
Downforce Max F&R
LSD Int,Acc,Dec 1 1

Gears - Final - 3.5 Auto 13

The first lap is so fast,because it is time trial,and i brake before start/finish line,turn around and drive back to have a higher launch speed.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

Ah,that makes sense then. Why didn't I think of it before? I would never do that though,too much of a hassle

How do you find my settings dzinatars? Is it good enough? Or could it be better?

 

[dzinatars]

At first I was driving with some other settings.The best lap time was 1 min 8 sec.Then I set everything as you wrote.Except downforce.Now it was faster. 1 min 3 sec.Then I set downforce to max and the the result is 59.615
I think there is no need to search other settings for better acceleration.The car is already very fast.

 

[sucahyo]

I think I will try to drive escudo in laguna again .

Viper Racing is PC game. you can get the evaluation one here:
http://members.shaw.ca/nhra/viper-racing.html
or
www.vrgt.com


to eliminate understeer on every condition you can try:
low front / high rear ride height
low front/ high rear stabilizer
negative rear or positive rear, depend on characteristic. If sliding use negative rear, otherwise use positive.

to eliminate understeer during acceleration try
low rear bound/high front rebound damper
low acceleration LSD especially at front

spring can have effect too, but tuning depend on when it understeer.


about gearing, they are complicated, but can improve laptime a bit if used .


I wish there are more indonesia too .

 

[LeGeNd-1]

I'm going to try and download the game 👍

I'll try your settings suc. I already set stabiliser to 1 7 and ride to 95 150. I'm more inclined to using negative rear for toe,but I try not to use it as it really slows you down on the straights (especially when used max). I'll mess around with the dampers and LSD and see what will happen. I think I'll leave springs at 20 20,except if you have a better setting.

The thing about gear tuning in GT is there is so much number involved, we're talking billions of combinations here, and fine tuning is even more crazier as each gear has thousands of setting possible. So yeah...I want to squeeze every possible millisecond but by gear tuning? No way. I'm better off experimenting with driving styles. That's how I am(prefer driving than tuning,that's why I admire people like you who can sit through and test every variable in tuning).

 

[sucahyo]

Did you try it? I find that using rear toe can improve 1000m time sometime. Spring in GT is rather weird, during change of speed it reduce grip, but on stable condition it increase grip. If you drive smoothly, using stiffer spring rate help improve cornering speed.

The purpose of transmission tuning guide is to avoid having to test billion of combination . When I tune the gear the consideration is wether I need smooth acceleration or quick acceleration. I usually tune it in about 5 minute including the testing. My laptime usually improve 2 seconds when using racing transmission.

 

[LeGeNd-1]

I don't conduct a specific test about the effect of toe on straights,it's just a general observation based on when I race. For example, when I use zero toe (on all wheels) I can pass car A on the straights easily,when I change the settings (say -0.20 rear toe) I found it harder to pass the same car on the straights,somehow my speed seems limited (just like using higher downforce). I may be wrong, but that's what I feel.

I think I drive quite smoothly, so I have no problems with stiff springs.

Even if you have a tuning guide if you still don't know which way to go (like me) you'll still end up testing combinations again and again and again. There's just so much variable involved (human variable is the most prominent, it's very hard to drive constantly to achieve fair comparisons). That's why when I tune transmission I just slap the tranny trick, then set the final drive to whatever value that allows the car to just top out on the longest straight of the particular track.

 

[sucahyo]

Ok.

In short my transmission tuning step would be (my tranny trick):
- drive around trying several auto number using lowest final drive, ie auto 14 at 2.000, auto 15 at 2.000, etc
- take note of the last gear value. , ie 0.850
- doing auto 1 at some final drive repeatedly until I get the same value as noted for last gear max value, ie auto 1 at 4.593, auto 1 at 4.678, etc (look long but usually take less than 30 second)
- move final drive to lowest final drive

 

[LeGeNd-1]

*bump*

Since no one can't be bothered to drive an Excuseo around Laguna anymore, I decided to try out another track to make it more interesting and less boring. So I came across the Rome Millenium Enduro and thought, why not try that instead? So I did, drove for 99 laps, and my best time so far is 1.03.354. Set it on lap 97.



If anyone can break one minute do tell

PS: For some reason the Excuseo handles better when its tires are starting to turn yellow, and that's why I set these times in Enduroes instead of Time Trials.

 

[blazing escudo]

I didn't know about that before.Thanks