The AI in the Rivals Mode is Completely Braindead.

  • Thread starter AMCNUT
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AMCNUT

AMCNUT

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AMCNUT
AMCNUT
Does anyone else agree with me here? I don't think that they resemble in any way the way an actual human would drive the car. They are fiendishly incompetent and can make it very hard to run a clean lap.

Case in point: I was doing the Sunset Peninsula Reverse Track Day event last night trying to beat my rival's time. Second lap: I was taking the high line around the ovular part and this corvette randomly spins out and in to me at the very last second, beyond the point to which I could react. Scratch that lap.

The next lap: Same part of the track - another car decides to drive straight into the wall, sharply curving out from the inside lane, collecting me in the process. Nothing I could've done would save me - Scratch that lap.

Another lap: On the front stretch, there are two cars running the high line, so I came up on the low line to pass them. Right when I'm on top of them, the second car pulls out directly in front of me, thus causing me to rear end it a mightily. Scratch that lap.

Another lap: Again, in the first oval turn. I'm trying to pick my way through the utter mess of cars that fanned out like a swarm of bugs all over the track in all directions. I make it through, but the loss of speed while playing dodgems is so severe that I can't hope to make up enough ground. This happens not once but twice. Thanks guys.

Yet another lap: In the infield section, I take the high line around a pair of cars in one of the tighter corners in order not to drive into them. As I'm (presumably safely) accelerating away, the stupid car drives up into me, completely oblivious to my presence, thus invalidating not only my current lap, but my next one as well. This also happens twice.

WHY MUST THEY DRIVE LIKE THIS!?!?!?!?!? :banghead: Whoever programmed those cars thinking it would be fun ought to reevaluate that strategy. I love the concept of track days - but the fun quotient starts to go down if the cars you have to circumnavigate feel not even a little like they are driven by anything resembling actual human opponents. I feel like they are literally only supposed to be rolling roadblocks, without any of the skill and awareness that normal people have. I can deal with slow cars, but it's the sheep incompetency of the AIs that get me.

They're annoying at all tracks, but this track seems to particularly give them a hard time. Anyone else feel this way or am I just a little crazy?
 
I do agree that Forza's AI can be VERY unpredictable and does make some pretty stupid moves at times. But, I have had more good races than bad. I can say it makes for some interesting racing and harder to get a podium finish. If I expect to win every race, then I would be more frustrated.

I guess a point of reference is always a helpful gauge for measurement. Most of us have played numerous racing sims and I would put Forza 4 somewhere in the middle on my experiences. But I will take unpredictability over AI that race on a predetermined line and never make mistakes.

I guess if someone was unfamiliar with Forza and considering a purchase, should they base their decision on this thread; AI sucks so don't bother?

Maybe in this virtual world, drinking an driving is not frowned upon :D
 
AMCNUT
Does anyone else agree with me here?
Click to expand...

No one is perfect, AI or human. The game depicts that just fine.
On a real track day you'll have people screwing up all the time, in the game it happens just as often but the consequences seem to be exaggerated.
 
I know exactly how you feel AMCnut, its happened to me every single time i raced that track. The very first oval turn almost every car would swerve wildly. I had some really closef unny calls right there though.
 
I'm going to go against the grain a bit. On track days it makes sense that the AI won't drive exactly the same each time, so you can memorize the general sequence of cars@corners, but you still have to "plan" a way round them each time.

What bothers me is that there is little to no consideration for being passed; compare any track day event to lapping an AI driver in a normal race and the difference is obvious. The track day cars don't even get off line on a straight ...
 
It certainly encourages multiple attempts which is good for the bank balance, at least.
 
I'm glad I'm not the only one who has noticed this. I don't expect Forza's AI (or any AI) to be perfect, but that particular event was especially brutal. I restarted that event a couple of times and that same Corvette spun the same way each time, and the same cars would drive up into the walls. The same chain of events repeated themselves every time. I mean, they shouldn't be programmed to do that, I hope.

Either way, it shouldn't happen, because I've had races in the event list at that same track and the AI drives just fine - it only seems to be in Rivals Mode that they forget how to drive.
 
I can't say I have experienced exactly the same yet. The only Rivals track days I have played so far are or were the Stratos and the new one at Camino Extreme. I only had it happen once where the AI pulled out in front of me and I did wreck it. I was having an amazing lap too at Camino, a top 500 time, which is something i never come close to.
I will say I prefer this type of racing to racing real people online. I am not a great racer but there a lot of bad, rude, crash happy drivers out there.
 
The AI in Track Days, are on rails, period. They are moving chicanes nothing more.

It is annoying, and seems lazy.

I dont do those rival events because of that.
 
Vaxxtx
The AI in Track Days, are on rails, period. They are moving chicanes nothing more.

It is annoying, and seems lazy.

I dont do those rival events because of that.
Click to expand...

On track days I seem them as panicked newbies. They're driving along all nice and neat until they see you coming and then decide to go where you're going in a state of panic.
 
Jay Psi
I'm going to go against the grain a bit. On track days it makes sense that the AI won't drive exactly the same each time, so you can memorize the general sequence of cars@corners, but you still have to "plan" a way round them each time.

What bothers me is that there is little to no consideration for being passed; compare any track day event to lapping an AI driver in a normal race and the difference is obvious. The track day cars don't even get off line on a straight ...
Click to expand...

Its far from that actually. The cars would be driving a line and it seems like they swerve the car as hard as they can to one direction spinning themselves out. Not just one car either, it happens to be every car on that turn almost every time.
 
The AI in normal racing is great, all things considered. As others have said, they don't just rigidly drive on rails; they get aggressive, make mistakes, and they can either leave you behind or get left behind.

The AI in track day events, on the other hand, is wholly inappropriate for the task. It appears to be based on the same programming, but obviously in slower cars at a restricted pace. So you have economy car "traffic" on a mountain road (Fujimi) wandering from shoulder to shoulder on a loose racing line (very immersive)...and track day traffic that's so sedated the only characteristic left from the standard racing AI is to make random, sometimes spectacular mistakes.

The AI is pretty much the same, but the results are totally different.

I've decided car-to-car contact is just a part of doing the track day/passing challenges in the Event List, and I still enjoy them. But trying to get a clean lap for a Rivals event? Yeah no.
 
Wolfe
The AI in normal racing is great, all things considered. As others have said, they don't just rigidly drive on rails; they get aggressive, make mistakes, and they can either leave you behind or get left behind.

The AI in track day events, on the other hand, is wholly inappropriate for the task. It appears to be based on the same programming, but obviously in slower cars at a restricted pace. So you have economy car "traffic" on a mountain road (Fujimi) wandering from shoulder to shoulder on a loose racing line (very immersive)...and track day traffic that's so sedated the only characteristic left from the standard racing AI is to make random, sometimes spectacular mistakes.

The AI is pretty much the same, but the results are totally different.

I've decided car-to-car contact is just a part of doing the track day/passing challenges in the Event List, and I still enjoy them. But trying to get a clean lap for a Rivals event? Yeah no.
Click to expand...
Speaking of Kaido. Has anyone tried the full lap track day? Most horrible experience of my life.. So many rage quits felt like throwing my pad haha. Especially when you are 7 minutes in -.-
 
I hate the track day AI, I was doing the R1 Audi event at Le Mans and one of the slow cars pulled out right in front of me mid way down the Mulsanne Straight.:banghead:
 
AMCNUT
I'm glad I'm not the only one who has noticed this. I don't expect Forza's AI (or any AI) to be perfect, but that particular event was especially brutal. I restarted that event a couple of times and that same Corvette spun the same way each time, and the same cars would drive up into the walls. The same chain of events repeated themselves every time. I mean, they shouldn't be programmed to do that, I hope.

Either way, it shouldn't happen, because I've had races in the event list at that same track and the AI drives just fine - it only seems to be in Rivals Mode that they forget how to drive.
Click to expand...

For RIVALS mode, this makes sense. The conditions for every person playing the game have to be the same since it's a leaderboard/big money situation. That means the cars in that event were programmed to do just that, repeat their pattern every time you restart.
IIRC, the programming resets every 10 laps. It was that way with the Motegi rival event a few weeks ago.
 
I think the confusion is calling it 'AI' .. In rivals mode it isn't AI, it's the game mechanic, i.e. that the other cars blindly follow a preset line, the skill is in learning this and therefore timing your overtakes to get the best laptime..

The regular AI isn't too bad, the biggest (and fixable) issue is the 'racing lines' as shown if you switch the full racing line on and rather too conservative, you can see lots of places where you know it's a full throttle section, yet the racing line shows an small orange/red section.. the AI follow that, which puts you at odds with them.. I did expect the last patch to have sorted those racing lines out..
 
PzR Crazy
The regular AI isn't too bad, the biggest (and fixable) issue is the 'racing lines' as shown if you switch the full racing line on and rather too conservative, you can see lots of places where you know it's a full throttle section, yet the racing line shows an small orange/red section.. the AI follow that, which puts you at odds with them.. I did expect the last patch to have sorted those racing lines out..
Click to expand...
That behavior isn't terribly unrealistic. I race with the line off and the same thing tends to happen in online multiplayer. ;)

Those players get the advantage over me on corners I don't know so well, so it evens out.
 
eSZee
For RIVALS mode, this makes sense. The conditions for every person playing the game have to be the same since it's a leaderboard/big money situation. That means the cars in that event were programmed to do just that, repeat their pattern every time you restart.
IIRC, the programming resets every 10 laps. It was that way with the Motegi rival event a few weeks ago.
Click to expand...

Yes yes and thrice yes!

👍
 
AMCNUT
Does anyone else agree with me here? I don't think that they resemble in any way the way an actual human would drive the car. They are fiendishly incompetent and can make it very hard to run a clean lap.

Case in point: I was doing the Sunset Peninsula Reverse Track Day event last night trying to beat my rival's time. Second lap: I was taking the high line around the ovular part and this corvette randomly spins out and in to me at the very last second, beyond the point to which I could react. Scratch that lap.

The next lap: Same part of the track - another car decides to drive straight into the wall, sharply curving out from the inside lane, collecting me in the process. Nothing I could've done would save me - Scratch that lap.

Another lap: On the front stretch, there are two cars running the high line, so I came up on the low line to pass them. Right when I'm on top of them, the second car pulls out directly in front of me, thus causing me to rear end it a mightily. Scratch that lap.

Another lap: Again, in the first oval turn. I'm trying to pick my way through the utter mess of cars that fanned out like a swarm of bugs all over the track in all directions. I make it through, but the loss of speed while playing dodgems is so severe that I can't hope to make up enough ground. This happens not once but twice. Thanks guys.

Yet another lap: In the infield section, I take the high line around a pair of cars in one of the tighter corners in order not to drive into them. As I'm (presumably safely) accelerating away, the stupid car drives up into me, completely oblivious to my presence, thus invalidating not only my current lap, but my next one as well. This also happens twice.

WHY MUST THEY DRIVE LIKE THIS!?!?!?!?!? :banghead: Whoever programmed those cars thinking it would be fun ought to reevaluate that strategy. I love the concept of track days - but the fun quotient starts to go down if the cars you have to circumnavigate feel not even a little like they are driven by anything resembling actual human opponents. I feel like they are literally only supposed to be rolling roadblocks, without any of the skill and awareness that normal people have. I can deal with slow cars, but it's the sheep incompetency of the AIs that get me.

They're annoying at all tracks, but this track seems to particularly give them a hard time. Anyone else feel this way or am I just a little crazy?
Click to expand...
Yes, I agreee...100%. Don't forget they ram you from behind, and push you off the track. I said this a while back, and some people said ....no they don't do that.....yea right. FM4 AI is awfull, very unrealistic. Just play F1 by Codies, the AI is aggressive but does not act stupid. They are brilliant actually. My "favorite" in FM4 is when the AI go off the track in the grass, and reenter by T-Boning you. Tell me that happens in real life racing.....NOT.
 
Zebrawire
Yes, I agreee...100%. Don't forget they ram you from behind, and push you off the track. I said this a while back, and some people said ....no they don't do that.....yea right. FM4 AI is awfull, very unrealistic. Just play F1 by Codies, the AI is aggressive but does not act stupid. They are brilliant actually. My "favorite" in FM4 is when the AI go off the track in the grass, and reenter by T-Boning you. Tell me that happens in real life racing.....NOT.
Click to expand...

Like someone said eariler, track day AI, and online/career AI are totally different.

FM4 does not have the best AI (Shift2, F1, and Race have very good AI), but it is FAR from the worst (i.e. GT5, rFactor no mods).
 
I agree, the AI in the track days rivals mode does make some weird ass decisions. Like turning into my car when I'm clearly on the racing line and have the right of way. But I enjoy the track day events very much. Yeah, it's very frustrating doing the event for the 9th or 10th time because of the dumbass AI or one tiny mistake you made but once you finally beat the time it is oh so satifying! :D
 
rtsbasic
what makes it real funny is watching the "real" AI dance around the track day one. Makes some funny decisions.
Click to expand...
Very amusing, no dought. Last night I was behind an AI and "he" does the infamous brake check way before the turn and then proceeds to go straight into the barrier without so much as turning a single degree.:D He was in P1. Not the way I wanted to win...lol (event)
 

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