World hunger solved.

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Who would have though Rocky Mountain Oysters would save the day?

I don't think it's unethical, it's just cells and DNA made whole again, and the ranchers will still have to feed the darn things. It's not as if a cloned bull that wins a county fair prize is going to try to kill its stunt double, confuse its owner, nor the slaughterhouse operator.
 
I'm more concerned about the frozen testicles bit than the ethical side :scared:

What's the advantages of cloned food though I don't really see it.
 
What's the advantages of cloned food though I don't really see it.

One quality bull X many = many quality bulls.

Cloning or not, when you go to McDonalds, you're still eating worse stuff than cloned bull meat...
 
One quality bull X many = many quality bulls.

Kind of similar results to selective breeding though...but without the danger of inbreeding I guess. Its still carries the problem of all of them potentially being crippled by one particular disease. I don't really see where much is to be gained from the cloning unless of course the cloning process becomes sufficiently easier.

Ethically, I don't see a problem.

Yep.
cloned meat = regular meat > Mcdonalds meat

I guess my main point was how does it solve world hunger, I know the title isn't to be taken too literally I am just struggling to see the big gains of cloning for the purpose of agriculture over say selective breeding, when the difficulties are factored in.
 
Its still carries the problem of all of them potentially being crippled by one particular disease.

Indeed, but remember that most diseases start with a damaged or weak animal in which the infection is being "produced". If the herd or flock exists of that one extremely healthy animal, health could even be increased through cloning, and thus the chance of an animal getting sick may be slimmer than when having a herd with different animal of which some might already have an infection.

On your point of world hunger, no, I can't see it saving people from starving. However, it may result in an easier way for farmers to produce top notch quality meat and milk, etc. Also, important animals or insects that are vital to another animal's habitat that are in danger of extinction could be saved through cloning.
 
Forgive me since my knowledge on this subject is basically simplified high school science (didnt take biology at A-level) including me reading around out of curiosity (genetics fascinates me) I can only see short term gains, by cloning your livestock you are assuming they are the best they can ever be, which if you do have a really good bull is great short term for meat production but if you keep re-using this copy the DNA essentially is removed from the genepool and will not advance. Long term this could cause real problems. If all your bulls across the country are the same then they may all carry an identical genetic weakness to a certain disease and as a result may all die big problem. with a large genepool there is lower chance of one single disease killing all the bulls in the country. That's assuming a whole country was to run of one single copy of DNA which frankly would be silly. My point is that if you displace natural livestock with a select group of clones your potentially endangering the future of your livestock. This is talking large scale cloning. This ceases to be an issue on an independent scale but I can't really see such a massive advantage over selective breeding when used on a small scale anyway.

Its not that I think cloning is a bad idea per say, I just think replicating one livestock for the sake of slightly better meat is a bit more trouble than its worth, particularly on a a large scale.
 
Its not that I think cloning is a bad idea per say, I just think replicating one livestock for the sake of slightly better meat is a bit more trouble than its worth, particularly on a a large scale.

Say that to the farmers. Some only care about their meat quality, yet others are struggling to survive in the business, and they'll do whatever needed to survive. I'm not backing up cloning at all, I'm always neutral at pretty much everything. But I also think we should not be afraid of experimenting with cloning. Some intensive tests could show the difference between the strength of cloned and not-cloned animals, and tests could also show the behavior and reactions upon diseases by cloned animals and not-cloned animals.
 
It sounds better than it is. Cloning (some animals more than others) is very difficult. With some animals it's not even possible (such as dogs). They might try to clone 5 animals from the same DNA and only one will survive longer than 3 days.

I support cloning though and even though it is not perfect now I think it will be a lot better in 3-5 years. I hate people who are against things like this. If it is helping humanity why hate it?
 
Can someone please tell me why ethics is always dragged into the cloning debate? Especially for something like animals?
 
Forgive me since my knowledge on this subject is basically simplified high school science (didnt take biology at A-level) including me reading around out of curiosity (genetics fascinates me) I can only see short term gains, by cloning your livestock you are assuming they are the best they can ever be, which if you do have a really good bull is great short term for meat production but if you keep re-using this copy the DNA essentially is removed from the genepool and will not advance. Long term this could cause real problems. If all your bulls across the country are the same then they may all carry an identical genetic weakness to a certain disease and as a result may all die big problem. with a large genepool there is lower chance of one single disease killing all the bulls in the country. That's assuming a whole country was to run of one single copy of DNA which frankly would be silly. My point is that if you displace natural livestock with a select group of clones your potentially endangering the future of your livestock. This is talking large scale cloning. This ceases to be an issue on an independent scale but I can't really see such a massive advantage over selective breeding when used on a small scale anyway.

Its not that I think cloning is a bad idea per say, I just think replicating one livestock for the sake of slightly better meat is a bit more trouble than its worth, particularly on a a large scale.

And therein lies the problem.

The trade in bull sperm (not from frozen testicles... but from living, prize-winning bulles) already threatens to lower genetic diversity in commercial cattle... but it's big business. To improve their breeds, many farmers buy this stuff to strengthen their herds... upgrade them to bigger cows... hardier... better milkers... etcetera.

But there's a problem there... if you have thousands... or even hundreds of thousands of cows with just a couple of hundred fathers, you're going to have virtual inbreeding in the future... and cloning those prize-winning sperm donors over and over again to sire more cows will just make the problem worse. Making entire herds out of a single cow, would be virtual suicide. If there's a hidden defect in that animal's DNA that makes it infertile within a few generations? Goodbye cows.

There are already alarms being raised about the lack of genetic diversity in livestock... which is getting just as bad as the lack of genetic diversity on food-crops. This makes larger and larger portions of our food supply vulnerable to sudden devastation from diseases and genetic abnormalities.

I'm not against cloning per se... it may be a viable option to preserve species on the brink of extinction. But cloning livestock is a really, really, really bad idea. The sad thing is, with widespread use of donor sperm, the cattle industry is already there.
 
One quality bull X many = many quality bulls.

There is, as I recall, some cloned stuff already being tinkered with, but I don't think the FDA is too hot on it yet. Selective breeding has already weeded out a lot of problems, however...
 


Tough, chewy rubbish for everyone :yuck:
Rubbish! Coming from a Student who's idea of a banquet is anything that doesn't include chicken or sausages, the key to not having chewy frozen beef is to beat the hell out of it once its defrosted.
 
To key to not having chewy frozen beef is to not buy it!

As someone who has cooked in a production kitchen (okay, once...), I'd be quite apprehensive about using cloned beef in producing a dish.
 
To key to not having chewy frozen beef is to not buy it!
Well I don't buy it frozen, I freeze it. It's the only way as a student I can take advantage of small bulk buys without the need to consume it quickly or waste it!
 
Rubbish! Coming from a Student who's idea of a banquet is anything that doesn't include chicken or sausages, the key to not having chewy frozen beef is to beat the hell out of it once its defrosted.

Well I don't buy it frozen, I freeze it. It's the only way as a student I can take advantage of small bulk buys without the need to consume it quickly or waste it!

I here ya... as a student, the freezer is your friend. Also, speaking as a single person, I often end up having to freeze stuff in order to avoid wastage. If being single means I have to beat my meat a bit more often, then so be it.
 
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As one of my bright work colleagues said last year, the cure for world hunger is to build a Morrisons in every poor village so they have somewhere to shop. And you think I'm joking...
 
Easy. "Playing God."
How can you play someone who doesn't exist...

"Playing God" is bollocks. It's regulating industry based on assumption instead of fact.

To the Do You Believe in God thread we go!
 
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