2014 European Parliament elections

[Tornado]

Not terribly related... at all, really, but this was blocking out all of my news feeds today during lunch and I thought of this thread.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/ele...s-chose-none-these-candidates-primary-n128166

Too bad they are fielding someone anyway. Kind of defeats the purpose.

 

[Leo0308]

If anyone is interested I was chatting to some people I know in the EU Parliament and apparently UKIP are in trouble. The nutters are grouping with the National Front and others are heading to the Tory group. UKIP are being left as piggy in the middle.

but i guess negotiations are hard when you stand on a platform of anti-international cooperation.

 

[doblocruiser]

Front National has become very strong because people here in France are just fed-up with years and years of left-wing promises. Yes, Front National puts France first and then the European Union. Yes Front National wants to keep tight control over who enters the country. They are not anti-europe, they just don't agree with the political union that is forced upon the French people which means all the liberties we fought for are been taking away by the European Super Powers.

Marine Le Pen is not her father! The Front National has changed quite a lot.

I don't want a political Europe! I want a Europe that benefits economically and works together but leaves politics up to the countries themselves. Why do all those unreliable and poor countries become member of the European Union? To benefit the system the strong countries build and to all the free money Brussels is giving them. In return, Brussels wants POWER in those countries. They are just playing a very very dangerous game which starts to explode in their face.

People can live peacefully together but it should not be forced upon them by a political prestige project.

Brussels is the most undemocratic "thing" that has happend for the people that live in "Europe". A money waisting machine with the endless need of more power and more control! Disgusting!

The media is also quite pathetic with their reports because they benefit from all the extra's a European Union provides. Yes, they can be critical, but not to much otherwise the are not allowed into the European parlement as an example.

10 Years ago people did not say they voted for a Front National, today they say it openly and add the reasons why. A lot has changed, just because people have been politically deceived for many years.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Interesting article about France's current Democracy Rating. France has always been a quite militant society (in a mostly enjoyable way).


And what do you think of the following?

"Ce rapport vise à mettre en œuvre le communautarisme anglo-saxon le plus excessif et à mettre en place une sorte de repentance qui serait la conséquence de la dette que nous aurions à l’égard des anciennes colonisations de la France".

Source

The media is also quite pathetic with their reports because they benefit from all the extra's a European Union provides. Yes, they can be critical, but not to much otherwise the are not allowed into the European parlement as an example.

Do you have a source to back that up? I can't imagine that either Reuters or AP would tolerate that, I'd love to hear of an example. Or is that simply your opinion?

 

[doblocruiser]

@TenEightyOne There was a Dutch investigation about the spending of the MP's who work in Brussels. A Dutch reporter even got hit by 2 MP's. No investigation was done even when the press complained about it and after that, the press was not allowed to enter the parlement just like that. Brussels controls what is allowed and not. It's against press freedom I think.

Let me see if I can find the article..

Link 1:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieve..._ostendorf_binnenkort_van_rompuy_opvolgt.html

Link2:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2013/06/sign_in_and_sod_off.html

Link3:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2013/06/tom_staal_trekt_rioolput_eu_op.html

Link4:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2014/04/corrupte_pvdaleider_schulz_sta.html

Link5:
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2014/06/europa_sloopt_eigen_vrijheid_v.html


Next to that, I am an immigrant who came to France 2 years ago. Sorry mate, but I don't completely understand the phrase you put in from Le Pen. My French vocabulary comes short. The translation I tried doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

[TenEightyOne]

@TenEightyOne There was a Dutch investigation about the spending of the MP's who work in Brussels. A Dutch reporter even got hit by 2 MP's. No investigation was done even when the press complained about it and after that, the press was not allowed to enter the parlement just like that. Brussels controls what is allowed and not. It's against press freedom I think.

Let me see if I can find the article..

...GeenStijl links...

Next to that, I am an immigrant who came to France 2 years ago. Sorry mate, but I don't completely understand the phrase you put in from Le Pen. My French vocabulary comes short. The translation I tried doesn't make a lot of sense.

If I may ask, how do you form your views on Marine Le Pen if you don't fully understand her? Are your opinions based on someone else's "translation"? That's a genuine question.

Which brings me to the linked articles, how good is your Dutch? Mine's fairly* rubbish but it seems that GeenStijl admit to earning E10,000 a minute from the news coverage of its video. They're also a very very politically polarised site but seemingly without a lot of actual content. The language used about politicians is incredible...

*Absolutely

 

[doblocruiser]

My Dutch is good. It's my native language

Le Pen I can mostly understand when I hear her talk on television and in het interviews. I have friends here in France who explain stuff if I don't understand. Political words are not my strongest side. But in the interviews she gave before the European elections she talked very clearly. Not saying that I would vote for her but she has made some very good points and I understand very well why people voted for the FN.

 

[TenEightyOne]

My Dutch is good. It's my native language

Brilliant So... do you think that site is unbiased and are you surprised that there don't seem to be many journalists who've had that response? It seems that the initial interview was a) very provocative and b) sold for a lot of money to news channels.

I'm not sure it's such a balanced view. You may be right in what you're saying about journalists being excluded if they show too much of an interest in finances but given the number of embarrassing financial stories coming out of the EP all the time I suspect you're not.

 

[doblocruiser]

True true, they are also there to stir up a few things but they dare to ask questions outside the political "correctness". Sometimes to go over the limit with their style but on the other side they get stuff outside in the open that no-one else has achieved.

I just wanted to point out that Brussel has a huge amount of power and they can use that power to remove any critical note to the European Union.

I just find it scary what happens within the EU.

 

[TenEightyOne]

I just wanted to point out that Brussel has a huge amount of power...

True, in some contexts.

...and they can use that power that remove any critical note to the European Union.

Not true, overall. Journalistic freedom of the press cannot be halted by Brussels or any other government expect in private newspapers where a politician can apply leverage through sponsorship.

Here the only papers that would respond to that are things like the Mail, or the Sport, "tabloid" opinion "news".

 

[doblocruiser]

True, in some contexts.


Not true, overall. Journalistic freedom of the press cannot be halted by Brussels or any other government expect in private newspapers where a politician can apply leverage through sponsorship..

I just hope you are right mate 👍

 

[BobK]

And what do you think of the following?

"Ce rapport vise à mettre en œuvre le communautarisme anglo-saxon le plus excessif et à mettre en place une sorte de repentance qui serait la conséquence de la dette que nous aurions à l’égard des anciennes colonisations de la France".

I think it's in French and I haven't a clue what it means.

 

[TenEightyOne]

I think it's in French and I haven't a clue what it means.

Oh DO keep up, Bob, it says; "On-hi-honh-hi-honh-hi-hon" and then spreads its hands helplessly like Marcel Marceau.


This proposal aims to establish a return to Anglo-Saxon communitarianism as is our duty (or debt) to the historically secular* settlements of France."

* The word secular doesn't actually appear in the quote, it's in the preceding sentence which I didn't include. I brought it back in to make more sense, sorry

 

[BobK]

communitarianism

Wuzzat? Is it contagious?

 

[TenEightyOne]

Wuzzat? Is it contagious?

I know, I know, it's the word she used and it's the best "kind-of" translation too. In retrospect I could have said "community spirit" but that's a bit more egalitarian than what she actually has in mind

 

[Carbonox]

http://www.aecr.eu/eurosceptic-meps-denied-rightful-roles-in-ep-committees/

As it turns out, the Euroskeptics had it correct all along. EU tries very hard to look like a democracy, but beneath the surface, the things federalists are ready to do in order to push their agenda are astonishingly similar to something a certain German guy with the moustache would've done.

 

[Famine]

Otto von Bismarck?

 

[TenEightyOne]

...the things federalists are ready to do in order to push their agenda are astonishingly similar to something a certain German guy with the moustache would've done.

Otto von Bismarck?

No, I think it's obvious who he means. Harald (Toni) Schumacher!

@Carbonox, can I infer from your post that you think Hitler was German? That's made my day

 

[Carbonox]

No, I think it's obvious who he means. Harald (Toni) Schumacher!

View attachment 191417

@Carbonox, can I infer from your post that you think Hitler was German? That's made my day

He, umm, was leading a country named Germany though at the peak of his career. Good enough for me.

 

[Dotini]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-29006799#
Germany's newest party, the Eurosceptic "Alternative for Germany" (AfD), has won its first seats in the state parliament of Saxony, according to preliminary results.

Chancellor Angela Merkel's Christian Democrats won the vote with 39.5% according to exit polls.

The AfD, which says it is anti-euro (the currency), rather than anti-Europe, won around 9.6% of the vote.

Eurosceptic parties made large gains in the European elections in May.

The projected results from Saxony, a state in eastern Germany, indicate a much more successful showing at the ballot box than had been predicted.

 

[Liquid]

Mecklenburg-Vorpommern already has racist xenophobes in its state parliament; Nationaldemokratische Partei Deutschlands. Easily enough, this translates to the National Democratic Party of Germany.

They have 5 seats in the 71 seat MeckPomm parliament and formerly had one seat in the 132 seat Saxony parliament. Saxony and MeckPomm are known hotbeds for racism in Germany, hotbeds of neo-Nazis and East German relics.

I don't know much about this AfD but I had heard of them somewhat when I lived there 3 years ago. Much like any country, there is a problem with the far-right but of course there is always extra focus on Germany because of its history, which I do find unfair but of course one can't ignore the fact that far-right parties do have regional representation.

However, from what I have learnt, which included a trip and guided tour of the MeckPomm parliament, they are still small time, generally unpopular and are not a threat to the national parliament as it stands; for both state and federal parliaments there is a 5% minimum threshold for representation. NPD is by far the most well known and legitimised far-right party but its performances in federal elections does not look favourable:

Minimum 5% of votes needed

Perhaps I am overexaggerating the possible nature of AfD without knowing the full extent of their doctrine, but we shall see how well they do in the Brandenburg and Thüringen state elections on the 14th September.

Either way, small-time state representation is a long, long way away from federal representation.

 

[DK]

AfD seem a lot less Nazi-ish than the NPD. They seem like a German UKIP.

 

[Liquid]

I didn't intimate Nazism specifically, more general far-right. So it seems much like the hierarchy of BNP and UKIP Germany now has parallels with the NPD and AfD.