2021 FIA Series Race Discussion

[Ashthebash]

I went into yesterday's race full of confidence after some really good practice runs where to be honest I'd mostly blitzed the fields I'd been in. Pre race practice went well, 55.7 in clean air for qualy, looking good along with another Ferrari driver that I'm extremely closely matched with. Fully expected to see him in the race with his DR about 500 lower than mine... no!

Entered the penultimate slot and found myself as door #20 for the second time in three races, this time in 2nd split.

After some information from @watto79 and a bit of YouTube spying I was always qualifying alone unless I absolutely nailed my first run, and all three qualy laps came in at 55.8## with the first lap being the quickest, which put me 6th.

The best way to describe the race is a scrap, start to finish. Nobody working together to try to get away, everyone wanting the place ahead asap and there were a number of forceful moves. A Jag trying to take 4th left himself vulnerable to me, I went for it, found myself 7th! It was that kind of race. At the halfway point I'd been beaten up, rammed, pushed off, and was 10th, 7.5s off the lead. Second half of the race as tyre wear began to kick in I started to gain the time and also the places back, on the final lap retaking the 6th position that I'd started in up the inside at T4, defended the inside into the final corner and came home where I began after a very eventful 25 laps, 3.5s behind the leader for 255 points. It was also a really slow winning time, indicative of the type of race that has multiple leaders and a lot of fighting going on

Had I been racing with my Ferrari mate I would have probably had a better result in terms of both position and points (how can 4th place in 3rd split get more than 6th in 2nd?!), but, Q6 P6 in second split? Got to be one of my best races to date

On to Spa, and anyone thinking the Ferrari has an advantage because it's MR hasn't driven it in the wet!

 

[Pigems]

This may have already been covered in the 100+ pages in this thread, but I am confused...

I entered my first FIA manufacturer Championship race yesterday racing for Ferrari. I entered three times.

First race, Q7, P11, awarded 6 points.
Second race, Q4, P16, awarded 4 points.
Third race, Q4, P1, awarded 4 points.

I know that only your last race is the result that you are left with, but 4 points for a race win? Is this right?

At the time of the race I was DR D, SR S. The lobby was full of drivers with the same DR and SR rating and I get less points for a Q4 and P1 than finishing P11. What is it about the points system am I missing?

I understand the points awarded depend on factors such as the level of competition in the lobby and clean racing etc, but I was expected more than just four points for an FIA race win. I made no contact with other drivers or the barriers, I moved up three positions and won the race...4 points?

Feeling robbed...

CPP

The FIA points are based on the average DR score of the lobby your in, nothing else is taken into account. So in your last race, the average DR of the lobby must have been lower than in your first race is all. Here’s a chart showing how it works.

 

[kungtotte_]

Yes, your two poor finishes (11 and 16) tanked your DR enough to put you in a lower point lobby.

 

[Pigems]

Yes, your two poor finishes (11 and 16) tanked your DR enough to put you in a lower point lobby.

Or they were just stronger rooms, which would explain the lower finishing position, but equal points earned.

 

[CPP]

Thanks for the info guys, still a little confused though, as all drivers in my lobby were the same DR (unless I was at the top end of the DR 'D' and the whole lobby was at the lowest end of their DR 'D'), matchmaking said we were equal...I'll get used to it.

Just seems a little unfair, we can't help who we are matched with in an FIA lobby, we can only race who we are on the grid with and 4 points for a race win for driver and constructor hurts...not even a point per lap! lol.

Ahhh nevermind...I'm still feeling salty, ignore my crying!

Looking forward to the next one...

CPP

 

[Pigems]

Thanks for the info guys, still a little confused though, as all drivers in my lobby were the same DR (unless I was at the top end of the DR 'D' and the whole lobby was at the lowest end of their DR 'D'), matchmaking said we were equal...I'll get used to it.

Just seems a little unfair, we can't help who we are matched with in an FIA lobby, we can only race who we are on the grid with and 4 points for a race win for driver and constructor hurts...not even a point per lap! lol.

Ahhh nevermind...I'm still feeling salty, ignore my crying!

Looking forward to the next one...

CPP

Just because everyone has a D, doesn’t mean all have the same DR score. Here are the values between DR letters, there can be quite a variance, even in a room with all the same letter drivers.

 

[CPP]

Many thanks for taking the time to explain Pigems, it makes more sense that now I know there is a 2000 point spread in the 'D' rating, also explains how A+ drivers are getting nearly 400 points for a win given there is a 50,000 spread in the A+ class.

Still stings a little lol.

Thanks again for your patience guys, I'm guessing you have explained this a thousand times to newbies coming to GT Sport...been sim racing for over ten years but only picked up GT Sport about a month ago...fun times!

CPP

 

[Pennyb12000]

I should say thanks to this forum and @Mistah_MCA 's video which I would only know about due to this forum. Without the knowledge from here I would have assumed today's race was a one-stopper.

Agreed. There is so much good knowledge here. Thank you guys for sharing.

 

[Pigems]

Many thanks for taking the time to explain Pigems, it makes more sense that now I know there is a 2000 point spread in the 'D' rating, also explains how A+ drivers are getting nearly 400 points for a win given there is a 50,000 spread in the A+ class.

Still stings a little lol.

Thanks again for your patience guys, I'm guessing you have explained this a thousand times to newbies coming to GT Sport...been sim racing for over ten years but only picked up GT Sport about a month ago...fun times!

CPP

No worries man, happy to help. Just keep at it and you’ll see those points keep rising and rising.

 

[KosmoKazi]

FIA Manufacturers Series - 2021 Exhibition Season - Round 3

Qualified 16th, impacted by being rear-ended into T1 on my optimal hot lap. 🤬

And with that starting position, wasn't able to survive much in the piranha pit that the mid-pack of this race created.

Not a very good combo overall (I'm not one to complain about the race combos, but this one was lame, to be kind...) and the Porsche in particular, was ill-suited to this track, especially with me at the wheel. I'm not good on softs, and I have a hard time with the dive, point and shoot type tracks in that underpowered Cayman, so it all added up to a hopeless exercise for me.

I'd make a run on people through the esses, after a decent pass through that impossible turn 4 left hander, then I'd out brake them into the final hairpin, only to get pulled on the exit anyway and then helplessly watch as they continued to pull away down the long main straight.

So finished 14th, after avoiding any significant garbage after the rough first lap or so. Lost about 500 DR, pocketed my second stash of FIA points that will likely be meaningless (or else I am in really bad shape), hopefully after the race at a wet Spa soon.

I did run another, in my Alt account, to see if I was really that bad or if the combo was really the problem for me. I chose McLaren, and while I only qualified 16th, in a similar lobby, I was able to run up to 6th, before I made a mistake in that tricky turn 4 with a few laps to go. I finished 10th, after coming to a complete stop on the guardrail there. I was happy to know that in a different car, I was actually competitive and effective there... making up 10 spots in an FIA race was an accomplishment, and if I had just been more careful, a solid finish was there for the taking after a good drive up through the field. Especially as I haven't raced the Mac much at all, and only had 3 laps practice before the race. Just wasn't to be, in my main account and in that Porsche. Will be a better scenario at Spa for sure.

 

[F1Bernardo]

Does anybody know what the S player selection criteria will be, now that they merged regions in Manufacturers? The GTSport site has a table but it does not reflect current regions :-/

Captura De Tela 2021-03-18 093740

• F1Bernardo
• Mar 18, 2021

I believe that the least they should do is to sum the ranges? So... top 200 in Americas or Top 10 for each manufacturer? But I haven't seen anything official from PD... does anybody know?

Tagging @Pigems since he knows everything

 

[Pigems]

Does anybody know what the S player selection criteria will be, now that they merged regions in Manufacturers? The GTSport site has a table but it does not reflect current regions :-/

Captura De Tela 2021-03-18 093740

• F1Bernardo
• Mar 18, 2021

I believe that the least they should do is to sum the ranges? So... top 200 in Americas or Top 10 for each manufacturer? But I haven't seen anything official from PD... does anybody know?

Tagging @Pigems since he knows everything

I wish I knew everything!! My best guess would be that they will combine the 140(NA)+60(SA) for a total of 200, similar to how it is in EU. But that’s just a guess. I really can’t see them offering less S ratings though, so it seems like the logical answer for now.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

there is a 2000 point spread in the 'D' rating,

Nope, a 3997 spread. Its not from 2000-3999, it's from two to three thousand nine hundred and ninety nine

 

[OJBrit]

The FIA points are based on the average DR score of the lobby your in, nothing else is taken into account. So in your last race, the average DR of the lobby must have been lower than in your first race is all. Here’s a chart showing how it works.

View attachment 998525

Many thanks for taking the time to explain Pigems, it makes more sense that now I know there is a 2000 point spread in the 'D' rating, also explains how A+ drivers are getting nearly 400 points for a win given there is a 50,000 spread in the A+ class.

Still stings a little lol.

Thanks again for your patience guys, I'm guessing you have explained this a thousand times to newbies coming to GT Sport...been sim racing for over ten years but only picked up GT Sport about a month ago...fun times!

CPP

I'm sure @Pigems has that picture saved to his desktop just for this occasion.

Congrats on the win @CPP and good luck with future races.

 

[Pigems]

I'm sure @Pigems has that picture saved to his desktop just for this occasion.

Congrats on the win @CPP and good luck with future races.

I do have it saved to favourites in my phone, that question seems to come up a lot. And a chart is much easier to post than a big long explanation.

 

[zavisic_]

TOP 10 lap guide for saturday race time trial. Not for everyone as its manufacturer series but just to give an idea. Car I am using is Corvette.

 

[Famine]

Nope, a 3997 spread. Its not from 2000-3999, it's from two to three thousand nine hundred and ninety nine

It's actually from one. Only your first five races are E-rank. After that if you can bounce your DR down to 1 you have a DR of D, and since both 1 and 3,999 are included it's a 3,999-point spread.

 

[Geauxgreddy]

Round 3
Sardegna C Gr4
Slot 1, DR A lobby, door 18

I'm not a huge fan of the track.. or the combo. But, it's what was next on the schedule. So, I put in about a billion laps trying to figure out turn 4, the Turn of Testicular Fortitude. Pretty sure I had mine crushed in that dang piece of wall that sticks out about 250 million times. Finally feeling like I could at least navigate it with speed, I hit the practice lobbies...and had success.

On to the race, thought I nailed the qualy with a 56.2xx, but it was only good for Q5. I figured I'd just hang out behind vvise and hope for some Greddy passes (aka free positions), I got 2!! One pitted and vvise had a mistake in the ToTF.

So all I had to do was pass a struggling RCZ to get into p2. Pulled that off around lap 19. Then managed to hold off a hard charging AndreiSav (who has been driving Aston in that hideous blue since birth). Very glad I wasn't in the mid pack though. Looked brutal back there.

Got 220 points and about 1400 DR. Woot, one and done.

 

[Ashthebash]

The importance of tow in qualifying is really daft. Often saw 10+ people lining up for a tow in the final corner because it buys you about 0.3 seconds (which is worth 10-15 positions on the grid in top split)

It's also why some people eventually nail a great result after 3-4 attempts. Because it takes that long to nail a lap when they luck into a great tow where someone doesn't bail on their lap in front of you

It's really not how it should work.

Think unless they totally revamp the qualifying that there isn't an easy workaround. I'd like one and done (basically because that's me!) or maybe a penalty for having multiple attempts at races like 2nd attempt you only get 90% of the points that you win, 3rd attempt 80% and so on. Things like this would, in my opinion, make people want to qualify on their own to make sure they get a solid qualy lap in rather than risk a tow for the ultimate time. But both have drawbacks with possible disconnects

 

[OJBrit]

Think unless they totally revamp the qualifying that there isn't an easy workaround. I'd like one and done (basically because that's me!) or maybe a penalty for having multiple attempts at races like 2nd attempt you only get 90% of the points that you win, 3rd attempt 80% and so on. Things like this would, in my opinion, make people want to qualify on their own to make sure they get a solid qualy lap in rather than risk a tow for the ultimate time. But both have drawbacks with possible disconnects

I'd like a 1 shot everyone on their own. I don't know if the way do the qualy in the finals is coded or they just tell them when to go but I like that format too. But I can understand some people will get bored sat in the pits.

 

[KosmoKazi]

nah, the 'game' within the game to get clear air or take advantage of the tow is all part of GT and sports car racing... I think it's great that PD set it up that way. My complaining from time to time isn't with the system, it's with the boneheads that just don't get it, or that do, but choose to be knuckleheads during qualifying sessions.

 

[ZiggyS80]

First Slot of Round 3 Manufacturer's Cup at Sardegna in the Gr. 4 Jaguar
Q5
P9
170 points

I think I'm finally getting the hang of group qualifying as this was my best result this season. I had practiced a good deal for this one and felt both qualifying and race pace could keep me in the top 10. Elbows were out at the start and I dropped to 6th on the final turn of lap 1 when a WRX bumped me out of the way. I returned that favor on lap 2 in the same spot. On lap 3 we went side by side into turn 1. I thought I had decent separation, so I foolishly took the outside line which earned me a little bump and a brief touch of gravel. A train of cars came by on the way to turn 4 and I lost 4 spots I never got back. I did learn my lesson, however, and defended the inside line from then on at turns 1 and 4 and the last one to at least hold station in 9th.

One and done and on to Spa. This combo is very intimidating. I've avoided the rain races, but its time to learn. Thank you @zavisic_ for the track guide. The Jag and Vette have a lot of similarities. If I can keep it on track for 13 laps I'll call it a win.

 

[Ashthebash]

I'd like a 1 shot everyone on their own. I don't know if the way do the qualy in the finals is coded or they just tell them when to go but I like that format too. But I can understand some people will get bored sat in the pits.

Yeah I'd be happy with a one shot with everyone on their own. But if you were to ask if people like all 20 cars being on track at the same time they'd say they would. Every workaround has some drawback somewhere. What I don't like at the moment is the fact that we can quit out and re-emerge almost instantly. Didn’t happen when we had fuel on, but now you'll get yourself some clean air and someone will pop out of the pits bang in your way as you start your flyer

 

[KosmoKazi]

Round 3
Sardegna C Gr4
Slot 1, DR A lobby, door 18

I'm not a huge fan of the track.. or the combo. But, it's what was next on the schedule. So, I put in about a billion laps trying to figure out turn 4, the Turn of Testicular Fortitude. Pretty sure I had mine crushed in that dang piece of wall that sticks out about 250 million times. Finally feeling like I could at least navigate it with speed, I hit the practice lobbies...and had success.

On to the race, thought I nailed the qualy with a 56.2xx, but it was only good for Q5. I figured I'd just hang out behind vvise and hope for some Greddy passes (aka free positions), I got 2!! One pitted and vvise had a mistake in the ToTF.

So all I had to do was pass a struggling RCZ to get into p2. Pulled that off around lap 19. Then managed to hold off a hard charging AndreiSav (who has been driving Aston in that hideous blue since birth). Very glad I wasn't in the mid pack though. Looked brutal back there.

Got 220 points and about 1400 DR. Woot, one and done.

I guess that's what I don't like about that track... a guy makes a pretty bad mistake in the TToF as you called it, and he can still just protect his position all the way thru the esses and not lose a spot, even if you are right behind. It's not fair from a sporting/competition point of view, unless the guy is reasonable like the Mustang was with you. Happened over and over to me in my first race on my primary account in the Porsche. Was my only opportunity to do anything, as I was able to be safe in that T4, then get solid runs thru the esses.

And as I noted on your youtube page... the new NA+SA matching really hurts the network strength... I'm only getting 3 bars on a 200MBPS xfinity feed on ethernet to the PS4, while the BRA and ARG guys seem to be at 4/5 green bars... another reason not to like the new setup!

GREAT result, it's been FOREVER since I earned a podium in an FIA event... hopefully a better run at Spa, and hopefully get matched with some good people from GTP this weekend. (though I won't be seeing you... I see you were just "passing through" my 35k-ish range when were were matched before, after a reset! good luck up there!)

 

[Geauxgreddy]

I guess that's what I don't like about that track... a guy makes a pretty bad mistake in the TToF as you called it, and he can still just protect his position all the way thru the esses and not lose a spot, even if you are right behind. It's not fair from a sporting/competition point of view, unless the guy is reasonable like the Mustang was with you. Happened over and over to me in my first race on my primary account in the Porsche. Was my only opportunity to do anything, as I was able to be safe in that T4, then get solid runs thru the esses.

And as I noted on your youtube page... the new NA+SA matching really hurts the network strength... I'm only getting 3 bars on a 200MBPS xfinity feed on ethernet to the PS4, while the BRA and ARG guys seem to be at 4/5 green bars... another reason not to like the new setup!

GREAT result, it's been FOREVER since I earned a podium in an FIA event... hopefully a better run at Spa, and hopefully get matched with some good people from GTP this weekend. (though I won't be seeing you... I see you were just "passing through" my 35k-ish range when were were matched before, after a reset! good luck up there!)

Ha, thanks. Im going to need all the luck I can get. I watch those higher lobby streams that @Pigems and PXCAM are in and I'm not sure I want any of that. Lol

Good luck to you at Spa, hope you get on that podium. Porsche is pretty good for that combo, just gotta put her up near the front for the start. Which we all know is easier said than done.

 

[Yard_Sale]

I’ve found that in the “B” and below lobbies, getting or giving a tow usually ends up being a sum-zero game. Often times at this level, the “towee” usually finds themselves in a wall because they don’t know how to account for; and navigate dirty air (myself included). I’m sure it’s a different story in the A and above lobbies

 

[JoeDaSnow]

Last night at round 3 of the 2021 Exhibition Series of the Manufacturers Series, I had started and finished 15th with 24 points. In this season, I represent Toyota.

 

[watto79]

nah, the 'game' within the game to get clear air or take advantage of the tow is all part of GT and sports car racing... I think it's great that PD set it up that way. My complaining from time to time isn't with the system, it's with the boneheads that just don't get it, or that do, but choose to be knuckleheads during qualifying sessions.

I actually agree with the overall idea of qualifying as it is, because as you say the principle is realistic.

The problem is the game introduces two problems that are very unrealistic.

Firstly the slipstream is way overpowered in GTSport. This has been done on purpose to encourage overtaking to make for more exciting races. In real GT racing slipstream is a thing but its not the DRS boost we get.

The other problem is having all 20 cars on track for a 5 minute period to set their times.

Neither of these factors are like real sports car racing. The combined result is at best a guarantee that cars at the front massively lose out and at worst a lot of carnage.

I thought the 10 minute qualifying did help things a little but you still have the OP slipstream problem. Thankfully they did get rid of the fuel burning sessions we used to have which were their own level of ridiculousness

 

[D_Dragline]

I actually agree with the overall idea of qualifying as it is, because as you say the principle is realistic.

The problem is the game introduces two problems that are very unrealistic.

Firstly the slipstream is way overpowered in GTSport. This has been done on purpose to encourage overtaking to make for more exciting races. In real GT racing slipstream is a thing but its not the DRS boost we get.

The other problem is having all 20 cars on track for a 5 minute period to set their times.

Neither of these factors are like real sports car racing. The combined result is at best a guarantee that cars at the front massively lose out and at worst a lot of carnage.

I thought the 10 minute qualifying did help things a little but you still have the OP slipstream problem. Thankfully they did get rid of the fuel burning sessions we used to have which were their own level of ridiculousness

3 possible alternatives for qualifying are;

1. Run as-is but turn off slipstream.

2. Run qualifying groups (of say 5) based on DR.

3. Run solo qualifying for everyone at the same time (just like free practice) with dynamic timing updates.

I think any of these would make for a better qualifying experience. 1 would be the most true to life. 2 would keep the current feel but reduce congestion, 3 would be the purest but least realistic option.

 

[05XR8]

Just leave it as is. One hot lap, crash & burn, bin it or win it, winner winner chicken dinner, P1 or P20. Gets it over an done with to start racing.

I wouldn't mind a top 10 shootout, but PD and mainly players, don't have time for that.