Automotive Photography Competition 60

[Syntax error]

-Levels, Curves, Colour Balance, Brightness/Contrast, Hue/Saturation, cropping, or anything else capable in the development process or with filters and common special lenses are allowed to use in Photoshop or other image editing softwares. Other adjustments and effects are not allowed to be used in your picture.

Obviously it doesn't count for this particular competition as everyone will be doing a selective colour/"colour splash" image, but I've also noticed in previous competitions that people have used selective colouring when theoretically it's not allowed as per the rule above. Are we going to relax this rule or are we going to tighten it in future so it restricts how much PP work can be done to a photo?

Nice shot HFS 👍

I used lightroom and de-saturated all the colours baring the red, and then I upped the contrast so the b&w has a little more punch. Doing it this way gave me more precision in getting all the red bits of the car to stay red through the fence whilst still keeping in line with the original rules (not that it occurred to me at all )

There are many ways to achieve selective colouring though, I'm sure a fair few people will layer a b&w version of the image on top of the colour and simply cut the car out. Same result really but will probably take twice as long to do and I guess would technically be breaking the rules.

Since this week’s comp is heavily reliant on PS, we can probably let the rules slide as to how people achieve this effect (not that there is any way to monitor it really).

 

[balang_479]

Its a nice shot...............................but the big fat bit of dirt on it is very distracting.






Scaff

ahaha i know... im seriously a newb at this, first time using a borrowed DSLR.. hope to get better.

 

[NISM0_SKYLINE]

ahaha i know... im seriously a newb at this, first time using a borrowed DSLR.. hope to get better.

Hope to get better? That picture is great, you don't have to hope, you will get better.

 

[homeforsummer]

Nice shot HFS 👍

I used lightroom and de-saturated all the colours baring the red, and then I upped the contrast so the b&w has a little more punch. Doing it this way gave me more precision in getting all the red bits of the car to stay red through the fence whilst still keeping in line with the original rules (not that it occurred to me at all )

Thanks 👍 Your technique sounds more or less what I did too.

There are many ways to achieve selective colouring though, I'm sure a fair few people will layer a b&w version of the image on top of the colour and simply cut the car out. Same result really but will probably take twice as long to do and I guess would technically be breaking the rules.

Since this week’s comp is heavily reliant on PS, we can probably let the rules slide as to how people achieve this effect (not that there is any way to monitor it really).

Indeed. I understand that this week's competition theme is difficult to achieve using basic "darkroom" techniques, but my thinking was that perhaps people should be a little more careful in future weeks not to use too many photoshop effects unless the theme specifically states that you can 👍

 

[LongbowX]

I've added my image into my first post.

Just a thought, but perhaps this should be re-worded for the competitions?

Obviously it doesn't count for this particular competition as everyone will be doing a selective colour/"colour splash" image, but I've also noticed in previous competitions that people have used selective colouring when theoretically it's not allowed as per the rule above. Are we going to relax this rule or are we going to tighten it in future so it restricts how much PP work can be done to a photo?

What do people think? From a variety point of view I like to see what people can achieve with loads of PP but at the same time I think there should be fairly clear guidelines on what we can and can't do each week. It's about the photography after all, not arty-farty photoshop work...

I said previously that selective colouring was allowed. Though you're right, I should have changed it so that it says that in the rules. I don't think any additional photoshop is needed really. It is always interesting to see what people create, but this is more about the photograph rather than the PP skills, I agree.

I used lightroom and de-saturated all the colours baring the red, and then I upped the contrast so the b&w has a little more punch. Doing it this way gave me more precision in getting all the red bits of the car to stay red through the fence whilst still keeping in line with the original rules (not that it occurred to me at all )

There are many ways to achieve selective colouring though, I'm sure a fair few people will layer a b&w version of the image on top of the colour and simply cut the car out. Same result really but will probably take twice as long to do and I guess would technically be breaking the rules.

Since this week’s comp is heavily reliant on PS, we can probably let the rules slide as to how people achieve this effect (not that there is any way to monitor it really).

Thanks 👍 Your technique sounds more or less what I did too.
Indeed. I understand that this week's competition theme is difficult to achieve using basic "darkroom" techniques, but my thinking was that perhaps people should be a little more careful in future weeks not to use too many photoshop effects unless the theme specifically states that you can 👍

We can't really monitor it, though. This is really based on the honesty of those competing. I'm pretty loose with the selective colouring methods. It doesn't much matter to me. I am relying on the integrity of those involved to do what they think is right. This is a competition with others with basic rules, and if you win using something that *probably* is outside the rules then I'm relying on that's person's conscience and guilt getting to them.

 

[Milliethemutt]

Mk2 Escort
Oliver's Mount Scarborough
November 2009
Canon 350D
​

Phew, that worked. I haven't tried the 400 pixel linky picture thing before.

 

[Speedster502]

Rockingham Speedway Paddocks,
United Kingdom,
Canon EOS 350D
30.5.2009

Not expecting mine to do very well, there's some much better shots in this weeks competition. 👍​

 

[Syntax error]

Are we going to relax this rule or are we going to tighten it in future so it restricts how much PP work can be done to a photo?

I think the rules are probably okay the way they are. Maybe we can stipulate no selective colouring for normal comps unless otherwise specified just to be on the safe side. I do enjoy these one off pp comps occasionally but my preference also is more of a "darkroom" only adjustments shots generally.

 

[Boffin]

.....but this is more about the photograph rather than the PP skills, I agree.

I don't. I don't see much in the way of differentiation if we couldn't edit our work. If this were a GT4 comp where cleaning the car and surroundings was required as well as adding motion blur, then yes I would agree that pp skills do count for quite a lot (even though most participants say otherwise) - but where is the skill in twiddling the curves and playing with the saturation and contrast? The pp in real photography comps, as far as I see, is only this sort of thing - and I think its great to amplify everyone's different tastes and styles. I see it as the whole package and not just the composition. I'm looking for the best picture - not the one with the most potential.

What I don't look at while voting (as I suspect contrary to some people who take one look at the poll and vote) is the subject. I've seen some pretty nice cars that were in not the best of pictures that have had heaps of votes because some random came in, saw it and liked the fact that it had some car in it. It really grinds my gears because someone else, who has a lesser car as the subject, but did a much better job of portraying it gets no votes - so I'd like to see something in the first post of the polls telling people to vote for the shot, not the car - but whatever, I'm not the one that runs this joint (thankfully - great job on this Longbow 👍).

My shot to come. [/2c]

 

[homeforsummer]

The pp in real photography comps, as far as I see, is only this sort of thing - and I think its great to amplify everyone's different tastes and styles. I see it as the whole package and not just the composition. I'm looking for the best picture - not the one with the most potential.

Don't get me wrong, I agree entirely with this - but it's also why composition and framing are important, possibly more so than PP. To me, that's where the skill lies, and if I'm being brutally honest with myself it's a skill I need a lot more work on because there are people here who are significantly better at composing an interesting image.

I'd fully acknowledge that a little PP can go a long way - I often increase the contrast a little and maybe the saturation, and I usually find that's enough for my taste.

What I don't look at while voting (as I suspect contrary to some people who take one look at the poll and vote) is the subject.

Likewise 👍

I've seen some pretty nice cars that were in not the best of pictures that have had heaps of votes because some random came in, saw it and liked the fact that it had some car in it. It really grinds my gears because someone else, who has a lesser car as the subject, but did a much better job of portraying it gets no votes - so I'd like to see something in the first post of the polls telling people to vote for the shot, not the car

I agree with this also. If you'll allow me to be cynical for a second, it does occasionally seem like you can rock up with any old picture of an Audi R8 and it'll immediately bring in votes simply because it's an R8. I'm aware of personal preference but I'd also agree that some pretty average shots have beaten some amazing ones before and I suspect it's down to the subject matter a lot of the time.

...given that I agree with you on all counts then, I don't see where your issue is with the competition being more about the photo than the PP skills? I think that if too much of a free reign is given on PP then we'll start ending up with loads of high contrast or high saturation images, or selective colour images in the regular competitions, and you might start getting a situation where the most "arty" photo wins rather than just the best one.

I personally would have no problems if we were restricted a little more on PP as it forces you to think a little more about composition rather than just letting photoshop do all the work for you.

As for the photos being biased towards flash cars, that's why if/when I win my next competition I'm going to have you all photographing crap cars

 

[LongbowX]

Darn. Now I have so much to read and reply to.

I don't. I don't see much in the way of differentiation if we couldn't edit our work. If this were a GT4 comp where cleaning the car and surroundings was required as well as adding motion blur, then yes I would agree that pp skills do count for quite a lot (even though most participants say otherwise) - but where is the skill in twiddling the curves and playing with the saturation and contrast? The pp in real photography comps, as far as I see, is only this sort of thing - and I think its great to amplify everyone's different tastes and styles. I see it as the whole package and not just the composition. I'm looking for the best picture - not the one with the most potential.

Don't get me wrong, I agree entirely with this - but it's also why composition and framing are important, possibly more so than PP. To me, that's where the skill lies, and if I'm being brutally honest with myself it's a skill I need a lot more work on because there are people here who are significantly better at composing an interesting image.

I'd fully acknowledge that a little PP can go a long way - I often increase the contrast a little and maybe the saturation, and I usually find that's enough for my taste.

I'm also not entirely clear on what your point is 80Y (not helped by the two negatives in the second sentence ). Of course PP can do a lot for an image and I certainly wasn't saying it has little effect because I would be lying if I did. It matters. It's a combination of the two - but I'd like to think it is the photograph that takes paramount over the PP of it. But it is the overall execution that what matters.

Also, this is contest that takes place over five days, a limited amount of time. I don't think I should free up the rules when it comes to PP.

What I don't look at while voting (as I suspect contrary to some people who take one look at the poll and vote) is the subject. I've seen some pretty nice cars that were in not the best of pictures that have had heaps of votes because some random came in, saw it and liked the fact that it had some car in it. It really grinds my gears because someone else, who has a lesser car as the subject, but did a much better job of portraying it gets no votes - so I'd like to see something in the first post of the polls telling people to vote for the shot, not the car - but whatever, I'm not the one that runs this joint (thankfully - great job on this Longbow 👍).

My shot to come. [/2c]

I agree with this also. If you'll allow me to be cynical for a second, it does occasionally seem like you can rock up with any old picture of an Audi R8 and it'll immediately bring in votes simply because it's an R8. I'm aware of personal preference but I'd also agree that some pretty average shots have beaten some amazing ones before and I suspect it's down to the subject matter a lot of the time.

...given that I agree with you on all counts then, I don't see where your issue is with the competition being more about the photo than the PP skills? I think that if too much of a free reign is given on PP then we'll start ending up with loads of high contrast or high saturation images, or selective colour images in the regular competitions, and you might start getting a situation where the most "arty" photo wins rather than just the best one.

I personally would have no problems if we were restricted a little more on PP as it forces you to think a little more about composition rather than just letting photoshop do all the work for you.

As for the photos being biased towards flash cars, that's why if/when I win my next competition I'm going to have you all photographing crap cars

Heh. 80Y, saying I do a great job mixed in with a bunch of criticism doesn't work. Because by then it doesn't seem honest.

I also don't know where your issue lies...but I will still say a few things.

Me and Speedster502 actually talked about the "flash car" issue week or so ago through PMs. So, I will say what I did to him: which is that I am aware of that. But that's inevitable. Sometimes a little credit is given to the photographer for actually seeing the rare car, because we know some effort was taken to actually see it. (I could go out and take a picture of a CR-V right now, but to see a F50...that's trickier). Though sometimes...it's just because of other people than the photography "usuals" voting. The photograph should be worth more than the car, though. I'm in agreement. I think I will add that in. I probably should have tweaked that since I've run this competition. But I haven't implemented too many changes since I have been...

I look forward to your crap car theme, hfs. Though I'm not exactly sure what a "crap" car is defined as.

 

[Joey D]

Well you got two people pulling for the crap car theme. If I ever win (which is doubtful, too many good shots) I have a couple ideas for some themes that will pull out the rareness of the car variable.

 

[homeforsummer]

Sometimes a little credit is given to the photographer for actually seeing the rare car, because we know some effort was taken to actually see it. (I could go out and take a picture of a CR-V right now, but to see a F50...that's trickier).

That's true, though it's worth noting that it doesn't take a great deal of effort to pop to your local prestige car showroom to fire off a few shots of a Ferrari. Likewise, I've got plenty of shots of Lamborghinis and Ferraris taken at motorsport events over the past couple of years - I just choose not to use them in the competitions. Mostly, because they're not as good as many of my photos of much more humble cars (something no amount of PP would change...). And there's an Audi R8 around five minutes walk away from me that I continually shun for these comps!

 

[MatskiMonk]

Well, I'm trying to fly the flag for the crappy old car brigade, by featuring my £500 eBay chariot of rust patches and loose trim, in my entry.. And as I drove about 450 miles at great expense (£1.12/ltr @ 17mpg!), it was also not an easy picture to get!


On the flip side... I had a back-up entry prepared, but chose not to go for it...

It features the obligatory R8...


... it's also an R8 GT3, RACE CAR, none the less!


.. it's also got a Lond Rover pickup in it.. for the anti-glamour factor...

Audi R8 GT3 LMS
FIA GT
Silverstone 2009
A Nikon DSLR I borrowed

Might be on a winner there if it was a better photo!

..

BTW, what is 'PP'?

 

[homeforsummer]

BTW, what is 'PP'?

"Post production". Any digital techniques you use once the image is on your computer. Previously known as darkroom techniques back in the days of good ol' film.

Do you have the 900px version of the shot above? It looks pretty cool but I can't see enough from the thumbnail!

 

[MatskiMonk]

"Post production". Any digital techniques you use once the image is on your computer. Previously known as darkroom techniques back in the days of good ol' film.

Do you have the 900px version of the shot above? It looks pretty cool but I can't see enough from the thumbnail!

Cheers, I guessed it was something to do with PhotoshoP !

The original of that pic is in a gallery of shots I let BMWblog.com post,

Gallery: http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/05/05/breathtaking-photos-bmw-m3-gt4-and-alpina-b6-gt3-at-silverstone/

Link to full res pic: http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/05/05/b...-b6-gt3-at-silverstone/picture-253-1900x1200/

It was a good day, although it was the first time I'd used a DSLR, neither lenses I had were particularly good for the work, neither were good for close up, and neither were that good for the cars on track..

 

[Boffin]

Don't get me wrong, I agree entirely with this - but it's also why composition and framing are important, possibly more so than PP. To me, that's where the skill lies, and if I'm being brutally honest with myself it's a skill I need a lot more work on because there are people here who are significantly better at composing an interesting image.

...given that I agree with you on all counts then, I don't see where your issue is with the competition being more about the photo than the PP skills? I think that if too much of a free reign is given on PP then we'll start ending up with loads of high contrast or high saturation images, or selective colour images in the regular competitions, and you might start getting a situation where the most "arty" photo wins rather than just the best one.

What I'm saying is that unlike the GT4 comps (where extensive pp work is needed for any success) - the only skill in the pp work in the APC is twiddling a few dials to get some more colour or change the mood or whatnot. I suppose the skill is also in having a strong mental picture of what you want it to look like, and then adjusting everything in order to replicate it.

If its not cleaning, or adding reflections, or motion blur (which takes more time and skill than most think) or adding/removing any features as per what GT4 comps do, I don't see much skill involved. All I see is someone making a photo stand out more, and I don't see that as a skill that someone has to learn, because as I said, its just a few dials and levels. So the skill is knowing when not to go too far.

So...in conclusion, I don't see the need to tone down the pp work that we are running with now, because, at least with me, the PS skills involved are elementary and not too hard to aquire.

I'm also not entirely clear on what your point is 80Y (not helped by the two negatives in the second sentence ). Of course PP can do a lot for an image and I certainly wasn't saying it has little effect because I would be lying if I did. It matters. It's a combination of the two - but I'd like to think it is the photograph that takes paramount over the PP of it. But it is the overall execution that what matters.

My point, as said above, is that I think we should keep the amount of pp work we do the same as what we are running with now - as the skill is not too hard to aquire, and I think good pp compliments the photo, instead of good pp making the photo.

Heh. 80Y, saying I do a great job mixed in with a bunch of criticism doesn't work. Because by then it doesn't seem honest.

Wow. I did not try to criticise you at all. All I said is that you are doing a great job. I'm a bit puzzled by it actually .

I also don't know where your issue lies...but I will still say a few things.

I was throwing this point out there because it seems as though we are talking about certain rules in the APC, thats all. 👍

Me and Speedster502 actually talked about the "flash car" issue week or so ago through PMs. So, I will say what I did to him: which is that I am aware of that. But that's inevitable. Sometimes a little credit is given to the photographer for actually seeing the rare car, because we know some effort was taken to actually see it. (I could go out and take a picture of a CR-V right now, but to see a F50...that's trickier). Though sometimes...it's just because of other people than the photography "usuals" voting. The photograph should be worth more than the car, though. I'm in agreement. I think I will add that in. I probably should have tweaked that since I've run this competition. But I haven't implemented too many changes since I have been...

I disagree. I'd expect street rep in the DYSAGT if I spotted and bagged am F50, but if presented with a standard snapshot of an F50 here, I would not vote for it if I was also presented with a really well presented shot of a CR-V. Sure, I know why some randoms come into the polls and vote for the best car, but I vote for the implementation of the shot, rather than the subject.
Also, if I was presented with two brilliantly implemented shots - one of an F50 and one of a CR-V, I would still not pay too much attention to the subject - moreover which one caught my eye more. Sure - the F50 has heaps of eye catchign features, but I'm sure If I had a day with a CR-V I could rustle something up with is also eye catching.

 

[LongbowX]

That's true, though it's worth noting that it doesn't take a great deal of effort to pop to your local prestige car showroom to fire off a few shots of a Ferrari. Likewise, I've got plenty of shots of Lamborghinis and Ferraris taken at motorsport events over the past couple of years - I just choose not to use them in the competitions. Mostly, because they're not as good as many of my photos of much more humble cars (something no amount of PP would change...). And there's an Audi R8 around five minutes walk away from me that I continually shun for these comps!

It might not take that much effort, but getting a good shot in a showroom can be difficult! And we know you're too honest to continually use that R8. We would get sick of it too. Not to mention I don't like it in the first place.

Audi R8 GT3 LMS
FIA GT
Silverstone 2009
A Nikon DSLR I borrowed

Might be on a winner there if it was a better photo!

So...just for curiousity...which is your entry. This one, or the one a page back. Because you can only enter one?

What I'm saying is that unlike the GT4 comps (where extensive pp work is needed for any success) - the only skill in the pp work in the APC is twiddling a few dials to get some more colour or change the mood or whatnot. I suppose the skill is also in having a strong mental picture of what you want it to look like, and then adjusting everything in order to replicate it.

If its not cleaning, or adding reflections, or motion blur (which takes more time and skill than most think) or adding/removing any features as per what GT4 comps do, I don't see much skill involved. All I see is someone making a photo stand out more, and I don't see that as a skill that someone has to learn, because as I said, its just a few dials and levels. So the skill is knowing when not to go too far.

So...in conclusion, I don't see the need to tone down the pp work that we are running with now, because, at least with me, the PS skills involved are elementary and not too hard to aquire.

My point, as said above, is that I think we should keep the amount of pp work we do the same as what we are running with now - as the skill is not too hard to aquire, and I think good pp compliments the photo, instead of good pp making the photo.

Mhmm. Well, I wasn't really planning on changing it anytime soon. I made allowances for the selective colouring in the past, and I think I will keep it as something that a person can do. Most people here don't do it very often anyway.

Wow. I did not try to criticise you at all. All I said is that you are doing a great job. I'm a bit puzzled by it actually .

Ahh. Ignore me. I'm a bit insane. Sorry.

I disagree. I'd expect street rep in the DYSAGT if I spotted and bagged am F50, but if presented with a standard snapshot of an F50 here, I would not vote for it if I was also presented with a really well presented shot of a CR-V. Sure, I know why some randoms come into the polls and vote for the best car, but I vote for the implementation of the shot, rather than the subject.
Also, if I was presented with two brilliantly implemented shots - one of an F50 and one of a CR-V, I would still not pay too much attention to the subject - moreover which one caught my eye more. Sure - the F50 has heaps of eye catchign features, but I'm sure If I had a day with a CR-V I could rustle something up with is also eye catching.

I was merely giving a reason for the effect, I wasn't saying I agree with it. I very much disagree with it, I assure you. But there isn't much more I can do other that say to vote for the best shot, not the best car.

 

[MatskiMonk]

So...just for curiousity...which is your entry. This one, or the one a page back. Because you can only enter one?

Sorry, the first one.. this later one was only made in jest as a response to the conversation.

 

[Boffin]

I have some photography.

Race prepped Ferrari 360

Eastern Creek

18/07/09

D60​

 

[LongbowX]

I have some photography.

Race prepped Ferrari 360

Eastern Creek

18/07/09

D60[/CENTER]

And very nice photography at that.

-----



Dyson Lola LMP2

Mosport

August 2009

Rebel XTi
__________________

 

[Spencer]

I was going to enter this:


But then I forgot about the comp.

 

[LongbowX]

I was going to enter this:


But then I forgot about the comp.

Mmm. Boss 302.

And, well, there's always next time...

 

[Boffin]

Actually - before we wrap this one up, I have one more thing I'd like to see changed with this comp. Nothing on how its run or anything, but what I'd love to see is more feedback, at both the entry and poll stage from entrants and regulars. Go into the GT4 comps (sorry to bring it up again) and the regulars there are always willing to give you support, critisisms, help etc. Every shot entered gets at least one or two comments each. This makes it feel like a really friendly section of the forum to be around, with all the encouragement going round. Now I'm not suggesting we should start brown nosing or anything, but it seems like all we do is drop out shots off go away and wait patiently till someone comes and betters it. There is no real feedback or anything. Sure, there is the occasional comment from LongbowX and I know HFS makes some effort to give comments as to why he's voted for a particular shot, and these are great - but theres only a few doing it. If we have some sort of feedback, it helps us to get better (in some ways - dissagreeing with someone's style does not count).

So, yeah, I'd like to see more regular feedback given by/to photographers.

[/rant]

 

[Joey D]

I agree, I would like criticisms too. Pretty much every week I enter I got either voteless or only get 1 or 2 votes. I'd like to know where I could improve.

 

[Boffin]

Cool 👍 - I shall try to start the trend in the next comp .

 

[homeforsummer]

I'm in agreement too. In the polls I usually try and explain why I've picked a shot - and in future I'll try and go into more depth with that.

 

[LongbowX]

Actually - before we wrap this one up, I have one more thing I'd like to see changed with this comp. Nothing on how its run or anything, but what I'd love to see is more feedback, at both the entry and poll stage from entrants and regulars. Go into the GT4 comps (sorry to bring it up again) and the regulars there are always willing to give you support, critisisms, help etc. Every shot entered gets at least one or two comments each. This makes it feel like a really friendly section of the forum to be around, with all the encouragement going round. Now I'm not suggesting we should start brown nosing or anything, but it seems like all we do is drop out shots off go away and wait patiently till someone comes and betters it. There is no real feedback or anything. Sure, there is the occasional comment from LongbowX and I know HFS makes some effort to give comments as to why he's voted for a particular shot, and these are great - but theres only a few doing it. If we have some sort of feedback, it helps us to get better (in some ways - dissagreeing with someone's style does not count).

So, yeah, I'd like to see more regular feedback given by/to photographers.

[/rant]

I agree, I would like criticisms too. Pretty much every week I enter I got either voteless or only get 1 or 2 votes. I'd like to know where I could improve.

I noticed that too in the GT4 comps when I entered them. They are a very enthusiastic bunch. I was inspired by their competitions to put in place the "winner chooses the theme" idea. I also kind of hoped it would lead to more involvement, and I suppose it did in time. Maybe it's just because we're mopey artists? But you're right, feedback would be a nice addition. Hopefully this idea will get picked up, and we can get more of a "community" feel going on.