What could I do to improve my time

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jeff666p
It's a sti type r v6
Tires sports hard
suspension
ride height 105in front 100 rear
spring rate 4kgf front 6 kgf rear
dampers compression and extension 5 front 7 rear
roll bars 5 front 7 rear
camber angle 0 front and read
toe 0 front and rear
center diff is 35:65

Everything else is stock

How much more can I get out of this car set up like this without changing the settings.


 
I've heard that having positive toe in front and negative toe in back improves handling. If that's what your looking for.
 
It's a sti type r v6
Tires sports hard
suspension
ride height 105in front 100 rear
spring rate 4kgf front 6 kgf rear
dampers compression and extension 5 front 7 rear
roll bars 5 front 7 rear
camber angle 0 front and read
toe 0 front and rear
center diff is 35:65

Everything else is stock

How much more can I get out of this car set up like this without changing the settings.


I have no sound on my end but from what I could see.
1. You could carry more speed through turn 3 entering the tunnel.
2. I think you can carry more speed through 5.
3. You missed the apex in turn 7 which cost you at least a half second on the straight.
4. You missed the apex and ran wide through 8 and 10 and 11.

Not sure what the PP of that car is, but I'd say you left several seconds on the track.

For comparison, @GT_Alex74 had a Trial Mountain TT Board and tested many cars all stock with no oil change. Not sure which STI you are in because there are several in the game, but you might find it on that board, or something similar.
TrialMountain_zpsc790c698.png
 
How much more can I get out of this car set up like this without changing the settings.
Oh I didn't realize that you were trying to get the most out of the vehicle without changing anything :dunce:. My bad.
 
As pointed out above there's plenty of time to be had,
you've got it moving around nicely but either far too early, or too late (mid-corner)
the awd setup can be very fast when driven loose, but you need to be using a lift-off oversteer technique toget it loose on entry and straight-line the exit.
This also has you on the throttle much earlier and keeps the turbo up on boost faster.

I also see you spend a lot of time with either no brake or throttle applied, (coasting),
that costs time,
you either need to be accelerating or braking in low powered cars like this

Also remember that the V6 STi did have a DCCD unit in the cabin, so there is no cheating in adjusting it from 35:65 up to 50:50 to get your desired handling balance
 
I watch an episode of Top Gear couple days ago on Hulu and it shows Jackie Stuart teaching May how to drive faster. He said this about the throttle:

"Only let off the throttle if you intend to brake."

Something like that, not a 100% accurate quote, but it was along the lines of that. Letting off the gas and jamming back on it constantly only upsets the balance and makes you go slower. Staying on the gas very lightly instead of lifting keeps the car balanced and maintain momentum. Try that, see if it works. Did for me. 👍
 
I have no sound on my end but from what I could see.
1. You could carry more speed through turn 3 entering the tunnel.
2. I think you can carry more speed through 5.
3. You missed the apex in turn 7 which cost you at least a half second on the straight.
4. You missed the apex and ran wide through 8 and 10 and 11.

Not sure what the PP of that car is, but I'd say you left several seconds on the track.

For comparison, @GT_Alex74 had a Trial Mountain TT Board and tested many cars all stock with no oil change. Not sure which STI you are in because there are several in the game, but you might find it on that board, or something similar.
TrialMountain_zpsc790c698.png
This^

Also, make sure you use the full width of the track in every corner. It'll help you shave off a lot of your time.
 
I watch an episode of Top Gear couple days ago on Hulu and it shows Jackie Stuart teaching May how to drive faster. He said this about the throttle:

"Only let off the throttle if you intend to brake."

Something like that, not a 100% accurate quote, but it was along the lines of that. Letting off the gas and jamming back on it constantly only upsets the balance and makes you go slower. Staying on the gas very lightly instead of lifting keeps the car balanced and maintain momentum. Try that, see if it works. Did for me. 👍

The quote is the other way around, something like "only get on the throttle if you're going to stay on it". But you've go the right reasoning, no throttle at all or very light throttle is best unless you're actually about to nail it down a straight.

How much more can I get out of this car set up like this without changing the settings.




Honestly, and I apologise if this sounds rude or elitist, I think you could improve your line on just about every single corner on that track. There's plenty of time to be made simply by getting your braking, turn in, and exit points right, and smoothing out your inputs through the corner.

If you're interested in knowing how I'd go about it let me know, and I'll be happy to go through corner by corner.
 
BEST thing to improve times is adjusting FOV.

Correct FOV improves driving precision.

You can adjust some FOV if you enable multiple screen. That allow you to reduce FOV until 50. You can also try cockpit view: standard, narrow, narrowest.

As in GT you can't adjust with precision FOV, my rule is to narrow view until car wheel is more or less same size of your wheel.


http://www.projectimmersion.com/fov/

In this website you can calculate your correct FOV.
 
I watch an episode of Top Gear couple days ago on Hulu and it shows Jackie Stuart teaching May how to drive faster. He said this about the throttle:

"Only let off the throttle if you intend to brake."

Something like that, not a 100% accurate quote, but it was along the lines of that. Letting off the gas and jamming back on it constantly only upsets the balance and makes you go slower. Staying on the gas very lightly instead of lifting keeps the car balanced and maintain momentum. Try that, see if it works. Did for me. 👍

Sorry to correct you but Sir Jackie told May: "only push the accelerator pedal getting out of a corner when you are sure that you won't have to take your foot from it again in the same corner."
 
The basic rule for being fast is "slow in fast out".
The most important thing is corner exit speed. Your lap is the exact opposite of that rule.
You are way to aggressive on corner entry, the tires loose grip and the car understeers all the way
through the corner.
Try to brake a bit earlier, than use lift-off oversteer the get the nose rotating towards the
apex and wait for the right moment to throttle.

Maybe this helps:

 
The basic rule for being fast is "slow in fast out".
The most important thing is corner exit speed. Your lap is the exact opposite of that rule.
You are way to aggressive on corner entry, the tires loose grip and the car understeers all the way
through the corner.
Try to brake a bit earlier, than use lift-off oversteer the get the nose rotating towards the
apex and wait for the right moment to throttle.

Maybe this helps:


This.
 
The quote is the other way around, something like "only get on the throttle if you're going to stay on it". But you've go the right reasoning, no throttle at all or very light throttle is best unless you're actually about to nail it down a straight.



Honestly, and I apologise if this sounds rude or elitist, I think you could improve your line on just about every single corner on that track. There's plenty of time to be made simply by getting your braking, turn in, and exit points right, and smoothing out your inputs through the corner.

If you're interested in knowing how I'd go about it let me know, and I'll be happy to go through corner by corner.


Please tell me how you would go about it
 
The key here is hitting the apex with just the right amount of speed when entering a corner, so that in turn, you can maximize your speed when exiting a corner. You need to keep in mind how much speed can you carry through a corner without understeering or going wide. If you miss the apex and go really wide, try braking earlier. If you slowed down too much, delay your braking or ease off on the brakes.

It also helps if you don't mash the brakes once you're entering the corner, so that your wheels won't lock up. Only mash the brakes if you need to drastically reduce your speed (i.e. entering a slow corner at very high speed). Once you've entered the corner, ease off on the brakes so that you can still manage your speed when hitting the apex. A good example would be the Turn 8, which is a mid-speed corner right after a long straight. Being a long straight, you'll be carrying a lot of speed going into Turn 8 and so you need to mash the brakes to sufficiently slow down. If you're entering the turn and you're going in too slow, delay your braking. If you're going in too fast, go easy on the brakes (by that I mean stay on the brakes but don't mash them, instead hold the brake button lightly so that you can still slow down and manage your speed while steering towards the apex).

Then once you've hit the apex, make sure you don't go wide on the corner exit once you step on the gas. Most of the time this would require you to be easy on the throttle until it's pretty safe that you can floor it when exiting the corner.
 
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Please tell me how you would go about it
What @=drifting24/7= said above but on top of that, for me anyway, it's all mindset and your mental approach to driving. You have to commit to the apex every corner. If you can't make the apex consistently you should view it as an opportunity to learn and improve your racing ability and work on your consistency. There are several things you can try to improve hitting the apex:

1. Slower overall speed on entry. Then build entry speed in ensuing laps. I have a lot of experience in online racing these last few years in public lobbies and without a doubt this is the number one error I see most people make. Way too fast in=====>way too slow out.
2. Turn in slightly sooner.
3. Trail brake just enough to increase front grip without introducing understeer.
4. Tune the car for better turn in through camber adjustments, shocks, springs etc.
5. Be wary of how the car balances itself in the corner. Sometimes changing the timing of your brake release and turn in alters how the car will grip at the front and how easily you make it to the apex. For example, are you starting to turn while braking? Do you let the brake go and turn at the exact same time? Do you release the brake fully, coast a bit and then turn? Each one of those will balance the car differently and may help or hurt corner entry depending on the car/track/tire combination. Not every corner is the same and you may have to alter your timing to get the best entry into the corner and this equation may change from car to car as well.

You must be committed to the apex, it should be your primary goal on every corner. Consider a missed apex a missed opportunity to lower your lap times. The bigger the miss the bigger the opportunity lost. Forget about watching your lap times too, concentrate solely on technique when practicing and hotlapping and the lap times will come.
 
I'm in agreement with others here, turn down the aggression slightly and get it all done before the corner, not during, so that you can get on the power earlier for a better corner exit. There are times where you are not using all of the track and entering corners at too tight of an angle. Time sliding is usually time lost.

If it's of any help, I have a video with a similar performing car and regulations > all aids off, ABS only, grip real, Sports Hard tires, 100% stock Jaguar XKR '10. This was for a time trial competition in these forums back on GT5 some years ago. If I remember correctly, I kept within tenths of winner DHolland on his wheel, me on a controller. Sorry for the potato video quality.

 
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I'm in agreement with others here, turn down the aggression slightly and get it all done before the corner, not during, so that you can get on the power earlier for a better corner exit. There are times where you are not using all of the track and entering corners at too tight of an angle. Time sliding is usually time lost.

If it's of any help, I have a video with a similar performing car and regulations > all aids off, ABS only, grip real, Sports Hard tires, 100% stock Jaguar XKR '10. This was for a time trial competition in these forums back on GT5 some years ago. If I remember correctly, I placed 2nd, keeping within tenths of winner DHolland on his wheel, me on a controller. I was a tenth slower than his best controller time. Sorry for the potato video quality.

Second to DHolland is like being runner up in a physics competition with Albert Einstein and 100,000 other physicists :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:
 
Second to DHolland is like being runner up in a physics competition with Albert Einstein and 100,000 other physicists :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

I did some google search digging to see if I remembered accurately. Not quite, I got top controller time but 4th over all, it was Timpaq who got 2nd, but distance to Dholland was still measurable in tenths. Adjusted my post accordingly. I did win the previous week but D wasn't participating.
 
I did some google search digging to see if I remembered accurately. Not quite, I got top controller time but 4th over all, it was Timpaq who got 2nd, but distance to Dholland was still measurable in tenths. Adjusted my post accordingly. I did win the previous week but D wasn't participating.
I'll have to adjust mine accordingly then. That's like being beaten in a physics contest by Einstein, Hawking and another physicist, with 99, 996 other physicists vying for the win. :sly::bowdown::bowdown:
 
@jeff6666p You look like you are using wheel and turning too much going by how red the tyres go in corners. Try and go with the flow of the track more and use more of the track. Much better racing line in some of the videos posted by people above which should help you become much faster. Try and look at throttle and brake input and corner approach and also how tyres are loaded and compare to your video and see if you can change your approach which should help not only with this car and track but for all in the game.
I'll have to adjust mine accordingly then. That's like being beaten in a physics contest by Einstein, Hawking and another physicist, with 99, 996 other physicists vying for the win. :sly::bowdown::bowdown:
That another one being me. Think I could have won that event if I did a really decent lap and nailed the last corner. Dan was without ABS IIRC so all my sectors apart from last one were quite good in comparison and he was in beatable range due to the handicap of without ABS. I think on online races, I got a better head to head against Dan although that is due to me being lucky as I played 4 races in a row with him using controller which I managed to beat him with ease but with wheel, it was hard to keep up with him when he was in his rhythm.
 
@jeff6666p You look like you are using wheel and turning too much going by how red the tyres go in corners. Try and go with the flow of the track more and use more of the track. Much better racing line in some of the videos posted by people above which should help you become much faster. Try and look at throttle and brake input and corner approach and also how tyres are loaded and compare to your video and see if you can change your approach which should help not only with this car and track but for all in the game.

That another one being me. Think I could have won that event if I did a really decent lap and nailed the last corner. Dan was without ABS IIRC so all my sectors apart from last one were quite good in comparison and he was in beatable range due to the handicap of without ABS. I think on online races, I got a better head to head against Dan although that is due to me being lucky as I played 4 races in a row with him using controller which I managed to beat him with ease but with wheel, it was hard to keep up with him when he was in his rhythm.
I have to change my analogy now. That's like @Lewis_Hamilton_ finishing fourth in a physics contest with Einstein, Hawking, and Issac Newton (brought back to life by Hawking and Einstein of course) and 99, 996 other physicists.

All I can say is, thank God Lewis didn't finish 25th:lol:
 
Please tell me how you would go about it

Let's use this handy map to establish corner numbers, and I'll go through it step by step. I'm not the world's greatest driver, but I'll do my best.

43E93984-6ACC-450A-9497-FBEB73657CF5_zps99fe73ea.jpg


Turn 1: You turned in a little too hard, and possibly a little too early. See how your car twitched mid-corner and you had to correct? That lost you time, and put you off-line for the next corner. You want to be coming through there as smoothly as possible, keeping as much speed as you can and staying on the right line. The right line is more or less on the black tyre marks that you can see running through the apex of T1 and 2. Slow down as much as you have to in order to stay on that, and you'll be faster.

Turn 2: Is compromised by you being off-line from your aggressive T1. You ran too far out to the left, costing you time and scrubbing speed. You really need to try and stay at least right of centre of the track to give yourself the best set up for the next corner. Again, the black marks of the racing line show you where you should probably be.

Turn 3: Not too bad. If you get the previous two corners right, you'll find that you're in a better position to take a wide line and carry more speed through. A little wobble mid corner, but nothing major.

Turn 4: Your corner entry was on the right track, you've got to trail brake your way into the apex while turning in. However, it's a long corner and you gave up the apex very early, meaning your exit left you way on the other side of the track. Try and follow the black racing line again. You should be hugging the inside curb of that corner and should be roughly in the middle of the track when you exit the tunnel. Don't get too far to the right, it's distance that you don't need to cover and it makes you scramble to get back in line for the next corner.

Turn 5: You can carry a lot more speed and run your exit out a lot wider through here. Sacrifice some of your entry speed if you have to.

Turns 6 and 7: Decent. I think you could stay further left through 6 and turn into 7 a bit later, but that's just me. If anything it'll make the next bit easier.

Turn 8: This is one of the most important corners on the track. You've got a massive straight after it, so getting a good exit gains you lots and lots of time.

You want to be against the right tunnel wall more or less as you enter the tunnel. You need the car as far over on the right as early as possible, and straight. What you're gonna aim to do is cut straight across that yellow lined section on the inside of the corner. It can be tough to get right, but when you do get it it's so much faster it's not even funny. You'll start turning in a decent way from the tunnel exit, almost clip the left hand tunnel wall as you exit, fly across that yellow bit and find that your momentum carries you just up to the right hand wall in the second tunnel.

You'll know when you get it, the only problem is that the window for entry is small and if you stuff it up you probably hit a wall.

Turn 9: You want to be on the yellow stuff again. It's a long corner, so expect to be hugging the inside curb for a while. Get your braking done early, get into that yellow zone and hold it. You'll have to experiment with what works for you for finding a marker for when to accelerate out of the corner, but the line that you want to be on is shown by the black racing line on the road.

Turns 10 and 11: These are just here to make the entry into 12 harder.

Turn 12: This is a funny corner. You understeered way off line, which is the usual problem. Brake deeper into the corner, and brake earlier if you have to, but don't let your car get that wide that early. The black racing line shows you where you should be aiming for.

Turn 13: You just missed the apex. Brake a little earlier, turn a little earlier, you'll make the corner a bit shallower which lets you carry more speed, and you won't have to travel quite as far either.

Turns 14 and 15: The other most important corners of the track. You got sideways through them, and had to correct. What you should be aiming for is to brake for 14, turn in, and basically nail the throttle as you hit the apex. You've got tons of room on the exit of 15, so if you set yourself up right then you can just go for it once you're past the apex of 14.


In summary, a lot of your problem is your line. The lap @Lewis_Hamilton_ posted is a great example of the line you should be aiming for. If you have to slow down at first to do it, then so be it. Once you get comfortable with it, you'll find that there's a lot more speed to be had that simply isn't accessable the way you're driving the car now.

When you're practising, watch your replays from one of the chase views and see if your car is on the black marked racing line. It's not always totally optimal, but if you're too far from it you could almost certainly be going faster on it.

I'm not sure if you're on a wheel or a pad. If you're on a pad it makes it tougher, but try hard to work on your smoothness, especially of steering inputs. Wherever possible it should be a gentle push into the apex of the corner, and then a gentle release as you come out.

Good luck, hope that helps.
 
Let's use this handy map to establish corner numbers, and I'll go through it step by step. I'm not the world's greatest driver, but I'll do my best.

43E93984-6ACC-450A-9497-FBEB73657CF5_zps99fe73ea.jpg


Turn 1: You turned in a little too hard, and possibly a little too early. See how your car twitched mid-corner and you had to correct? That lost you time, and put you off-line for the next corner. You want to be coming through there as smoothly as possible, keeping as much speed as you can and staying on the right line. The right line is more or less on the black tyre marks that you can see running through the apex of T1 and 2. Slow down as much as you have to in order to stay on that, and you'll be faster.

Turn 2: Is compromised by you being off-line from your aggressive T1. You ran too far out to the left, costing you time and scrubbing speed. You really need to try and stay at least right of centre of the track to give yourself the best set up for the next corner. Again, the black marks of the racing line show you where you should probably be.

Turn 3: Not too bad. If you get the previous two corners right, you'll find that you're in a better position to take a wide line and carry more speed through. A little wobble mid corner, but nothing major.

Turn 4: Your corner entry was on the right track, you've got to trail brake your way into the apex while turning in. However, it's a long corner and you gave up the apex very early, meaning your exit left you way on the other side of the track. Try and follow the black racing line again. You should be hugging the inside curb of that corner and should be roughly in the middle of the track when you exit the tunnel. Don't get too far to the right, it's distance that you don't need to cover and it makes you scramble to get back in line for the next corner.

Turn 5: You can carry a lot more speed and run your exit out a lot wider through here. Sacrifice some of your entry speed if you have to.

Turns 6 and 7: Decent. I think you could stay further left through 6 and turn into 7 a bit later, but that's just me. If anything it'll make the next bit easier.

Turn 8: This is one of the most important corners on the track. You've got a massive straight after it, so getting a good exit gains you lots and lots of time.

You want to be against the right tunnel wall more or less as you enter the tunnel. You need the car as far over on the right as early as possible, and straight. What you're gonna aim to do is cut straight across that yellow lined section on the inside of the corner. It can be tough to get right, but when you do get it it's so much faster it's not even funny. You'll start turning in a decent way from the tunnel exit, almost clip the left hand tunnel wall as you exit, fly across that yellow bit and find that your momentum carries you just up to the right hand wall in the second tunnel.

You'll know when you get it, the only problem is that the window for entry is small and if you stuff it up you probably hit a wall.

Turn 9: You want to be on the yellow stuff again. It's a long corner, so expect to be hugging the inside curb for a while. Get your braking done early, get into that yellow zone and hold it. You'll have to experiment with what works for you for finding a marker for when to accelerate out of the corner, but the line that you want to be on is shown by the black racing line on the road.

Turns 10 and 11: These are just here to make the entry into 12 harder.

Turn 12: This is a funny corner. You understeered way off line, which is the usual problem. Brake deeper into the corner, and brake earlier if you have to, but don't let your car get that wide that early. The black racing line shows you where you should be aiming for.

Turn 13: You just missed the apex. Brake a little earlier, turn a little earlier, you'll make the corner a bit shallower which lets you carry more speed, and you won't have to travel quite as far either.

Turns 14 and 15: The other most important corners of the track. You got sideways through them, and had to correct. What you should be aiming for is to brake for 14, turn in, and basically nail the throttle as you hit the apex. You've got tons of room on the exit of 15, so if you set yourself up right then you can just go for it once you're past the apex of 14.


In summary, a lot of your problem is your line. The lap @Lewis_Hamilton_ posted is a great example of the line you should be aiming for. If you have to slow down at first to do it, then so be it. Once you get comfortable with it, you'll find that there's a lot more speed to be had that simply isn't accessable the way you're driving the car now.

When you're practising, watch your replays from one of the chase views and see if your car is on the black marked racing line. It's not always totally optimal, but if you're too far from it you could almost certainly be going faster on it.

I'm not sure if you're on a wheel or a pad. If you're on a pad it makes it tougher, but try hard to work on your smoothness, especially of steering inputs. Wherever possible it should be a gentle push into the apex of the corner, and then a gentle release as you come out.

Good luck, hope that helps.

I was playing on a pad , I did manage to get my time down by 1.4 secs after about an hour trying last night. I haven't played with a pad in about 6 years so it's very hard for me to smooth out my inputs. When I was trailbraking it would the rear would slide out and be hard to control for me with the pad. I'll try to find my wheel and post a vid later tonight or tomorrow. Thank you
 
I haven't found my wheel yet so this is on the gamepad. Is the line any better?



Much better. :)

You look like you're fighting the car a lot less through the corners as well, which is a very good thing. Well done reducing your time by almost a second and a half! That's a great improvement.
 
Much better. :)

You look like you're fighting the car a lot less through the corners as well, which is a very good thing. Well done reducing your time by almost a second and a half! That's a great improvement.

Thank you very much. What else do I need to do to lower my time and what do you think the car current setup best time could be.
 
Thank you very much. What else do I need to do to lower my time and what do you think the car current setup best time could be.
Nice driving:tup:👍 Dramatic improvement in just a couple of days:eek: There are a whole bunch of lap times from @GT_Alex74 on the Trial Mountain TT Board, but on comfort softs. That would be a good place to start comparing or maybe one of our resident aliens can run the same combination and give you a target to shoot for.
 
Thank you very much. What else do I need to do to lower my time and what do you think the car current setup best time could be.

If my GT6 ever finishes updating*, I'm tempted to give it a run myself and see what I can manage. I tend to be 2-3 seconds a minute off alien times, so at least I'll be able to give you a rough benchmark of what's possible.

But that's not real helpful, because neither you or I are aliens. The goal should always be to just improve a bit on what your current best is. I find comparing myself to aliens is just depressing, I could technically get there but I've got to do it one little step at a time. I like to aim for improving by about 0.3 seconds a session. You can always find another 0.3, and you can't usually find it by being lucky, you've got to drive better. A bunch of those little improvements adds up, and eventually you'll find that a trick that you learned in one corner can be used in others as well.

So I'll get back to you on a time and further improvements once I've refamiliarised myself with the track. But I think you'll find even more time in your next couple of practise sessions. Just getting used to the new line, refining your braking points, and becoming more comfortable with how the car rides with your new style will gain you a bit more. Then I'll see what more I can contribute to helping you go even faster. :)

*Been updating for the last three hours. Still 30% to go. I know I haven't played in a while, but yeesh. ;)
 
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