(ETZ)Esattezza Autosport! Lancia Stratos "La Italiano" Model added

Thanks again for you thoughts, Killer. It is always good to hear what other people make of your work.

I have no doubt that you're finding understeer to be pretty much a constant in GT4 - just talk to the Drifting guys about that .

With nearly all of the big FR cars that are what we would actually call modern incarnations of Grand Tourers, you have perforce to change how you drive them in order to get the best out of them. In the case of these cars, fortunately that change to is actually to treat them like real cars rather than game constructs.

So, in order to get them to corner well, brake steadily and early, coming mostly (if not totaly) off the brakes before you turn if you can to allow the suspension to settle. Let the car find the apex and then feed the power back in steadily again. The big engines have torque everywhere, even when turbo'd up, so you don't have to keep the revs up. If you do, then that fires up the 'locking' of the diff and that leads to exit understeer if it happens too early.

Of course, there are always exceptions . For example, the SL65 at Opera. There is a super tight 180 hairpin at the end of the first third of the course. How I handled that was utterly against all what I just said above. I turned in early and stamped on the brakes hard and short; that throws the weight forward, making the back-end light and start to kick-out. As the nose goes into the corner, I gave her a blast of throttle and then shut off again, which continued the rotation of the back-end so that, as the apex cleared, I could feed the power back in, stabalising the car ready for the right turn just ahead.

I'm working on the DB7 at present, Killer. Do you want me to use a Wing on the car or not? It makes a big difference to how I approach it. Without a Tea-tray I'm getting 1'59's at Suzuka.

I'd prefer no but if you have to ok.Whats your time w/ a Bench on the back?

I have so far hesitated to try it .

If you want me to then it will mean a revision of what I have so far as the added downforce plays merry hell with the suspension behaviour and grip budget.

Otherwise I can post up my results tomorrow for you to try.

Ok i'd like it as fast as possible so no wing

How's the DB7 doing?

Remember the time difference between Texas and Staffordshire and the twin facts that I both work for a living during the day and have had visitors this evening .

I've got a basic set-up dialed in that works okay but I'm not entirely happy with it myself yet (could just be that I don't gel with Suzuka of course ).

I find the car is turning in too sharply on some of the corners and has some high speed understeer on the way out of the fast corners. I don't want to post up something that I change as I go but a way to proceed is if I mail you the set-up and see if I can alter it according to your feedback?

I like the DB7 other then the understeer.

She is a long, heavy, car with a lot of power, so she will understeer when going fast. Persever with her a while and try to see where it is that the understeer is creeping in.

I can't guarantee it but I would guess that it is likely to be that the power is coming in too strong and too early. After a while, you get a sense for when the apex is cleared enough to bring up the 'noise' .

As I said a few posts ago, don't be tempted to try and keep the revs up in corners - the infamous double-apexed Spoon is a place certainly not to do that.

It's a shame that you're on NTSC as I have two replays that show very clearly that it is faster to have zero throttle mid-corner and build it up evenly on the way out than try to blip power on and off on the way round.

Hey guys, once again Iam without internet. Currently I'm at a public location with WIFI. I'm now considering hiring another staff member to contribute more content because my availability is kinda unstable at the moment. I'll try to come back to you all a soon as possible and thanks for keeping the shop alive.

Thanks
Mark

Aston Martin DB7 Vantage Coupe






What our client was after with this one was to enable the DB7 to lap Suzuka as fast as we could get it. There was also an implicit proviso of retaining consistency. After all, there is no point turning in a blinding lap and then ending up in the sand on the next.

Money was no object but what was objected to was sticking an unsightly Wing on such a pretty car. The hardware list is therefore extensive and expensive for this project :



Hardware Changes:

Weight Reduction Stage 3
Port Polish & Engine balance
Chassis Stiffness

Racing Exhaust & Chip & Stage 3 NA Tune

Racing Tyres (Grade 3)

Racing Brakes & Balancer

Racing Suspension

Fully Custom Transmission
Triple-Plate Clutch & Racing Flywheel & Carbon Prop Shaft

Fully Custom Limited Slip Differential




Brakes: 3/4
Springs: 12.3/10.3
Ride: 112/112
Damper Bound: 6/6
Damper Rebound: 7/9
Camber: 2.5/1.0
Toe: 0/-1
Stabiliser: 6/6

Gearbox: 14 @ 3.760
1st: 2.760
2nd: 2.010
3rd: 1.400
4th: 1.080
5th: 0.870
6th: 0.750

TCS: 2

Downforce: -/-

LSD: 11/38/22

Ballast: 0/0




Our test driver was getting laps in the mid 1'58's with this and found the handling to be very predictable and smooth. The tyre wear was also wonderfully balanced, which gives rise to the thought that this might not be a bad car for endurance racing ... hmmm .

Thats nice.Will give the updated one a try soon.

the DB7 looks great sukerkin.
I just updated the first page, I know it maybe kinda late but I'll keep updating everytime I get a chance to get on the internet.

Sorry for the lack of activity here, ladies and gentlemen. Soprano is sans Net connection right now and in my case we've had a death in the family so GT has not exactly been at the forefront of my mind for the past week or so.

I will put something up next week (or maybe the weekend if I feel the need to distract myself from unpleasant real world events).

SL65 Review(Continued..)
Setup B
This is the most stable car ive ever driven.It still has that under steer but high speed under steer was just scary.It takes low speed corners well but high speed ones I always hit the wall.
7/10

sukerkin

Sorry for the lack of activity here, ladies and gentlemen. Soprano is sans Net connection right now and in my case we've had a death in the family so GT has not exactly been at the forefront of my mind for the past week or so.

I will put something up next week (or maybe the weekend if I feel the need to distract myself from unpleasant real world events).

Click to expand...

I feel sorry for you, my father died when I was 9 so I know what you're going through. It'll never escape my mind that when I was young he told me he'd take me to the snow one day, then when he learnt he had cancer, he planned the trip. He used his last days on this Earth to fulfill a promise to his son.

Mercedes Benz SL55 AMG



It might sound very odd to talk in terms of "Budget" when dealing with the distinctly upmarket AMG modified models but in this case this is remarkable but true.

Our client burned most of his budget buying the car and paying booking fees for it to be transported about to the various tracks in the Premium Sports Lounge series of races, so he didn't want to spend an awful lot getting the car modified (especially after a careless moment of weakness caused him to blow 30,000 on getting a fancy roll cage fitted). So every corner that could be cut on the hardware we were strongly encouraged to do.

In the end this meant that we had a car with no engine modifications, sitting on Road tyes {he sold the track legal tyres the car came with }, driven via a factory stock gearbox. As an example of the battles we had, we managed to persuade him that a Brake Balance controller was an investment but he balked at paying for a Racing Brake kit. Then he insisted on a Carbon Prop Shaft even tho' we told him it would make little difference .

On top of all this penny-pinching, he wanted the car to win races with the maximum possible reward!

The hardware changes to the car we ended up with were:

Road Tyres (N3 grade)
Brake Balance Controller
Racing Suspension & Chassis Stiffness
Triple-Plate Clutch
Racing Flywheel
Carbon Prop Shaft

We spent a lot of hours running races in the series, tackling whatever we came across on any given occasion and generally taking victory. New York was a different matter and our test driver received an official reprimand for costing us money after he stormed out of the car after about his twelfth loss and threw his crash helmet through the windscreen of the TVR Speed 12 that had rammed him into the barriers ... for about the twelfth time.

The upshot is that we got 200 A-Spec everywhere but New York, where we had to settle for 191 A-Spec after shelling out for some S1 grade sports tyres, a Custom Gearbox and an adjustable limited slip diff. We don't like to lose .

The settings suite for Cote d'Azur, Opera Paris and Hong Kong was:

Brakes: 1/2 2/4
Springs: 9.6/8.3
Ride: 96/96
Bamper Bound: 5/5 4/5 3/2
Damper Rebound: 7/9 8/5 6/9
Camber: 2.4/1.0
Toe: -1/+1
Stabalisers: 3/5 5/5 6/6

Gears: Stock AutoSet 13 @ Final 3.410

TCS: 0/0/1

Downforce: Stock
LSD: Stock 9/36/24

Ballast: 66 @ -30 66 @ -35 200 @ -35

Changes for High Speed Ring are in red. Changes for New York are in blue

A few words of caution to anyone trying this out. It will not be easy driving a car this heavy and this fast on the tyres it's wearing. Braking early and gently and not trying to turn at the same time will be necessary whenever possible. Throttle modulation will be required to prevent the nose being pushed wide on exits and patience before getting on the loud pedal is essential.

However, when you learn how to drive her and know what pace you need to set then it is very satisfying to conquer the challenge.

Game Notes: I drove this against the first twenty grids at each circuit and altho' it is actually easier to forget most of the above and drive versus Grid 18 on S2 tyres with 186KG Ballast for 200 A-Spec (set-up at the end), it is a major pain to have to work through that many grids for each race, this being a non-Qualifying series.

For the N3 shod version, Grid 6 is the one that yields the points (DB7, Cizeta, Zonda C12, Cerbera Speed 12, Zonda C12S 7.3) and it is only at High Speed Ring (where you need to be good to beat the Speed 12) and New York (where you need to be good and lucky and ruthless) that the AI provide much opposition.

If A-Spec points are not a concern, then grids without the Speed 12 or the SLR McLaren are much easier (Grid 4 for example).


Grid 18 Set-up (not extensively researched):


Brakes: 2/2
Springs: 13.6/11.6
Ride: 96/96
Bamper Bound: 5/5
Damper Rebound: 7/6
Camber: 2.0/1.0
Toe: 0/0
Stabalisers: 3/6
Gears: 13 @ 2.820
TCS: 0/0/0

Downforce: Stock
LSD: Stock

Ballast: 186 @ -30

EDIT:

An alternative 'budget' approach that I think actually handles better (getting me 1'45's (and occasional 1'44's) at Cote d'Azur) is to dispense with the Chassis Stiffness option and run with a Custom LSD.

Hardware is:

N3 Tyres
Brake balancer
Racing Suspension
3-Plate Clutch
Racing Flywheel
Carbon Propeller Shaft
Custom LSD

Brakes: 2/2

Springs: 16.3/14.0
Ride: 96/96
Bamper Bound: 3/2
Damper Rebound: 8/6
Camber: 3.2/1.2
Toe: -1/+1
Stabaliser: 3/5 for more entry oversteer or 5/5 for more exit stability

Gears: Stock

TCS: 0/0/0

Downforce: Stock

LSD: 9/35/27

Ballast: 66 @ -30

Is it just me or does someone here like green cars?

No, it' s not your imagination . If I can get it in green then green it shall be .

Alternate SL55 AMG set-up added.

Front page updated.., Sorry for the delay sukerkin.

Not to worry about the delay, mate. I know things are awkward for you with regards to getting on-line at the moment. As a note, there are still two SL500 set-ups that I did that could do with adding to the front end.

They're here (R129): https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3133138&postcount=237

and here (R230): https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3133650&postcount=239

Do you guys think you have room for one more tuner?If you want to try out my cars the on shoman's tuning tread(quit due to lack of reviews)

You don't have to let lack of reviews worry you, Killer.

Look at me - I work like mad putting A-Spec winning set-ups together, sometimes spending weeks in testing and I get almost no feedback whatsoever (other than from your goodself).

As to hiring, well, that's not my call. You might want to drop Soprano a PM to see whether he thinks an extra pair of hands might be advisable.

I've got a couple of reviews coming your way. The SL600 was a particular favourite. I'll try to get time to post them tomorrow.

👍. I look forward to them, PF.

sukerkin

You don't have to let lack of reviews worry you, Killer.

Look at me - I work like mad putting A-Spec winning set-ups together, sometimes spending weeks in testing and I get almost no feedback whatsoever (other than from your goodself).

As to hiring, well, that's not my call. You might want to drop Soprano a PM to see whether he thinks an extra pair of hands might be advisable.

Click to expand...

I, for one, would like to go on record to thank Sukerkin for the plethora and quality of his entertaining and informative setups. If the scientific process of testing, reason and rationality mean anything, there is more to learn from his body of work than from most other tuners combined, in my humble opinion. To me, his insight into the effects of damper tuning on vehicle dynamics make his setups mandatory reading for real world racers like me, as well as for would-be masters of GT4-style 2D racing, again like me. To labor in obscurity is the fate of many a genius. But Sukerkin can rest assured that his works are valued by appreciative students all over the world.

High praise indeed. You honour me, my friend :bows:.

I keep meaning to try to write up a "How I approach tuning" type of essay to flesh out the reasoning behind the bare bones of set-up statistics and gather together the maunderings I've littered the web with over the years. Maybe one day I'll get round to it.

Of course, the essence of it is Testing, Testing and more Testing to try and come up with a suite that works in most places as you figure out the intrinsic balance characteristics that PD have given a cars in-game model.

Speaking of which, I should have another Merc ready for the Premium Sports Lounge by the end of tonight.

Such an essay would be a worthwhile addition to the body of literature on performance tuning, and should not be merely a labor of love. I'll put my money where my mouth is to the tune of $25 for a copy.

Thanks for letting me join!I have a JGTC300 Rx-8 ill post soon,playing Forza2 atm.