At what refresh rate could GT5 be running at ?.

[irnbrutwinturbo]

This thread is a fantastic.

Metfanant is absolutely right, so many technologies being mixed together, yet are very much unrelated.

So if my eyes can see a refresh rate of 30 fps
and my brain calculates in Gigahertz, probably fair to say it's multi-core, especially in women
and my heart beats 100 times a minute
and my body is sending information through my nerves at 10000 times a second, through multiple paths,
and i breathe say once every 5 seconds
and of course i have to blink, so that will also effect my actual FPS
and of course i need to pee 3 times a day

so whats the calculation to see how fast, or 'refresh rate', GT5 should run to ensure i am playing it to my max computing limit.

 

[Stonemonkey]

My understanding is that GT5 is meant to run at 60 frames per second. The refresh rate is dependant upon the monitor/tv you're using which tries to interpolate the signal being sent from the source (PS3 in this case) and add more frames to give the impression of a smoother image - something you might nake use of when watching a blu-ray.

OMG! who would watch a blu-ray with interpolation turned on on their TV? it makes movies look like they've been filmed with a TV studio camera and look like eastenders or the bill. The thing about blu-ray and 24p is it retains the cinema feel.

 

[ddl8]

Oh my god, this thread is absolutely amazing, hilarious, impecable piece of dump, pointless, just because of nothing to say/do ********.

who the *&^* cares about all that garbage I read just now?

Sorry for offtopic, now lets get to the point. GT5 will be running roughly at 60fps, cause its PD's standart, anything less and they dont consider its a game anything above and like u said (most tv's are 60hz) most people wont see the differenece (not because as someone said here he sees 30 fps - actually i can tell difference between 30, 60 ,100 and even 1000 fps even with 60 hz tv but if tv was 1000hz i would see difference even stronger, i thing much stronger) cause most lcds and plazmas are 60hz.

GT5p doesnt run at native 1080p its running at its own resolution which is far worse than 1080p and then its upscaled to 1080p, well to me its cheating, cause quality wise those two are not comparable at all, ye i agree pd should have created gt5 with 720p resolution in mind and dont try to "jump above the roof". No, really graphic wise gt5p looks sometimes awesome but actual gameplay graphics somewhat lacking field of depth (playing at 720p/1080i) especcially on highspeed ring and fuji speedway, on the long stretch u just cant see far enough, so what i am trying to say its not good for our eyesight, having played gt5p for an hour and my eyes watering - that is not good!

i would watch blu ray with 100hz on, if i had one, you know why? cause i dont watch movies i watch documentary on bluray, so 100hz makes the picruter just jaw dropping, spare some money man and buy movies on dvds cause u wount see much difference in picture sharpness between dvd and blu ray if you have good dvd that can upscale to 1080p.

this thread is garbage enjoy reading peice

 

[Stonemonkey]

Thankyou, in among that jibberish you make a point. Documentaries are probably enhanced by frame interpolatiion but I've not watched any yet and was only considering movies, so sorry.

 

[drivatar]

There is no reason for physics calulations per second to be greater than the number of times it draws a frame.

There is. Making the time-steps smaller leads to more accurate physics even if user input isn't updated that often. User input is more constant than forces etc..

But getting the physics right is more important than ultra small time-steps.

 

[Raitziger]

Actually physics have to be allways faster than display frequency. You can also think it this way:
Let's assume we have physics running at 60Hz.
Car goes 200km/h = 55,55 m/s . Display cycle=physics cycle is 60Hz => Ts=0,016667 s This means if there is a smaller than 0.925 m long pig in the way just before next cycle calculation and game does not notice that. Also game needs some calculation time to figure out what is happeing after we hit the pig.

So physics need to be faster than display frequency. Display frequency can understood as sampling of the physics world into "3d world".

And those who do not know, games have 67ms or more integrated input lag to cover calculations. http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-lag-factor-article?page=3

 

[ddl8]

Thankyou, in among that jibberish you make a point. Documentaries are probably enhanced by frame interpolatiion but I've not watched any yet and was only considering movies, so sorry.

man u r missing a lot, try planet earth, yellow stone and such, u gonnabe blown away by picture sharpness, no bd movie will come even close.

 

[Bandit6]

About TV refresh rates, do they actually make a difference in video games? Or is it only good for regular TV viewing and or movies?

I'm about to buy a new TV soon and I see all these sets at either 120 or 240(?) is it worth it to pick one of these up or is the normal 60hz good enough?

Don't know much about this stuff, so I apologize if I'm asking a dumb question.

 

[Raitziger]

If you are worried about input lag, you dot need 120Hz set.
If you are worried about motion resolution, you need one.

I play some games with 240Hz but in some that makes input lag too high.

 

[Metfanant]

man u r missing a lot, try planet earth, yellow stone and such, u gonnabe blown away by picture sharpness, no bd movie will come even close.

there are MANY movies that have better picture quality than Planet Earth

 

[oze]

Hi ho silver!

This is my first post to GTPlanet forums. I've been reading the news section but I just discovered here is a quite active forum! 💡

I have to correct on misunderstanding here:
If a HDTV is 120hz or 240hz (100 or 200hz PAL) it is actually not refreshing the original image 120 or 240 times per second. It artificially generates extra frames between the original frames of the picture source.
So yes, the picture is moving smoother. But no, it doesn't help gamers.
It is a quite different thing in SDTV and PC monitors.

In my opinion the input lag from 120 or 240hz sets doesn't matter in games like GT. Maybe in FPS games it would.

Finnish gamermagazine, Pelaajalehti, said that GT5 physics calculation works with 60hz rate. Ok they didn't say it directly but they let you understand it that way. Also they say that compromises had to be made for 60hz framerate: No antialiasign -> rougher edges of objects. Less details in enviroment. Also textures, light maps and shadows have to be compromised in favor of 60fps. I think this is true because PS3 has so little memory to use.

They also had this funny picture of a PD programmer working with 7 screens and sleeping the nights under his desk.

 

[ddl8]

About TV refresh rates, do they actually make a difference in video games? Or is it only good for regular TV viewing and or movies?

I'm about to buy a new TV soon and I see all these sets at either 120 or 240(?) is it worth it to pick one of these up or is the normal 60hz good enough?

Don't know much about this stuff, so I apologize if I'm asking a dumb question.

Ok, i'll try to explain to you as simple as i can.

most current gen games on consoles runs either at 30 or 60 fps, 60 fps is deemed to be standard which is not being followed in many cases due to hardware limitations of the consoles. Lets assume all games 60 fps for now, ok? It means that every second u have 60 frames.

second component is TV. TVs could be 60, 100, 120, 240 hz etc. Most lcd and plasma tvs are 60 hz especially early models up to 2008. What does it mean? 60hz means that pictrue is refreshed 60 times per second on the screen, so if u play a game which runs at 60 frames per second iu gonna see every single frame, the more frames the smoother the picture u see on the screen. So if u r planning to play only console games u can easely take 60hz tv and be better off.

Why would somebody want to have 100 hz TV? Well its good for television, documentary blu rays, cause it makes picture closer to real world. In real world u see perfectly u dont have torn frames etc, the more hz tv is capable of the more picture quality gonna be close to reality... something like that.

Why somebody would want 120hz or even high hz TVs? Well there is such thing as 3D. Have u heard of it? Most advanced 3D technologies utilize, sorry dont know exactly what they utilize.... but when u take on 3D glasses the number of frames for each eye is reduced by half, so if you want a good experience in 3d glasses u need as much hz as it possible, when u try to watch 3d on 60hz tv u get only 30hz for each eye which is suchs as u understand especially for games, when u use 120hz u get 60hz for each eye which is pretty damn good.

In conclusion i would recommend u to take 100 or 120 hz tv, it makes picture quality much better especially for games, 240hz not better than 120hz or 100hz cause most tvs cannot utilize it properly, i.e. picture quality detireorates due to too much tv processing. And ye 3d glasses sucks, world moves in a wrong direction, this technology is old as world and they still trying to push it through, super HD is the future, cause u dont need glasses to feel like u r looking out of the window.

 

[ddl8]

there are MANY movies that have better picture quality than Planet Earth

Please list for me those movies that have picture sharpness better than documentaries.

 

[Metfanant]

Please list for me those movies that have picture sharpness better than documentaries.

the list is probably to large to put here...so try here...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1168342

that is a list of Blu-ray picture quality from the NUT JOBS at avsforum....they don't mess around over there and to get on that list there is a lot of discussion among members on where to place the movie...notice that Planet Earth is in the "silver" category....

as far as movies that I own, and find the PQ to be better than PE....

all 3 Pirates of the Caribbean movies
The Dark Knight
any of Pixar's movies (although not really fair)
Black Hawk Down
Troy
The Patriot
Apocolypto

and some others...but im not sitting in front of my movie collection right now...

 

[oze]

Why somebody would want 120hz or even high hz TVs? Well there is such thing as 3D. Have u heard of it? Most advanced 3D technologies utilize, sorry dont know exactly what they utilize.... but when u take on 3D glasses the number of frames for each eye is reduced by half, so if you want a good experience in 3d glasses u need as much hz as it possible, when u try to watch 3d on 60hz tv u get only 30hz for each eye which is suchs as u understand especially for games, when u use 120hz u get 60hz for each eye which is pretty damn good.

Actually you can't watch this new 3D material with current 120+hz TV sets.
Like I explained in my previous post it is not a real refresh rate of the screen. You do need a real refresh rate of at least 100hz to be able to show 3D material.
Sony and Panasonic have announced TV models with real refresh rate of 120hz for 2010.

But anyhow you explained well the differences between choosing 60 or 100+hz TV. 👍

 

[Bandit6]

Thanks for explaining the whole 60/120/240hz thing guys. 👍

 

[Raitziger]

"240hz not better than 120hz or 100hz cause most tvs cannot utilize it properly"

Most TVs that have 240Hz mode have designed panels for that. Eg. sony 240Hz sets have better motion resolution than sony 120Hz sets. European model w5500 gives 650p motion resolution with its 100/120 Hz mode, but z5500 model with 240Hz manages full 1080p.
tested by http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk

 

[ddl8]

"240hz not better than 120hz or 100hz cause most tvs cannot utilize it properly"

Most TVs that have 240Hz mode have designed panels for that. Eg. sony 240Hz sets have better motion resolution than sony 120Hz sets. European model w5500 gives 650p motion resolution with its 100/120 Hz mode, but z5500 model with 240Hz manages full 1080p.
tested by http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk

Thanks for the info dude, if i were u i would not take the figures seriously, its just figures, they state in the article that difference between 100hz motion flow system and 200hz is subtle rather than obvious.

"200Hz Motionflow] worked well to reduce motion blur without introducing any significant interpolation artefacts when we watched football on the Sony KDL40Z5500, although any improvement over the W5500’s 100Hz Motionflow system was subtle rather than obvious. The “Standard” setting should suffice… on [Motionflow] “High” we witnessed some frame tearing/ juddering during very fast pans, while failing to observe any further improvement in motion clarity"

anyway its not real 200hz as one of the gt planet members outlined above, but rather artificial increasing of frames in a video material, for games i guess this feature is useless cause u got 60fps on ps3.

 

[Raitziger]

Well they tested that real world test with SD input and without a doubt 650P motion resolution manages quite nice with 576i signal. It is like if you walk past TV showing HD image you just can not straight if it is 1080p or 720p. PS3 is 1080p set so it will show differense "better".

"for games i guess this feature is useless cause u got 60fps on ps3"
Main function of motion vector interpolation is to give you sharper moving image(possibly the full 1080p), not to make input framerate faster.