The Mulsanne Straight

638
United States
Los Angeles, CA
scoobyonline2000
Sorry if I spelled it wrong by the way. But here is the question and it isnt a big one. What is the fastest a car has ever done on the Le Mans Mulsanne Straight before the current ugly configuration? in MPH. And when.
 
According to mulsannescorner.com it is 250.1 in a WMP 88 in 1989. I have no idea what a WMP is but a yahoo search confirmed the speed.
 
The WMP I believe was the old relative of the current WR cars that race LeMans nowadays.

It should be noted however that the WMP that set the record had it's air ducts taped shut in order to achieve such high speed, and thus would have been completely useless for more then a few laps due to overheating.

The Sauber C9's record of 248mph is the fastest speed in true race trim.
 
Roger Dorchy drove a WM Peugeot P88 at Le Mans in 1988 and reached a top speed of 405 kph. This was before the chicanes were put in in 1990. The team felt they had no chance of a win so they thought they would like to be remembered for something else. They reached the speed very early in the race and the cars engine was pretty buggered after the lap and the car was retired from the race. The team was even supplied special narrow tyres by Michelin to reduce drag.
 
For safety reasons I guess so, but come on it's racing it can never be completely safe. The drivers are putting their lives at risk no matter what speed they are traveling. I guess it's also smart for spectator safty. Being it a public road and all if a car does indeed crash at over 200 mph I'm sure it's not going to stay on the track. However, from the perspective of a person that drives on race tracks(go kart), I say take them out! Almost nothing *ehem* feels as good as pounding down a straight at full speed.
 
The chicanes were added because FIA rules state that no straight can be more than 1 mile (1.609km) in length. A chicane was also added on the Bathurst circuit for the same reasons. The car with the top speed was a Peugeot P88 titled "Project 400" (standing for the goal to break 400kph). They did hit 251.7mph (405kph), and retired after 59 laps with an overheated engine. I do believe that it was unneeded to add the chicanes, as drivers today hit roughly 330kph before the chicanes. It did lower the number of injuries and deaths greatly, but this year at Le Mans Anthony Davison broke his back in an incident at the end of the straight, so injuries haven't been eliminated with the addition of the chicanes. And lastly, I feel that the straight was part of the character, or reputation, that the famous circuit has; and the chicanes have somewhat ruined it.
 
Ruined or not, I'd rather take a blown tire at 70 mph in the chicanes than at 200+ mph.

I think the chicanes added some new character though. Instead of cars just drafting each other, you got them sizing up braking zones and traffic at the same time. Makes it a little more exciting, or at least somewhat.

As for that Sauber's 248 mph, I think that's qualifying speed.

I don't think Group C cars seldom went over 230+ mph during the actual race.
 
The car with the top speed was a Peugeot P88 titled "Project 400" (standing for the goal to break 400kph). They did hit 251.7mph (405kph), and retired after 59 laps with an overheated engine.
Well, you will overheat if you tape up the air intakes, which is why The359 said "true race trim"

as i said above, the peugeot p88 did 407 DURING the race.
Yes, but they had no intention of making it to the end. They were solely there to break the highest speed, which they did with special tyres and taped up air intakes. Their fastest lap was in the region of 3'41 compared to the 962's fastest lap of 3'22.

And holy thread resurrection , Batman...
 
[OT]There's no such thing as the "Mulsanne Straight", except for anglophones whose ancestors found it hard to say Hunaudieres. :D

There's a town called Mulsanne at the end of it and therefore it is true that the track has at least 3 sections, all near or at the end of the straight, you may call Mulsanne. But they're a kink, a hump and a corner, not a straight.[/OT]

About WM (and not WMP as I read in posts above) I think they did the right thing regarding their admitted purpose. I remember the car and how it was big news what they achieved with it.

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And its history is very interesting, an engineer thing (for those that already viewed the last episode of "Tooned" you'll remember "M"s story ;) ). Here some of it, with an interesting info at the end:

"The duo Gérard Welter and Michel Meunier, both engineers and designers for Peugeot, worked using traditional methods in an intelligent way, to create competition cars powered by a Peugeot engine. The first WM cars used the very basic engine of the Peugeot 204, but in 1976 this was exchanged for the V6 PRV engine from the Peugeot 604, and was used in the WM P76 to take part in the Le Mans 24 Hour Race. Unfortunately the car was forced to retire in the 16th hour with a fuel leak. The WM duo returned to Le Mans in 1980, this time with support from the marque. In 1981, four WM P81 cars lined up for the start. Tragically, one of these, driven by Thierry Boutsen, was involved in an accident which killed a marshall in the third hour of the race. From 1981, the WMs carried the Heuliez logo, as Henri Heuliez’s company, keen to promote their research, had decided to sponsor WM’s efforts and help develop the bodywork. WM cars enlisted for the Le Mans 24 Hour Race every year without interruption until 1988. That year, the main objective for the WM entry was to beat the official top speed record of 391 km/h achieved on the Hunaudières Straight by a Porsche. Heuliez was given the job of creating a more flowing body style. The reduced air intakes prompted much testing in the wind tunnel and on the computer, to allow adequate engine cooling while offering the least wind resistance. Several P88 models were tested in the CSTB Jules Vernes wind tunnel in Nantes. And so that year, the WM P88 number 51 lined up for the start, equipped with a twin-turbo 3,643cc V6 PRV engine. Three drivers were sharing the car: Roger Dorchy, Claude Haldi, and Jean-Daniel Raulet. According to Le Mans legend, although the WM team had been able to break the 400km/h barrier while testing on the autoroute, they had not been able to achieve the same speeds on the Hunaudiéres straight during the early days of testing. Fortunately, it was then discovered on the Saturday during the race, that the speed radar on the legendary straight line, had not been set up to record speeds above 400 km/h. At 20h46, over the noise of engines roaring down the straight, past the rostrum, and the uneasy silence in the WM paddock every time a car crossed the line at Hunaudières, the crackly and almost inaudible hoped-for message was delivered to the helmets of drivers and track officials : « New Record » ! At that moment, Gérard Welter’s eyes shone with the indescribable joy of success mixed with incredulity, emotion, and heartfelt gratitude for his team and all those who had contributed to this spectacular result. Drained by the feat, P88 didn’t cross the finish line, and retired, crowned with laurels, during the night. The WM P88 still holds this record, and may always do so, since two chicanes were added to the Hunaudières straight in 1990, allowing the legend to remain! The following year, WM P88 no. 51 started the 24 Hour race at Le Mans, but was forced to retire when an engine fire brought its great career to an end. WM 88 remains today in the same condition as the day it won the world speed record. It is missing the damaged engine which was taken back by Gérard Welter. He has it still, and is open to the possibility, at some future date, of selling it to the new owner, restored and fitted back into the car, subject to estimate. The historical importance of WM P88 is clear, as is its emotional resonance! Power and provenance come hand in hand with this beautiful monster. This car that has played a major part in automotive history was given a ranking in the Inventaire des Monuments Historiques in 2010, and as such, is not allowed to leave French soil. "
 
Cool story, Hun407kmh 👍 (Do you see what I did there?)

So it would seem that they hadn't taped up the vents this time, (I'm pretty sure they did that in the past,) but just that they were smaller than they needed to be to stop the engine from cooking.
 
The chicanes were added because FIA rules state that no straight can be more than 1 mile (1.609km) in length. A chicane was also added on the Bathurst circuit for the same reasons. The car with the top speed was a Peugeot P88 titled "Project 400" (standing for the goal to break 400kph). They did hit 251.7mph (405kph), and retired after 59 laps with an overheated engine. I do believe that it was unneeded to add the chicanes, as drivers today hit roughly 330kph before the chicanes. It did lower the number of injuries and deaths greatly, but this year at Le Mans Anthony Davison broke his back in an incident at the end of the straight, so injuries haven't been eliminated with the addition of the chicanes. And lastly, I feel that the straight was part of the character, or reputation, that the famous circuit has; and the chicanes have somewhat ruined it.

It's absolutely different to control a car going at its 95% instead of its 100%.

Also teams would aim for a higher top speed without the chicanes, and it's rude to resurrect a 8 year old thread lol.
 
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Cool story, Hun407kmh 👍 (Do you see what I did there?)

:lol: daan, I guess either you have great memory or amazing divination skills. However, the mrs. stopped me from going faster than 200 and so 200 it is and probably will remain forever! :)


EDIT - Famine, not for all of you, I stand corrected :)
 
Do you guys think today's LMP cars could reach those speeds?

Because today they reach around 215 mph at most, but surprisingly the lap times are almost identical.
 
^ I don't think so, unless they start reducing the downforce drastically. It's the cornering of the modern cars which more than make up for the time lost on the straights.
 
Do you guys think today's LMP cars could reach those speeds?

Because today they reach around 215 mph at most, but surprisingly the lap times are almost identical.

They are about 10 seconds a lap slower than they used to be in the Group C era.

3:23.787 this year in qualifying against a 3:14 something from a Lancia LC2 back in the day.

They would have to lose all their downforce and get very slick bodywork if the ACO decided to bypass the chicanes. That would make the rest of the track very interesting.

Interestingly, the ACO has not ruled out a return to the no chicane straight. I doubt we'll ever see it again though.
 
Do you guys think today's LMP cars could reach those speeds?

Because today they reach around 215 mph at most, but surprisingly the lap times are almost identical.

If they allowed ground effects again, yes a modern car would be faster. Aerodynamics have come a long, long way since then. Plus all the advancements in engines, gearboxes, brakes, etc etc etc.
But the current cars rely too much on wings (which mean drag) and are designed for corners seeing as the straight isn't so straight anymore.
 
^^^The current track's qualifying lap record is a 3'18.5 by the Peugeot 908 in 2008, the fastest Group C time was a 3'14.8 by a Porsche 962 in 1985, and the fastest ever was 3'13.6 by a Porsche 917k in 1971.
 
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The track records though can't be really compared since the layouts of the circuits changed many times.

But they do provide a good guide into how today's cars fare against cars back then.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but group c cars didn't go as far between stints compared to today's machinery.
 
Group c cars ate gas and tires much faster than the modern cars, and their engines, gearboxes, brakes, etc didn't last as long either. So they went shorter stints as well as a smaller percentage of cars finished the entire race
 
WM 88 remains today in the same condition as the day it won the world speed record.

As fast as the cars are at Le Mans Paul Tracy in an Indycar still holds the record for highest closed course competition trap speed at 256.948 mph (413.518 kmh) in 1996 at Michigan International Speedway.
 
As fast as the cars are at Le Mans Paul Tracy in an Indycar still holds the record for highest closed course competition trap speed at 256.948 mph (413.518 kmh) in 1996 at Michigan International Speedway.

Yes and the land speed record is 763 mph..
 
I've heard that the drivers from the past generally felt the chicanes actually added more danger; they now could not afford a slight break in concentration due to the two lumps in the back straight. The turns aren't considered difficult, but the added braking points from 200 mph to 70 mph (estimates) just put a little more danger.

Supposedly, Jo Gartner's fatal accident was brought about by an errant deer that had crossed the track, but eyewitness accounts might be a tad faulty in the dark of night. If we want to be specious about it, there haven't been any deaths at Le Mans since then.
 
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Earth
As fast as the cars are at Le Mans Paul Tracy in an Indycar still holds the record for highest closed course competition trap speed at 256.948 mph (413.518 kmh) in 1996 at Michigan International Speedway.

It's an oval, granted, but that is ******* fast.
 
The track records though can't be really compared since the layouts of the circuits changed many times.

But they do provide a good guide into how today's cars fare against cars back then.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but group c cars didn't go as far between stints compared to today's machinery.

Wrong. Group C was a fuel limited category. They did one Hour stints at Le Mans and covered 16 laps per stint.

Group c cars ate gas and tires much faster than the modern cars, and their engines, gearboxes, brakes, etc didn't last as long either. So they went shorter stints as well as a smaller percentage of cars finished the entire race

I don't know what category you are thinking of but it isn't Group C.

Group C cars where allowed just 5 fuel stops in a 1000KM race and 25 in the Le Mans 24 hours.
 
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