seriously, i can acknowledge the fact that a muscle car can easly kill a rice car due to the fact that muscle cars go fast..fast. but, how do they handle? take for example, a downhill twisty course. how would they do on that? i dont wana sound like i know everything about cars by the way since i dont, i just wanna know.
sure...muscle cars go fast and eat rice for dinner, but how do they turn?
- Thread starter kin
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- 4,473
There was an old Camaro made for Trans Am Racing (not too many mods) and it handled pretty well. Had the opprotunity to see it in action in person. Was great. Even though it was far away you could still hear that engine roaring. Then when it went by, 
, cover your ears and dont blink. Was very nice. I forgot what gen camaro it was though. I know what It looks like. I will try to find a picture of the model.
Todays American Muscle can turn better than ever (though some still cant). As Blazin said, the Vette has great handling and the Viper has loads of grip as well. You shouldnt always try to measure how well a car can turn by using just the G's it can pull. You should also account for the turning radius at different speeds
.
BTW, dont forget about European Muscle. When I think about a European Muscle, I always think of fine tuning and refinement somehow...
, cover your ears and dont blink. Was very nice. I forgot what gen camaro it was though. I know what It looks like. I will try to find a picture of the model.Todays American Muscle can turn better than ever (though some still cant). As Blazin said, the Vette has great handling and the Viper has loads of grip as well. You shouldnt always try to measure how well a car can turn by using just the G's it can pull. You should also account for the turning radius at different speeds
.BTW, dont forget about European Muscle. When I think about a European Muscle, I always think of fine tuning and refinement somehow...
- 4,473
I didnt mean it was that good. But its still good. Anyway, its a racecar...
BTW, I cant find the picture of the model of car it was. Im pretty sure it was a Camaro or a Trans Am...
BTW, I cant find the picture of the model of car it was. Im pretty sure it was a Camaro or a Trans Am...
- 820
today cars are lither and are made with more tecnology and experince.
and today's improvement on the aerodinamics and suspension and the packages of it make the cars better than the olds on the handling.
but you can be sure theres are a few company's making suspensions and chassis with today's tecnology for those beatifull beast.
and i agree with cobraboy.
and today's improvement on the aerodinamics and suspension and the packages of it make the cars better than the olds on the handling.
but you can be sure theres are a few company's making suspensions and chassis with today's tecnology for those beatifull beast.
and i agree with cobraboy.
diferent times diferent needs.
- 7,402
If by "Eat rice for dinner" you are talking about fuel consumption...rice is non-combustable and will not flow through the fuel lines.
And many cars from Japan are fasted and handle better than US cars. Plus, there's an issue of quality. Japanese cars have way more quality than US cars, partly because US car parts are made in Mexico and 3rd world countries. Also Japan has more technology than the US, so they do things better.
Bleh, whatever. I'm not a fan of muscle cars, or really anything from a US car company...
And many cars from Japan are fasted and handle better than US cars. Plus, there's an issue of quality. Japanese cars have way more quality than US cars, partly because US car parts are made in Mexico and 3rd world countries. Also Japan has more technology than the US, so they do things better.
Bleh, whatever. I'm not a fan of muscle cars, or really anything from a US car company...
- 4,473
I'd have to disagree with you on the quality of cars. My grandmother's Corolla has been to the shop many times (things keep going wrong and she keeps good care of it). I personally think that the US and Japan are equal in quality but Europe has the best quality. No offense or anything but its kind of hard to take a statement seriously on american cars made from someone who hates them. Kind of like getting a review of a Steakhouse that was written by a vegetarian 
...
[EDIT] I dunno, maybe its just her car...
...[EDIT] I dunno, maybe its just her car...
- 820
i don't like when people said cars in mexico are bad just because are made there.(i know is part truh but)
you get what you paid for>if the us really want better cars made there just need ask and paid for it.
example: if they they want better cars just have to make better standards of quality and better test to the parts and cars made there.
better quality products and better preparation for those employ's may could help.
but they want cut the cost and thats what they get cheap produts.
sorry if i dont explain my point in a better way,and no i don't saying want make crap cars.
sorry if i'm wrong ,if this the case let me know and we can talk about (with out insults please)
you get what you paid for>if the us really want better cars made there just need ask and paid for it.
example: if they they want better cars just have to make better standards of quality and better test to the parts and cars made there.
better quality products and better preparation for those employ's may could help.
but they want cut the cost and thats what they get cheap produts.
sorry if i dont explain my point in a better way,and no i don't saying want make crap cars.
sorry if i'm wrong ,if this the case let me know and we can talk about (with out insults please)
- 5,677
well generaly if you want to raise quality and better prepare your workers it's gonna cost money....meaning that the car will cost more.....they would rather find cheap labor and sella car that breaks...that way you can bring it in and fix it and they can make MORE money off the same car.....because we all know that nothing really breaks while the car is still under waranty......my mom had a van and like 5 days after the waranty ran out everything went to hell and it cost tons of money to fix.....generally if you take care of your car it will last you for a long time....hell I've seen hondas with 400,000 miles on them and they still have the factory motor and tranny and still run great....
- 820
my friend hava acoord and was several times on the dealer for problems,incluiding twice for problems with the transmition.(it still on warranty)
btw my friend said it would trade for a civic ,because the last civic work almost perfect for ten years.
btw my friend said it would trade for a civic ,because the last civic work almost perfect for ten years.
that why they didn't follow making the nova.
- 5,677
personally I think accords are better than civics....They're (usualy) faster than a civic....not to mention the V6 option......leather...and they LOOK better....pluss they give you more room to move around.....
What was wrong with the tranny?
any car company has some lemons.....some just have more than others....
- 1,494
Perhaps they can make the most efficient, the most compact and the most technologically advanced micro econo boxes, but they are simply unable to make a car with a heart and soul like europe and america can. something with a heart warming V8 or with lines so sleak and perfect it rivals the best masterpieces from the renaissance.
- 4,473
^That brought a tear to my eye. Well you have to remember the NSX, which are handbuilt and do have alot of work put into them as well.
Seeing as todays cars are mostly built by machines and computers (though there are some that arent), you dont need many workers. The machines take care of the more precise things as well. Usualy the workers are there to install the seats, interior products and so on. Alot of companies test each vehicle that comes off the line to make sure it is of the right quality for sale, and if there is something wrong they send it back to be fixed.
- 7,402
Ohh yes, cause the 3rd gen RX-7 was so squared off. Silly me. Also, the US tried unsuccessfully to use rotary engines in thier cars after Mazda started it. How come Mazda was able to do it while the much bigger US 3 companies couldn't?
And my mom had a Corolla, a 1980 hatchback. Ran forever. Never a major problem in the 16 years she owned it, though the ride quality was sub par because on the highway the 3 speed auto and the engine were very loud and annoying. But it drove nice, went through the snow(even though it was RWD and didn't have posi-traction so 1 wheel would spin), and looked fairly cool.
If you want an example of Japanese to US quality, look at Mazda. The totally Japanese Mazdas(the Miata, Protege models, MPV, and Mazda 6(to a cirtain level), very rarely have problems and last forever. Then you get to the Ford-Mazdas: The Tribute and truck. The Tribute, when it came out, was a mechanical disaster. My dad got some in the shop with 80 miles with lifters that come apart and some with 200 miles where there was a total engine failure. Can you say Ford engines? Also the last model 626 had many automatic transmission problems from the Ford drivetrain.
And Japan has V8s. You do realize that Lexus and Infinity(who I believe both offer V8s in thier cars) are made in Japan and are really just Toyota or Nissan cars that are rebaged and have some upgrades?
And really, for normal driving, do you really need the V8 power that you claim is so good? My 323 does just fine driving normal...minus the highway on ramps where you have to mash it to not get rearended, but it's 15 years old and is mechanically sound(though it wasn't due to mistreatment by my dad, ie: strapping a roof-top carrier on it, loading our stuff in it, and us going to Tenn. through the mountains and all, kinda hurt the trans...).
Ohh, and who needs a car that looks like a renessance painting or statue? That would be goofy...
And my mom had a Corolla, a 1980 hatchback. Ran forever. Never a major problem in the 16 years she owned it, though the ride quality was sub par because on the highway the 3 speed auto and the engine were very loud and annoying. But it drove nice, went through the snow(even though it was RWD and didn't have posi-traction so 1 wheel would spin), and looked fairly cool.
If you want an example of Japanese to US quality, look at Mazda. The totally Japanese Mazdas(the Miata, Protege models, MPV, and Mazda 6(to a cirtain level), very rarely have problems and last forever. Then you get to the Ford-Mazdas: The Tribute and truck. The Tribute, when it came out, was a mechanical disaster. My dad got some in the shop with 80 miles with lifters that come apart and some with 200 miles where there was a total engine failure. Can you say Ford engines? Also the last model 626 had many automatic transmission problems from the Ford drivetrain.
And Japan has V8s. You do realize that Lexus and Infinity(who I believe both offer V8s in thier cars) are made in Japan and are really just Toyota or Nissan cars that are rebaged and have some upgrades?
And really, for normal driving, do you really need the V8 power that you claim is so good? My 323 does just fine driving normal...minus the highway on ramps where you have to mash it to not get rearended, but it's 15 years old and is mechanically sound(though it wasn't due to mistreatment by my dad, ie: strapping a roof-top carrier on it, loading our stuff in it, and us going to Tenn. through the mountains and all, kinda hurt the trans...).
Ohh, and who needs a car that looks like a renessance painting or statue? That would be goofy...
- 1,494
woah, someone is a mazda fan 
mazkid yes lexus does have V8's but they don't exactly sound like a '67 camaro (err forgive my lack of knowledge of american cars if that one doesn't actually exist) and nothing from japan looks or sounds like a 911 carrera flat 6. how about a ferrari 355 V8, high revving engine, glorious sound.
yes the nsx looks good, so does the skyline, but then the list runs out more or less
i don't think a car has to be built by hand to make it good, it just needs to be checked by hand when its finished thats all...
mazkid yes lexus does have V8's but they don't exactly sound like a '67 camaro (err forgive my lack of knowledge of american cars if that one doesn't actually exist)
and nothing from japan looks or sounds like a 911 carrera flat 6. how about a ferrari 355 V8, high revving engine, glorious sound.yes the nsx looks good, so does the skyline, but then the list runs out more or less
i don't think a car has to be built by hand to make it good, it just needs to be checked by hand when its finished thats all...
- 7,402
Why should they sound like other cars? What's the fun in that? It's copying. We need more uniqueness. If I was buying a Protege, if it sounded like a Camero I wouldn't buy it.
Ohh, and looks like a 911, haveyou seen the 350Z/G35 coupe?
But really, would you want every car looking and sounding like another car? I think not.
Ohh, and looks like a 911, haveyou seen the 350Z/G35 coupe?
But really, would you want every car looking and sounding like another car? I think not.
- 4,473
My Grandfather's ford pickup (early 90's). He drives it hard and alot and it hasnt had any problems yet (other than normal wear n' tear).
My Mom's Dodge Neon (when she had it). No problems. We were hit in the back by someone not paying attention. No real damage to us. The Bumper was fine, just needed to be re-adjusted about an inch. No mechanical problems either.
My Grandfather's 83 Camaro. Its not restored yet and its had a good history (he has had it since 89' I think). Yeah, it looks like crap but it still runs great.
My dad's old 92 Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR4. We are going down the road. Suddenly all four wheels locked up. Screwed Transmission (he had only had it about two weeks). Cost for replacement tranny- $10K.
Personally, I think the quality statements are more of opinions and personall experience. Maybe we have just had our bad luck. I dont know.
My Mom's Dodge Neon (when she had it). No problems. We were hit in the back by someone not paying attention. No real damage to us. The Bumper was fine, just needed to be re-adjusted about an inch. No mechanical problems either.
My Grandfather's 83 Camaro. Its not restored yet and its had a good history (he has had it since 89' I think). Yeah, it looks like crap but it still runs great.
My dad's old 92 Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR4. We are going down the road. Suddenly all four wheels locked up. Screwed Transmission (he had only had it about two weeks). Cost for replacement tranny- $10K.
Personally, I think the quality statements are more of opinions and personall experience. Maybe we have just had our bad luck. I dont know.
- 5,677
yeah I have to agree that there are somr japanesese cars such as the NSX, Skyline etc that look good and are fast but you have to remember that the reason japan doesn't put out all of these high horsepower cars is because of "the gentlemans agreement" in which the cars are not supposed to put out more than 280ps....so why would they make a car they could not use?
as for the lexus/infinity not sounding nice....well those are luxury cars which are supposed to be quiet...your paying for a nice, comfortable, quiet ride....I guess If you really wanted to you could take care of that issue with a nice aftermarket exhaust and an intake....
If all cars looked and sounded the same what fun would that be?
as for the lexus/infinity not sounding nice....well those are luxury cars which are supposed to be quiet...your paying for a nice, comfortable, quiet ride....I guess If you really wanted to you could take care of that issue with a nice aftermarket exhaust and an intake....
If all cars looked and sounded the same what fun would that be?
- 1,494
and
hey if they all had 5.7 V8's or flat 6's, i really wouldn't complain.
- 5,677
yeah but being able to take a 4cyl and make it cream that v8 is even more rewarding...
- 4,473
Since you have to customize the 4cyl to cream the stock V8 doesnt always sound rewarding to me. I like knowing that my car, stock, can beat a modified car (which happened at VIR with my car ).
).
- 5,677
Originally posted by Frustrated Palm
Since you have to customize the 4cyl to cream the stock V8 doesnt always sound rewarding to me. I like knowing that my car, stock, can beat a modified car (which happened at VIR with my car
rewarding in a sense that you accomplished something...well that's if you do everything your self like you should....that way you can get to really know your car....I'm not saying that somebody who knows nothing about cars should try...just If you feel up to it...hands on is the only way to learn....
about the stock car beating a modded one....I don't know...that just proves that you bought a fater car and nothing more....I could go out and buy a ferrari and beat tons of people but that doesn't make winning any more rewarding....
- 317
Originally posted by Frustrated Palm
There was an old Camaro made for Trans Am Racing (not too many mods) and it handled pretty well. Had the opprotunity to see it in action in person. Was great. Even though it was far away you could still hear that engine roaring. Then when it went by,
Todays American Muscle can turn better than ever (though some still cant). As Blazin said, the Vette has great handling and the Viper has loads of grip as well. You shouldnt always try to measure how well a car can turn by using just the G's it can pull. You should also account for the turning radius at different speeds
BTW, dont forget about European Muscle. When I think about a European Muscle, I always think of fine tuning and refinement somehow... [/QUOTE}
thetype of camaro they used for Trans Am racing to be a Blue 1969 Camaro Z/28 in blue with the words "SUNCO" {i think} written on it
- 1,494
to be honest i would too, but the insurance here costs as much as the car so i'll give it a miss
- 1,494
well since prices are always relative to everything i'll just say that it would cost the same as the insurance for an M3, which is more than an M5 and almost as much as a skyline.
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