The remake car thread

[Conza]

I don't know about anyone else, but I have for some reason, a huge hatred of the new Mini, and love the old Mini. And it's been nearly a decade since the Mini was revived by BMW, but the thing I hate the most is that they keep flogging it with newer weird variants, and none of them make it any better.

I'm sure there are heaps of examples of newer versions that people go 'wow, what is that?' and likewise 'wow, thats a massive improvement', so it'll be interesting to hear a comparison from two other people.

When I look at modern Minis, they don't really exist like they once did, they are German not British, Large on the outside but Small on the inside, not the other way around, some of them are fast, but they aren't cheap cars for the masses, they're now little more than a fashion symbol, kinda like the beetle remake from a similar time.

And I especially hate non-car people who buy them, then think their somehow british for buying one, no, you're not, you're buying a german product from the manufacturer renowned for their FR configurations, not their FF configurations, and its cheap on the BMW scale as well.

Then there's the stupid variants, wagon variants, coupe, soft-top, on and on it goes. I think its currently aimed as a C-segment hatch, and it needs to be moved, to the B-segment, maybe even introduce a 2 litre engine, instead of this 1.6 engine used every where. The essence of the original car is gone and this car is a mere shadow by comparison.

 

[Tornado]

I quite like the Fiat 500. And the New New Beetle, too.





Also, inb4 Joey.

 

[Dennisch]

BMW Z8. That is all.


Edit!!!
And Mercedes SLS.

That is all.

Again.

 

[Giygas]

I really liked the GT1 homologation specials of the 90's, but now there's little reason to remake them

I'd also like a remake of the 8 series, but BMW and Audi seem to shy away from the idea of big luxo-coupes for some reason.

 

[JrDarknes]

I'd also like a remake of the 8 series, but BMW and Audi seem to shy away from the idea of big luxo-coupes for some reason.

I know right!!?;!. I didn't know this car existed til I saw one pull through burger king. They need to bring it back!

 

[niky]

The one MINI concept that actually shows what a modern Mini could be is the MINI Rocketman:

Great design. Modernizes the Mini look instead of the disappointing incremental change with the current models, and it's actually small.

The problem with MINI nowadays is that to preserve their vaunted handling, they are still sticking to the Z-axle design that robs the MINI hatchback of any useful rear space. The Mazda2/Fiesta handle swell with a torsion H-beam... and the Focus shows a way to minimize the multilink without sacrificing handling.

Maybe it's about time MINI considered investing in a more compact rear suspension design for their smaller models. Sure, you can't get the ride/handling balance as sweet with a compact set-up, but MINIs ride like garbage anyway... [/end MINI rant]

-

Modern takes on classics I'd like to see:
http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2007/05/21-benchmark-ford-escort-concept/

Pretty self-explanatory. An upright, compact, two-door or four-door sports sedan, perhaps available with an Ecoboost 1.6. Use Ford's control blade rear to keep packaging compact.

And it doesn't have to be slavishly retro. Chevrolet has already been mulling something like this with the 130R, which could be seen as a modern interpretation of the Opel Kadet:

And that one's powered by a 1.4 liter turbo.

These buzzboxes would introduce a new generation to the loads of fun we had in our childhood, skating around in light, rear wheel drive cars. (I'm just old enough to have experienced the last of the light 1970's RWDs, before they rusted away into oblivion) And if you make them in four-door form, you can lower the price of admission due to economies of scale.

 

[homeforsummer]

And it doesn't have to be slavishly retro. Chevrolet has already been mulling something like this with the 130R, which could be seen as a modern interpretation of the Opel Kadet

The 130R reminded me of another remake I'd love to have seen:

Still one of my favourite concept cars ever.

As for other remakes, like Toronado I quite like the current Beetle, as it's much closer proportionally to the classic car than the New Beetle was, and the detailing is better too. It's actually longer and wider than the New Beetle but because it's less of a blob it looks smaller and more agile. It does drive better too, and there's no longer a football field between you and the windscreen when you sit inside.

 

[Liquid]

Generally, I want to see more saloons. I like the saloon body style, with an actual, third box where the boot is, as opposed to fastbacks and notchbacks. I'm not a big fan of increasingly curvy, angular body shapes.

However, I fear that I am increasingly alone in disliking modern car design.

 

[avens]

They don't do small cars anymore, which I like lots but old cars are increasingly unreliable and with expensive parts.

At the same time I really like current cars design as they resemble prototypes quite a lot, considering regulations and that prototype-like cars seems a tendency that is going to continue over the years.

The "dark ages of car design" are finally over. I know it sounds dramatic but besides some models there was a huge period of time with cars a lot less appealing than lets say the 60s.

 

[homeforsummer]

I'm not a big fan of increasingly curvy, angular body shapes.

So which don't you like? Curvy or angular? Both are rather different...

 

[analog]

You know, I got excited by a new Mini when I saw these concepts back in 1997 which weren't pastiche nor retro (apart from a few recognizable Mini cues) and showed a new possible direction but instead they went upmarket trendy and conventionally retro and to my eyes the BMW Mini's don't even pull that of convincingly (they're too big and not 'cute' enough), the new Fiat 500 is better in that regard but I think I'll still take a new Panda instead.

As for my favourite modern reinterpretations of a classic.

The Fenomenom Stratos ranks pretty high.

But so does this.

And this one is pretty much at the top.

 

[MatskiMonk]

I don't know about anyone else, but I have for some reason, a huge hatred of the new Mini, and love the old Mini. And it's been nearly a decade since the Mini was revived by BMW, but the thing I hate the most is that they keep flogging it with newer weird variants, and none of them make it any better.

I'm sure there are heaps of examples of newer versions that people go 'wow, what is that?' and likewise 'wow, thats a massive improvement', so it'll be interesting to hear a comparison from two other people.

When I look at modern Minis, they don't really exist like they once did, they are German not British, Large on the outside but Small on the inside, not the other way around, some of them are fast, but they aren't cheap cars for the masses, they're now little more than a fashion symbol, kinda like the beetle remake from a similar time.

And I especially hate non-car people who buy them, then think their somehow british for buying one, no, you're not, you're buying a german product from the manufacturer renowned for their FR configurations, not their FF configurations, and its cheap on the BMW scale as well.

Then there's the stupid variants, wagon variants, coupe, soft-top, on and on it goes. I think its currently aimed as a C-segment hatch, and it needs to be moved, to the B-segment, maybe even introduce a 2 litre engine, instead of this 1.6 engine used every where. The essence of the original car is gone and this car is a mere shadow by comparison.

You probably hate the new one because you love the old one.

I like the new one because it's a cash-cow for BMW, and I dislike the old one because it's not a pleasant place to be as a passenger, it's uncomfortable, it's small on the outside and small on the inside, it's not actually as fast as it feels - mostly because you are sat so close to the ground, and in these days of SUVs and luxo-barges in towns, visibility is rubbish. The MINI isn't exactly large on the outside, it's not a bad handler, and on the second hand market they're now cheap enough to really start capturing interest from youngsters (<21) who want something a little classier and cooler than a Citroen. You might not like the other variants, but, they're different, and the countryman - being the least Mini like, is one of the most popular.

Also, they're still plenty British enough, sure BMW is the parent company and they're German, but enough of them are still made in England and powered by engines made in England.. the German parentage means they won't fall apart quite as readily as they might, and they won't go bust with in two years!

Like I say, judge the MINI without the Mini and it makes a lot of sense, judging the MINI by the Mini lets nostalgia cloud peoples judgement.

Just my two cents. Like I say I'm not a big fan of the MINI either.

 

[Liquid]

So which don't you like? Curvy or angular? Both are rather different...

No. No. No. No.

 

[Famine]

And it's been nearly a decade since the Mini was revived by BMW, but the thing I hate the most is that they keep flogging it with newer weird variants, and none of them make it any better.

Oh yeah, that never happened with the original...

I hate both Minis, for reference. I wrote a slightly unpopular blog article about it.

 

[Tornado]

I think cars have been getting more and more overstyled in recent years. To the extent of looking like caricatures of older models rather than cars themselves.

 

[Liquid]

I hate both Minis, for reference. I wrote a slightly unpopular blog article about it.

This.

I've never been a fan of the Mini. Such an oversaturated cliche.

 

[XS]

I love the niche remakes, i.e the Stratos (God I wish that was produced), the SLS, Ford GT, etc. But I rarely like the mass produced remakes like the Fiat 500, and completely agree with the OP's opinion of the Mini.

 

[homeforsummer]

I dislike the old one because it's not a pleasant place to be as a passenger, it's uncomfortable

All correct.

it's small on the outside

Also correct, but is that automatically a bad thing? A Lotus Elan makes even an MX-5 look gigantic, but driving a small car is incredibly liberating after inflated modern stuff. Roads feel twice as wide.

and small on the inside

While the driving position in Minis is a bit... odd... they're actually very space-efficient unless you're a lanky giant. I'd go as far as saying there's more rear space in the early Minis than there is in a MINI, because it was designed that way rather than a couple of seats needing to be squeezed into a retro shape.

it's not actually as fast as it feels

Also correct, but again - is this such a bad thing? I'd rather be having a hoot to find out I'm doing 15mph than be bored witless at 70mph.

Some of the best fun I've had this year in a car was in a 64 Cooper S on some private land. Barely broke 30mph, but it was hilarious from start to finish.

and in these days of SUVs and luxo-barges in towns, visibility is rubbish.

It's not really the Mini's fault that a Range Rover is like a block of flats next to it. By all sane measurements an old Mini has better visibility than 99% of modern cars because it has roof pillars like cocktail sticks and big, flat panes of glass to see out of.

Saying it's rubbish because big cars block your view is like saying a convertible's view of the sky is rubbish when you're driving through a tunnel...

No. No. No. No.

Focus aside, I think those are all quite successful designs. The BMW I would call outright curvy, the others more angular, and the Focus a bloody mess. I'd not say that modern car design is any more "angular & curvy" (cojoined terms) than particularly any other decade, save for perhaps the 1980s when everything was made of rectangles

A more accurate way of describing modern car design is to say that it plays heavily on combinations of concave and convex surfaces. Some do this more successfully than others...

I think cars have been getting more and more overstyled in recent years.

Generally I'd agree. The Focus is again a good example of this, as is the MINI. The new Beetle less so, as they've resisted the temptation to throw loads of chrome and odd surfacing on it.

Much as they're maligned for designing a range of identical curves, Audi is perhaps one of the least guilty of over-styling their cars at the moment.

A car I'd like to see remade?

Yes, Mercedes still sells an SL, and it's a nice enough thing to drive, but too many modern Mercs are a bit monstrous at the moment. They've never topped the elegance, class, and restrained detailing of the Pagoda SL. In fact, I'm not sure any car company has made anything since which is quite as tasteful.

Unfortunately, it does have poor visibility when it's parked between four brick walls.

 

[Liquid]

Focus aside, I think those are all quite successful designs. The BMW I would call outright curvy, the others more angular, and the Focus a bloody mess. I'd not say that modern car design is any more "angular & curvy" (cojoined terms) than particularly any other decade, save for perhaps the 1980s when everything was made of rectangles

A more accurate way of describing modern car design is to say that it plays heavily on combinations of concave and convex surfaces. Some do this more successfully than others...

Fair enough, you've described it much better than I have.

I just don't have tastes which reflect the current trends. Much like with clothes and music!

 

[OHM_fusion]

Generally, I want to see more saloons. I like the saloon body style, with an actual, third box where the boot is, as opposed to fastbacks and notchbacks. I'm not a big fan of increasingly curvy, angular body shapes.

However, I fear that I am increasingly alone in disliking modern car design.

I'm with you. It's impossible to find a traditional sedan nowdays. I like simpler, more subtle looks with good proportions. Can't think of a single modern sedan that does that.

I think cars have been getting more and more overstyled in recent years. To the extent of looking like caricatures of older models rather than cars themselves.

So true. People are too concerned about what looks modern instead of what looks good.

 

[avens]

I've never been a fan of the Mini. Such an oversaturated cliche.

Instead of a wall text I'll just say this: there are quite a few reasons why Enzo Ferrari had 3 minis (one custom made) and used them as a daily driver. Funny that his old self drove minis more than ferraris.

If classic minis were more reliable there would be 100x more still running no matter that for the price (considering spares and work) you can get "better" cars based on stats. If anything, classic minis are underestimated and underused.

 

[Worst_Driver]

I quite like the Challenger revival. It stays relatively true to the original and you can spot easily the similarities. I don't understand why people dislike it's size compared to the mustang and the camaro. Yes it is bigger, heavier than the competition but it's a muscle car not a compact and that's why I like it.

 

[niky]

I suspect with Minis, it's much the concept of owning and driving that's more important than actually doing so.

Just like classic Beetles. I can honestly say that some of the most dreadful times I've ever had on the road were in a Beetle.

I'd still buy one. Heck, if I won the lottery, it'd be going into my garage beside a classic Mini, Escort and Opel Kadet.

 

[homeforsummer]

Quite. Even as a Beetle owner I'd say it isn't up to much to drive, though no doubt once mine is done and dusted it'll be slightly improved - an alignment and some new tyres certainly wouldn't go amiss!

That said, Minis are genuinely great fun to drive. They're certainly compromised, but then so is more or less any classic car next to a modern equivalent. A Jag E-Type is wonderful in isolation but next to a new XK it feels slow, noisy, doesn't handle, doesn't stop, has heavy controls... you get the idea.

And Minis do still have some benefits. They're getting a bit steep to buy these days for a good, working one, but parts for them grow on trees and even the most expensive mechanical jobs is about the same as replacing a power steering pump on a modern MINI (except you can do it yourself rather than having to take it to a stealership). They're fun to drive, which is a given. Smallness means easy to park/manoeuver/fit in the garage. And, if you're into this sort of thing (and most of us here are, as petrolheads) it also has quite a spectacular heritage, with giant-killing performances in rallies and touring car racing.

All of that makes the MINI a bit limp-wristed by comparison.

Even if I'd prefer to drive a MINI every day over a Mini. Though I'd have an early MX-5 over both. Or, if someone was offering, the aforementioned Pagoda SL.

 

[Roo]

Minis (as opposed to MINIs) make a lot more sense if you think of them as a pet. They'll make you smile, they'll piss you off, sometimes you'll love them, sometimes you'll wonder why you bother. But getting rid of one whilst it's still going is very difficult to do. You either get it or you don't; I had 2 Minis (technically I still have one), but I can't see the point of owning, say, a guinea pig. Or a labador. Or a pony, and so on and so forth and suchlike. And after you've enjoyed your Mini pet, you can still drive to work in it, which you can't do with a hamster. Unless it's broken again. (The Mini, obviously. A broken hamster is about as much use as a working one.)

 

[Giygas]

My dad owned a grey MINI Cooper S while i was in elementary school and while it was certainly a fun, quick little thing, it was the bane of our existence. I believe in the 3 years he owned it he had to replace the clutch and eventually the transmission, and the back seats were downright terrible. I believe it might've led to the back problems i have today; they were cramped, rock hard, and pretty much unwelcoming.

 

[Leonidae@MFT]

This needs to be redone. C70 and C30 were decent, but they were just shortened or less practical versions of their saloon siblings. Volvo has plenty of sales, so making a less practical RWD sportscar wouldn't hurt but increase sales instead.

 

[Liquid]

RWD Volvos

Excellent call. Volvo should make a simple RWD car again.

 

[homeforsummer]

I don't want to open a can of worms here, but any reason it has to be RWD in particular? It's not like the P1800 was a big c00l dr1ft0rZ car - it was all about the style.

 

[Celicaas]

For me they should Remake the Elcamino & chevelle and Old Chevy caprice (The american one not this australian Fake interpatition of a Big V8 american saloon )
and Big block V8 Engine rather than the stupid ecotec

Even ford is doing the same thing

And they should Return oldsomible and buick and pontiac Also Cryhsler's AMC

Fast note These B Body cars of the 80's Were in variations Like the Caprice had alot Of similiar models from buick and oldsomible and pontiac