America - The Official Thread

[McLaren]

Democratic Rep. Zoe Lofgren quietly releases a 2,000-page report made up of various social media posts from her Republican colleagues who voted against certifying the election.

The report features a collection of social media posts and tweets that span dozens of pages from Arizona Rep. Paul Gosar where he urges supporters to "hold the line," days before what would become the Capitol insurrection. In another social media post included in the report, Gosar wrote that "sedition and treason for stealing votes is appropriate."

The report also captures numerous tweets where Gosar invoked @ali on Twitter, which was formerly the account used by Ali Alexander, a leader of the "Stop the Steal" group, who said in several Periscope livestream videos that he planned the rally that preceded the riot in conjunction with Gosar and two other congressional Republicans, Mo Brooks of Alabama and Andy Biggs of Arizona.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/03/05/politics/lofgren-social-media-report-gop-lawmakers/index.html

Gosar is the rep. who spoke at a white nationalist conference just days ago.

Last week a sitting U.S. congressman delivered a keynote speech at a white nationalist conference in Florida.

“Wow, what a group,” Rep. Paul Gosar (R-Ariz.) said as he took his place behind a podium emblazoned with the letters “AFPAC” — an acronym for America First Political Action Conference, the second annual gathering of the white nationalist “groyper” movement.

AFPAC’s organizer, white nationalist figurehead Nick Fuentes, took the stage next, telling the crowd that “white people are done being bullied” and that America needs to protect its “white demographic core.”

The next day, Fuentes and Gosar sat down for coffee, according to a photo Fuentes posted to Twitter.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/paul-gosar-white-nationalist-republican_n_60415a1ec5b60208555d4f60

 

[Scaff]

But Biden was going to start all the wars...

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/03/05/biden-war-powers-congress-473843

 

[GranTurNismo]

I was reading up on Krysten Cinema, the senator from Arizona who is vehemently against the $15 min wage increase, along with 8 other democratic senators (I think the highest she'll compromise on is $11), and it seems that she has fallen victim to the DC establishment. Before her political career, she was a member of the Green Party and a self-described libertarian leftist (which is basically what I am) who gave speeches openly criticizing capitalism and the free market, believing in post-capitalist solutions such as syndicalism/worker co-ops. She was also an anti-war activist and engaged in anti-Iraq war protests, as well as supporting single-payer universal healthcare. Now, she has the second most conservative voting record out of any senate Democrat (only after good ol' Joe Manchin), and has taken large donations from defense contractors and fossil fuel companies. I'm not denying that she could have become more moderate as she got older, but I'm getting strong vibes that she is a grifter, and discarded her previous positions in the name of obtaining money and power. If that's true, than thats a real shame.

 

[Populuxe]

Then:


Now:


Vote to raise the minimum wage to $15/hr?
GOP: No
Dems: No ♥️️‍ #BLM ️‍

 

[UKMikey]

Having not heard of this no doubt potential subject of a future tragic political biopic, I'm glad to discover she spells her last name with an "S" instead of a "C". I was beginning to think it was some kind of pseudonym or stage name.

 

[Liquid]

I thought she was a Republican before checking.

 

[McLaren]

Looks like the $1.9T relief passed, 50-49. 1 Republican was attending a funeral in Alaska and no Republican in the Senate voted for the relief.

 

[Tornado]

I was reading up on Krysten Cinema, the senator from Arizona who is vehemently against the $15 min wage increase, along with 8 other democratic senators (I think the highest she'll compromise on is $11), and it seems that she has fallen victim to the DC establishment. Before her political career, she was a member of the Green Party and a self-described libertarian leftist (which is basically what I am) who gave speeches openly criticizing capitalism and the free market, believing in post-capitalist solutions such as syndicalism/worker co-ops. She was also an anti-war activist and engaged in anti-Iraq war protests, as well as supporting single-payer universal healthcare. Now, she has the second most conservative voting record out of any senate Democrat (only after good ol' Joe Manchin), and has taken large donations from defense contractors and fossil fuel companies. I'm not denying that she could have become more moderate as she got older, but I'm getting strong vibes that she is a grifter, and discarded her previous positions in the name of obtaining money and power. If that's true, than thats a real shame.

Then:


Now:


Vote to raise the minimum wage to $15/hr?
GOP: No
Dems: No ♥️️‍ #BLM ️‍

I'd just as soon that the Democrats not force a vote-a-rama on themselves seemingly just to damage the reelection chances of their own caucus for things that they already knew couldn't be added to the bill in the first place.

 

[GranTurNismo]

I'd just as soon that the Democrats not force a vote-a-rama on themselves seemingly just to damage the reelection chances of their own caucus for things that they already knew couldn't be added to the bill in the first place.

Then Biden shouldn’t have campaigned on a $15 wage if they supposedly knew there was no way it could be realistically passed. It’s a broken promise regardless and voters will take note of that. Also, it’s not as if the McConnell-controlled senate had this deep respect for rules and precedents. I’ve yet to hear a compelling argument as to why the parliamentarian cannot be overruled.

 

[Danoff]

Looks like the $1.9T relief passed, 50-49. 1 Republican was attending a funeral in Alaska and no Republican in the Senate voted for the relief.

My understanding is that even getting it passed was difficult because of Manchin.

 

[GranTurNismo]

Having not heard of this no doubt potential subject of a future tragic political biopic, I'm glad to discover she spells her last name with an "S" instead of a "C". I was beginning to think it was some kind of pseudonym or stage name.

LOL, grammarly "corrected" Sinema to Cinema.

My understanding is that even getting it passed was difficult because of Manchin.

He definitely voted for it reluctantly. I think he was originally completely against any form of direct-cash payment, before eventually being a proponent of the $600 check passed under Trump. Gotta love austerity.

 

[Tornado]

Then Biden shouldn’t have campaigned on a $15 wage if they supposedly knew there was no way it could be realistically passed.

Doesn't sound like they the Senate even knew until just before the bill went to the Senate, but they definitely knew when Bernie wasted 12 hours trying to force it back in as if there was even unilateral Democrat support for it.

It’s a broken promise regardless and voters will take note of that.

Yes, the Democrats are much better at drawing attention to their own failings for no reason and causing themselves to lose elections as a result. That was the point.

 

[GranTurNismo]

Doesn't sound like they the Senate even knew until just before the bill went to the Senate, but they definitely knew when Bernie wasted 12 hours trying to force it back in as if there was even unilateral Democrat support for it.


Yes, the Democrats are much better at drawing attention to their own failings for no reason and causing themselves to lose elections as a result. That was the point.

Yea it's clear that Bernie's efforts had no actual chance at passing the $15 wage, and was a virtue-signal, but if there's any benefit, now we know 8 Democrats who will be primaried come next election.

Usually because Democratic voters care a smidge more about honesty actual policies being passed while Republican voters, at least those of today, are too distracted by culture-war minutia to purity-test their elected officials. It doesn't take an idiot to know that Trump broke more of his promises than most other presidents, but do any of his supporters even care? As long as he saves America from socialism/communism/marxism and cancel culture and satanic pedophile cabal made up of Obama, Soros, the Clintons, and the rest of the "establishment", and instills a sense of jingoistic national pride is what really matters to them.

 

[Tornado]

Yea it's clear that Bernie's efforts had no actual chance at passing the $15 wage, and was a virtue-signal, but if there's any benefit, now we know 8 Democrats who will be primaried come next election.

So 8 seats that will flip Republican, because Democrats can't help but stab each other in the back in their race to the bottom and Bernie's pointless grandstanding has given them election attack ad fodder to go for it.


Remind me what the "benefit" is if there's as much of a bloodbath in the Senate in 2022 as there was in the House in 2020. Democrats do not have the luxury of enough of a legislative majority, in either chamber, that they can start pulling stunts like this just to expose each other when they were already overwhelmingly getting what they wanted as a collective anyway.

Usually because Democratic voters care a smidge more about honesty actual policies being passed while Republican voters, at least those of today, are too distracted by culture-war minutia to purity-test their elected officials.

Seems to me based on how much the Twitter set has been pissing and moaning about Democrats basically since Biden set foot in office like the reality is more that the really vocal Democrat voters just don't have any understanding of how the Senate (or federal government in general) works in the first place and instead just want to whine when Biden doesn't write on the back of a napkin to say that all student loan debt is cancelled forever and have his entire political agenda taken care of in a month and a half. After four years of the Cheeto writing piles and piles of EOs that weren't worth the paper they were written on one would think it would be obvious that there are limits to what they can actually do.

 

[Liquid]

@Tornado Genuine question, what do you think is the best plan of action for Congressional Democrats and the wider Democratic Party?

Assuming that their goal is to retain both houses.

 

[Tornado]

Add states.

 

[Blitz24]

Add states.

At minimum. It's been over 60 years since the last state was added (Hawaii), and if the Democrats want to prevent a brief 2 year control of Congress and the House, adding states would be the most logical way of doing so.

 

[Keef]

Add DC specifically because they've been denied representation since its creation, and then add PR.

Then:


Now:


Vote to raise the minimum wage to $15/hr?
GOP: No
Dems: No ♥️️‍ #BLM ️‍

Looks like the $1.9T relief passed, 50-49. 1 Republican was attending a funeral in Alaska and no Republican in the Senate voted for the relief.

I haven't been keeping up lately but this sounds like good news. As for the $15/hr amendment, I suppose they can do that later. But eight Dems didn't like it? Since when did that happen? I thought only Manchin was the roadblock to that? This Sinema lady especially, with her sassy little Karen curtsy as she votes no, aw isn't she cute. Wow I hate her.

 

[BobK]

Add DC specifically because they've been denied representation since its creation, and then add PR.

It would make a lot more sense to cede the district back to Maryland.

Alternatively, why not consider permanent residents of Washington, DC citizens of Maryland?

That would avoid pretty much all issues with Article I, section 8 of the Constitution.

As for adding PR, that should definitely happen.

 

[Liquid]

How many other places could be under consideration for statehood? As well as DC the other territories of the United States are Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands, Guam and American Samoa, I think.

There are other places like the Marshall Islands, Micronesia and Palau which are "associated states" wherein the USA basically covers their defence and social security but all three are recognised independent members of the UN.

 

[Dotini]

How many other places could be under consideration for statehood? As well as DC the other territories of the United States are Puerto Rico, US Virgin Islands, Guam and American Samoa, I think.

There are other places like the Marshall Islands, Micronesia and Palau which are "associated states" wherein the USA basically covers their defence and social security but all three are recognised independent members of the UN.

There are parts of existing states which wish to either become their own state or join a neighboring state.

 

[Danoff]

It would make a lot more sense to cede the district back to Maryland.

Virginia wants it too (and they have their own set of arguments). Makes more sense to me to keep it DC, because it has been DC for a very long time (and not Maryland or Virginia).

That would avoid pretty much all issues with Article I, section * of the Constitution.

There aren't any real issues with that.

 

[Liquid]

There are parts of existing states which wish to either become their own state or join a neighboring state.

I imagine that adding existing territories is less contentious than dividing current states.

 

[Keef]

It would make a lot more sense to cede the district back to Maryland.

Alternatively, why not consider permanent residents of Washington, DC citizens of Maryland?

That would avoid pretty much all issues with Article I, section * of the Constitution.

As for adding PR, that should definitely happen.

It wouldn't make more sense because nobody actually supports retrocession. DC residents, Maryland residents, and even the Maryland government don't want retrocession to happen. It also has conflicts with the 23rd Amendment which grants three electoral votes to DC because of the people living there...but if DC were retroceded then those electoral votes would still apply to the leftover DC where very few people live. Also, DC currently has a delegate in the House and Senate which are non-voting.

In order for retrocession to work, first the Maryland government (and thereby its citizens) would have to support the measure because if they don't support it then it could only happen via constitutional amendment which would both repeal the 23rd amendment and also write changes to the state of Maryland into the constitution. There are several other problems but the bottom line is constitutional amendments are extremely difficult.

However the easiest and most practical and agreeable route is to simply create a new state and leave behind a tiny federal district. DC residents are actually in support of this, and Maryland becomes a non-issue. The 23rd Amendment becomes a non-issue as well, because the admission of a new state by Congress is merely a matter of passing a law - and in passing a new law, they can include language which changes other laws, so the 23rd Amendment issue becomes null because the law in the US Code that actually enforces the 23rd Amendment can simply be re-written by the simple majority needed to pass the DC Statehood law, rather than the 2/3 majority needed to pass an Amendment. In this simple majority manner, both the three electoral delegates and the two Congressional delegates can be removed from the leftover DC.

The bill which has already passed already makes provisions for the Congressional delegate issue and the 23rd Amendment issue (sections 222 and 223). The whole law is already written and has already passed the House (Edit: It passed the 116th Congress but due to the new elections it needs to re-pass the 117th Congress). It merely needs to pass the Senate and be signed by the president and boom, new state.

 

[Dotini]

I imagine that adding existing territories is less contentious than dividing current states.

It's all contentious.

 

[Blitz24]

It's all contentious.

How does @TB feel about being part of Northeast Dakota?

 

[TexRex]

How does @TB feel about being part of Northeast Dakota?

East North Dakota?

 

[TB]

Western part of the state has all the oil. We'll keep it, thanks.

Whatever you do, just don't bulk us together with South Dakota.

 

[McLaren]

Western part of the state has all the oil. We'll keep it, thanks.

Whatever you do, just don't bulk us together with South Dakota.

C'mon, you sure you don't want Burgum splitting governing duties with her? Just look into them eyes.

 

[TB]

C'mon, you sure you don't want Burgum splitting governing duties with her? Just look into them eyes.

She is the sole reason for my comment.