Us citizen: watch your downloads!

[Ibonibo]

http://news.cnet.com/8301-31001_3-5...-isps-to-start-policing-copyright-by-july-12/

Basiclly your ISP have become deputies of the content mafia.

Who needs SOPA right?

Discuss

 

[W3H5]

China 1 - U.S 0.

 

[terminator363]

I'm afraid Shem's correct.

 

[Joey D]

I hate the RIAA, they are what's wrong with the industry.

 

[Villain]

Nothing really sounds new. Still simple to circumvent for the worst offenders so nothing will change. They naive and lazy will get snatched up, hit the headlines for a bit, and this will be a hot story again. Then it goes away and they try new laws later.

 

[CodeRedR51]

So how exactly do they know you're downloading something illegally?

 

[Northstar]

So how exactly do they know you're downloading something illegally?

From where you are downloading the file from.

I see no problem with this, people need to stop acting like the law doesn't apply on the Internet.

 

[Azure Flare]

Silly US government, theres no oil on the internet!

 

[Northstar]

Silly US government, theres no oil on the internet!

This has nothing to do with the government. Also, oil? People are still using that insanely stupid argument?

 

[PAPPACLART]

Virgin Media in the UK, who are in the music and movie business but are also an ISP have in there power to monitor and to warn you, throttle you or suspend your connection much in the way that US ISP's are allowed to do now. I know plenty of people whom are with Virgin and illegally file share but have had no such letters of warning as of yet.

At the moment in the UK it is up to the discretion of the ISP if they actively pursue a file sharer and not all ISP's inforce this, even those that are in favor of doing so. Also some ISP's do not agree to such monitoring of there customers.

If Virgin got tough with file sharers, I can see a large amount of its subscribers jumping ship, and heading off the the nearest ISP that does not penalize illegal file sharers.

This can only have a degree of success if all ISP's agree and set out to enforce this new power.

A VPN is probably a quick way around this tho is it not?

 

[Joey D]

So how exactly do they know you're downloading something illegally?

Knowing the shadiness of the RIAA, they'll probably just assume.

I see no problem with this, people need to stop acting like the law doesn't apply on the Internet.

You are essentially saying it is OK for a private organization to spy on what you are doing. If they can see your downloads, they can see everything else. Think about it, if the RIAA can police the Internet and take action how they see fit, then this opens the door for other media corporations. Would you really want to be in hot water over downloading a Gran Turismo picture? Or creating a GT video? If you let corporations and organizations get away with this, it'll eventually happen.

The Internet still has way to many gray areas that need to be colored in before laws start taking place. We also need technologically competent people making these laws, not some 60 year old Congressman that has no idea how to even work a mobile phone.

 

[Northstar]

You are essentially saying it is OK for a private organization to spy on what you are doing.

If I am using a service provided by them, yes.

 

[Joey D]

If I am using a service provided by them, yes.

You aren't using a service by the RIAA though, you are using an ISP.

 

[Northstar]

You aren't using a service by the RIAA though, you are using an ISP.

Where does it say the RIAA is doing the policing? From what I read the ISP's that are participating are just using their process for punishment, which seems reasonable.

The tinfoil hat business must be booming.

 

[arora]

I brought this up some time back, not suprised it's moving forward. My response from almost a year ago

Legislating from the ISP? Maybe not, circumventing the judicial system? Yeah I know I'm a crazed Xenophobic Right wing Patriot but surely more then just me dislikes this? (and no I'm not a pirate Aar!)

From here, https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=5574050#post5574050 3391 and on, and the piece I first heard of it.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/08/us-internet-piracy-idUSTRE7667FL20110708

 

[Ibonibo]

From where you are downloading the file from.

I see no problem with this, people need to stop acting like the law doesn't apply on the Internet.

As Kim dotcom can vouch for internet is not a legal free zone, and all without internet laws.
So why this, or Sopa, or acta, or.....

Did you ask Matt Groening permission for your avatar picture?
busted!

it's not about illegal downloads, it's about privacy which you are entiteled to and the contentindusty grabbing on the copyright form centuries ago.

Why intellectual propriety is more important than material propriety?

When you write a book, you and your children and future generation can live on that one invention.
Is that normal? Is it right? What added-value did the future generations add.

Look also at the income numbers of contentindustry during the last 10 years, a period in which the pirating really took off, they increased their income massively! So why whine?

Copyright and Patents need to be change to modern times.

Every one creating a value, whether intellectual or material, should be paid and honored for it. It's product should be protected.
But for how long? And for how much?
that is the discussion that needs to be raised.

Look at the design patent from Apple for a Pad.
Ridiculous.
A display behind a transparent panel.
Really, what else, behind bricks?

Look megaupload still had people paying for content even if it was illegal.
For now, convience and price are not given, therefor the problem with piracy.
So instead of changing their business method to the new medium, Internet, they try to force us by laws, bills, and repressive methods into adapting into their old archaic business model.

that's why it's call Contentmafia.
that's why the discussion.
that's why the need for change

 

[Joey D]

Where does it say the RIAA is doing the policing? From what I read the ISP's that are participating are just using their process for punishment, which seems reasonable.

The tinfoil hat business must be booming.

The RIAA is using the ISPs as a puppet. They are the ones pulling the strings. Even then I don't see how they can just make their own laws as they see fit. This is what everyone protesting was against and now it doesn't matter because it's a private organization?

It all stems from the RIAA using a failed business model, if they want to stop illegal downloading they need to change how they do business. Look at Steam, it's helped reduce computer game piracy, they have a proper business model for modern times.

 

[arora]

Did you ask Matt Groening permission for your avatar picture?
busted!

Every one creating a value, whether intellectual or material, should be paid and honored for it. It's product should be protected.
But for how long? And for how much?
that is the discussion that needs to be raised.

Something like how the pharmaceutical patents work? i.e. research and development is rewarded for 5 years or something, then not only is generic reproduction allowed but encouraged, I believe the original company even provides there Proprietary information(not clear on that but I do know the generic companies get all the info they need).

This gives the big dogs great profits and also the motivation to continue new r and d.

 

[Ibonibo]

^Generic drugs generally take very long to become available because of patents. And with Acta, which the US also agreed on already despite the protest for SOPA (diversion tactic),these patents will become even more protected than before making new generics drugs are rarity.

Politics are the puppets of the lobbies

True story. Look ACTA's text.

 

[Pupik]

China 1 - U.S 0.

Quick! Tell me if you can access Google?

 

[arora]

yes I'm familiar with acta, of course I don't care much for it but that wasn't really my point. In an attempt to continue said conversation about patents as you described, I was more going for a generality of sorts, for comparison. Btw I don't consider art(music, films, etc) the same as something contributing greatly to society, as much as say software perhaps. I do believe the more information that is freely shared the greater possibility for human advancement and bettered standard of living for all.


DR. SHARON LEVINE

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Do you think that we run the risk today of making brand manufacturers look like greedy mortals who will do anything to make a buck and stretch out their patents? Whereas that's totally unjustified, because they do such marvelous work in creating, finding, discovering new drugs. And there is no -- there is no system in the world that can match ours for the discovery of new pharmaceuticals.

And then the generics come along and they take all of that research and use it, and it's legitimate, but they don't spend $1 billion bringing a drug to market. They don't go through the agony of protocols put out by the FDA. So we're not really knocking brand drugs here, are we?


DR. LEVINE: Not at all. What Congress has said is there is a period of time where the brand manufacturer has the right to monopoly- price the product and get return on that investment. And there's a point at which, though, consumers have the right to have access to those drugs when the patent expires.

And I agree with you that this is not about knocking brand manufacturers. It's really about a balance. It's finding the balance between ensuring we have enough investment in brand pharmaceutical companies to ensure a continuing stream of innovation. But also that we have a point at which those patents expire and the price comes down and the consumers -- who, by the way, through their taxes are supporting a lot of the basic research that goes into this drug development -- they have a right to get access to those drugs at a price they can afford.

http://www.mclaughlin.com/transcript.htm?id=214&moo=1

I figured this sort of thing is what you where talking about, not kids stealing mp3 tunes on torrents.

 

[Northstar]

As Kim dotcom can vouch for internet is not a legal free zone, and all without internet laws.
So why this, or Sopa, or acta, or.....

Because it's better than getting the government involved and wasting even more tax dollars.

Did you ask Matt Groening permission for your avatar picture?
busted!

Nope, and I would just take it down on the first of the 5 warnings they will seemingly be giving before doing anything.

it's not about illegal downloads, it's about privacy which you are entiteled to and the contentindusty grabbing on the copyright form centuries ago.

Your ISP could track your movements before this, why the fuss now?

Why intellectual propriety is more important than material propriety?

Who said it was?

Copyright and Patents need to be change to modern times.

I agree, but as of this post they haven't so it doesn't change much.

So instead of changing their business method to the new medium, Internet, they try to force us by laws, bills, and repressive methods into adapting into their old archaic business model.

Are you forgetting itunes, Amazon MP3 Store, Zune etc... exist?

The RIAA is using the ISPs as a puppet.

So? People are stealing from them and ISP's have the means to stop it.

Even then I don't see how they can just make their own laws as they see fit.

They aren't, every ISP has voluntarily joined this and has the right to refuse service to anyone.

This is what everyone protesting was against and now it doesn't matter because it's a private organization?

There is an insanely huge difference between this and SOPIPTA, the big one being these would basically kill the internet without warning, this gives you..

1) A Warning
2) A Second Warning
3) A Confirmation of the warning
4) A Third Warning
5) Action

This doesn't even seem to be going after sites even, seems it's focused entirely on users and if after 4 warning you are still stupid enough to pirate you deserve to have your internet shut off.

It all stems from the RIAA using a failed business model, if they want to stop illegal downloading they need to change how they do business. Look at Steam, it's helped reduce computer game piracy, they have a proper business model for modern times.

Again, there is iTunes as well as other various Internet music stores, what exactly do you think they should do?

 

[Joey D]

So? People are stealing from them and ISP's have the means to stop it.

No one is stealing from the RIAA using ISP's. People are committing copyright infringement, but that is not theft of any kind. I really wish people would stop thinking copyright infringement is theft, because it isn't, it's copyright infringement.

They aren't, every ISP has voluntarily joined this and has the right to refuse service to anyone.

I don't believe for a second ISP's have voluntarily joined this. They have either been threatened by the RIAA with legal action or lawsuits if they don't comply. I don't think any ISP wants to lose customers since it's so easy for them to make money at it and the Internet is in such high demand. Plus the more people want to download anything ISP's can make more money by offering outrageously expensive high bandwidth packages.

The RIAA are a bully of an organization which has been seen time and time again, this isn't beneath them at all.

There is also no checks and balances system, who's not to say that I don't have written permission from the artist that I can download there song? Just viewing a download isn't really going to give any other information than it's happening. It's saying someone is guilty and they must prove their innocence...which isn't how it works in America.

There is an insanely huge difference between this and SOPIPTA, the big one being these would basically kill the internet without warning, this gives you..

1) A Warning
2) A Second Warning
3) A Confirmation of the warning
4) A Third Warning
5) Action

This doesn't even seem to be going after sites even, seems it's focused entirely on users and if after 4 warning you are still stupid enough to pirate you deserve to have your internet shut off.

There's a difference yes, but it's not that big and they are along similar lines. If you let the RIAA start doing this then it opens the door for other organization like MPAA to start doing the same thing. Would you really want your Internet shut off for downloading an image from a movie? Or writing fan-fiction? Or creating a movie character for a skin in a game? I know I wouldn't.

And really if you pirate and deserve have your Internet shut off, than I guess the RIAA should have their's turned off pronto!

Again, there is iTunes as well as other various Internet music stores, what exactly do you think they should do?

Drop the RIAA altogether and allow artists to marker their music the way they see fit. Or just do what Radiohead did with In Rainbows, allow people to pay what they think the music is worth. It's been successful with the bands that have done that. I'll admit I never really listened to Radiohead and when In Rainbows came out I downloaded it for free, legally. I ended up liking them so much I bought other albums and ended up paying for In Rainbows. I will also buy tickets when the come to town this summer (they finally decided they want to play in Detroit ). Most artists I don't even bother giving their album a try because I hear the one song on the radio that sucks and I don't want to pay $12 for it. I'm sure I'm missing some great music out there.

iTunes is a massive racket in itself, $.99-$1.29 per song is way to expensive and if bought individually it would be way more expensive than the album itself. The only thing I buy off of iTunes is apps for my phone, they can keep their music. If I really want an album I'll buy it off Amazon for lower than retail price and I'll get a physical copy of the media while I'm at it.

Spotify is the best transformation of the industry I've seen yet. For $9.99 a month I get access to millions of songs with no time limits and on my mobile device? That makes a ton of sense. If you're so inclined you can even get a free version with ads and time limits, but that's still millions of songs for free. The best part is it is 100% legal, however I'm sure the RIAA will eventually try to take it down.

 

[Slash]

There is going to be so many people they will need to bust it won't even be worth it.