Fate, Karma, co-incidence, or something else?

ITCC_Andrew · Jul 4, 2012

Earlier today, I saw a girl I attended high school with. She was... stunning, to the point that my knees went weak. So far, in my somewhat short (18 years of) life, she's the only girl who has.

But, she had since moved away to a university.

It left me wondering: is it fate? Is there some factor that we can't control, influencing our lives? Or, is it logical; was she coming back to visit her family, since school is out for summer? Or, is it Karma? Is a Karmic effect influencing it, and the karma's trying to show me something?

Once I thought of that, I became curious, as to what other sorts of experiences people have had, and what their personal opinion on it is.

I am a Jainist. My religion works hand-in-hand with Sikhs, Buddhists and Hindus, helping them to run Religious ceremonies, and even sharing temples. I, personally, believe that no one should hate on a different person's opinion, or belief, and your posts are safe with me. I will not insult you, or refute any opinion. All I will say, is that I believe in Karma, fate and co-incidence.

But, what's your take? What's an interesting and relevant story you've experienced?

nobuffalo · Jul 4, 2012

Nothing happens for a reason.

That's my take.

Joel · Jul 4, 2012

I don't believe in a guiding hand of fate or anything like that.

Azuremen · Jul 4, 2012

I'm not sure why seeing a girl who had clearly returned for the summer to visit family would prompt you to question fate or Karma.

All things happen, regardless. Any value an event holds is the value you choose to give it.

ITCC_Andrew · Jul 4, 2012

Azuremen
I'm not sure why seeing a girl who had clearly returned for the summer to visit family would prompt you to question fate or Karma.

Using reverse logic here, I imagine that you believe in a co-incidental existence?

And, it's more of a poll and discussion, than it is an invitation to doubt each other's reasonings. Everyone believes something.

Exorcet · Jul 4, 2012

Probably just back to see family. I don't seen any fate or karma in the world.

Off the top of my head, the only thing I can relate to is when I lose something. It always seems like the things I need go missing, but it's only because I'm actually looking for them.

lemansfanatic · Jul 4, 2012

Without actually being there and experiencing it first hand I cant pretend I know what happened to you and this person, but I can say that I too have met people that I have felt a sudden-strong indescribable connection to(not neccesarily sexual). These moments have made me wonder if I was supposed to take some kind of immediate action to find out how this person could become part of my life or if God was just giving me a glimpse of someone who might be influential to me in some way later on down the road. Never discount those feelings, sometimes they lead you out of yourself to experience something or someone you were supposed to be close to. Neat story, but you should elaborate more on your thoughts/intentions.

niky · Jul 4, 2012

Whether it's fate or coincidence matters less than what you do with it.

I don't believe in Karma, because too many good people get less than they deserve and too many bad ones get away with doing wrong.

The strong man creates his own fate.

TDZdave · Jul 4, 2012

mel, i totally understand where your coming from, last year i went to the v8 supercars bathurst 1000, we had everything planned camp on top of the mountain, do it the traditional aussie way, we got there on wednesday morning setup our camp and went to the track, when all the days festivities were over we returned to our camp site and other people had arrived and setup camps around us, (as it is a campground lol) whilst organising dinner out of the trailer a blonde girl caught my eye, as i was hammered drunk i said hey you look my old friend katie.... she turned and said, funny that my name is katie, then she recognised me, (nothing amounted other then friendship out of this) having said all this are currently 25yonow, the last time we seen each other we were in school together approx 11-12 yo at the time, i had moved almost 700kms away and hadnt seen her since that year of school, honestly it got me thinking, and im an athiest....

W3H5 · Jul 4, 2012

If fate was to be accepted then all the murderers, rapists and pedophiles couldn't help commiting their crimes, it was fate that made them do so.

This is the reson I don't believe in fate.

I have my own ideas about Karma but not necessarily the idea everyone else has. I think by doing something good I'm rewarded with pride, satisfaction and so on and so forth. If I do something wrong I feel guilt, sadness and the negative emotions. This is my idea if Karma.

Azuremen · Jul 4, 2012

MrMelancholy15
Using reverse logic here, I imagine that you believe in a coincidental existence?

Coincidence is all there is; if it seems like more it is because you want to see it that way. What matters more is what you make of it an opportunity that arises from random chance.

I feel it is almost narcissistic to believe the world would do something specifically for someone.

TDZdave · Jul 4, 2012

W3HS
If fate was to be accepted then all the murderers, rapists and pedophiles couldn't help commiting their crimes, it was fate that made them do so.

This is the reson I don't believe in fate.

I have my own ideas about Karma but not necessarily the idea everyone else has. I think by doing something good I'm rewarded with pride, satisfaction and so on and so forth. If I do something wrong I feel guilt, sadness and the negative emotions. This is my idea if Karma.

i too live by this guidline, positive action positive emotion, negative action, negative emotion, its almost the rule to making your own luck/ fate, however, my oversight on this is that there is a large number of people in this world that are the worst to be around, the worst to deal with and regardless of of how "positive" polite, etc you are towards them, theyre ignorance, and attitude out weigh the negatives,

The Bman · Jul 4, 2012

The only thing that seems logical is coincidence. Karma doesn't work in the slightest, as I have seen so many good people suffer and so many bad people get what they want. Fate is just a myth. Read Shem's (W3HS) post for more details.

PeterJB · Jul 4, 2012

I believe in Karma in the sense that justice will be served on your actions, whether in this life or the next. I don't believe that killing somebody will make you reincarnated as a Cockroach, but then I'm not Hindu.

TankAss95 · Jul 4, 2012

PeterJB
I believe in Karma in the sense that justice will be served on your actions, whether in this life or the next. I don't believe that killing somebody will make you reincarnated as a Cockroach, but then I'm not Hindu.

I don't believe in any justice in this world. It's a sad conclusion I've came to accept.

Nicksfix · Jul 4, 2012

niky
Whether it's fate or coincidence matters less than what you do with it.

The strong man creates his own fate.

So do the weak.

Crispy · Jul 4, 2012

Coincidence is just that, coincidence. You just happened to be in the same place at the same time.

Karma is more in the mind. You do something good then you get satisfaction and pride, which changed your state of mind and turned an average event, into good luck. An example would be you help an old lady cross the parking lot into Target, and when you check to see if your favorite cereal may be in-stock (because for the past two days its been out) and you find there's one box. They simply restocked, but since you helped the lady and got a sense of pride, you take it as good luck and karma.

Fate can be easily disproved, because if fate was real then time travel into the future would be theoretically possible.

Nothing happens for a reason, though it is fun to believe they do. I know nothing happens for a reason, yet I still believe in karma and fate.

ITCC_Andrew · Jul 4, 2012

But, you guys imagine, then, that co-incidences happen thousands of times a day? It seems a bit strange, to be honest, but I won't refute your ideas.

I just seem to think that there is a strange way, in which friends seem to find each other, after years. There're a lot of similar stories.

Hun200kmh · Jul 4, 2012

Coincidence is perceived as an accident in the chaotic global chain of events we all are part of. Fate is the opposite. So ... I'll go for coincidence. I hate fate, heard about it too often as an excuse to something that could've been avoided, should've been avoided ... but wasn't.

Karma ... I don't even know what that is. But if what it means is something like what is said in this example:

What a child doesn't receive he can seldom later give

Or what is shown in this drawing:

Then yes, Karma is something I believe in.

ITCC_Andrew · Jul 4, 2012

Hun200kmh
Coincidence is perceived as an accident in the chaotic global chain of events we all are part of. Fate is the opposite. So ... I'll go for coincidence. I hate fate, heard about it too often as an excuse to something that could've been avoided, should've been avoided ... but wasn't.

That's definitely an interesting idea. 👍 I can agree with that, that people should avoid hurting each other, no matter what the cost.

Carlos · Jul 5, 2012

MrMelancholy15
That's definitely an interesting idea. 👍 I can agree with that, that people should avoid hurting each other, no matter what the cost.

That's the whole problem. It's not a problem hurting anyone, just be honest. If you try not hurting someone, you eventually have to lie to them. Lies aren't any good either, what would happen if they find that out? What's the cost then? You can better be honost. If they don't like what comes to them, they have the power to change it. That's leaving you, or they'll appreciate your honesty and you just gained a better friend.

And I think your girl is just really smart and went to university to be even smarter. Maybe you can do too..

ITCC_Andrew · Jul 5, 2012

Carlos
And I think your girl is just really smart and went to university to be even smarter. Maybe you can do too..

Ironically, I almost did end up at the same University, without knowing, for translations, but I've decided to become a mechanic.

As much as I would've liked to travel the world, and, perhaps, get with Kathryn, I just don't think I'd want to wake up in thirty years, thinking "I wanted to get into racing. I haven't driven a car with more than 110 hp! Where did my life go?"

Carlos · Jul 5, 2012

MrMelancholy15
As much as I would've liked to travel the world, and, perhaps, get with Kathryn, I just don't think I'd want to wake up in thirty years, thinking "I wanted to get into racing. I haven't driven a car with more than 110 hp! Where did my life go?"

Is getting with Kathryn traveling the world? If not why not get both. You don't have to change your lifestyle since she accept who you are (or else she won't love you for who you really are, and she is probably a busy woman, all beautiful woman are), so you can have enough time for your own things. Or do you want to sit every evening with her on the couch....? :indiff:

I know I don't :lol:

PAPPACLART · Jul 5, 2012

Humanity is inherently insecure and places too much importance on it's existence. Too many people think they are some how special in the universe and that we are here for some special reason.

There have been millions of people before us and millions will come after what is so important about you/us compared to the grandness of the Universe ?

So, Karma is a sweet thing to believe, and I sometimes act like I believe it. Fate is another, I often think somebody is looking out for me, when crazy stuff happens but I am just inherently doing this, as it makes me feel special, it is good for my well being and is a Darwinian mechanism.

Alex. · Jul 5, 2012

I think that right before the moment we make a decision it has already been made. Everything that has happened throughout our lives is a combination of other people's decisions (and natural occurrences that are unavoidable) before this point. When it comes to make any kind of choice or decision, they will decide the choice by their influence on us before we actually decide it. So technically, we aren't in control of our lives at all because every single thing we do is dictated by every single thing anyone else has ever done ever since the first decision was ever made. So it's possible we are on a set course and we just don't see it that way.

It's really hard to describe.

Joel · Jul 5, 2012

I certainly believe that a lot of decision making is based on prior actions, but that's not really what I'd call "fate", so much as influences and your own personality dictating how you will act. As for a guiding force of fate, I don't believe in that at all. Coincidence is all there really is, a lot of our lives is just random chance. As Niky said, a strong man makes his own fate, which to me just means that a strong person takes advantage of the coincidences, and strives to make favourable ones occur.

Carlos · Jul 5, 2012

Alex.
I think that right before the moment we make a decision it has already been made. Everything that has happened throughout our lives is a combination of other people's decisions (and natural occurrences that are unavoidable) before this point. When it comes to make any kind of choice or decision, they will decide the choice by their influence on us before we actually decide it. So technically, we aren't in control of our lives at all because every single thing we do is dictated by every single thing anyone else has ever done ever since the first decision was ever made. So it's possible we are on a set course and we just don't see it that way.

It's really hard to describe.

But then it's not right before we make the decision? The way I understand you, is what you try to say, we roll on the path made by people(?) many many years ago? And is that who 'they' are? Who or what is they?

Sam48 · Jul 5, 2012

Anyone here watched the movie "It's a Wonderful Life"?

Anyway, I have to agree with Niky, however, there have been times where "fate" ,or what not, seem to be the only answer. Who knows, maybe some things really are meant to be.

niky · Jul 5, 2012

As I've argued before... whether a choice is pre-determined or not, you're still making it, here, and now.

To hell with what fate chooses for you. As long as you make the decision and it's not made for you. Even if you choose what you know other people would have you choose, or what your genes have predisposed you to choose, it's your choice, and no one else's. They can't take that away from you.

I think this line is entirely appropriate: "I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."

You want her? Go get her. Even if you have to go banging down church doors to do it. *

*Oh, I know... it's not about the girl... but I couldn't resist...

ITCC_Andrew · Jul 5, 2012

I'm still enjoying people's opinions. Alex, I fully agree, actually. Sam, I know the plot behind that movie.

But, if we're going to talk movies, with an undertone of fate:

"American Beauty"
"Kirschbluten" ("Cherry Blossom Flowers" in English)

Those films might make some people reconsider.

In Kirschbluten, fate took Rudi's wife away, in my opinion, and her dreams, inevitably sealed his fate. The movie is still one of my favourite movies.

And, in American Beauty, the father tries to make his own choices, but, what almost seems like Karma turns the tables against him.

Both movies seem fully relevant.

And, "Milkweed," a book by Jerry Spinelli, tells the story of a young Gypsy trapped in Poland (Warsaw) during the Holocaust. I can't imagine that the events in Poland at that time were something that he did.

To be honest, there just seems to be something intriguing and intricate that causes these events.

What if every event in human history were the doing of the inner soul, but our souls-our existence- were thoroughly and intricately intertwined? What if our actions, as humans, affected more than just the logical effects?

Fate, Karma, co-incidence, or something else?

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